LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Jan 21, 2021 21:58:51 GMT -5
Ewing and the staff have had four years to set up relationships in the local community and have not done so, leaving them to chase the Chudier Biles of the world to fill a roster. Local coaches take notice of this. So do recruits. What DC area class of 2020 recruits were still available in January 2020?
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Jan 21, 2021 22:11:20 GMT -5
This list is incomplete without Jahmir Young. Kid is a stud. I actually had him on my original list--he is putting up impressive numbers at Charlotte--but I haven't actually seen them play so I didn't include in the post. There are definitely a handful of others that I didn't mention either that are having solid college careers, especially at mid and low majors. It's difficult to overstate how deep the league has been, it feels like even if you missed out on the top 3 or 4 WCAC prospects every year you could still put together a really good team. For what it's worth, per 247 in 2022 they've got: 79- Favour Aire, McNamara 81- Dug McDaniel, Paul VI 87- Rodney Rice, Dematha 93- Judah Mintz, Gonzaga 109- Tyrell Ward, Dematha 170- Paul Lewis, O'Connell 188- Christian Watson, St. John's 200- Jared Turner, Gonzaga 209- Devin Dinkins, Gonzaga So that's 9 players who are veritable locks to be high majors (all of the above have at least 1 high major offer already). I know there are several others in the league with mid-major offers and some high major interest, so the list could easily be in double figures by the time it's all said and done.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Jan 21, 2021 22:14:47 GMT -5
What DC area class of 2020 recruits were still available in January 2020? I'm sure someone local has those names, but there are always seniors (including WCAC) that sign in the spring. And the All-Met teams usually have a second or third team selection listed as "unsigned" or "undeclared" at the end of the season. FWIW, the announcement dates for each of the 2020 recruits: October 30, 2019: Dante Harris November 29, 2019: Jamari Sibley Feb. 20, 2020: Kobe Clark April 3, 2020: Jalen Harris April 27, 2020: Chudier Bile May 12, 2020: T.J. Berger June 4, 2020: Collin Holloway July 21,2020: Donald Carey
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Jan 22, 2021 0:06:28 GMT -5
What DC area class of 2020 recruits were still available in January 2020? I'm sure someone local has those names, but there are always seniors (including WCAC) that sign in the spring. And the All-Met teams usually have a second or third team selection listed as "unsigned" or "undeclared" at the end of the season. FWIW, the announcement dates for each of the 2020 recruits: October 30, 2019: Dante Harris November 29, 2019: Jamari Sibley Feb. 20, 2020: Kobe Clark April 3, 2020: Jalen Harris April 27, 2020: Chudier Bile May 12, 2020: T.J. Berger June 4, 2020: Collin Holloway July 21,2020: Donald Carey Right, and as I said in my earlier post, the 20-21 roster was full after the Jamari Sibley commitment.
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Post by thejerseytornado on Jan 22, 2021 9:12:30 GMT -5
As you look at that list, notice how few players stay local. The fact is, "local" and college basketball are no longer really that much of a draw in the 21st century. They aren't going to Maryland. The closest school is, I think, JMU.
It'd be great to get a real pipeline, but that's harkening back to an era before there was this much money and this much national press and fame and TV and bigger recruiting budgets. Honestly, I'm not sure it's a viable method.
Would I like to see it? hell yes. Should Ewing try to build a local pool and maybe think about how to do that recruiting differently/market the team differently to create that? yes. But that simply might not be the reality in the 2020s
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 22, 2021 9:18:36 GMT -5
At the risk of getting in trouble with the fables being bandied about, my view is this is very simple. JT2 didn't have very good relationships with local high school and AAU coaches, particularly during the last half of his Georgetown career. I'm sure there are many reasons for that, and I'm sure the Thompson legacy defenders would say it's because JT2 was clean and everybody else was dirty. An anti-Thompson person might say that JT2 was prickly, held grudges and didn't make much effort to build relationships, particularly if he felt he was wronged at some point (justly or otherwise).
JT3 did a solid job locally, particularly early in his caeer (Summers, Sims, Wright, Freeman, etc.) and you have to give him credit for that. But I think Ewing is a lot more like JT2 than JT3 (minus the on-court success) and I think the local power brokers remain not particularly high on the Thompson legacy.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 22, 2021 9:21:57 GMT -5
As you look at that list, notice how few players stay local. The fact is, "local" and college basketball are no longer really that much of a draw in the 21st century. They aren't going to Maryland. The closest school is, I think, JMU. It'd be great to get a real pipeline, but that's harkening back to an era before there was this much money and this much national press and fame and TV and bigger recruiting budgets. Honestly, I'm not sure it's a viable method. Would I like to see it? hell yes. Should Ewing try to build a local pool and maybe think about how to do that recruiting differently/market the team differently to create that? yes. But that simply might not be the reality in the 2020s Earlier, a poster mentioned a highly ranked local prospect who said that GU and Maryland should recruit the area a lot more than they were doing now. It was his impression that both programs could be better and more attractive if they would do so. Would someone repost that quote?
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Jan 22, 2021 9:23:35 GMT -5
As you look at that list, notice how few players stay local. The fact is, "local" and college basketball are no longer really that much of a draw in the 21st century. They aren't going to Maryland. The closest school is, I think, JMU. It'd be great to get a real pipeline, but that's harkening back to an era before there was this much money and this much national press and fame and TV and bigger recruiting budgets. Honestly, I'm not sure it's a viable method. Would I like to see it? hell yes. Should Ewing try to build a local pool and maybe think about how to do that recruiting differently/market the team differently to create that? yes. But that simply might not be the reality in the 2020s Earlier, a poster mentioned a highly ranked local prospect who said that GU and Maryland should recruit the area a lot more than they were doing now. It was his impression that both programs could be better and more attractive if they would do so. Would someone repost that quote? But Dickinson, now starring for the Wolverines as one of the country’s best big men, single-handedly reignited questions about Maryland’s local recruiting success. Before Michigan’s game against the Terps last month, Dickinson told reporters, “I did feel a little disrespected when I wasn’t recruited by them.” Since 2010, Maryland has landed eight players considered four- or five-star prospects by 247Sports from high schools within a 50-mile radius of College Park. (That total doesn’t include the three local four-star players signed or committed to Maryland in the 2021 and 2022 classes.) Some of those Terps, such as forward Jalen Smith and Cowan, established themselves as all-time greats during their careers, but others, such as Makhi Mitchell and Roddy Peters, ultimately transferred. In that time, Villanova, which won national titles in 2016 and 2018, has brought in six players of that caliber from schools in the region. Miami and Georgetown have each signed three of these players. No other program — including Duke and North Carolina — has landed more than two. www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/01/18/maryland-basketball-recruiting-hunter-dickinson/
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 22, 2021 9:30:33 GMT -5
Earlier, a poster mentioned a highly ranked local prospect who said that GU and Maryland should recruit the area a lot more than they were doing now. It was his impression that both programs could be better and more attractive if they would do so. Would someone repost that quote? But Dickinson, now starring for the Wolverines as one of the country’s best big men, single-handedly reignited questions about Maryland’s local recruiting success. Before Michigan’s game against the Terps last month, Dickinson told reporters, “I did feel a little disrespected when I wasn’t recruited by them.” Since 2010, Maryland has landed eight players considered four- or five-star prospects by 247Sports from high schools within a 50-mile radius of College Park. (That total doesn’t include the three local four-star players signed or committed to Maryland in the 2021 and 2022 classes.) Some of those Terps, such as forward Jalen Smith and Cowan, established themselves as all-time greats during their careers, but others, such as Makhi Mitchell and Roddy Peters, ultimately transferred. www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/01/18/maryland-basketball-recruiting-hunter-dickinson/Thanks, but That’s not the one I read here. I think it’s from a current recruit we’re on.
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Jan 22, 2021 9:37:27 GMT -5
But Dickinson, now starring for the Wolverines as one of the country’s best big men, single-handedly reignited questions about Maryland’s local recruiting success. Before Michigan’s game against the Terps last month, Dickinson told reporters, “I did feel a little disrespected when I wasn’t recruited by them.” Since 2010, Maryland has landed eight players considered four- or five-star prospects by 247Sports from high schools within a 50-mile radius of College Park. (That total doesn’t include the three local four-star players signed or committed to Maryland in the 2021 and 2022 classes.) Some of those Terps, such as forward Jalen Smith and Cowan, established themselves as all-time greats during their careers, but others, such as Makhi Mitchell and Roddy Peters, ultimately transferred. www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/01/18/maryland-basketball-recruiting-hunter-dickinson/Thanks, but That’s not the one I read here. I think it’s from a current recruit we’re on. hoyatalk2.proboards.com/post/901305/threadRodney Rice
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Jan 22, 2021 9:39:19 GMT -5
But Dickinson, now starring for the Wolverines as one of the country’s best big men, single-handedly reignited questions about Maryland’s local recruiting success. Before Michigan’s game against the Terps last month, Dickinson told reporters, “I did feel a little disrespected when I wasn’t recruited by them.” Since 2010, Maryland has landed eight players considered four- or five-star prospects by 247Sports from high schools within a 50-mile radius of College Park. (That total doesn’t include the three local four-star players signed or committed to Maryland in the 2021 and 2022 classes.) Some of those Terps, such as forward Jalen Smith and Cowan, established themselves as all-time greats during their careers, but others, such as Makhi Mitchell and Roddy Peters, ultimately transferred. www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/01/18/maryland-basketball-recruiting-hunter-dickinson/Thanks, but That’s not the one I read here. I think it’s from a current recruit we’re on. Well, the fact we're on a current WCAC recruit is a positive if nothing else but guess better execution/contact needed.
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Jan 22, 2021 9:49:12 GMT -5
As you look at that list, notice how few players stay local. The fact is, "local" and college basketball are no longer really that much of a draw in the 21st century. They aren't going to Maryland. The closest school is, I think, JMU. It'd be great to get a real pipeline, but that's harkening back to an era before there was this much money and this much national press and fame and TV and bigger recruiting budgets. Honestly, I'm not sure it's a viable method. Would I like to see it? hell yes. Should Ewing try to build a local pool and maybe think about how to do that recruiting differently/market the team differently to create that? yes. But that simply might not be the reality in the 2020s Earlier, a poster mentioned a highly ranked local prospect who said that GU and Maryland should recruit the area a lot more than they were doing now. It was his impression that both programs could be better and more attractive if they would do so. Would someone repost that quote?
#40/43 prospect in the 2020 class, played at DeMatha
EDIT: Sorry, not sure if the tweet image came through, but the quote was: "Imagine if the two HM programs in the DMV actually recruited kids in this area for basketball... They’d be top 5 in the country every year" "https://twitter.com/H_Dickinson24/status/1270110454325657602" Second Edit: Apparently not the one you were talking about anyway, lol. Nevermind!
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Jan 22, 2021 10:52:21 GMT -5
Easier said than done. A lot of politics involved, I'm sure.
We haven't even discussed Baltimore kids. Would love if we established relationships in Baltimore like JT2 had back in the day.
Maryland, despite its recruiting, still gets flack because of ones "that got away".
The area is so rich that you can't sign everyone. JT2 got it too for not getting Sherman douglass, Michael smith from providence, Lawrence Moten, etc.
Some local guys (and their handlers) get excited when recruited from the major powers in the country outside of the area. Coach K, Wright, etc. coveting the players. Some local guys just want to leave the area.
Yes, it would be nice to get a few local guys. If you look back at JT2's 84-85 team, 4 of the starting 5 were all local: Wingate and Reggie (Baltimore), Jackson (Reston, VA), Martin (DC). Ewing was the only non-local from MASS by way of Jamaica. The 83-84 National title also had Graham and Smith (DC), Dalton (PG county)
Sometimes it takes a special, talented kid to say "hey, I want to get the ball rolling from the area again". Keith Booth did that for Maryland after there was bad blood between Baltimore and Terps for a period.
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dchoya72
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Post by dchoya72 on Jan 22, 2021 11:25:13 GMT -5
I don't believe Ewing has any issues with WCAC coaches, and programs, or area college coaches. We have to begin winning, and do it consistently. That, I believe, will make a difference to prospects.
From Baltimore: David Wingate and Reggie Williams, the big fella (a senior moment, LOL).
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Jan 22, 2021 11:28:37 GMT -5
Agreed with Way here. Agree with other posters that Ewing had some guys (Mac, Akinjo, Leblanc) that probably chased off other guys and then we lost those guys. McDaniel, Ward, Rice would be a nice place to start in these upcoming classes. You aren't signing the number one WCAC guy out of the gates unless you have some connection. Keels has Duke & Nova all over him and they have been there for a long time. I think Pat is picking his spots here.
Now what would be great is rather then going cross country to get a #200 kid, you bring in a WCAC kid or other area kid who is comparable. People want to watch local talent. The Harris kid is a good example at Butler. We got our own Harris and maybe the Butler Harris wasn't in the cards for us but building with kids like that would be great. Sure a Rice, Ward or McDaniel would be fantastic but those are going to be really tough to pull. Hawkins going to UConn stings a bit too. Dickinson is full of s**t because Ewing had Wahab and probably thought he was late to the game on him so that kid is just making noise for noise sake. I watched him play in high school and hated his game so clearly I was right.
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Post by Problem of Dog on Jan 22, 2021 11:31:44 GMT -5
There are 10+ kids in the WCAC every year that you could get to come at the last minute who are better than TJ Berger. And if we're doing favors for programs by taking kids who are fringe prospects, preferred walk on types, then that list expands even more.
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hoyazeke
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Post by hoyazeke on Jan 22, 2021 11:42:07 GMT -5
As you look at that list, notice how few players stay local. The fact is, "local" and college basketball are no longer really that much of a draw in the 21st century. They aren't going to Maryland. The closest school is, I think, JMU. It'd be great to get a real pipeline, but that's harkening back to an era before there was this much money and this much national press and fame and TV and bigger recruiting budgets. Honestly, I'm not sure it's a viable method. Would I like to see it? hell yes. Should Ewing try to build a local pool and maybe think about how to do that recruiting differently/market the team differently to create that? yes. But that simply might not be the reality in the 2020s I just do not believe this statement to be true. Every time there has been a 5* kid in the Tri-Cities area of NC, Duke or UNC has got that kid. Kentucky isn't really a hot bed but I would bet if a 5* kid was in the state Kentucky would get him. When GTown was really good in the 80s and 90s JT2 was in the running for every 5* kid from NY to Hampton Roads. If Ewing can somehow get the program back into the Top 15 range the local kids will want to play for him. If he can get the program back into the Top 5 range he will start getting 5* local kids.....IMO
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Jan 22, 2021 11:57:01 GMT -5
As you look at that list, notice how few players stay local. The fact is, "local" and college basketball are no longer really that much of a draw in the 21st century. They aren't going to Maryland. The closest school is, I think, JMU. It'd be great to get a real pipeline, but that's harkening back to an era before there was this much money and this much national press and fame and TV and bigger recruiting budgets. Honestly, I'm not sure it's a viable method. Would I like to see it? hell yes. Should Ewing try to build a local pool and maybe think about how to do that recruiting differently/market the team differently to create that? yes. But that simply might not be the reality in the 2020s There may be some truth in this. 30 years ago I think more players were inclined to "stay home." Nowadays with social media, facetime, etc. being so ubiquitous, I think people feel less cut off from their families and closest friends even if they go to a different part of the country. I also think that young players take their cues from their idols in the NBA, and the NBA culture has changed from where the top players mostly stayed with one team their entire career (Bird, Magic, Isiah, Jordan, Kobe) to the modern superstar that tends to move around a lot more. For example LeBron deciding he wanted to play with his buddies in South Beach for a few years, then returning home for a few, then deciding he wants to go out to Hollywood for a while, or KD deciding to go to the bay for a couple years, then moving to Williamsburg, or even guys like Davis or Harden pouting their way to their preferred destinations. As a society, people (especially young people) are not as tied to their hometown as they were a few decades ago. The concept of "homesickness" is slowly being erased. From that perspective, being close to home may not be as big of an advantage in the 2020s as it was in the 1980s or 1990s. That said, it is still AN advantage, in most cases. Yes, there are some players who are eager to get away from their families, or who don't have much family to speak of, or maybe grew up in a neighborhood that they're eager to escape from, and in those cases being near home is not a plus (maybe even a minus). But I still feel pretty confident that a majority of players would be happy to play near home, assuming all else is relatively equal. To most kids the ability to have their family at their games is appealing, and the ability to team up with other players from the area that they know and respect is attractive too. It may not be as big of an edge as it once was, but in most cases it's still an edge. Also, even if the player is totally indifferent about the location of his college, we should have an edge with local kids simply because it should be much easier for our staff to build a relationship with them, which is usually one of if not the biggest factors in a players decision. Gonzaga and Bishop O'Connell are about 15 minutes from campus, Dematha about 30 minutes, Paul VI maybe 40. It should be MUCH easier for our coaches to drop in at a practice or a game to chat with these players (or even not chat if it's a quiet period, but just show up and show the player that you're there for him) than it is for the staffs of Michigan or Miami or Butler. The ability to make those connections and build those relationships in person, week after week, month after month, year after year should be the biggest advantage.
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Post by thejerseytornado on Jan 22, 2021 12:23:54 GMT -5
I just do not believe this statement to be true. Every time there has been a 5* kid in the Tri-Cities area of NC, Duke or UNC has got that kid. Kentucky isn't really a hot bed but I would bet if a 5* kid was in the state Kentucky would get him. When GTown was really good in the 80s and 90s JT2 was in the running for every 5* kid from NY to Hampton Roads. If Ewing can somehow get the program back into the Top 15 range the local kids will want to play for him. If he can get the program back into the Top 5 range he will start getting 5* local kids.....IMO Ahh yes, that's how UNC, Duke, and UK do it--it's their local connections. if the only examples we've got of a local connection is UNC and Duke, my point is made. More seriously, where is an example program in a major recruiting area that has the local connection you all are looking for? It's not happening in Chicago. Certainly not NYC. Not DC. LA? UCLA's a blueblood if it's even true, so that's not really fair. Where is this local connection that's helping teams in the past 5-10 years? Show me the team that's doing it? Not a pipeline--a local connection. Again, i'd love for it to happen, but i think it might be at least partially nostalgia for a time that's no longer true about basketball recruiting.
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hoyazeke
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Post by hoyazeke on Jan 22, 2021 19:27:21 GMT -5
I just do not believe this statement to be true. Every time there has been a 5* kid in the Tri-Cities area of NC, Duke or UNC has got that kid. Kentucky isn't really a hot bed but I would bet if a 5* kid was in the state Kentucky would get him. When GTown was really good in the 80s and 90s JT2 was in the running for every 5* kid from NY to Hampton Roads. If Ewing can somehow get the program back into the Top 15 range the local kids will want to play for him. If he can get the program back into the Top 5 range he will start getting 5* local kids.....IMO Ahh yes, that's how UNC, Duke, and UK do it--it's their local connections. if the only examples we've got of a local connection is UNC and Duke, my point is made. More seriously, where is an example program in a major recruiting area that has the local connection you all are looking for? It's not happening in Chicago. Certainly not NYC. Not DC. LA? UCLA's a blueblood if it's even true, so that's not really fair. Where is this local connection that's helping teams in the past 5-10 years? Show me the team that's doing it? Not a pipeline--a local connection. Again, i'd love for it to happen, but i think it might be at least partially nostalgia for a time that's no longer true about basketball recruiting. I'm not so much talking about a connection. I'm talking about winning. If you want examples that aren't blue bloods, I would go Gonzaga, Nova, Virginia, MichSt and UF. We are in a bball hotbed so there is no excuse not to get 4/5 star kids. Nova has plenty of local talent. MichSt, Gonzaga, Virginia and UF are getting talent off of winning....
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