Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Feb 22, 2020 10:51:13 GMT -5
Ewing was on a good path, then the four transfers absolutely devastated the program. Those players were the future. Now we will be mediocre for longer. Poor results and weak attendance.
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 22, 2020 10:54:36 GMT -5
Ewing was on a good path, then the four transfers absolutely devastated the program. Those players were the future. Now we will be mediocre for longer. Poor results and weak attendance. I don't really buy that line of excuse in this area because the four transfers open up a ton of playing time for potential recruits. They've been at it for 3 years and suddenly the forward positions opened up completely with immediate playing time for anyone coming in - that should be very fertile ground for recruiting.
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madgesiq92
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Post by madgesiq92 on Feb 22, 2020 10:58:11 GMT -5
Ewing was on a good path, then the four transfers absolutely devastated the program. Those players were the future. Now we will be mediocre for longer. Poor results and weak attendance. Only problem with that is that the quality of basketball that the team is playing objectively improved after they left.
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Feb 22, 2020 10:59:53 GMT -5
Ewing was on a good path, then the four transfers absolutely devastated the program. Those players were the future. Now we will be mediocre for longer. Poor results and weak attendance. I don't really buy that line of excuse in this area because the four transfers open up a ton of playing time for potential recruits. They've been at it for 3 years and suddenly the forward positions opened up completely with immediate playing time for anyone coming in - that should be very fertile ground for recruiting. You can’t keep losing seasoned players and replace them with freshmen. We lost four key pieces. Also, we miss Walker. This team has no PF.
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Feb 22, 2020 11:05:36 GMT -5
Ewing was on a good path, then the four transfers absolutely devastated the program. Those players were the future. Now we will be mediocre for longer. Poor results and weak attendance. Only problem with that is that the quality of basketball that the team is playing objectively improved after they left. We lost the better individual talents and our future. We were lucky to have upperclassmen to step up. We lose Allen, Mosley and Yurtseven. The facts are we are in 8th place, unranked and NIT bound.
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Post by Ranch Dressing on Feb 22, 2020 11:28:33 GMT -5
Ewing was on a good path, then the four transfers absolutely devastated the program. Those players were the future. Now we will be mediocre for longer. Poor results and weak attendance. I don't really buy that line of excuse in this area because the four transfers open up a ton of playing time for potential recruits. They've been at it for 3 years and suddenly the forward positions opened up completely with immediate playing time for anyone coming in - that should be very fertile ground for recruiting. I don't disagree with the premise that playing time opens up opportunity, but what we lost was time. Ewing can and will fill the gaps with talent. But key departures from 2 consecutive recruiting classes means the rebuilding plan was effectively delayed 1-2 years. Need to recruit and retain talent to get competitive again. Hurts.
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guru
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Post by guru on Feb 22, 2020 11:45:51 GMT -5
Consistently? In his last 4 seasons he was 8 games under .500 in the Big East. He finished 7th, 8th and 9th in 3 of those years. They were stellar in 2014-2015 and finished 2nd in the Big East. Beat E. Washington in Rd 1 and loss to Utah in Rd. 2. So the consistency in that 4 year stretch was bottom half of the Big East for 3 of 4 years and small upset in Rd 2 of NCAA.They did make it to rd 2 of NIT in 2013-2014. 4 years before that 7th, 8th, 4th and 1st. So 2 out of 4 years in top half of Big East. That did include 4 straight NCAA appearances with him going 1 and 3 in the tournament. That stretch included a humiliating lost as a 2 seed to FLorida Gulf Coast in Rd 1, getting blown up by Ohio as 3 seed in rd 1 and another blow out by 18 as a seed 6 to VCU. Then a 2nd round loss as a 3 seed to an 11 seed. His first 5 years cannot be questioned it included a Final Four and a Sweet Sixteen another rd of 32 appearance and 2 NIT appearances. Which deservedly bought him 8 years of mediocrity. So in the last 8 years as the head coach he finished below 7th 5 of the 8 years. Went 2 - 4 in NCAA's with 3 awful losses, literally awful. Agree Ewing better get moving in year 4 but let's not pretend the goalposts were that remarkable over the last 8 years and if 3 out of 8 years is considered consistent then I don't know the definition of the word. I am not defending nor bashing Ewing as a coach and the results are not there yet but JT3 for almost the last decade of his tenure was no Wooden. The last few years of the JT3 era was some of the most painful basketball I’ve ever had to watch. Even the good seasons were capped with utter humiliations. The hole we are still digging out of is the direct result. Ewing has had significant setbacks - I was ambivalent to disappointed when he was hired - but I think there have been moments where he has proven that he can coach. I still think this years team will be in the tourney, too.
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 22, 2020 12:20:17 GMT -5
Call me old fashioned and a geezer but I just don't get it. A kid considers coming to GU to play basketball but opts instead for Ok. State. Huh? I realize that there are lots of things going through a kids mind and many factors influencing his decision but you turn down an offer to play basketball at a top academic institution under an NBA Hall of Fame coach in a dominant basketball conference that plays in the nations largest media market and instead opt to play at Ok. State? Someone please tell me what I'm missing. Are we looking at under the table money? Or is it that our academic standards are too high? I'm really starting to believe that our recruiting pool, and not our recruiters, is the problem. There just aren't that many top quality high school basketball recruits that want to play at a University like GU. Have we become too "elite" both academically and socio/economically?
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Feb 22, 2020 13:01:36 GMT -5
Call me old fashioned and a geezer but I just don't get it. A kid considers coming to GU to play basketball but opts instead for Ok. State. Huh? I realize that there are lots of things going through a kids mind and many factors influencing his decision but you turn down an offer to play basketball at a top academic institution under an NBA Hall of Fame coach in a dominant basketball conference that plays in the nations largest media market and instead opt to play at Ok. State? Someone please tell me what I'm missing. Are we looking at under the table money? Or is it that our academic standards are too high? I'm really starting to believe that our recruiting pool, and not our recruiters, is the problem. There just aren't that many top quality high school basketball recruits that want to play at a University like GU. Have we become too "elite" both academically and socio/economically? It's not just Oklahoma State because, frankly, Ewing has lost recruiting battles across the board. But to your question, three points: 1. Why Stillwater? A lot of good recruits end up in places like Stillwater or Tallahassee or Waco because they are looking for three things out of college, none of which involve academic prestige or if they can rub shoulders with a future ambassador: 1) are they wanted (i.e., how long has the school been recruiting them versus just showing up at a gym and offering a scholarship), 2) are they bring developed for the NBA (recruits know which programs develop talent and which do not), and 3) are they being seen by parents and fans and potential NBA clubs (on ESPN, for example). "When I went on the visit Coach (Mike) Boynton really laid the plan out for me in terms of what they need from me," Moncreiffe told Sports Illustrated. What was Georgetown's plan for him? 2. I don't think academic standards are in play at all. There was a time where Georgetown would not go below a certain threshold but the Big East now all recruits at the same level--if you can qualify by NCAA minimums, you can be admitted. That Georgetown took in Galen Alexander after his incident at LSU is an example of this. 3. Basketball (or football) players aren't judging a student body by the average household incomes or their propensity to watch Fox or MSNBC. They go where they can succeed which, to many, is defined as the NBA. Absent 10-day players (something nearly every school can claim), Georgetown has had one NBA player drafted since 2010. Is that a measure of success? We may disagree from Georgetown's lofty perch but 0.0% of recruits are asking Ewing about SFS 100 or Donald Trump or whether the campus is sustainable-friendly. They see the future of Georgetown's program, and ask where they fit into it.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Feb 22, 2020 13:08:30 GMT -5
Gtown has to walk before it can run, I'd worry about winning big in the Big East after they start consistently finishing in the top half of the conference... Categorize the recruits how you want to but I do like the fact that Sibley, Beard & Clark all know how to play & contribute without being the stars of their teams(all high-level HS programs btw)... Time will tell how it works out for PE/staff... You need to re-read DFWs post from yesterday. We have a top 10 budget, just built a $60MM facility and made Ewing one of the highest paid coaches in the nation. The recruiting class we landed this year is full of complementary players bc we missed on our top targets from high level programs— Pat doesn’t fly around the country offering 4 and 5 star players because he likes photo ops and frequent flyer miles. The “plan” isn’t to get 3 star under the radar kids. He knows the type of talent it takes to win at the level Georgetown needs to to sustain the program. Forget about the blue bloods, we are not recruiting w the Marquette’s, Xavier’s and Butlers of the world right now — each of whom have top 20 recruiting classes with 3 four stars. We still need to land a program changing recruit — hopefully 2021 is the year that the relationships he and his staff have built pay off. Until then, he will make the best of what we can with the kids that he brought in— all of whom look like solid kids who can ultimately be role players on a winning team. But don’t kid yourself that this is the plan. If we're being honest we'd all have to admit that each of these schools has better basketball infrastructures than Gtown does especially Xavier & Butler so it shouldn't be a surprise that they're outperforming Gtown on the recruiting trail right now...
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madgesiq92
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Post by madgesiq92 on Feb 22, 2020 13:52:26 GMT -5
You need to re-read DFWs post from yesterday. We have a top 10 budget, just built a $60MM facility and made Ewing one of the highest paid coaches in the nation. The recruiting class we landed this year is full of complementary players bc we missed on our top targets from high level programs— Pat doesn’t fly around the country offering 4 and 5 star players because he likes photo ops and frequent flyer miles. The “plan” isn’t to get 3 star under the radar kids. He knows the type of talent it takes to win at the level Georgetown needs to to sustain the program. Forget about the blue bloods, we are not recruiting w the Marquette’s, Xavier’s and Butlers of the world right now — each of whom have top 20 recruiting classes with 3 four stars. We still need to land a program changing recruit — hopefully 2021 is the year that the relationships he and his staff have built pay off. Until then, he will make the best of what we can with the kids that he brought in— all of whom look like solid kids who can ultimately be role players on a winning team. But don’t kid yourself that this is the plan. If we're being honest we'd all have to admit that each of these schools has better basketball infrastructures than Gtown does especially Xavier & Butler so it shouldn't be a surprise that they're outperforming Gtown on the recruiting trail right now... I disagree with your assumption. We just fundraised and built a $62 million athletic center over 50% of which is specifically for the basketball program. If you’re telling me that we shouldn’t use Xavier as a measuring stick, we may as well play in the Patriot League and abandon all pretenses of being a national program.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2020 13:57:53 GMT -5
Can't believe you all are melting down over losing this kid. C'mon guys...
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Feb 22, 2020 14:05:20 GMT -5
If we're being honest we'd all have to admit that each of these schools has better basketball infrastructures than Gtown does especially Xavier & Butler so it shouldn't be a surprise that they're outperforming Gtown on the recruiting trail right now... I disagree with your assumption. We just fundraised and built a $62 million athletic center over 50% of which is specifically for the basketball program. If you’re telling me that we shouldn’t use Xavier as a measuring stick, we may as well play in the Patriot League and abandon all pretenses of being a national program. I'm not telling you that Gtown shouldn't use Xavier as a measuring stick, they definitely should. What I'm telling you is that they are a better basketball program than Gtown is right now and that it doesn't surprise me that they are outperforming Gtown recruiting wise right now... Xavier is built to succeed, they've done it with multiple coaches, their administration is invested in it... Can folks say the same for Gtown?
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kbones17
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Post by kbones17 on Feb 22, 2020 14:10:11 GMT -5
Committing to Ok St indicates to me that he thinks of himself of more of a one and done type player (like Cade). Which is fine by me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2020 14:20:38 GMT -5
Committing to Ok St indicates to me that he thinks of himself of more of a one and done type player (like Cade). Which is fine by me. He said in this interview he wants to play 1 year in college and go to NBA.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2020 14:22:36 GMT -5
Kobe Clark > Moncrieffe I don't care about the rankings
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 22, 2020 14:31:35 GMT -5
Raises the question, if the kid was planning on being a one and done why even bother recruiting him in the first place? Why waste the time and money?
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guru
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Post by guru on Feb 22, 2020 14:32:39 GMT -5
I disagree with your assumption. We just fundraised and built a $62 million athletic center over 50% of which is specifically for the basketball program. If you’re telling me that we shouldn’t use Xavier as a measuring stick, we may as well play in the Patriot League and abandon all pretenses of being a national program. I'm not telling you that Gtown shouldn't use Xavier as a measuring stick, they definitely should. What I'm telling you is that they are a better basketball program than Gtown is right now and that it doesn't surprise me that they are outperforming Gtown recruiting wise right now... Xavier is built to succeed, they've done it with multiple coaches, their administration is invested in it... Can folks say the same for Gtown? Xavier has been a better program than Georgetown for the past 25 years. Maybe longer. Just look at the results.
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guru
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Post by guru on Feb 22, 2020 14:34:12 GMT -5
Can't believe you all are melting down over losing this kid. C'mon guys... It is a little crazy. This guys not even top 100, right? I’d say recruits ranked above 50 are a crapshoot. Above 100 even more so. It’s just another opportunity for the same old posters to tell us the sky is falling.
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 22, 2020 14:58:09 GMT -5
Call me old fashioned and a geezer but I just don't get it. A kid considers coming to GU to play basketball but opts instead for Ok. State. Huh? I realize that there are lots of things going through a kids mind and many factors influencing his decision but you turn down an offer to play basketball at a top academic institution under an NBA Hall of Fame coach in a dominant basketball conference that plays in the nations largest media market and instead opt to play at Ok. State? Someone please tell me what I'm missing. Are we looking at under the table money? Or is it that our academic standards are too high? I'm really starting to believe that our recruiting pool, and not our recruiters, is the problem. There just aren't that many top quality high school basketball recruits that want to play at a University like GU. Have we become too "elite" both academically and socio/economically? It's not just Oklahoma State because, frankly, Ewing has lost recruiting battles across the board. But to your question, three points: 1. Why Stillwater? A lot of good recruits end up in places like Stillwater or Tallahassee or Waco because they are looking for three things out of college, none of which involve academic prestige or if they can rub shoulders with a future ambassador: 1) are they wanted (i.e., how long has the school been recruiting them versus just showing up at a gym and offering a scholarship), 2) are they bring developed for the NBA (recruits know which programs develop talent and which do not), and 3) are they being seen by parents and fans and potential NBA clubs (on ESPN, for example). "When I went on the visit Coach (Mike) Boynton really laid the plan out for me in terms of what they need from me," Moncreiffe told Sports Illustrated. What was Georgetown's plan for him? 2. I don't think academic standards are in play at all. There was a time where Georgetown would not go below a certain threshold but the Big East now all recruits at the same level--if you can qualify by NCAA minimums, you can be admitted. That Georgetown took in Galen Alexander after his incident at LSU is an example of this. 3. Basketball (or football) players aren't judging a student body by the average household incomes or their propensity to watch Fox or MSNBC. They go where they can succeed which, to many, is defined as the NBA. Absent 10-day players (something nearly every school can claim), Georgetown has had one NBA player drafted since 2010. Is that a measure of success? We may disagree from Georgetown's lofty perch but 0.0% of recruits are asking Ewing about SFS 100 or Donald Trump or whether the campus is sustainable-friendly. They see the future of Georgetown's program, and ask where they fit into it. Thanks for the input. My concern is it's not a matter of kids not interested in or intimidated by our academic programs but rather not feeling comfortable on a campus full of kids coming from families that can afford to pay $60k a year in tuition. I can tell you from personal experience that the atmosphere at GU is much different than that at many of our BE competitors and big state schools.
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