Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2021 20:14:39 GMT -5
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SDHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,339
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Post by SDHoya on Feb 13, 2021 20:30:59 GMT -5
Do you all forget that we blew big leads to WV and Nova and MU earlier this season? Can’t blame Ewing for coaching to win. I’d like to see more rotation as much as anyone, but if Ewing put Kobe and tj in and we fell apart (the same) people would be complaining that Ewing screwed up by having too large a rotation.
This was a weird one, but we handily beat a mid table BE team. I’d take that any season.
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Post by HometownHoya on Feb 13, 2021 20:41:01 GMT -5
Yes, I have watched the middle of the pack BE teams...have you? For examples: UConn 5th place - 7th person Tyler Polley F (20.4 MPG 8.2ppg, 2.3 rpg) 8th Adam Sanogo F (15.2 MPG 6.6ppg 3.9 rpg) both those guys are performing better then Sibley right now, not to mention Kobe or TJ. St Johns 6th place - 7th man Isiah Moore F (17.5 mpg 9.2 ppg, 4.8 rpg) 8th man Marcelus Earlington (16.3 mpg, 6.5 ppg, 3.7 rpg). Again, outperforming our Hoyas. Georgetown 10th place - 7th man Timmy I (9.4 mpg 2.8 ppg 3.6 rpg) 8th man Jamari Sibley (6.2 mpg, 1.5 ppg, 1.5 rpg), 9th man TJ Berger (4.8 mpg 1.7 ppg, 0.1 rbg 0.6 apg). In comparison, the closest UConn guy to those averages are their 9th, 11th, and 12th man. Closest StJ guys are their 9th, 10th, 11th respectively. If you want to argue that they have more MPG sure, I don't have the per 40 stats but they still don't match up. I agree that they would be great 7th and 8th rotation guys someday but to get there they need development. Neither are ready for that this year. They are currently the 9th and 10th and it makes sense for where they are in their development. We could give them another 5 mpg but then Pat and the Hoyas are currently 3-13 and we are firmly in 11th rather then getting to look down on DePaul and have a fighting chance at 7th-9th. When it comes down to it, a coach's responsibility is to win. A lot of fans are ready to give up wins now for wins later. Unfortunately it doesnt work that way, wins later are not guaranteed. You try to win every time you're on the court. Seems to me you're changing the subject here, I never questioned whether or not other teams in the BE had better 7th or 8th men, that's an obvious yes... You were making the point that Kobe & Clark would never amount to more than 7th or 8th guys on a mid-level team, I think that it's too early to be that definitive... Uconn starts transfers from Howard & URI, take a look at the offers Wsu had other than St. John's, Seton Hall starts a former walk-on, that's the point I'm trying to make... You're right, it is too early to be definitive on their impacts. I had mentioned in the original comment you quoted that I hope they develop and that is largely on the player's self motivation with coaches direction. I will stand by that all three seem to be below BE athleticism but as we all know, there is more to CBB then athleticism. Even as far as that goes, we saw how far Roy came but you can't teach size...which Holloway and Kobe dont have for their position.
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smokeyjack
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,300
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Post by smokeyjack on Feb 13, 2021 20:46:04 GMT -5
If Clark or Berger or Holloway could play, they would be playing. On this team, it’s not a matter of not ready, because nobody on this team is ready game in and game out. It’s a matter of don’t have it.
With the notable exception of Bile, I thought the team was really, really good defensively today - best I’ve seen from them all season.
Only thing I really learned/was reminded of today - good/great defense gives you a lot of margin for error on the other end. We shot OK today from deep but were generally miserable on the offensive end and still won easily because our defense was very good. And let’s be honest, the BE is very weak this season. The fact that Butler has 6 league wins is shocking - they are categorically awful in every respect - shooting, driving, defense, size/paint points. That’s an awful bball team. They looked as bad or worse than GU looked against Creighton. Does anyone on that team even concern you, much less scare you? Yuck!
On lone off pos note, credit where it’s due to Morko - he has been our best player by far two games in a row now.
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by EasyEd on Feb 13, 2021 21:10:47 GMT -5
Two opinions about the rest of the season: 1. Our final record for the year will be largely dependent on Bile's contribution, good or bad. We know who we have with the other players but not Bile. 2. Dante may have the biggest potential of all our current players.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Feb 13, 2021 21:24:33 GMT -5
I am as much a "play the freshman" advocate as anyone on this board, but if we lose a week from today to Seton Hall because Pickett and Blair were compromised by overuse today, then as a program we need to figure out far more than just how to put together a rotation.
That being said, choosing to sit Blair after a play where he was clearly fouled and took exception to the non-call vs. any of the 9 TOs he committed... was questionable.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 13, 2021 21:43:05 GMT -5
I think Jamorko and Jahvon can probably recuperate in 7 days.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2021 21:52:40 GMT -5
You guys keep knocking Bile but you all don't realize that Bile was the best player on the court today. Bile is the reason why the season is turning around. Bile has effectively given us a big 4. He has madw everyone in the starting lineup jobs easier.
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smokeyjack
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,300
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Post by smokeyjack on Feb 13, 2021 22:02:54 GMT -5
You guys keep knocking Bile but you all don't realize that Bile was the best player on the court today. Bile is the reason why the season is turning around. Bile has effectively given us a big 4. He has madw everyone in the starting lineup jobs easier. I think everyone realizes his positives, but you need to realize his negatives. His offensive usage is WAY too high for a guy who shoots as marginally as he does. He should be 4th option, but he often doesn’t play like he understands this. And as well as he sometimes rebounds and runs the floor, he also often gets completely lost on his off-ball defense, always bites on the pump fake and overestimates his dribbling ability and overall skills. Hes a net-plus, but he was absolutely not the best player on the floor today. Today was a VERY weird game. Take Blair. He commits 9!!!, 9!!!! TOs. That’s an inexcusable number. A run-until-you-vomit number. A buy-a-tennis-racquet number. But he also threw no less than 5 scintillating 50-foot diagonal passes that either directly led to buckets or were hockey assists. His passing was at times absolutely magnificent. While he was at other times a human TO. Really hard to reconcile the two, because most of his TOs weren’t committed in the act of making near-remarkable plays but were of the utterly brain dead variety. It was that kind of game...for literally every major contributor (Blair, Bile, Q, Harris) on the team other than Pickett. Morko was once again very solid. Harris plays super hard, but still can’t finish when he dives into the lane, never gets to the line, struggles to find bigs after initial penetration and gets iso inside picked on by other team’s guards 2/3 poss/game (mouse in house). Q has the hands of a fish. Squeeze it and slam it big fella. Don’t bring it down and don’t get stripped by mice. Offensively, warts were everywhere. Defensively, the guys played what I felt was their best game of the season.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,962
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Post by EtomicB on Feb 13, 2021 22:56:38 GMT -5
If Clark or Berger or Holloway could play, they would be playing. On this team, it’s not a matter of not ready, because nobody on this team is ready game in and game out. It’s a matter of don’t have it. With the notable exception of Bile, I thought the team was really, really good defensively today - best I’ve seen from them all season. Only thing I really learned/was reminded of today - good/great defense gives you a lot of margin for error on the other end. We shot OK today from deep but were generally miserable on the offensive end and still won easily because our defense was very good. And let’s be honest, the BE is very weak this season. The fact that Butler has 6 league wins is shocking - they are categorically awful in every respect - shooting, driving, defense, size/paint points. That’s an awful bball team. They looked as bad or worse than GU looked against Creighton. Does anyone on that team even concern you, much less scare you? Yuck! On lone off pos note, credit where it’s due to Morko - he has been our best player by far two games in a row now. Hard for me to buy this when it comes to Berger especially, we saw him play pretty well in crunch time in the 1st game against St. John's & played ok @ Syracuse as well... I believe PE when he says he's going with "the guys who have been thru the wars" many times coaches are creatures of habit, JT3 was the same way... Remember the ongoing debate about playing Hayes over Moses? A lot of "practice, can't play & trust the coach" excuses in that thread too. Hayes was average at best but he had a much better career than Moses once he was given time, not even close...
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Feb 13, 2021 23:04:50 GMT -5
Seems to me you're changing the subject here, I never questioned whether or not other teams in the BE had better 7th or 8th men, that's an obvious yes... You were making the point that Kobe & Clark would never amount to more than 7th or 8th guys on a mid-level team, I think that it's too early to be that definitive... Uconn starts transfers from Howard & URI, take a look at the offers Wsu had other than St. John's, Seton Hall starts a former walk-on, that's the point I'm trying to make... You're right, it is too early to be definitive on their impacts. I had mentioned in the original comment you quoted that I hope they develop and that is largely on the player's self motivation with coaches direction. I will stand by that all three seem to be below BE athleticism but as we all know, there is more to CBB then athleticism. Even as far as that goes, we saw how far Roy came but you can't teach size...which Holloway and Kobe dont have for their position. Disagree. Before he got hurt, Clark looked just fine re: athleticism. He basically hasn’t played since then. Berger has looked fine moving around and has shown some dribbling moves in a handful of minutes. Holloway has played even fewer minutes.
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dchoya72
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,488
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Post by dchoya72 on Feb 13, 2021 23:35:12 GMT -5
Just saw that we had five players score in double figures and one with nine points today.
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,422
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Post by the_way on Feb 14, 2021 0:06:29 GMT -5
We won decisively.
I'm sure the usual suspects will find something to complain about though. It never fails. lol
Go Hoyas!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2021 1:19:01 GMT -5
You guys keep knocking Bile but you all don't realize that Bile was the best player on the court today. Bile is the reason why the season is turning around. Bile has effectively given us a big 4. He has madw everyone in the starting lineup jobs easier. I think everyone realizes his positives, but you need to realize his negatives. His offensive usage is WAY too high for a guy who shoots as marginally as he does. He should be 4th option, but he often doesn’t play like he understands this. And as well as he sometimes rebounds and runs the floor, he also often gets completely lost on his off-ball defense, always bites on the pump fake and overestimates his dribbling ability and overall skills. Hes a net-plus, but he was absolutely not the best player on the floor today. Today was a VERY weird game. Take Blair. He commits 9!!!, 9!!!! TOs. That’s an inexcusable number. A run-until-you-vomit number. A buy-a-tennis-racquet number. But he also threw no less than 5 scintillating 50-foot diagonal passes that either directly led to buckets or were hockey assists. His passing was at times absolutely magnificent. While he was at other times a human TO. Really hard to reconcile the two, because most of his TOs weren’t committed in the act of making near-remarkable plays but were of the utterly brain dead variety. It was that kind of game...for literally every major contributor (Blair, Bile, Q, Harris) on the team other than Pickett. Morko was once again very solid. Harris plays super hard, but still can’t finish when he dives into the lane, never gets to the line, struggles to find bigs after initial penetration and gets iso inside picked on by other team’s guards 2/3 poss/game (mouse in house). Q has the hands of a fish. Squeeze it and slam it big fella. Don’t bring it down and don’t get stripped by mice. Offensively, warts were everywhere. Defensively, the guys played what I felt was their best game of the season. I hear all of your bellyaching and you got the stats to prove your arguments and all but there is one stat that you keep ignoring. That stat is 4-2 since Bile has been inserted into the starting lineup. Furthermore look at the "Bile effect" and that is the affect that he has on the rest of his teammates. Wthh Bile on the floor, He makes his teammates so much better, especially Pickett. You used to talk bad about Pickett and now you don't talk bad about Pickett anymore. You know why you don't? It is because now the opponent has to be concerned about Bile now that it takes the stress off of Pickett! Effectively Bile gives us a big 4. He's a threat both on d and offense. The team just started learning how to play together and now they are winning games and you guys want to complain and you cant even see that we are twending upwards now. It is amazing!!
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dchoya72
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,488
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Post by dchoya72 on Feb 14, 2021 8:44:01 GMT -5
To those being hyper-critical of the recruiting classes of Patrick Ewing and his coaching generally. I believe he is getting the best players he can get. He's made some good decisions talented-wise, and others are slow in their development. He has pursued the top talent and has been in the mix, but loss to the bluebloods in the end. He knows talent and scours the earth to bring the best he can to the hilltop. In my opinion, at first he had to show the world what his style of play was, and he has done that. He has not had, until this year vets to show the way and lead the young Hoyas, even our vets are flawed!! I believe prospects can now look at the Hoyas and imagine themselves in the scheme, watch the bungling antics and know how play should be better, and will want to be a part of rebuilding the Hoyas. We have come a long way since Patrick began coaching, and have a long way to go. He is building a winning culture and it is filled with growing pains for him and the players. He is not getting the cream of the crop yet, but they are coming! The players we have have to earn their playing time. If they were kicking butt in practice and dawging the seniors, they would be playing during prime time! They audition for him everyday in practice. Bottom line is the coach wants to win more that we want him to win. He is exercising his authority and prerogative to do things his way. His staff respects that.
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Post by practice on Feb 14, 2021 8:50:29 GMT -5
Ewing is trying to win games. He's playing a tight rotation of 6.5/7 guys. He calls timeouts in the first 2 minutes of games if he doesn't like what he's seeing. The team is 3-2 since the COVID break ... I'll take it!
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smokeyjack
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,300
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Post by smokeyjack on Feb 14, 2021 9:30:36 GMT -5
I think everyone realizes his positives, but you need to realize his negatives. His offensive usage is WAY too high for a guy who shoots as marginally as he does. He should be 4th option, but he often doesn’t play like he understands this. And as well as he sometimes rebounds and runs the floor, he also often gets completely lost on his off-ball defense, always bites on the pump fake and overestimates his dribbling ability and overall skills. Hes a net-plus, but he was absolutely not the best player on the floor today. Today was a VERY weird game. Take Blair. He commits 9!!!, 9!!!! TOs. That’s an inexcusable number. A run-until-you-vomit number. A buy-a-tennis-racquet number. But he also threw no less than 5 scintillating 50-foot diagonal passes that either directly led to buckets or were hockey assists. His passing was at times absolutely magnificent. While he was at other times a human TO. Really hard to reconcile the two, because most of his TOs weren’t committed in the act of making near-remarkable plays but were of the utterly brain dead variety. It was that kind of game...for literally every major contributor (Blair, Bile, Q, Harris) on the team other than Pickett. Morko was once again very solid. Harris plays super hard, but still can’t finish when he dives into the lane, never gets to the line, struggles to find bigs after initial penetration and gets iso inside picked on by other team’s guards 2/3 poss/game (mouse in house). Q has the hands of a fish. Squeeze it and slam it big fella. Don’t bring it down and don’t get stripped by mice. Offensively, warts were everywhere. Defensively, the guys played what I felt was their best game of the season. I hear all of your bellyaching and you got the stats to prove your arguments and all but there is one stat that you keep ignoring. That stat is 4-2 since Bile has been inserted into the starting lineup. Furthermore look at the "Bile effect" and that is the affect that he has on the rest of his teammates. Wthh Bile on the floor, He makes his teammates so much better, especially Pickett. You used to talk bad about Pickett and now you don't talk bad about Pickett anymore. You know why you don't? It is because now the opponent has to be concerned about Bile now that it takes the stress off of Pickett! Effectively Bile gives us a big 4. He's a threat both on d and offense. The team just started learning how to play together and now they are winning games and you guys want to complain and you cant even see that we are twending upwards now. It is amazing!! It’s 3-2, and if you’ve read my posts in the past, you’d know that I not only really like Bile (because he is both a true 4 and an energy guy), but I’ve openly advocated that among seniors and transfers only two I’d like to see back are Bile and Blair. I like Bile. But let’s not act like he’s not deeply flawed and wildly erratic. One thing that doesn’t change about him is his effort, aggression and rugged style of play. Simply put, his flaws can all be addressed relatively easily, and he could take a huge leap in consistency between this season and next. Don’t see that among the benchwarmers, but here’s to unicorns!
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Post by bigelephant on Feb 14, 2021 9:42:33 GMT -5
ditto
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blueandgray
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,762
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Post by blueandgray on Feb 14, 2021 10:15:25 GMT -5
The Berger worship is out of control If by worship you mean those wanting him to see the court for 2-3 minutes in a 20 point blowout....then include me in that group.
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blueandgray
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,762
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Post by blueandgray on Feb 14, 2021 10:16:44 GMT -5
Ewing is trying to win games. He's playing a tight rotation of 6.5/7 guys. He calls timeouts in the first 2 minutes of games if he doesn't like what he's seeing. The team is 3-2 since the COVID break ... I'll take it! This team may finish the regular season 5-5 post-Covid break. I for one did not see that coming.
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