prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,358
|
Post by prhoya on Jan 1, 2021 15:41:56 GMT -5
How about treating GU’s basketball program as his family’s business? The two head coach “national searches”?
|
|
|
Post by bigelephant on Jan 2, 2021 11:38:15 GMT -5
Just finished reading the book - it was GREAT - so many things that I didn't know
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,599
|
Post by DanMcQ on Jan 2, 2021 11:59:06 GMT -5
|
|
Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 10,495
|
Post by Elvado on Jan 2, 2021 12:12:30 GMT -5
How about treating GU’s basketball program as his family’s business? The two head coach “national searches”? Why should the successor searches be any different than the search that hired him?
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,599
|
Post by DanMcQ on Jan 4, 2021 9:59:40 GMT -5
|
|
paranoia2
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 847
|
Post by paranoia2 on Jan 4, 2021 11:44:14 GMT -5
Big John presided over a great basketball team that also became a cultural iconic BRAND. The starter jacket alone was must have gear. The team meant so much more than just basketball.
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,599
|
Post by DanMcQ on Jan 4, 2021 23:57:27 GMT -5
|
|
prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,358
|
Post by prhoya on Jan 5, 2021 17:55:27 GMT -5
Hey, I was just asking for a review, not for you to spill the beans. But, thanks for the link. One of my New Year's resolutions is to teach myself how to play a musical instrument and that link is a sign. I will not buy his book, but use that $20.86 plus change to buy the following John Thompson book further down your link's book list: www.amazon.com/John-Thompsons-Easiest-Piano-Course/dp/1423468228/ref=sr_1_fkmr4_1?crid=38PCTGJHSPJWB&dchild=1&keywords=i+came+as+a+shadow+john+thompson&qid=1609887127&sprefix=i+came+as+a%2Caps%2C410&sr=8-1-fkmr4If you had actually bothered to read the Washington Post book review linked upthread, you would have found a book excerpt directed at you: B.S.! He had the power, but could not cover for his son's ineptness any longer after everyone (alumni, donors, students and fans) turned against him. It was a very smart move by him to cut his son loose, but it's not like it took JT3 by surprise. JT3 knew he had to go and then helped his dad convince the Family's hand-picked, presentable successor (not Fredo). Even Ewing admits to receiving "keep it in the family" calls from the Thompsons.
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,599
|
Post by DanMcQ on Jan 5, 2021 21:38:50 GMT -5
Glad to see you have all the inside info.
|
|
prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,358
|
Post by prhoya on Jan 5, 2021 23:08:28 GMT -5
Glad to see you have all the inside info. Had inside info. Not all. This last year? Nada.
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,599
|
Post by DanMcQ on Jan 8, 2021 23:52:46 GMT -5
|
|
dchoya72
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,488
|
Post by dchoya72 on Jan 9, 2021 8:05:24 GMT -5
He was a great coach and established Georgetown University. Yes, it existed before he came, but was never the same afterwards. A very tough but loving man.
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,599
|
Post by DanMcQ on Jan 13, 2021 22:20:17 GMT -5
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,599
|
Post by DanMcQ on Jan 14, 2021 21:24:21 GMT -5
|
|
tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,329
|
Post by tashoya on Jan 15, 2021 21:00:47 GMT -5
I very much hope that Georgetown both remembers and continues to hold sacred the values, ethos and activism that Big Coach brought by nature of who he was. It's a big part of what drew me to Georgetown in the first place and I remain very proud to be able to call myself a Hoya, in part, because Big John called himself one. We've never not needed a voice like his in a prominent position with a captive audience. 2020 REALLY could have used a young, energetic John Thompson, Jr. being unafraid and unapologetic. May he RIP. I miss and will continue to miss him.
|
|
LCPolo18
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,406
|
Post by LCPolo18 on Jan 15, 2021 22:59:44 GMT -5
|
|
RusskyHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
In Soviet Russia, Hoya Blue Bleeds You!
Posts: 4,618
|
Post by RusskyHoya on Jan 16, 2021 11:37:56 GMT -5
I think a lot of us struggle with this. Do we think Brad Stevens got Butler to two national title games by handing out bags of cash to street agents? Did Jay Wright win it all by leveraging a network of shadowy shoe brokers? Has Mark Few gotten Gonzaga to #1 by dropping Bitcoins into the accounts of top recruits? I am quite sympathetic to the argument that the advantages conveyed by rampant cheating have led to major asymmetries in college basketball competition, even above and beyond the greater resources commanded by big-time football schools. Any Georgetown coach is gonna be swimming against that current. On the other hand, bribery tends to have a really deleterious effect on team chemistry. It gives players leverage over coaches and administrators and can just as easily blow up in everyone's face as pay off with titles and banners. To me, the real sign of Pops' diminished institutional influence wasn't the gravitational pull he exerted in the Ewing hire or his inability to keep JTIII employed. It was the fact that it took so long for the Thompson Center to become a reality. JTIII surely had his weaknesses with adjusting playing style to new rules and tendencies and the like, but he is also a very, very smart man who was under no delusions about how the landscape was evolving. Who knows how his recruiting might have turned out if he had non-embarassing facilities at his disposal years earlier than they ultimately materialized.
|
|
tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,329
|
Post by tashoya on Jan 16, 2021 11:47:36 GMT -5
I think a lot of us struggle with this. Do we think Brad Stevens got Butler to two national title games by handing out bags of cash to street agents? Did Jay Wright win it all by leveraging a network of shadowy shoe brokers? Has Mark Few gotten Gonzaga to #1 by dropping Bitcoins into the accounts of top recruits? I am quite sympathetic to the argument that the advantages conveyed by rampant cheating have led to major asymmetries in college basketball competition, even above and beyond the greater resources commanded by big-time football schools. Any Georgetown coach is gonna be swimming against that current. On the other hand, bribery tends to have a really deleterious effect on team chemistry. It gives players leverage over coaches and administrators and can just as easily blow up in everyone's face as pay off with titles and banners. To me, the real sign of Pops' diminished institutional influence wasn't the gravitational pull he exerted in the Ewing hire or his inability to keep JTIII employed. It was the fact that it took so long for the Thompson Center to become a reality. JTIII surely had his weaknesses with adjusting playing style to new rules and tendencies and the like, but he is also a very, very smart man who was under no delusions about how the landscape was evolving. Who knows how his recruiting might have turned out if he had non-embarassing facilities at his disposal years earlier than they ultimately materialized. Excellent post. +1.
|
|
the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,422
|
Post by the_way on Jan 16, 2021 12:52:08 GMT -5
Two losing seasons in a row is tough to maintain job security, right or wrong. Esh had 1 losing season (as the full-time head coach) and got canned. Esh defended himself at the time because he believed his record was strong off the court and that is what also went into the evaluation of his job. Obviously, it didn't when he got fired.
It is the same reason people are growing restless with Ewing right now. On top of it, he had issues with players off the court.
Not having an answer on the court for today's college basketball game was also III's undoing. It didn't look like, going forward, the results would change. He didn't adapt.
During JT2's era, other programs had players getting paid and not going to class, lacking the ability to read, etc. JT2 still won. They added the shot-clock and 3 pt. line and he still thrived. The main difference is that players aren't even attending college. They are not staying in school as long too. Big difference I would say because that is another can of worms when it comes to recruiting.
As mentioned earlier, who is running a clean program these days, graduating players, and winning on the basketball court?
|
|
|
Post by iheartdurenbros on Jan 16, 2021 14:20:34 GMT -5
Is it possible that JT Jr revealed some flaws in that book? So he could not control the decision to fire his son. Just because he did not have complete control, doesn’t mean that he had no influence over the decision or program.
To be clear, he is a great man, the book is good, he deserves the eulogies he’s receiving, but the university made the right decision. And maybe waited a year too long.
|
|