Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2016 18:40:31 GMT -5
Broadus brought in Peak I believe, Hardy brought in Govan but personally I think it's a major opportunity more than a major loss.. Hardy only brought in 1 guy...paul white. That's it. He worked hard on Jessie, JG said so himself 3 gets an assist and Broadus also helped a lot and was on him 1st...but I know for a fact his people always thought Gtown was a perfect fit.. Not quite a Markel situation but he was a Gtown lean as long as they showed him love |
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Post by professorhoya on May 5, 2016 19:24:55 GMT -5
Hardy was from Northwestern where he was assistant coach for 7 years under Bill Carmody who runs a Princeton offense and is a Princeton alum.
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on May 5, 2016 21:02:03 GMT -5
Chicago Tribune stated that Hardy played a role in bringing Peak to Georgetown in this profile where Hardy was mentioned as a potential head coaching option for DePaul... "Hardy, 35, helped recruit Paul White and LJ Peak to Georgetown" www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/ct-depaul-coaching-candidates-spt-0316-20150315-story.htmlNBCSports thought so as well... "Hardy has already made a major splash under John Thompson III’s staff at Georgetown by continuing to harvest players from the fertile recruiting ground of Chicago and helping the Hoyas land the (former) Whitney Young duo of L.J. Peak and Paul White." collegebasketball.nbcsports.com/tag/tavaras-hardy/To imply that Hardy wasn't a factor in LJ being a Hoya is disingenous and reeks of sour grapes, IMO. You're wrong my friend. Hardy had nothing to do with LJ. Do you think that Hardy's people may have had something to do with these articles being written. Hardy has every interest in making himself look important....so he is taking credit where he can. I have first hand knowledge of these recruitments ...this is not guess work. Further, it's important to note that Hardy's departure was not a surprise to jt3. There was always a bit of a fit issue in my opinion. Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one. |
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on May 5, 2016 21:18:19 GMT -5
You're wrong my friend. Hardy had nothing to do with LJ. Do you think that Hardy's people may have had something to do with these articles being written. Hardy has every interest in making himself look important....so he is taking credit where he can. I have first hand knowledge of these recruitments ...this is not guess work. Further, it's important to note that Hardy's departure was not a surprise to jt3. There was always a bit of a fit issue in my opinion. Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one. Not for nothing, it wouldn't have been appropriate for a person with knowledge of the inner workings of the program to share his opinion on the fit of a coach while that coach was still employed by the University. The best recruiters are still with the program in JT3 and Broadus. Who knows why they left? Maybe it was a fit issue. Maybe it was money. Maybe they were tired of DC. In the case of Tavares, it doesn't seem like a bad idea to follow Pastner who's an atrocious coach that, within a couple of years, could easily be let go leaving an opening for a guy that maybe has done really well by the program on the recruiting trail. The odd part is that many were calling for the head coach's job and 2 assistants leave and the sky is now falling. Could it be a red flag? Sure. But, considering the news was, apparently, not surprising to the staff, it's more likely natural turnover. Change isn't always bad and it isn't always good. After last year, we needed some change. Maybe this will work out for all concerned. For the two gentlemen that have moved on, I wish them luck and appreciate all of their work in their time on the Hilltop. I'm sure they wish there had been more success too but that's in the past. I'm more interested in and concerned with how we move forward than with what has already transpired. |
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,407
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Post by SaxaCD on May 5, 2016 22:02:15 GMT -5
What is JYD doing these days? He had a cup of coffee at Findlay Prep. Maybe he could help on the recruiting side. Or what about Jonathan Wallace? He might be able to help with guards and Xs and Os... Serious question: why do so many people think that [insert former GU player] can join the program and simply "help on the recruiting side." Look at the assistants that are considered to be great recruiters. Almost none of them are big name players returning to their alma maters. Coaches are good recruiters because they put in the time, hit the streets, develop relationships, and can sell the program. To me, it's the same as assuming a former star player will make a good head coach. I do think that PEJr could be a good fit, as I see him as more than willing and able to put in the time, hit the streets and develop relationships. Not saying that's the typical profile of a former player, but he was more of a "big-name", but not "big-career" player -- also one with name recognition and an incredible supply of energy and enthusiasm. |
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on May 5, 2016 22:13:53 GMT -5
Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one. I think people are reacting more to your claim that he was the best recruiting assistant coach, as opposed to reacting to Hardy leaving. First, you're only considering the players that committed to Georgetown. The list of top players that Broadus recruited and got Georgetown to be finalists for in the past few years is extremely long (Seventh Woods, Alonzo Trier, Curtis Jones, Anthony Cowan, Temple Gibbs, Markelle Fultz, Ivan Rabb, Skal Labissiere, Tyler Dorsey, Perry Dosier, Terance Mann, Chance Comanche, Bryant Crawford, Ben Bentil to name a few). I can't really find anything about Hardy's other targets for what it's worth. Second, if you look at the breakdown of our roster and commits by coach(es) that recruited each player you'll see that Broadus and Hardy are at least a push in terms of quality and Broadus is the overwhelming favorite on quantity. I really appreciate what Hardy brought to the program, I just don't agree with your statement that he was the best recruiter on the Hoyas staff. 28 - Copeland - Hunter/Broadus 42 - Govan - Hardy/Broadus 51 - White - Hardy 62 - Peak - Broadus/Hardy 75 - Cameron - ? 88 - Agau - ? 93 - Derrickson - Broadus Hayes - ? Campbell - Broadus Johnson - Broadus Mosely - Broadus Mourning - ? Muresan - ? Pryor - Broadus Mulmore - Broadus Foster - Broadus |
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Post by FrazierFanatic on May 5, 2016 22:30:17 GMT -5
You're wrong my friend. Hardy had nothing to do with LJ. Do you think that Hardy's people may have had something to do with these articles being written. Hardy has every interest in making himself look important....so he is taking credit where he can. I have first hand knowledge of these recruitments ...this is not guess work. Further, it's important to note that Hardy's departure was not a surprise to jt3. There was always a bit of a fit issue in my opinion. Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one. And of course your anti-JTIII bias has nothing to do with your baseless attempt to prop Hardy up as "our best recruiter" who I guess left because our head coach and his program are so bad that it would be better to be employed by an underperforming coach at a school with one of the worst P5 basketball resumes over at last the last 5 years. I will credit blueandgray's information on these matters every single time. |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on May 5, 2016 22:48:37 GMT -5
Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one. Not for nothing, it wouldn't have been appropriate for a person with knowledge of the inner workings of the program to share his opinion on the fit of a coach while that coach was still employed by the University. The best recruiters are still with the program in JT3 and Broadus. Who knows why they left? Maybe it was a fit issue. Maybe it was money. Maybe they were tired of DC. In the case of Tavares, it doesn't seem like a bad idea to follow Pastner who's an atrocious coach that, within a couple of years, could easily be let go leaving an opening for a guy that maybe has done really well by the program on the recruiting trail. The odd part is that many were calling for the head coach's job and 2 assistants leave and the sky is now falling. Could it be a red flag? Sure. But, considering the news was, apparently, not surprising to the staff, it's more likely natural turnover. Change isn't always bad and it isn't always good. After last year, we needed some change. Maybe this will work out for all concerned. For the two gentlemen that have moved on, I wish them luck and appreciate all of their work in their time on the Hilltop. I'm sure they wish there had been more success too but that's in the past. I'm more interested in and concerned with how we move forward than with what has already transpired. Hard to say it's natural turnover when Sutton was actively looking for jobs & neither guy was named Asst HC, both seem to be lateral moves.. Bottom line to me is the fact that JT3 hired these coaches so if they were bad fits or not great at important parts of their jobs then that falls on him.. A lot of what's being said about Hardy & Sutton we heard about Hunter & Brennan too when they left.. Makes it hard to be confident in JT3's ability to hire and develop a solid staff.. In this thread posters are pointing out how both the roster & the staff have bad fits or are out of balance, it definitely opens eyes.. Also if JT3 & Broadus can handle the major bulk of the coaching & recruiting then why not just give Pat Jr. one spot and then use the money for the 3rd asst. on a top flight strength & conditioning coach.. |
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blueandgray
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Posts: 6,822
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Post by blueandgray on May 5, 2016 23:26:06 GMT -5
Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one. I think people are reacting more to your claim that he was the best recruiting assistant coach, as opposed to reacting to Hardy leaving. First, you're only considering the players that committed to Georgetown. The list of top players that Broadus recruited and got Georgetown to be finalists for in the past few years is extremely long (Seventh Woods, Alonzo Trier, Curtis Jones, Anthony Cowan, Temple Gibbs, Markelle Fultz, Ivan Rabb, Skal Labissiere, Tyler Dorsey, Perry Dosier, Terance Mann, Chance Comanche, Bryant Crawford, Ben Bentil to name a few). I can't really find anything about Hardy's other targets for what it's worth. Second, if you look at the breakdown of our roster and commits by coach(es) that recruited each player you'll see that Broadus and Hardy are at least a push in terms of quality and Broadus is the overwhelming favorite on quantity. I really appreciate what Hardy brought to the program, I just don't agree with your statement that he was the best recruiter on the Hoyas staff. 28 - Copeland - Hunter/Broadus 42 - Govan - Hardy/Broadus 51 - White - Hardy 62 - Peak - Broadus/Hardy 75 - Cameron - ? 88 - Agau - ? 93 - Derrickson - Broadus Hayes - ? Campbell - Broadus Johnson - Broadus Mosely - Broadus Mourning - ? Muresan - ? Pryor - Broadus Mulmore - Broadus Foster - Broadus Great post. Both Reggie Cameron and Agau were Broadus guys. |
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blueandgray
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by blueandgray on May 5, 2016 23:39:21 GMT -5
For those of you that are suggesting that I am "sour grapes" for saying that Hardy wasn't a great fit....that's simply just not the case. Its just an observation that I (and others who have contact with the staff) have observed. You'll notice that I said nothing of the sort when Coach Sutton left. Further, anything I report about is based on information I know. With regard to Hardy perhaps exaggerating his contribution to recruiting....I wish I could get into why I know this, but this forum isn't the appropriate place for that. If what I say bothers you, feel free to block me.
At the end of the day, everyone wishes Hardy well and much success. He is leaving on good terms....no sour grapes here.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2016 1:50:04 GMT -5
You're wrong my friend. Hardy had nothing to do with LJ. Do you think that Hardy's people may have had something to do with these articles being written. Hardy has every interest in making himself look important....so he is taking credit where he can. I have first hand knowledge of these recruitments ...this is not guess work. Further, it's important to note that Hardy's departure was not a surprise to jt3. There was always a bit of a fit issue in my opinion. Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one.What do I gain by doing this?? Again I'm interested in being accurate but you are certainly entitled to your own opinion... It is what it is... |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2016 1:55:59 GMT -5
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Eurostar
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by Eurostar on May 6, 2016 3:00:30 GMT -5
I know nothing about Hardy, but if he was a Princeton offense guy, I'm all for getting some new blood.
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Just Cos
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Eat 'em up Hoyas
Posts: 1,519
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Post by Just Cos on May 6, 2016 3:31:44 GMT -5
Worst season in a long time. Time for change. We all agree. Unless you want III gone why this battle? Some people just have agendas. Holy ...
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Filo
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,930
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Post by Filo on May 6, 2016 7:02:50 GMT -5
Hardy's people? Seriously? You really think Tavaras Hardy has people that are planting false ideas in people's heads at the Chicago Tribune and NBC Sports Online so that they'll write nice things about him? That seems like a stretch. So now, the day he decides to leave, we find out that there was a fit issue between Hardy and JT3? Interesting... Seems pretty simple to me. We lost the best recruiter among our assistant coaches, who decided it would be better to work for Josh Pastner and a second tier ACC program than JT3 and Georgetown, and now people are all of a sudden trying to discredit what Hardy accomplished. Sour grapes and unbecoming. I have a ton of respect for what YaBoy and B&G bring to this board, they're two premier posters as it relates to recruiting, but seems like they're trying too hard to prop up JT3/Broadus on this one. Yep, just that simple. Your opinion is the right one and everyone on the other side, which just happens to be a little less negative, is dead wrong. So simple. |
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bostonfan
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,546
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Post by bostonfan on May 6, 2016 7:21:22 GMT -5
Why these two guys left and how important they were to the program is really not that important anymore. They are gone and it is time to move on. The more important question now is who is going to fill those two open positions. If JT3 was aware they were both leaving you have to think he has been working on replacements for a little while. Any rumors out there as to who is being considered? I would assume PEJr is in the mix and probably in a good position for one of the spots. Any names being connected with the other spot?
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,681
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Post by tashoya on May 6, 2016 7:31:00 GMT -5
Not for nothing, it wouldn't have been appropriate for a person with knowledge of the inner workings of the program to share his opinion on the fit of a coach while that coach was still employed by the University. The best recruiters are still with the program in JT3 and Broadus. Who knows why they left? Maybe it was a fit issue. Maybe it was money. Maybe they were tired of DC. In the case of Tavares, it doesn't seem like a bad idea to follow Pastner who's an atrocious coach that, within a couple of years, could easily be let go leaving an opening for a guy that maybe has done really well by the program on the recruiting trail. The odd part is that many were calling for the head coach's job and 2 assistants leave and the sky is now falling. Could it be a red flag? Sure. But, considering the news was, apparently, not surprising to the staff, it's more likely natural turnover. Change isn't always bad and it isn't always good. After last year, we needed some change. Maybe this will work out for all concerned. For the two gentlemen that have moved on, I wish them luck and appreciate all of their work in their time on the Hilltop. I'm sure they wish there had been more success too but that's in the past. I'm more interested in and concerned with how we move forward than with what has already transpired. Hard to say it's natural turnover when Sutton was actively looking for jobs & neither guy was named Asst HC, both seem to be lateral moves.. Bottom line to me is the fact that JT3 hired these coaches so if they were bad fits or not great at important parts of their jobs then that falls on him.. A lot of what's being said about Hardy & Sutton we heard about Hunter & Brennan too when they left.. Makes it hard to be confident in JT3's ability to hire and develop a solid staff.. In this thread posters are pointing out how both the roster & the staff have bad fits or are out of balance, it definitely opens eyes.. Also if JT3 & Broadus can handle the major bulk of the coaching & recruiting then why not just give Pat Jr. one spot and then use the money for the 3rd asst. on a top flight strength & conditioning coach.. Who said JT3 and Broadus can handle the bulk of the coaching and recruiting? If coaches are not a good fit, it's better that they move on. Keeping them on staff is a more concerning issue than having them leave. I would think it would take a while to figure such things out and, thus, the turnover. It's not like a coach in a new job doesn't do his best to fit in for that honeymoon period in a new job. After that, the HC probably has a bit of a grace period for a coach that doesn't fit hoping things will improve. After which, both parties realize it's time for a change. It's possible that JT3 has an issue hiring a staff that fits. We'll never know. As for the developing of staff, we can't know that either. That said, both coaches made, at worst, lateral moves so, apparently, some people think Hardy and Sutton can get it done. |
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by DFW HOYA on May 6, 2016 7:58:08 GMT -5
1. First and foremost, thanks to Coach Hardy and best wishes for his future at Tech. The life of an assistant coach isn't an easy one and almost all move frequently, either in search of a head coaching job, or because of a change in staff. That's what cleared the staff in Atlanta, of course. Hardy is still only 36 and a run at Tech may open up some head coaching opportunities. Good for him.
2. The role of an assistant coach is underrated in terms of day to day coaching. A head coach doesn't have the time to be teaching X and O's to 15 players of various skill sets, and that's what the assistants do. Yes, John Thompson knew defense, but it was people like Mike Riley that really worked day in, day out to teach it. A fair criticism of late is that JT III had three recruiters and not enough teachers on that staff. Here's an opportunity to fix that.
3. Some of JT III's most productive in-game assistants (Sydney Johnson, Mike Brennan, Rob Burke) came from outside the University, and having played in McDonough is not always an advantage in bringing new ideas to the table. Yes, there are teams like Duke where their bench is an alumni club of sorts, but that speaks more to Krzyzewski's autocracy, and the track record of Duke alumni in head coaching positions is a mixed one. A better example is Michigan State: Tom Izzo has one assistant with a background completely outside MSU (Dane Fife, who played at Indiana), one with coaching experience outside the conference (Mike Garland, formerly at SMU and Cleveland State), and a former player in Dwayne Stephens. All are solid teachers and not just recruiters.
4. That having been said, these are important hires. Those beating the drum about JT III will be back in force if this team lays another egg in 16-17, so it's up to building a capable staff to develop what they have into a more consistent effort.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on May 6, 2016 8:42:29 GMT -5
Put me in the camp of wanting assistants who can recruit, recruit, and recruit some more. IF they are really good teachers, that is a bonus more than a job requirement.
Jimmies and Joes > Xs and Os. All day/ every day.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 15,429
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Post by EtomicB on May 6, 2016 9:01:50 GMT -5
Put me in the camp of wanting assistants who can recruit, recruit, and recruit some more. IF they are really good teachers, that is a bonus more than a job requirement. Jimmies and Joes > Xs and Os. All day/ every day. Tell that to UNC fans.. |
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