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Post by RockawayHoya on Dec 18, 2018 20:53:07 GMT -5
Happy to get a double digit win (finally), but man... not a whole lot encouraging about tonight.
Was looking for the following tonight:
Alleninxis' analytics post on CH confirmed what most of us already knew. Leblanc and Malinowski have to play more, Trey has to play less. And what we saw tonight completely ignored those findings; Trey made a bunch of mistakes early and we started slow out of the gate again (no surprise). Greg didn't even see the court in the first half, but was a difference maker in the 2nd. Let a largely mediocre team like App. St. hang around and they start to get the belief that they can pull it off. That's on Pat for not making the obvious lineup adjustments that have been screaming at him. For my money, the analytics guy we supposedly hired in the offseason can pack his bags and leave tomorrow morning.
Jessie needed to play better after a poor game on both ends vs. SMU. He hit a big 3 down the stretch, but overall he was even worse tonight. Zero D, careless turnovers at midcourt, poor entry into Trey that should've been stolen but luckily deflected to Akinjo, missed open jumpers, etc. Not sure what is wrong with him right now, but his level of energy is extremely low. We cannot hope to compete in conference this year with Jessie motoring around at anything less than his 100%.
Thankfully it looks like Pickett's absence was limited to one game, because without his defense vs. the likes of Mourning/Kaleb/others, we may have lost this one too.
As has plagued us for a year and a half, our decision making coming down the stretch was again questionable. How you can turn a 7 point lead with the ball and 4:30 to go to a 3 point lead and the other team having possession with 3:50 to go is mind-boggling. 3 turnovers and just rushing every single possession for no reason. Even James' pull up at the elbow was rushed. This team has GOT to start to learn how to burn some clock towards the end of games with a lead. It is going to unnecessarily cost us games against better teams. Have James dribble at half court till the shot clock gets to 10 and let him go. This again is on Pat for not reeling his guys in when the situation warrants it. Pat's post game comment with Lavin re: telling James "just go ahead and play" at halftime screams "I have no clue what else to tell him." It was alarming.
Aside from Greg's timely shooting and passable defense (which is starting to be something we can count on more often than not), one positive was Carter looking like he's finally making some strides and could push for some spot minutes. If he can play at least halfway credible defense, box out, and hit the rare open jumper, there is a role for him on this year's team. I'd rather see him shoot the 3 than Trey, that's for sure.
Hoping to see some improvement in these key areas that we didn't see tonight on Saturday. Time is running out before we have to run through the conference gauntlet, and I'm still not sure Pat has figured out which combinations work and which don't, what problem areas to focus on in practice, etc.
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bamahoya11
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Post by bamahoya11 on Dec 18, 2018 21:01:28 GMT -5
Once again, Josh with easily the best +/- on the team today. Whatever you think of the stat, the fact that he's ALWAYS on the + side of it means something indeed. I already bragged on him in my longer post on the game, but Josh LeBlanc makes it worth the time and money to go to a game these days. He is by far the best defender on this team -- no one else comes close. He is our most reliable rebounder and a surprisingly good passer. He could stand to improve on offense, but he's still a major impact there. I want to see him finish more at the rim and frankly create more instead of passing up options. I'm of the view this team too often just shoots it from the perimeter when we should rely on one of the better front courts (at least offensively) in the Big East. |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 18, 2018 21:06:28 GMT -5
Look, there has been a lot of questioning why Mourning is stealing minutes from Leblanc but tonight's game has me wondering if he's also stealing minutes that Carter should get. Carter didn't seem scared to shoot when he was wide open but also seemed to recognize that he needs to give it up when he doesn't have an ideal shot. More frustrating to me than Mourning's defense capabilities is that he tries to do too much on offense when he is the 5th scoring option in the floor. He has the best looking entry passes of a big man that we've had in a long time but it seems like Pat's got to figure out how to get his players to play the role that the team needs. Carter also looked competent defensively, he was able to hedge & get back, he also deflected a couple of passes... I'd like to see more time for GM, JL & Carter... |
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DallasHoya
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Post by DallasHoya on Dec 18, 2018 21:40:08 GMT -5
2 or 3 great scripted plays out of a TO is a positive development.
My favorite development, though, is when Mac shoots free throws at the end, with no Hoyas in rebounding position, makes the first and always gives the low five motions to absolutely no one.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Dec 18, 2018 21:45:14 GMT -5
There's just something not quite sharp on either end of the court. That's my biggest takeaway.
On offense, we are slow to get into the sets, the cuts and passes are a step slow, and we don't seem to have secondary action that results in good looks. We missed a bunch of open looks but that's going to happen.
On D, I think our help is primarily good. Our rotations are there....they're just not quick close outs. The primary issue is just that the primary defender gets beat so darned often. Again, it's all just a step slow.
It seems unconscionable to me that we can't get Jesse more looks. It's not like he's Josh Smith...you can run pick and pops with him. Hell we can run some down screens for him.
And you can add me to the LeBlanc masses. But we do need to remember that he played 24 minutes. At most he's going to get another handful.
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mfk24
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Post by mfk24 on Dec 18, 2018 22:04:11 GMT -5
Happy to get a double digit win (finally), but man... not a whole lot encouraging about tonight. Was looking for the following tonight: Alleninxis' analytics post on CH confirmed what most of us already knew. Leblanc and Malinowski have to play more, Trey has to play less. And what we saw tonight completely ignored those findings; Trey made a bunch of mistakes early and we started slow out of the gate again (no surprise). Greg didn't even see the court in the first half, but was a difference maker in the 2nd. Let a largely mediocre team like App. St. hang around and they start to get the belief that they can pull it off. That's on Pat for not making the obvious lineup adjustments that have been screaming at him. For my money, the analytics guy we supposedly hired in the offseason can pack his bags and leave tomorrow morning. Jessie needed to play better after a poor game on both ends vs. SMU. He hit a big 3 down the stretch, but overall he was even worse tonight. Zero D, careless turnovers at midcourt, poor entry into Trey that should've been stolen but luckily deflected to Akinjo, missed open jumpers, etc. Not sure what is wrong with him right now, but his level of energy is extremely low. We cannot hope to compete in conference this year with Jessie motoring around at anything less than his 100%. Thankfully it looks like Pickett's absence was limited to one game, because without his defense vs. the likes of Mourning/Kaleb/others, we may have lost this one too. As has plagued us for a year and a half, our decision making coming down the stretch was again questionable. How you can turn a 7 point lead with the ball and 4:30 to go to a 3 point lead and the other team having possession with 3:50 to go is mind-boggling. 3 turnovers and just rushing every single possession for no reason. Even James' pull up at the elbow was rushed. This team has GOT to start to learn how to burn some clock towards the end of games with a lead. It is going to unnecessarily cost us games against better teams. Have James dribble at half court till the shot clock gets to 10 and let him go. This again is on Pat for not reeling his guys in when the situation warrants it. Pat's post game comment with Lavin re: telling James "just go ahead and play" at halftime screams "I have no clue what else to tell him." It was alarming. Aside from Greg's timely shooting and passable defense (which is starting to be something we can count on more often than not), one positive was Carter looking like he's finally making some strides and could push for some spot minutes. If he can play at least halfway credible defense, box out, and hit the rare open jumper, there is a role for him on this year's team. I'd rather see him shoot the 3 than Trey, that's for sure. Hoping to see some improvement in these key areas that we didn't see tonight on Saturday. Time is running out before we have to run through the conference gauntlet, and I'm still not sure Pat has figured out which combinations work and which don't, what problem areas to focus on in practice, etc. The thing is there are multiple problem areas, hard to pick just a few. Personnel wise, there’s no way to please everyone and w/ 11 guys you could realistically give minutes to, it’s hard to see where there could be a consistent rotation. He seems to use guys situationally but there are some redundancies like Malinowksi and Blair for example and guys who are one dimensional/essentially defense only like Jagan and Kaleb. Sad to say but I think he could probably drop Kaleb from the rotation entirely except for foul trouble situations. I also think for all the talk there are some really good plays in the offense that don’t always get well executed. We ran good stuff to get Greg open from 3, there’s a play with Govan and Akinjo where he sets a brush screen and Govan ends up open for 3 almost every time. The play that Leblanc dunked on also had a shooter wide open in the opposite corner for a 3. There are some good pin down plays for Govan to get the ball in the post, some high-low big to big action, pick and pop for short jumpers for Govan, we ran quite a few plays to get Malinowksi open for 3. Unfortunately it’s just choppy and disjointed right now. A huge part of that is guys will will take the first semi-available open shot in a set instead of working for a better shot. For example, right before the barrage of second half turnovers l, Ewing called out a play, Leblanc set a screen for Mac which he came off of for a pull up 3. Do I think that was the shot Ewing wanted? Sure didn’t seem like it given his yelling and facial expression. Mac has to learn that there is probably a better shot available by making the extra pass. I hear Ewing saying “move” or “move the ball” quite often so clearly he wants more ball and player movement. To me that says it’s an execution issue. The backcourt needs to learn to balance getting their own shots with getting shots for their teammates and that’s a bigger challenge for these guys because they believe they can get theirs anytime they want. I also didn’t take Pat’s comments as not knowing what to tell Akinjo, he clearly said that in the first half he told Akinjo to focus on getting others involved first before looking for his own shots. Sounded to me like Akinjo asked Coach to loosen the reins a little and let him play his game to which he obliged. You can argue if that was the right decision or not but again these guys are learning that balance and rewarding him a bit can also be positive. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2018 22:06:29 GMT -5
Josh has to start and play at least 28-30 minutes a night.
There's a very good case to be made that he's the best player on our roster right now. Which honestly, for reasons unknown, is something I hadn't considered until tonight.
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skunk
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Post by skunk on Dec 18, 2018 22:18:59 GMT -5
Josh has to start and play at least 28-30 minutes a night. There's a very good case to be made that he's the best player on our roster right now. Which honestly, for reasons unknown, is something I hadn't considered until tonight. When akinjo and Leblanc come off the floor, I notice the biggest difference. We need those 2 as well govan to play a lot of minutes. I personally think GM needs more minutes as well. |
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Post by HometownHoya on Dec 18, 2018 22:25:07 GMT -5
Sharing the ball? I do too but that didnt work well with the last coach and this coach has only worked with star PGs that have been trusted with the ball, to break their man down and to make the right decision. Now I hope Pat adjusts and realizes in CBB it's not just an allstar PG and a bunch of finishes but so far, this offense is predicated on beating the D with that first move then finding the next pass or shot. Yes, share the ball, move the ball, the ball sticks wayy too much with this team... It worked very well until JT3 lost his way... Akinjo is very good but Gtown doesn't have the personnel to have him distribute to the way you're describing... Plus he's a scorer 1st anyway so that makes it that much harder to do for him... Once the BE season starts, I think this team will be easy to defend... In my eyes, you are right. I definitely preferred JTIII's team oriented style of basketball but once he lost the guys that could win 1 on 1 match-ups, it was too easy to defend the one dimensional players. I also agree that Akinjo is a score first PG but that is where Pat's coaching needs to come in. Teach him that his teammates are there for him. I disagree that we don't have the personnel around him to distribute. Pat just needs to find the right off-ball sets to get guys available where they are comfortable: Pickett at the high-post extended, Jessie anywhere, Mourning at the elbow, LeBlanc for dump offs, Mac with a lane to the rim, Greg for any 3pt shot, Blair with a set shot, etc. Plus James needs to be comfortable not only dumping the ball off but getting it to guys outside the arc. This team has talent. Definitely not the exact talent if Pat drafted everyone to run his sets but enough to make it work. While our offense isn't perfect and isn't the ideal type of team ball, it will get the job done as long as we are shooting around average (which we haven't done every game). The real key to our season will be defense, which I'm not sure how we solve it. We dont have the length up top to run zone and we don't have the athleticism in the middle and on both wings (outside of line-ups with both Pickett and LeBlanc) to run man. Pack the line would be perfect for this team but it's too late for that. We will just need to be a help heavy team and get our rotations down. |
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mdtd
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Post by mdtd on Dec 18, 2018 22:48:11 GMT -5
Defense was better, gave up 73 to a team that averages 79.6 (excluding the two d2 teams) before the game. Better, defense was sloppy at times though. The offense did seem slow at times but, it picked up towards the end. I like how many lineup combinations were used, granted most out of necessity, because at this point we need a money lineup. Ideally, I want to see some more small ball with Malinowski running the 4 at some rare points, just to see if it creates match up problems. We are behind at this stage, need to try out as much as possible to catch up to other teams in the conference. Meh win really, 10 over a team that shouldn't be that close. Improvement is coming, hope to see significant improvement from the SMU game to that Butler game and these next 2 are crucial for that.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 18, 2018 23:20:47 GMT -5
I think I watched a much different game than those in the game thread. Obviously, this team isn't a great team, but I saw some levels of progress to see the team win by 10 despite a complete no show by Govan. - The Hoyas absolutely deserved their high 3pt shooting this game. Almost all of our threes taken were open. People have a strong hatred of early shot clock threes; I don't if they are open and in rhythm, especially those close to the line. I don't remember a bad three, except the Trey Mourning 3. That's a big reason why we shot 45%.
- We ran a ton more plays this game than we have previously, especially in the second half. It was good to see Ewing take more control, even when the execution didn't work. App St.'s last run wasn't driven by a lack of direction, despite some poster's view in the game thread -- it was just crappy execution leading to a few straight turnovers. That's completely different than without a plan. And the plays were largely successful -- that last clear out with the dish to LeBlanc for the dunk was very nice. So were the simple screens to Malinowski, though we twice screwed those up in execution.
- Akinjo was great on offense. He got bullied a bit on defense, but the effort was there. But he ran the offense very well. Yes, once or twice he got ahead of himself / didn't make the right call on dishing the ball. But for the most part, he made the right pass, kept the ball moving and didn't dominate nearly as much. Strong progress.
- Lots of good out of bounds plays as well
- Seventeen assists on 28 made shots is pretty good. Not Warriors-like ball movement, but we actually assist on a high % of our baskets, which doesn't quite fit the narrative.
- As much as I thought the play calling was much more controlled and thus better, the minutes choices continue to confound a bit. Govan wasn't good, but Mourning was worse than his box score. Good to see Josh get 30+ minutes but I wonder if that is true in a game where Jessie isn't in foul trouble or bad. Kaleb was also not good.
- Best part of today was Pickett playing with energy, getting into position for shots and taking them. We need both his spacing and defensive length -- we are a much better team with Pickett around.
- The reason why App St stayed anywhere near us in this game was the fact that we somehow were outrebounded and committed more turnovers. Many of the turnovers are still dumb -- we had several players bobble away easy layups, for example. And Akinjo and Malinowski both had terrible live ball giveaways late. But more damning is getting outworked on the boards. Part of the reason teams like App State rarely beat high majors is that they usually have to overcome a rebounding disparity even if they can outshoot the opponent. We didn't have that -- in fact, they got more chances than us.
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vv83
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Post by vv83 on Dec 18, 2018 23:26:24 GMT -5
The first half defense was typically poor, but I thought we did a decent job on D in the second half. We closed out a lot better on their 3 point shooters in the second half. They had a number of really bad misses because we were contesting the shot so heavily. We also contested some of their inside shots in the second half. The D we played in the second half can at least allow us to compete with decent teams. The first half defense is not beating anyone.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on Dec 18, 2018 23:40:24 GMT -5
The first half defense was typically poor, but I thought we did a decent job on D in the second half. We closed out a lot better on their 3 point shooters in the second half. They had a number of really bad misses because we were contesting the shot so heavily. We also contested some of their inside shots in the second half. The D we played in the second half can at least allow us to compete with decent teams. The first half defense is not beating anyone. We traded bad d for sloppy TOs in 2nd half |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 19, 2018 1:00:07 GMT -5
Everybody but Mosely scored! Because he didn't shoot! 14 mins and zero shots. 0 TO, 2 Assists, 2 Steals and 2 rbs was good. Last 3 games: 58 minutes played and just 1 shot. |
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kbones17
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Post by kbones17 on Dec 19, 2018 3:05:47 GMT -5
We left about 10-12 points out there on bunnies that we missed (and should have converted). Game was much closer than it should have been because of that. Still had our usual allotment of sloppy TO’s. I would like us to slow our pace a bit; we simply aren’t skilled or experienced enough to play at the pace we attempt and it shows every game. Part of our defensive woes are due to these live ball TO’s and to the defensive confusion of our (poor) transition defense.
On a different note, it’s just plain odd that Malinowski plays zero minutes in the first half and then most of the final 15 minutes. The other side of the coin is that Pickett mostly sits in the second half. I’d like to see us play some of a Akinjo (or Mac), Pickett, Malinowski, Leblanc, Govan lineup. That lineup should hold up on D (unless you have two really quick guards) and gets your three best 3 pt shooters on the floor.
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Post by ewingitrust on Dec 19, 2018 4:53:57 GMT -5
Everybody but Mosely scored! ...a couple months from now we might point back to this game as the one where everything finally clicked. It's unorthodox; but i like the "play whoever's hot" mentality coach seems to have. Use our depth, reward good play and when your number's called...be expected to contribute/perform. |
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Post by Ranch Dressing on Dec 19, 2018 6:27:04 GMT -5
Everybody but Mosely scored! ...a couple months from now we might point back to this game as the one where everything finally clicked. It's unorthodox; but i like the "play whoever's hot" mentality coach seems to have. Use our depth, reward good play and when your number's called...be expected to contribute/perform. Mosely played okay. He must lead the nation in charges taken per minutes played. |
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SSHoya
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"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Post by SSHoya on Dec 19, 2018 6:50:52 GMT -5
...a couple months from now we might point back to this game as the one where everything finally clicked. It's unorthodox; but i like the "play whoever's hot" mentality coach seems to have. Use our depth, reward good play and when your number's called...be expected to contribute/perform. Mosely played okay. He must lead the nation in charges taken per minutes played. What's the net on charges taken v. TOs for the season? |
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by SaxaCD on Dec 19, 2018 7:33:36 GMT -5
...a couple months from now we might point back to this game as the one where everything finally clicked. It's unorthodox; but i like the "play whoever's hot" mentality coach seems to have. Use our depth, reward good play and when your number's called...be expected to contribute/perform. Mosely played okay. He must lead the nation in charges taken per minutes played. He had 2 but ref robbed him of one! |
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Post by aleutianhoya on Dec 19, 2018 7:36:52 GMT -5
I think I watched a much different game than those in the game thread. Obviously, this team isn't a great team, but I saw some levels of progress to see the team win by 10 despite a complete no show by Govan. - The Hoyas absolutely deserved their high 3pt shooting this game. Almost all of our threes taken were open. People have a strong hatred of early shot clock threes; I don't if they are open and in rhythm, especially those close to the line. I don't remember a bad three, except the Trey Mourning 3. That's a big reason why we shot 45%.
- We ran a ton more plays this game than we have previously, especially in the second half. It was good to see Ewing take more control, even when the execution didn't work. App St.'s last run wasn't driven by a lack of direction, despite some poster's view in the game thread -- it was just crappy execution leading to a few straight turnovers. That's completely different than without a plan. And the plays were largely successful -- that last clear out with the dish to LeBlanc for the dunk was very nice. So were the simple screens to Malinowski, though we twice screwed those up in execution.
- Akinjo was great on offense. He got bullied a bit on defense, but the effort was there. But he ran the offense very well. Yes, once or twice he got ahead of himself / didn't make the right call on dishing the ball. But for the most part, he made the right pass, kept the ball moving and didn't dominate nearly as much. Strong progress.
- Lots of good out of bounds plays as well
- Seventeen assists on 28 made shots is pretty good. Not Warriors-like ball movement, but we actually assist on a high % of our baskets, which doesn't quite fit the narrative.
- As much as I thought the play calling was much more controlled and thus better, the minutes choices continue to confound a bit. Govan wasn't good, but Mourning was worse than his box score. Good to see Josh get 30+ minutes but I wonder if that is true in a game where Jessie isn't in foul trouble or bad. Kaleb was also not good.
- Best part of today was Pickett playing with energy, getting into position for shots and taking them. We need both his spacing and defensive length -- we are a much better team with Pickett around.
- The reason why App St stayed anywhere near us in this game was the fact that we somehow were outrebounded and committed more turnovers. Many of the turnovers are still dumb -- we had several players bobble away easy layups, for example. And Akinjo and Malinowski both had terrible live ball giveaways late. But more damning is getting outworked on the boards. Part of the reason teams like App State rarely beat high majors is that they usually have to overcome a rebounding disparity even if they can outshoot the opponent. We didn't have that -- in fact, they got more chances than us.
I don't mind the right people taking early threes but Mac (or any big other than Jesse) really shouldn't be. I think we actually have run plays on most possessions throughout the year and maybe the execution has improved, but it's still very crappy. Agree to disagree on James. I think he remains a ball-stopper. His first instinct when he gets the ball is to bounce it. Maybe that's by design (and he's obviously very dangerous with the bounce). In any event, it's more the off-the-ball action that's lacking. The screens aren't solid, the cuts are lazy, and the weak-side action is either not drawn up correctly or run very poorly. My concern is that there's not much we do that's overly intricate on either offense or defense, so the execution should be really, really good at this point. I get that we're young. But rubbing hard off a pin-down screen isn't exactly an advanced concept! Defensively, to be fair, it may be more an issue of foot speed than execution, but it still looks to me like we fail to close out appropriately. Perhaps there's been improvement, but we need to get a lot better. Quickly. At this point in the season, the margins of victory don't lie. We've played 2 games against 200-300 teams and didn't beat either of them by over 10. We've played 4 games against KenPom 100-200 teams and have lost 1 and failed to win by more than 10 points against the other 3 of them. Illinois, SMU and Liberty are all ranked in the 90s. Illinois was a good (but not great) win. We lost to SMU. And Liberty is 93....we played them close. Syracuse obviously was a very close loss -- probably our best result of the season statistically. Well, four of our nine conference opponents are ranked in the top 50. The other five are in the top 100. |
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