|
Post by juanjohnhoya on Dec 1, 2008 13:06:04 GMT -5
The MSF page has new, revised drawings of what the finished stadium would look like. The Gothic Columns/Towers that were on each corner are now gone. The written description hasn't changed, but the seating sure looks different. Makes one wonder how they plan to fit the supposed 4500 spectators under the new design. guhoyas.cstv.com/facilities/gu-multi-sport.html
|
|
derhoya
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 584
|
Post by derhoya on Dec 1, 2008 13:29:50 GMT -5
nice find. a timeline on its completion would be nice but as always, its asking too much.
I'm not sure what number this is, but its like the 5 or 6th rendering i've seen which leads me to ask... how much have we spent on renderings alone? I'm no architect but the planning and visual design within this link aren't easily done I would guess. It would be interesting to see how much has been wasted on all these pipe dreams...
|
|
DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,856
|
Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 1, 2008 13:31:07 GMT -5
This is the fifth design I've seen posted online.
The copy doesn't match the drawing, however.
"The four gothic entry pavilions will create a strong threshold experience which echoes the architectural fabric and traditions of Georgetown. The proportions of the pavilions, colonnades, detailing and features in the design all reflect the American Gothic character of the campus."
|
|
hoya4ever
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 805
|
Post by hoya4ever on Dec 1, 2008 14:11:24 GMT -5
Someone with better perception tell me where the locker rooms / training room will fit in that thing. Is there room?
|
|
|
Post by hilltopper2000 on Dec 1, 2008 22:06:21 GMT -5
BOOOOOOOOOOO!
This is a bad, bad re-design. First, this is in the middle of campus and a beautiful gothic structure is befitting this visibility. This design is a glorified high school field. Second, by not having any (aparent) locker room or training space, the university is throwing away valuable space.
If you can't do it right, don't do it, Georgetown.
|
|
|
Post by AustinHoya03 on Dec 1, 2008 22:40:58 GMT -5
BOOOOOOOOOOO! This is a bad, bad re-design. First, this is in the middle of campus and a beautiful gothic structure is befitting this visibility. This design is a glorified high school field. Second, by not having any (aparent) locker room or training space, the university is throwing away valuable space. If you can't do it right, don't do it, Georgetown. I agree this is a very bad re-design. But a glorified high school stadium is better than the worse-than-a-high-school-stadium eyesore currently wasting space in the center of campus. The downgrade is a disappointment, but I say build it so that the athletic department and coaches can build the football program, then expand the stadium.
|
|
|
Post by juanjohnhoya on Dec 2, 2008 0:57:53 GMT -5
Which begs the question, how much money does GU actually *need* to build the original design, and how much is it budgeting now for the new, reduced design?
|
|
CAHoya07
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,598
|
Post by CAHoya07 on Dec 2, 2008 11:03:52 GMT -5
It looks like this is barely a redesign, and looks more like the stands we have now plus a larger press box, some lighting, and big Georgetown football pictures. I can't even tell if there is a video scoreboard as promised in the earlier version.
I'm hoping we can get some sort of word soon about the status of this project (and the basketball practice facility, for that matter). I think one of the most important parts of this was to get training and locker rooms in the MSF, alleviating the overcrowding of McDonough. Not sure if this will be the case anymore.
And I assume, based on the description in the summary, that Phase 1A has been completed, and we're just waiting on 1B? That seems about right, although I'm pretty sure the North Lawn still has not been completed.
|
|
The Stig
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,844
|
Post by The Stig on Dec 2, 2008 11:40:47 GMT -5
It looks like they're just touching up what we have already. At least it'll make the current field less of an eyesore.
|
|
GUHoya07
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,083
|
Post by GUHoya07 on Dec 2, 2008 12:08:25 GMT -5
I'm sorry, I hate to be overly negative and I want to support the university, but this design is absolute crap.
All the talk about a design that matches the surrounding architecture and they come up with this piece of dung? It really just looks like some high school bleachers with a big press box built in. What are those absurd looking towers with pictures on them? Is that some sort of terrible joke?
Most importantly, as people have mentioned, does this design include any room for offices or locker rooms? It certainly doesn't look like it from these renderings and it appears that there is just empty space under the bleachers like we currently have.
This would be an enormous waste of space and an eyesore in the middle of campus. I know its even worse right now, but we've always had the hope that they would eventually build something befitting of the space.
To be honest, I see almost no benefit of even having a football program anymore, and I don't mean to offend any current players or parents. I wish I could see something positive, but its just an embarrassment to the university these days. I went to every single home game while I was in college and really tried to be a fan of the program, but its just too much of a joke to follow anymore.
I can handle losing, that's not my problem with the football program. The problem is that there seems to be no improvement of any kind from year to year, no real commitment from the university, or any desire to do anything that would make Georgetown football enjoyable and attractive to the Georgetown community and alumni. We can't continue to wallow in this state of disrepair forever.
In my opinion its time to either make a greater university wide commitment to this program or get rid of it completely. As Hoyas we claim we are committed to being the best we can possibly be at everything we do and then we put this $hit show out there.
All I view the football program as now is a hindrance to the basketball program. We need to improve our basketball facilities and ensure that our flagship program remains one of the best in the country every year. Even if we never get an on campus arena, we need a practice facility and that should be our first and foremost priority, even if we need to cancel the football program to achieve it.
This isn't the FBS where we're making millions for the athletic department, we're just draining valuable time and money that could be used elsewhere.
I think we're all sick and tired of this and its time we made that clear.
|
|
PhillyHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,016
|
Post by PhillyHoya on Dec 2, 2008 13:02:26 GMT -5
^ What he said. Completely.
|
|
DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,856
|
Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 2, 2008 13:28:09 GMT -5
I understand the frustration, but if Georgetown was judging sports sponsorship by the level of "embarassment" over the years it would no longer be a Division I school. Baseball hasn't had a winning season in 24 years. Men's lacrosse went 28 years without a winning record and is still here (and playing iun the unnamed and unfinished MSF). Field hockey, tennis, golf, soccer, women's basketball, volleyball...every sport short of men's basketball, track and rowing have been labeled as such over the years. None of these sports, incl. football, is a hindrance to basketball. A philosophical argument can be made that Georgetown spends too much money on men's basketball, not too little, but I'll take that up at another time. Football has donors ready and willing to put the dollars down to get this built--they had upwards of $12 million in gifts and pledges in the discussion eight years ago when the wheels came off this project. When Georgetown makes a commitment, they'll be there. But it takes a public commitment. And for those wondering about the commitments on the unnamed practice facility/ training center/ locker rooms/ et al, beware. If Georgetown can't get a set of bleachers and a press box off the ground, how would you ever expect that to move? Remember this link? It's over two years old.... thevanburenboys.blogspot.com/2007/01/rumors-rumors.html
|
|
kchoya
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Enter your message here...
Posts: 9,934
|
Post by kchoya on Dec 2, 2008 13:39:50 GMT -5
It looks like this is barely a redesign, and looks more like the stands we have now plus a larger press box, some lighting, and big Georgetown football pictures. I can't even tell if there is a video scoreboard as promised in the earlier version. I'm hoping we can get some sort of word soon about the status of this project (and the basketball practice facility, for that matter). I think one of the most important parts of this was to get training and locker rooms in the MSF, alleviating the overcrowding of McDonough. Not sure if this will be the case anymore. And I assume, based on the description in the summary, that Phase 1A has been completed, and we're just waiting on 1B? That seems about right, although I'm pretty sure the North Lawn still has not been completed. What, did you leave your microscope at home? Can't you tell there's a jumbotron on that tower thing on the left side of this picture: grfx.cstv.com/schools/gu/graphics/field-1-324.jpgI think.
|
|
GUHoya07
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,083
|
Post by GUHoya07 on Dec 2, 2008 13:43:16 GMT -5
It's probably just a 42 inch flat screen tv.
|
|
TBird41
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
"Roy! I Love All 7'2" of you Roy!"
Posts: 8,740
|
Post by TBird41 on Dec 2, 2008 13:54:33 GMT -5
It's probably just a 42 inch flat screen tv. You're an optimist. I bet it's not even a flat screen.
|
|
|
Post by 98hoya on Dec 2, 2008 13:58:14 GMT -5
Get this...there's ANOTHER re-design for the MSF on the website today. It's a totally different look, but I ran into Mr. Muir today and asked him about it. He said that today's updated design is within our current budget, can be constructed by next season, and will "bring everyone back to the days when Georgetown was a football power." Here's a link to a photo of how it will look: www.library.georgetown.edu/dept/speccoll/i/page/fbandh~1.jpg
|
|
|
Post by 98hoya on Dec 2, 2008 14:02:06 GMT -5
It's probably just a 42 inch flat screen tv. You're an optimist. I bet it's not even a flat screen. If it's not a flatscreen, does it at least come with one of those converter boxes so it'll work in February when the government changes the way TV is broadcast?
|
|
GUHoya07
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,083
|
Post by GUHoya07 on Dec 2, 2008 14:03:46 GMT -5
I understand the frustration, but if Georgetown was judging sports sponsorship by the level of "embarassment" over the years it would no longer be a Division I school. Baseball hasn't had a winning season in 24 years. Men's lacrosse went 28 years without a winning record and is still here (and playing iun the unnamed and unfinished MSF). Field hockey, tennis, golf, soccer, women's basketball, volleyball...every sport short of men's basketball, track and rowing have been labeled as such over the years. None of these sports, incl. football, is a hindrance to basketball. A philosophical argument can be made that Georgetown spends too much money on men's basketball, not too little, but I'll take that up at another time. Football has donors ready and willing to put the dollars down to get this built--they had upwards of $12 million in gifts and pledges in the discussion eight years ago when the wheels came off this project. When Georgetown makes a commitment, they'll be there. But it takes a public commitment. And for those wondering about the commitments on the unnamed practice facility/ training center/ locker rooms/ et al, beware. If Georgetown can't get a set of bleachers and a press box off the ground, how would you ever expect that to move? Remember this link? It's over two years old.... thevanburenboys.blogspot.com/2007/01/rumors-rumors.htmlI obviously don't know as much about the inner workings of this situation as you do, but some of your comments seem hard to believe. If we had so many donors willing to get this thing built why has it been held up so many times? I've heard about the university not accepting gifts until other priorities reach their fundraising goals first, at least thats what I've been told, but I thought there was a time when they were actively pursuing donations for this project and were not able to raise the $25-$30 million or whatever they needed. As for some of the other programs, I agree that they are a huge embarrassment as well, but at least they are not as high profile as a football team. To be honest, the most embarrassing program at Georgetown has to be Field Hockey right now. Not only were we 0-17, but we don't even play at home anymore. We play in college park, the home of the National Champions in Field Hockey this year. Just the thought of it is disgusting. How can we allow this sort of thing to happen?
|
|
RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,143
|
Post by RBHoya on Dec 2, 2008 14:48:36 GMT -5
That screen looks pretty lame and out of place.
Overall I agree with 007 to the fullest. I supported the team for my 4 years as an undergrad, but now as an alumnus who is not near campus, the program is a complete afterthought. I'm fairly confident that it's an afterthought for almost all alumni, whether they live near DC or not. And, it's an afterthought to most students as well. Nobody I knew at Georgetown really cared about the team except for a few of my fellow Hoya Blue members, and even they mostly went to the games out of a sense that it was "the right thing to do", not because they wanted to be there. (The exceptions to this are of course the players and alumni and their close friends and family.) I am fairly convinced that this is not JUST because the team was always losing, but also because people at Georgetown just aren't that excited about an FCS football team, win or lose. Unless you're a big football fan or somebody who is overflowing with school spirit, there are probably more fun ways to spend a nice saturday afternoon in Washington DC.
Honestly, I'm just not sure what we're trying to accomplish with this football experiment. It isn't enhancing the lives of the vast majority of students or alumni. It's not bringing any prestige or pride or unity to the school. Matter of fact it's an embarrassment in most situations, if you have friends from Yale or Penn or any of the other schools that routinely kicks our asses. Not that that's a big deal by any means, just underscores the point that the program isn't really doing anything good for the vast majority of people affiliated with the university... So why DO we have this program? Cura personalis etc. etc. explains why we have athletics in general, but if we're going to half-heartedly pursue something, I think we'd be better committing the resources to other endeavors... and you can say football is not a hindrance to other sports, DFW, but on the most basic level there's a finite number of dollars and resources and what's going to football right now would be going to hoops or something else if there was not football.... If it's just a matter of us wanting to give kids a chance to play, then let's go ahead and set up a club football team, we could probably have a good one like we do with hockey.
Anyway, I mean no disrespect to the players or the football alumni, I know you guys worked hard in trying to build the program. But at this point I'm pretty convinced that Georgetown would be better off either shutting the program down or moving it off-site to a legitimate facility (like they did with the baseball team). Having a really watered-down facility taking up valuable space in the middle of campus is the worst of both worlds, because you KNOW it isn't going to help the team get better... And to AustinHoya's point, going through with this sort of renovation would probably just mean many more years of proposals and waiting and hoping that the team shows signs of life.
I'm telling you guys... build a brand new, state of the art student fitness center (+ a garden/some green space) on what's currently the football field, and then build a new basketball arena/practice facility where Yates currently is. 100% chance that using the land that way adds more to the university than even a top-notch FCS team playing in the middle of campus ever could.
|
|
SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,899
|
Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 2, 2008 16:08:26 GMT -5
The problem isn't investing in football.
That's a good idea, I think, overall. Not sure of its relative merits, but if you did it right, and had a winning team, people would watch.
That said, going halfway is incredibly expensive, relative to the benefit. Georgetown needs to firmly set and publicize its priorities, and get fundraising. I realize now is not the best time to be asking for money, but still...
|
|