nodak89
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Roy Roy Royyyyy!!!
Posts: 1,881
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Post by nodak89 on Dec 28, 2004 23:30:51 GMT -5
The GUHoyas.com highlights are up now. WOW! What a dunk by JG. That up and under and the finish! It looks even better from a different angle on the iLLbanian highlights.
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ahoya3
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Former hoop club president and 22 year season ticket holder
Posts: 60
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Post by ahoya3 on Dec 28, 2004 23:47:32 GMT -5
Let's cool off a little. Norfolk State played an active zone(like Temple) and we didn't penetrate well till the end when Bowman beat a two man and made some nice passes underneath to Green. The team looked tired(jet lag?). Reed showed some relapse to his out of control stuff after a few very good games. Our guards are very small and can't get their own shot so when teams extend out the zone and we don't penetrate we don't do as well. Bowman played pretty well despite a bad night from the arc(1/7). Owens hit some threes and did well on the glass but is still a real liability on D where he gets beat off the dribble at will.
The best part of the game was they didn't panic like they would have done the last couple years. They didn't seem to get tight when things got dicey-shows they have some confidence.
No big deal. Looked to me like a case of the Christmas doldrums, jet lag, fatigue, lack of interest on fans' part, etc. A win is a win even if it is against a MEACer
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aggypryd
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Post by aggypryd on Dec 29, 2004 0:23:34 GMT -5
Don't know what to say. Was flying high after the Clemson victory, but after blowing a 10 point half-time lead to Norfolk State, this brings us down to earth really quickly. Let's hope we can just shrug it off to post-Hawaiian post-Christmas rust. Here is to Norfolk State running the table in the MEAC. Norfolk State probably isn't in the top three in the MEAC... South Carolina State and FAMU are ahead of them...
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Dec 29, 2004 0:43:28 GMT -5
Good gracious that was a bad game. We had a chance to blow them out in the first half but failed to do so and paid the price in a big way. Our lack of focus in the second half was disturbing. Also, the fact that our offense seems to place little emphasis on getting Green the ball is a problem. Here are some thoughts...
Ray Reed makes nice plays at times, but he counteracts them with stupid and costly mistakes. He has ability, especially on the defensive end, and he is a Big East player, but right now he is not a very good one. We need for him to develop to be competitive in conference; mostly, that means fewer bad mistakes (such as a play late in regulation when he tried to dribble through the press single-handly and got the ball stolen. Still, he is only a sophomore. As fans we should try to recognize his positives and not jump down his neck after every dumb play. He does have ability.
Wallace is a solid player but I am concerned that he may be a step slow when trying to guard Big East players. Still, he has a nice shot and plays pretty smart. I'm glad we have him on the roster.
Green has the ability to be a big time star. He plays hard and smart. We must get him the ball more often.
Bowman is good. With a little bit more consistent focus he should be an upper level player in conference play. He stepped it up in OT and shut the door nicely. However, he cannot be invisible as he was at times and he must take charge more vocally on the court.
Hibbert is not useless but he is too slow to really execute true post moves. He will still be useful as a scrapper inside.
DJ is so frustrating. He has such a nice shot and he was not hesitating when open from three. Otherwise, however, he was the same old passive DJ and he refused to do anything off the dribble. We need him to be more aggressive and penetrate more.
Cook had some nice threes. He had a nice drive and dish to Green late; we need a lot more of that.
Overall, the defensive effort must be more consistent. Jeff should be more of a presence inside.
There were some nice backdoors but overall the offense is fairly stagnant.
Thank goodness we won. This will probably be my only game in person this year (stupid law school) and a loss to Norfolk State would have been not so good.
Also, # 5 for Norfold State carried the ball literally every time he dribbled-- almost like a bad eighth-grade player-- but it was never called.
Go Hoyas.
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thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by thebin on Dec 29, 2004 6:28:42 GMT -5
Hey MCI do me a favor and get off your "what is happenin in the world today" horse. Totally uncalled for moralizing. On this board, we talk about hoya bastketball and so that is what matters HERE. You haven't the first clue what perspective I hold college athletics in general- so back off with that holier than thou act. I can promise you I spend less time on hoya hoops and hoops in general than you do but the last thing I would do ON THIS BOARD would be to tell you to spend less time on the recruiting boards and go spend more time with your family instead or some such stunt.
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HoyaFanNY
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Never throw to the venus on a spider 3 Y banana!
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Post by HoyaFanNY on Dec 29, 2004 7:08:31 GMT -5
just looking at the box, the 28 3's are way too many. bowman missed 7 shots total, and 6 were 3's. practically all of the shots taken by wallace and owens were 3's. i agree we need more penetration from wallace and cook and maybe get jeff in the post more. allowing 13 offensive baords is unacceptable. we should kill a team like this on the boards. it's obvious the defense and rebounding need improvement.
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nodak89
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Roy Roy Royyyyy!!!
Posts: 1,881
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Post by nodak89 on Dec 29, 2004 7:37:01 GMT -5
During HoyaChat it was said "Nodak, you won't be penning any verses on this one" and I thought that was true, but.... Norfolk State ain't worth the bandwidth, so just a few lyrics. It's Overtime (to the tune of the great disco classic, "I Will Survive") At first my dear Hoyas I was satisfied A 10 pt lead, Norfolk State, a win won't be denied But I've seen too many games When our shooting comes up lame A scoring drought, Oh my gosh they'll drag it out It's overtime! It's overtime! I didn't know a MEAC foe Could make me scream and whine Bowman saved the day With his OT play In overtime We did survive, we did survive, we did survive
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Highsmith
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Post by Highsmith on Dec 29, 2004 8:16:08 GMT -5
I wasn't able to listen to this game, but I have to say I was shocked when I saw the score scroll by on ESPN2 during the Gonzaga/Okla. St. game (great game by the way). From what I have read here and what I saw in the box score, it seems as though we had a great deal of trouble with the zone and just like the old days we started throwing up poor 3-pt. shots all over the place. I really hope JTIII is getting all over the guys today, especially if that is the case.
I am starting to see a trend of this team playing to its competition. That is pretty common with teams as young as this one, but it can be frustrating to a fan. They looked very strong against Illinois- just couldn't sustain it for the whole game. They obviously played very well against Clemson too. Then in some of these games against "weak" opponents, they are winning but looking terrible in doing so. I hope we can just mark it down as growing pains that will (hopefully) soon go away. I think this team has some promise. They just need to learn how to put away teams that shouldn't be sticking with them. It sounds easy, but it's not. It is easy to get pulled down to another team's level, and find yourselves in a tough game that should have been a blowout. We aren't alone in this either- lots of other (and higher ranked) teams have gotten themselves into very close games with teams they should have beaten by 40......does the name Chaminade sound familiar? Was this game a bit disappointing and embarrassing? Yes.....but it is not THAT big a deal, and it was a WIN!!!!
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Post by TrueHoyaBlue on Dec 29, 2004 8:28:00 GMT -5
Having been at the game, there were a few things I noticed.
Offense:
For the majority (though certainly not all) of the game, it looked like Coach was really focusing on running the offense. There was actually a good deal of cutting (as evidenced by the 21 assists), and a few plays that I hadn't seen in earlier games, like one where a forward holds the ball at the top of the key and the two guards cross paths on successive cuts down and through the lane (this one led directly to points at least once, and it seemed like they were working out the rhythm). There were a couple of other sets like that, and a decent number of frontdoor cuts, particularly in the middle of the first half, and in overtime, and it seemed like working out the kinks on these sets was one of the main focuses of the team.
The back line of NSU's zone played pretty close to the baseline, which made it pretty tough to get the ball down to Jeff without him being in major traffic and/or under the basket. I think this was what led to many of the 3-point attempts, a la the Davidson game. Most (though not all, including a few clunkers from Wallace, Cook, and BB) were decent open looks, but in this game, they weren't falling with a high enough frequency to get the Spartans out of their zone.
For that reason, I think JTIII saw Reed as a potential sparkplug, and he was, for a big chunk of the time he was in there, using dribble penetration to cut through the zone and lead to some easy looks for the big men.
Defense:
I don't want to talk about it much, but suffice it to say, it wasn't that impressive.
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Dec 29, 2004 8:40:05 GMT -5
Wash Times: Georgetown Survives -- But Barelywww.washtimes.com/sports/20041228-113218-4530r.htm "There's no one that we have played or are going to play where you walk on the court and say, 'OK, this one's good,' " Georgetown coach John Thompson III said. "We have to be focused. We have to come to play every day, every game, no matter who the opponent is. They did a better job of coming in focused than we did today." Times: Hoyas Reportwww.washtimes.com/sports/20041229-121830-3161r.htmPost: Hoya Survive Scarewww.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A32445-2004Dec28.html"We can beat any team in the country. We can also lose to any team in the country. That's just the composition of our team right now," Georgetown Coach John Thompson III said. "We're young, inexperienced; we're learning new things. . . . We have to be focused, we have to come to play, every day, every game, no matter who the opponent is. They did a better job of coming in focused than we did today." As for perspective, BC (a far more talented and mature team than this year's Hoyas) had to go to 2OTs to beat Holy Cross and OT to beat Yale, so early in the year like this these things are going to happen. Last year's squad would have had a better than even chance of losing this one.
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ahoya3
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Former hoop club president and 22 year season ticket holder
Posts: 60
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Post by ahoya3 on Dec 29, 2004 9:01:27 GMT -5
Agree with Dan McQ. For some reason I felt confident in overtime and so did the team appear to be. I am not sure that would have occured last year. It sure would be nice to have a strong, big guard to penetrate into that slot inside the zone up top.
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Post by showcase on Dec 29, 2004 9:26:27 GMT -5
Phooey on that, MCI - this OT win is the worse loss ever. Come here and help me tie this noose.
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KHoyaNYC
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Dec 29, 2004 9:34:23 GMT -5
A win is a win and the fact that we were tested by such a poor team (sorry Norfolk State is a poor team) is a nice wake-up call for this team. We wil turn the negative into a positive.
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Dec 29, 2004 9:43:21 GMT -5
The positive is I wasn't going to go to the Howard game and now I might. The fans were pathetic which is to be expected in a match up like this. Without students, the shirts that were thrown into the stands weren't even G'Town shirts (the kid behind me caught one because I didn't bother to stand up).
NS figured out we have no offense against a zone and played us zone in the second half and that is how they closed the gap. They were hitting some pretty wild shots that were basically one on one moves versus our man. No one for us penetrates against a zone. No one gets the ball to the high post against a zone. And on the off chance that we do, it actually works. I am just shocked that our coaches aren't getting all over these guys on this.
A lack of enthusiasm was to be expected but if we don't come out hungry against Howard, I will lose it!
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Post by BubbleVisionBiff on Dec 29, 2004 9:44:24 GMT -5
During HoyaChat it was said "Nodak, you won't be penning any verses on this one" and I thought that was true, but.... It's Overtime (to the tune of the great disco classic, "I Will Survive") At first my dear Hoyas I was satisfied A 10 pt lead, Norfolk State, a win won't be denied But I've seen too many games When our shooting comes up lame A scoring drought, Oh my gosh they'll drag it out It's overtime! It's overtime! I didn't know a MEAC foe Could make me scream and whine Bowman saved the day With his OT play In overtime We did survive, we did survive, we did survive I can't believe someone made me smile about this game so early the morning after. Huzzah, Nodak! Having been there, I would second some of the earlier observations, especially ahoya's note that they just had a long plane ride back (anyone know what day they got back into DC?), so maybe that's why thery were a little flat and unfocused. Ahoya is also right on about the zone. NS played an agressive zone early, meeting our guards way out on top. It took us awhile to get some good looks inside in the first half, and then young Ray found some room over the top to Brandon. In the second half, NS seemed to pack in the zone and dare us to hit from the outside, which we really didn't. Our executionin the second half, as many noted, was not good. Not crisp passing, just around the perimeter, letting the clock run down and hoisting a 3. Hoyalover4ever is also right about our guards maybe being a little slow right now. I saw lots of times where Tony Murphy (no. 5) or someone else (maybe Hicks) blew right by whoever was guarding them, Cook or Wallace. This was what got us in trouble with Oral Roberts, if I am not mistaken. Carl Krauser, Billy Edelin, or Chris Thomas, anyone? My only other beef was the officiating. The number of walks missed in the second half was pretty bad. And one play where Jeff got a baseball pass under the rim, the NS defender put both arms in his back as Jeff went up. No call. But I think I get too worked up about the refs anyway. Oh, and our rebounding stunk.
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Jack
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Post by Jack on Dec 29, 2004 9:48:33 GMT -5
Not much to add from my perspective now, except to reinforce the "calm down" message. I was only worried about losing for about 15 seconds last night, when NSU had the ball down 2 with the shot clock off- an open 3 would have been scary. Once it went to OT I was confident of a victory.
The excuses have been made and they have some validity, so let's at least wait to see what happens in the Howard game. I believe the team comes out more focused and less tired, wins by 20+. JT3 does not seem the type to panic off of one bad game, and the results in the Clemson game after a lackluster start in Hawaii show the benefit of patience with this team. Everyone needs to back away from the ledge and get ready for an unusual Big East season. I foresee at least one major upset for us, and at least two bad losses as well.
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hoopsmccan
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Post by hoopsmccan on Dec 29, 2004 10:37:21 GMT -5
ok not a great game but a win roy didnot have the best game their defense actually stopped jefff inside... the other team wasnot that bad they hustled and had some athletes and shooters .. we fell apart i think brandon had 13 in the first half two in the second or so and then eight on a great tear in ot to put it away.. one sequence he lost the ball badly and then got it back and went on a tear.. ray reed little outa control like last year hibbert not a factor did get called for one or two quesionable offensive foula which seemed to take him outa the game but we didnot lose this game repeat we didnot lose this game and some great back doors some great second effort baskets maybe tired and flat from hawaiii who knows but they didnot give up; and coulda go hoyas howard has won some games this year and will be tough on thurs they will be tough Lic's annoying posts make me pine for the posts of Daryl Hall and/or John Oates. Hall made some interesting observations (or was it Oates?) As for the game, I'm glad to see some outrage on the board - thanks bin, very refreshing. I was afraid of the usually rhetoric after a loss or near catastrophe, ie "we knew this would be an up and down season," "we are young," "we are learning a new system" or "[blank] opponent is a good team." Even with the usual excuses, an OT game against Norfolk - that's embarrassing. It seems like when the team wins a game like the Clemson one, people inundate the board with talk of a 7+ win big east season. Those are the people that need perspective. hm
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Post by DuddingtonHoya on Dec 29, 2004 10:41:25 GMT -5
At one point an MCI employee told me I had to sit down in the closing minutes because I was blocking people's view. Could it possibly get any worse?
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Post by Fan Of The Game on Dec 29, 2004 11:52:53 GMT -5
As for perspective, BC (a far more talented and mature team than this year's Hoyas) had to go to 2OTs to beat Holy Cross and OT to beat Yale, so early in the year like this these things are going to happen. Last year's squad would have had a better than even chance of losing this one. While I believe Yale and Holy Cross to be MUCH better teams than Norfolk State, you probably have a good point. It was just such a painful game to attend. Maybe the lack of outrage on the board is because no one was there to have to sit through it. Is it good or bad that we're so far below radar that a MEAC team taking us to OT is not recognized nationally? Is it good that no one noticed our terrible performance or is it bad that no one cares anymore?
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FOTP
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by FOTP on Dec 29, 2004 11:54:21 GMT -5
I've been to most if not all of the Hoyas games over the past 6 years and I can say last night was the most embarressed I've ever been to call myself a Hoya.
Awful effort all around. the thing that really infuriated me was the effort in OT. It's like they thought they were a good team and could "turn it on" at any time. Just awful.
For all those people who think we can go 6-10 or something like that in the BE you need to look closely at the team and the talent level...and effort (never thought I'd say that).
If we win 3 games it would be a miracle...and I'm dead serious.
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