guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,599
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Post by guru on Dec 9, 2019 17:47:05 GMT -5
It's college basketball. We've been so squeaky clean for years. Controversy finally hit the hill-top and its being dealt with, I feel.. No one is squeaky clean. It’s the nature of the beast.
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Post by johnnysnowplow on Dec 9, 2019 21:54:12 GMT -5
It's college basketball. We've been so squeaky clean for years. Controversy finally hit the hill-top and its being dealt with, I feel.. No one is squeaky clean. It’s the nature of the beast. Exactly. Which is why all these people who are ready to denounce the school and burn all their gear over this incident look so foolish.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 11, 2019 16:39:56 GMT -5
Take it Fwiw...
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Dec 11, 2019 17:05:04 GMT -5
Yes Yes YES
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,438
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Post by lichoya68 on Dec 13, 2019 14:49:31 GMT -5
let the process play out STUDENTS always two sides to every story ALL student privacy etc etc never know we will see. go hoyas beast cuse
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LCPolo18
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by LCPolo18 on Dec 13, 2019 15:23:35 GMT -5
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Hoyas4Ever
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
A Wise Man Once Told Me Don't Argue With Fools....
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Post by Hoyas4Ever on Dec 13, 2019 15:57:14 GMT -5
Jeez, no wonder Gardner and Alexander are leaving. They have no choice. By doing this, the 68 faculty are also condemning the players once again without due process. The players have rights as well (innocent until proven guilty) and the 68 faculty have chimed in stomping on the players rights and making the school/athletic departments job to manage everybody named in this incident rights properly an impossible task. Sometimes people get way over there skies on things and don't let the facts come out. This rush to judge society has gone overboard. If the facts come out and the players are found to have committed server wrongdoing, then yes they should be punished. I just don't get this let's punish them now before any facts come to light...
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hoya95
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoya95 on Dec 13, 2019 16:17:13 GMT -5
I have no idea what the underlying facts are in any of this. But the Duke lacrosse families sued the hell out of the school because of comments professors made that presumed guilt. It got really ugly internally there. We'll see what happens here.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by TC on Dec 13, 2019 16:39:35 GMT -5
I have no idea what the underlying facts are in any of this. But the Duke lacrosse families sued the hell out of the school because of comments professors made that presumed guilt. It got really ugly internally there. We'll see what happens here. Did you read the letter? I did - it didn't name any players or programs and made two points : - why are athletes under investigation able to play, but a Professor credibly accused is suspended? - FERPA is to protect students, but students are made to feel unsupported by the University because the University won't explain what specifically is preventing transparency The Duke Lacrosse comparison is ridiculous, it's a well-written letter, and the second point they made applies to both accuser and accused. I would also say that the letter might not be about the Alexander / Gardner situation whatsoever.
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hoya95
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoya95 on Dec 13, 2019 17:11:50 GMT -5
I have no idea what the underlying facts are in any of this. But the Duke lacrosse families sued the hell out of the school because of comments professors made that presumed guilt. It got really ugly internally there. We'll see what happens here. Did you read the letter? I did - it didn't name any players or programs and made two points : - why are athletes under investigation able to play, but a Professor credibly accused is suspended? - FERPA is to protect students, but students are made to feel unsupported by the University because the University won't explain what specifically is preventing transparency The Duke Lacrosse comparison is ridiculous, it's a well-written letter, and the second point they made applies to both accuser and accused. I would also say that the letter might not be about the Alexander / Gardner situation whatsoever. A group of faculty at Duke put out an ad that said "regardless of the results of the police investigation", the larger issue was racism and sexism on campus. They didn't name any names or directly accuse anyone of a crime either. But it opened the door to a massive lawsuit. I have a friend who was working in their judicial affairs office at the time, and the ugliness from that lawsuit went on for years. The Georgetown letter doesn't directly accuse anyone either, but it says the larger problem is Georgetown not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. You don't have to like it, but the players can sue over something like this, especially if they wind up cleared of any wrongdoing.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,443
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Post by TC on Dec 13, 2019 17:41:04 GMT -5
A group of faculty at Duke put out an ad that said "regardless of the results of the police investigation", the larger issue was racism and sexism on campus. They didn't name any names or directly accuse anyone of a crime either. But it opened the door to a massive lawsuit. I have a friend who was working in their judicial affairs office at the time, and the ugliness from that lawsuit went on for years. The Georgetown letter doesn't directly accuse anyone either, but it says the larger problem is Georgetown not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. You don't have to like it, but the players can sue over something like this, especially if they wind up cleared of any wrongdoing. Nowhere does that letter make the argument that Georgetown is not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. The argument the letter makes is that people aren't confident that Georgetown is taking it seriously because of the lack of transparency and the lack of any statement from the administration.
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by guru on Dec 13, 2019 17:52:09 GMT -5
A group of faculty at Duke put out an ad that said "regardless of the results of the police investigation", the larger issue was racism and sexism on campus. They didn't name any names or directly accuse anyone of a crime either. But it opened the door to a massive lawsuit. I have a friend who was working in their judicial affairs office at the time, and the ugliness from that lawsuit went on for years. The Georgetown letter doesn't directly accuse anyone either, but it says the larger problem is Georgetown not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. You don't have to like it, but the players can sue over something like this, especially if they wind up cleared of any wrongdoing. Nowhere does that letter make the argument that Georgetown is not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. The argument the letter makes is that people aren't confident that Georgetown is taking it seriously because of the lack of transparency and the lack of any statement from the administration. Those absurd and incompetent press releases massively harmed the university and the program.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 13, 2019 17:54:55 GMT -5
Nowhere does that letter make the argument that Georgetown is not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. The argument the letter makes is that people aren't confident that Georgetown is taking it seriously because of the lack of transparency and the lack of any statement from the administration. Those absurd and incompetent press releases massively harmed the university and the program. That’s an overstatement. A lot of alumni don’t even what happened two weeks ago.
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by guru on Dec 13, 2019 18:17:34 GMT -5
Those absurd and incompetent press releases massively harmed the university and the program. That’s an overstatement. A lot of alumni don’t even what happened two weeks ago. And?
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 13, 2019 18:33:35 GMT -5
That’s an overstatement. A lot of alumni don’t even what happened two weeks ago. And? The Gordie Ernst story is probably as much or more on their concern than this.
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hoya95
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoya95 on Dec 13, 2019 19:27:48 GMT -5
A group of faculty at Duke put out an ad that said "regardless of the results of the police investigation", the larger issue was racism and sexism on campus. They didn't name any names or directly accuse anyone of a crime either. But it opened the door to a massive lawsuit. I have a friend who was working in their judicial affairs office at the time, and the ugliness from that lawsuit went on for years. The Georgetown letter doesn't directly accuse anyone either, but it says the larger problem is Georgetown not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. You don't have to like it, but the players can sue over something like this, especially if they wind up cleared of any wrongdoing. Nowhere does that letter make the argument that Georgetown is not taking sexual assault or misconduct seriously. The argument the letter makes is that people aren't confident that Georgetown is taking it seriously because of the lack of transparency and the lack of any statement from the administration. The Georgetown faculty letter says: 1) they are "deeply disturbed" by the allegations, and they want "to express unreservedly their support" for all survivors of any such claims; 2) that university students don't believe Georgetown takes those claims seriously; and 3) they want to know why the players weren't immediately suspended like faculty would be. This opens the door for the players to file a claim against the school that they were subject to harassment/threats and had their characters defamed due to statements by Georgetown employees. It makes no difference whether you or I think those claims should succeed on the merits. We don't take a poll before someone can file a lawsuit. I don't think the Duke professors' ad caused any damages or even defamed those lacrosse players. But that's irrelevant. They sued. Duke had to pay up, and then they had to put in procedures to ensure something like this wouldn't happen again. Lawyers don't tell you not to talk publicly for their health. Georgetown hasn't made any statements about an ongoing investigation because they would likely be sued. Duke immediately shut down their entire lacrosse program pending an investigation. They wouldn't do that now without much more due process as a direct result of the changes they implemented after that lawsuit. Those professors think they are on the right side, and they may think they are helping. But I feel pretty confident that University Counsel wanted to throw something at them when they read it.
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Post by reformation on Dec 14, 2019 9:47:52 GMT -5
Interesting I took a look at the professors who signed the complaint-seemed to emanate from the History Dept for what its worth.
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