TC
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Post by TC on Dec 6, 2019 11:18:01 GMT -5
At a former company I worked for, these e-mails fell into three categories: 1. Forced to Quit: "It is my sad duty to report that Jack Smith is leaving the company effective Dec. 31. [Insert paragraph on past accomplishments]. He will be missed by all of us at [Company]. Stop by the cafeteria on Friday afternoon for cake to wish Jack well." 2. Laid off, but really got canned: "Jack Smith is no longer with us this morning. [No paragraph on past accomplishments.] We do not anticipate any more reductions today. We wish him well in his future endeavors." 3. Fired outright: "Effective immediately, Jack Smith is no longer with the company." www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Future%20EndeavorsWhich is kind of my point - if you want to sell the idea that Leblanc and Akinjo transferred of their own free will, you release something like a (2) but what they released was a (3), so either they meant they were booted or they released a horrible statement. That wasn't the same under JT3 : www.guhoyas.com/news/2016/8/18/Paul_White_to_Transfer_from_Georgetown.aspx
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Dec 6, 2019 11:25:38 GMT -5
I have had employees who I terminated for poor performance work out a notice their own request. Things happen differently based on different situations at different times. The jumps to conclusions are becoming leaps and bounds.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 6, 2019 11:29:24 GMT -5
The statement did not reference anything related to discipline. All of the speculation was external. But we already knew Josh had been disciplined earlier in the year so stating that he won’t be with the team the remainder of the year instead of saying he’s transferring is a very poor way to announce his leaving... The leap that folks made wasn’t very far...
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 6, 2019 11:32:43 GMT -5
I have had employees who I terminated for poor performance work out a notice their own request. Things happen differently based on different situations at different times. The jumps to conclusions are becoming leaps and bounds. All due respect but you and your employees aren’t in the public eye... Again Gtown isn’t required to say much or anything at all for that matter but when they do choose to speak it must be as accurate and clear as possible... The original statement failed miserably on both of those fronts...
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guru
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Post by guru on Dec 6, 2019 11:38:16 GMT -5
What Lee Reed did was to give in to pressure- shame on him for that. Any confusion was caused by external speculation rather than the statement itself. In my opinion, the university and program has said too much. You’re simply wrong on this. The original statement was worded so poorly and so strangely given their later scrambling explanations for the departures. It was incompetent. We clearly need better communications employees.
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guru
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Post by guru on Dec 6, 2019 11:41:42 GMT -5
I do think that original statement was fine. While I am fine with the limited additional information that was provided, I would have stuck by that original statement, as in, "We have made a statement and that is all of the information we are providing on that subject. The student-athletes are no longer on the team. Next question." The statement read in part that the two players wouldn’t be on the team the remainder of the season... How can you describe that as fine? Yes, the remainder of the season phrase was really a doozy. Who announces transfers that way? It didn’t even include the boilerplate “we wish them well” language. My guess is they were angry and caught off-guard, and so fired off a quickly composed statement. This is problematic for so many reasons.
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lichoya68
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OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
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Post by lichoya68 on Dec 6, 2019 11:47:22 GMT -5
its very complicated no easy solutions or answers. dealing with a lot of issues here eg privacy what really happened? alot of assuming by the wash post and some posters. dealing with 18-19 year olds VERY complicated . especially when need to respect everyone's privacy. never know whats really going on and sometimes shouldn.t praying for all hoyas__ students athletes the accused the accusors. need prayers rather than snap judgements. I Worked with adolescents for years. Can't assume much if don't know the real facts.. But as a jesuit friend of mind said once these are 18 year olds who frequently do stupid things doesn't make it right but need to respect some type of process go hoyas
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hoya9797
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Post by hoya9797 on Dec 6, 2019 11:51:45 GMT -5
Prayers will do nothing. Having competent communication professionals in the AD will help a lot.
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IDenj
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Post by IDenj on Dec 6, 2019 11:54:08 GMT -5
The players should be held back from playing while the the investigation is on going. They are innocent until proven guilty but as an institution they should not be allowed to represent the basketball program. Look at the claims made against the NHL coaches; while the clubs/league followed thru on investigations both Peters and Crawford were put on leave. It’s the right thing to do. What investigation?! This events took place in September, it sounds like it’s already taken place and/or it is an extremely long drawn out process that would be completely unfair to sit players for its completion. Comparing well compensated NHL coaches to student athletes who are already taken advantage of by the system is asinine. Is law enforcement not still investigating? And it is a fair comparison; accusations are made against individuals who represent your institution or business. Doesn’t matter how much money one makes, that’s asinine. Same applies to anyone in any walk of life.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Dec 6, 2019 11:58:09 GMT -5
On the first page of the thread that James and Josh are no longer playing for the team, DFW very succinctly and accurately noted that when players are transferring, Georgetown normally announces it as such. So it is an understatement to characterize the original announcement as abnormal.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Dec 6, 2019 12:14:01 GMT -5
What investigation?! This events took place in September, it sounds like it’s already taken place and/or it is an extremely long drawn out process that would be completely unfair to sit players for its completion. Comparing well compensated NHL coaches to student athletes who are already taken advantage of by the system is asinine. Is law enforcement not still investigating? And it is a fair comparison; accusations are made against individuals who represent your institution or business. Doesn’t matter how much money one makes, that’s asinine. Same applies to anyone in any walk of life. Nothing that has come out has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. It's a civil dispute now. Athletes aren't employees of the university. If anything, they are already being taken advantage of the university. There school is there to help and protect them, they aren't there to serve the school. A School to student relationship should not be at all the same as a employee to employer relationship.
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TC
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Post by TC on Dec 6, 2019 13:33:30 GMT -5
Is law enforcement not still investigating? And it is a fair comparison; accusations are made against individuals who represent your institution or business. Doesn’t matter how much money one makes, that’s asinine. Same applies to anyone in any walk of life. Nothing that has come out has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. It's a civil dispute now. No. Your first statement is that nothing has come out that has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. That does not mean that law enforcement is not involved anymore. I have no knowledge here, but that's just logically incorrect. A does not imply B. I am not a lawyer and I defer to people who know the DC justice system better, but this thing seems like it still is in progress - the hearing for the roommate's restraining order is on Monday the 9th. It seems pretty early to declare that charges have been ruled out based on the lack of public knowledge.
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Dec 6, 2019 13:40:10 GMT -5
On the first page of the thread that James and Josh are no longer playing for the team, DFW very succinctly and accurately noted that when players are transferring, Georgetown normally announces it as such. So it is an understatement to characterize the original announcement as abnormal. Is there a middle ground perhaps being missed? Perhaps they wanted to enter the portal but finish the season. Is that possible? On this I defer to NCAA rules folks. Perhaps they wanted to enter the portal at which point Pat said ”see ya”. I just don’t remember if we have had transfer announcements mid-year but I am slipping as to memory.
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IDenj
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Post by IDenj on Dec 6, 2019 13:48:17 GMT -5
Nothing that has come out has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. It's a civil dispute now. No. Your first statement is that nothing has come out that has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. That does not mean that law enforcement is not involved anymore. I have no knowledge here, but that's just logically incorrect. A does not imply B. I am not a lawyer and I defer to people who know the DC justice system better, but this thing seems like it still is in progress - the hearing for the roommate's restraining order is on Monday the 9th. It seems pretty early to declare that charges have been ruled out based on the lack of public knowledge. Exactly. Not passing judgement on the players but they are representing your institution. In almost any situation the prudent thing is to suspend with pay or hold them out of competition until all the facts become known. Because in the end IF they are found to be in the wrong and you’ve allowed them to represent your interests it is an extremely bad look, with potential further implications.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Dec 6, 2019 14:40:52 GMT -5
No. Your first statement is that nothing has come out that has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. That does not mean that law enforcement is not involved anymore. I have no knowledge here, but that's just logically incorrect. A does not imply B. I am not a lawyer and I defer to people who know the DC justice system better, but this thing seems like it still is in progress - the hearing for the roommate's restraining order is on Monday the 9th. It seems pretty early to declare that charges have been ruled out based on the lack of public knowledge. Exactly. Not passing judgement on the players but they are representing your institution. In almost any situation the prudent thing is to suspend with pay or hold them out of competition until all the facts become known. Because in the end IF they are found to be in the wrong and you’ve allowed them to represent your interests it is an extremely bad look, with potential further implications. And in the end IF they are found to be innocent you potentially ruined a full year of their basketball career and reputation. Its not as clear cut as you were making it.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Dec 6, 2019 14:44:28 GMT -5
Nothing that has come out has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. It's a civil dispute now. No. Your first statement is that nothing has come out that has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. That does not mean that law enforcement is not involved anymore. I have no knowledge here, but that's just logically incorrect. A does not imply B. I am not a lawyer and I defer to people who know the DC justice system better, but this thing seems like it still is in progress - the hearing for the roommate's restraining order is on Monday the 9th. It seems pretty early to declare that charges have been ruled out based on the lack of public knowledge. I really don't think police enforcement is spending 3+ months investigation misdemeanors on a college campus. Based on the lack of severity of the accusations, I cannot image a world where anything new comes out of it. Maybe they get back involved because of the new press but, I'm not sure what you people are expecting.
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IDenj
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Post by IDenj on Dec 6, 2019 15:45:03 GMT -5
Exactly. Not passing judgement on the players but they are representing your institution. In almost any situation the prudent thing is to suspend with pay or hold them out of competition until all the facts become known. Because in the end IF they are found to be in the wrong and you’ve allowed them to represent your interests it is an extremely bad look, with potential further implications. And in the end IF they are found to be innocent you potentially ruined a full year of their basketball career and reputation. Its not as clear cut as you were making it. Their reputation will be vindicated when a final judgement is rendered. But as student athlete the good news is they can focus on their studies.
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Post by gatormcclusky on Dec 6, 2019 15:45:06 GMT -5
No. Your first statement is that nothing has come out that has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. That does not mean that law enforcement is not involved anymore. I have no knowledge here, but that's just logically incorrect. A does not imply B. I am not a lawyer and I defer to people who know the DC justice system better, but this thing seems like it still is in progress - the hearing for the roommate's restraining order is on Monday the 9th. It seems pretty early to declare that charges have been ruled out based on the lack of public knowledge. Exactly. Not passing judgement on the players but they are representing your institution. In almost any situation the prudent thing is to suspend with pay or hold them out of competition until all the facts become known. Because in the end IF they are found to be in the wrong and you’ve allowed them to represent your interests it is an extremely bad look, with potential further implications. it sets a terrible precedent for an institution to suspend student-athletes based on unproven allegations from an in-progress civil suit. Players being officially charged with a crime, that's different - sure, in that case suspend them until the judicial process is complete. But just because someone is willing to file a lawsuit against a player for a perceived wrongful act, it should not automatically result in a suspension.
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Post by HoyaRejuveNation85 on Dec 6, 2019 15:53:36 GMT -5
Prayers will do nothing. Having competent communication professionals in the AD will help a lot. Hoya97, we get it. You hate any reference to God, prayer, etc. in connection with Georgetown. It was nothing to your experience as we've heard many times over. Would you please stop reflexively negatively commenting on any poster who does post something with religious overtones, especially one like Lic who offered "prayers" for a good resolution for all parties in this mess? God, Catholicism, prayer were and are a part of the Georgetown experience for many of us. We are different there. Let's focus on the things that (usually) bind us -- like Georgetown hoops. Hoya Saxa!
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guru
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Post by guru on Dec 6, 2019 16:04:19 GMT -5
No. Your first statement is that nothing has come out that has implied law enforcement is involved anymore. That does not mean that law enforcement is not involved anymore. I have no knowledge here, but that's just logically incorrect. A does not imply B. I am not a lawyer and I defer to people who know the DC justice system better, but this thing seems like it still is in progress - the hearing for the roommate's restraining order is on Monday the 9th. It seems pretty early to declare that charges have been ruled out based on the lack of public knowledge. I really don't think police enforcement is spending 3+ months investigation misdemeanors on a college campus. Based on the lack of severity of the accusations, I cannot image a world where anything new comes out of it. Maybe they get back involved because of the new press but, I'm not sure what you people are expecting. The only thing I was expecting - and it's clearly too much to ask from the Georgetown basketball program - was a coherent statement about the transfers. A competently written original announcement of the Leblanc and Akinjo transfers likely would have spared the program this ongoing public embarrassment.
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