lurkerhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,182
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Post by lurkerhoya on Nov 18, 2009 19:49:32 GMT -5
Create a shot for himself? That's about all he does, and in doing so he pretty much turns our other 4 guys into Allen Iverson's rebound crew.
Create a shot for others? He has 3 assists in 2 games as our starting PG.
Move without the ball? You have to be kidding me. This also goes to creating a shot for himself since he never gets open on his own, and has no three-point range that would make him effective even if he did get open. When he doesn't have the ball in his hands, he simply tunes out.
I'm not trying to trash the kid. I like what CW brings, but the only insanity is thinking he's the type of PG that can run this team and this offense. He has a role on this team, and I don't see why it's so insane to think that it might not be as our starting PG, but instead in one that plays to his ability (maybe his only one) as a slasher/scorer.
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richfame
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,266
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Post by richfame on Nov 18, 2009 20:26:58 GMT -5
There has to be a happy medium between Sleepys rose colored glasses approach to hoya basketball and Mr sixers we have to scrap everything JT3 is trying to build.
To sleepy theres nothing wrong with people questioning the program and to a smaller extend the big picture coaching decisions ie the offense. This team was in chaos, not disiplined, and not hungry last year. Its natural for fans to critique more closely. I dont think anyone has said anything on here thats disrespectful to the program.
As for MR SIXER yeah this year is a huge make or break year for JT3 but he should have our faith this year.
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sleepy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,079
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Post by sleepy on Nov 18, 2009 20:29:59 GMT -5
Create a shot for himself? That's about all he does, and in doing so he pretty much turns our other 4 guys into Allen Iverson's rebound crew. Create a shot for others? He has 3 assists in 2 games as our starting PG. Move without the ball? You have to be kidding me. This also goes to creating a shot for himself since he never gets open on his own, and has no three-point range that would make him effective even if he did get open. When he doesn't have the ball in his hands, he simply tunes out. I'm not trying to trash the kid. I like what CW brings, but the only insanity is thinking he's the type of PG that can run this team and this offense. He has a role on this team, and I don't see why it's so insane to think that it might not be as our starting PG, but instead in one that plays to his ability (maybe his only one) as a slasher/scorer. After seeing the kid play two years, he is more than capable of creating shots for others, he did it on numerous occasions last year. Its not his top strength, but his is probably one of the best on the team in doing it. Chris is the ONLY person on this team that know how to cut correctly, and its obvious because most of Gregs assists are TO Chris. Most of Chris' points were infact off of assists. You think its just a coincidense the only person that is able to score off of an inbounds play is usually Chris? No. He is the only guy, at this point, that knows how and when to cut to the basket. And I have heard other echo the same setiments so I know I am not alone in this opinion. I have no problem being critcal of the program. I hardly see this program in rose colored glasses. The problem is this board makes it neccessary for me to defend this team, because I would say a good 70% of the people on this board have no faith this program. My honest assestment of this team so far: 1) Our offense is pretty dreadful right now, needs to improve, need to make adjustments in the way we approach it and we need certain players to step up. 2) Defensively- As a whole our team is made up of pretty lazy defenders with below average lateral quickness. Chris cheats to much and gets burned. Our match-up zone makes up for these things and is by far our stronger defense at this point in the season. I personally hate our 2-3 and have the last three seasons, teams almost always score against it whenever they inbound it because thats the only time we ever really run it. So far this year, its particuarly dreadful. 3) We need to shoot better in games. I know we can, but we got a bunch of open looks yesterday that we didn't knock down. That needs to change. With all that said, I am not worried. Its November. Who cares how you play in November. People are reading way to much into these games, because they are scared of a repeat of last year. That is not fair to this years team.Give them a chance to improve and adjust before you write them off.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Nov 18, 2009 21:13:28 GMT -5
yeah um people do realize chris led the team in assists last year right?
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sleepy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,079
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Post by sleepy on Nov 18, 2009 21:17:54 GMT -5
yeah um people do realize chris led the team in assists last year right? Nope, Nope, he only has 3 or 4 assists so far. It doesn't matter what happened last year unless its something negative.
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mrsixer123
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,283
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Post by mrsixer123 on Nov 18, 2009 21:56:13 GMT -5
This offense must go!!!!!!!! Did you get that from a text message? I hope it's another 8 months before your next post. deleted
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,674
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Post by guru on Nov 18, 2009 22:11:18 GMT -5
It's really great to have all the snowbird posters back. Such a breath of fresh air.
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skyhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,496
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Post by skyhoya on Nov 19, 2009 9:56:54 GMT -5
to be fair to Chris, if he makes a good pass and our shooter doesn't score, there is NO assist. If the team was hitting 50% from the field, he'd have a lot more assists.You have to have scorers to get assists, JWall, Jeff, Dajuan and Jessie are all gone to the next level.
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 18,007
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Post by SFHoya99 on Nov 19, 2009 11:26:35 GMT -5
While this game sucked, what has been different so far (can you say changed after two games?): - Defensive Rebounding: Over the two games, our D Rebounding Rate has been 75.0% and 72.1%, the latter against a pretty good frontline. I don't expect us to always be above 70%, but that is good, no matter the competition.
- We had 61 possessions in the Temple game. Monroe was on the floor for 56 of them. He took 12 shots (9 FGA plus 3 times to the line), had three assists and four turnovers. That's 19 of 56, or roughly 34% of possessions. I know that's not his usage rate (I don't know exactly how they figure the assists in there), but Monroe is actually a fairly strong center of attention.
You want to know why it doesn't look like it? He doesn't finish like Roy or Jeff, and when the team gives up the ball on 17 of 61 possessions, it's tough to wrack up the shots.
(Against Tulane he had 14 shots, 2 assists and 1 TO in 57 offensive possessions. That's 30%)
What hasn't been different? - The unfounded Chris Wright bashing. Yes, he had one assist to three turnovers. And no steals.
But that while he was on the floor, his teammates made 9 FGs. Let's not pretend we were hitting shots here.
More importantly, Chris was 3-4 from 2 and 6-7 from the line. Yes, he was 1-4 from three, but at least one of those was late in the shot clock. Inside the arc, he was remarkably effective, taking 7 shots in a game without a lot of shots and scoring 12 points. Maybe it will be better if he can focus on scoring, but Chris got to the rack.
- Turnovers. I can't explain how much of an issue this is for this team. The next point is bad -- this is abysmal.
- Offensive Rebounding. We got outrebounded because we got almost nothing on the offensive boards. There's no excuse for this, especially since Julian and Henry have shown to be decent at this.
- Outside shooting. Chris has never been a marksman (please stop with the McD's AA shooting contest -- he's a streak shooter and has always been), but someone figure out where Austin's three stroke went.
The other legimate gripe is that we take too many, especially the bigs. Some are in the flow, but many aren't.
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theexorcist
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,506
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Post by theexorcist on Nov 19, 2009 11:48:38 GMT -5
yeah um people do realize chris led the team in assists last year right? Nope, Nope, he only has 3 or 4 assists so far. It doesn't matter what happened last year unless its something negative. In fairness to the criticism, Wright last year was pretty much the point guard. It's the goal of the point guard to get assists. I can guarantee that Greg Monroe isn't going to lead the team in assists this year. In further fairness, Wright always looked to shoot (Marty Blake, an NBA scout, referred to these players as shooting points, who look to shoot first). On a team with a someone expected to be a lock draft pick and someone else who ended up getting drafted, this would have been a weak strategy if the person was a good shooter. Wright was an inconsistent shooter, and this hurt many things. Wright now looks to pass first. His shooting percentages are now up because he takes good shots when necessary.
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Cambridge
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Canes Pugnaces
Posts: 5,304
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Post by Cambridge on Nov 19, 2009 14:28:58 GMT -5
Its like you people expected this team to come out and be dramatically better than they were at the end of last year at the first tip. Thats just not realistic. We ended last year doing literally everything wrong. Yes, I did expect dramatic improvement. Yes, that is realistic. That's what we pay a coach to do. That's why we give 10 guys free rides to a top 25 university. Put in the work and get better. Fix the obvious strategic and preparation flaws. No excuses. Are you implying that JTIII has somehow held practice with this squad prior to mid-October of this season? Did you forget that the NCAA rules prohibit this and the team has had all of three weeks of practice up to this point? Regardless of whether you demand improvement, that is an awfully short window of expectation.
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paranoia2
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 847
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Post by paranoia2 on Nov 19, 2009 15:48:52 GMT -5
Name the 5 best players on the court in the Temple vs. Georgetown game. Take into consideration rankings as recruits and actual basketball skills. Here is mine:
1) Greg Monroe: #1 recruit that will be a high NBA pick.
2) Chris Wright: McDonalds All American that has great physical skills and could be an explosive scorer.
3) Austin Freeman: McDonalds All American with the body of a NFL linebacker. A guy that can score the basketball from anywhere.
4) Jason Clark: Long-armed combo guard with all the tools to be a top college player. A first team Big East player by the time he is a senior.
5) Levoy Allen: Don't know anything about his high school ranking but the guy performed well in the 2nd half and had an awesome one hand swoop-dunk.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Nov 19, 2009 15:56:03 GMT -5
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 18,007
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Post by SFHoya99 on Nov 19, 2009 16:00:43 GMT -5
Name the 5 best players on the court in the Temple vs. Georgetown game. Take into consideration rankings as recruits and actual basketball skills. Here is mine: 1) Greg Monroe: #1 recruit that will be a high NBA pick. 2) Chris Wright: McDonalds All American that has great physical skills and could be an explosive scorer. 3) Austin Freeman: McDonalds All American with the body of a NFL linebacker. A guy that can score the basketball from anywhere. 4) Jason Clark: Long-armed combo guard with all the tools to be a top college player. A first team Big East player by the time he is a senior. 5) Levoy Allen: Don't know anything about his high school ranking but the guy performed well in the 2nd half and had an awesome one hand swoop-dunk. That's basically based off of recruit rankings and the fact that you know nothing about Temple. Lavoy Allen is a heckuva player who would easily be our starting PF, for example.
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paranoia2
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 847
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Post by paranoia2 on Nov 19, 2009 16:27:50 GMT -5
I live in Philly and would make a wager that Temple finishes below 5th in the A 10. Talk is cheap.
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 18,007
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Post by SFHoya99 on Nov 19, 2009 16:34:34 GMT -5
What's your point? You've made an argument in this thread that if we let Chris Wright go "free" his shooting would improve.
That statement has absolutely no backing. As are many of yours.
Your factual basis are recruiting ranking three years in the past. Awesome. You run with that.
We get you don't like the offense. You don't really present an argument that is logical -- and there are plenty of logical arguments against the offense if you look -- but instead through recruiting rankings around. Whatever.
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