hoyarad
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Post by hoyarad on Apr 3, 2017 12:01:41 GMT -5
I think everyone just needs to relax, logout from Hoyatalk, step away from your computer/phone/tablet, and come back when an announcement has been made about the coach. Please!?!?
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concord
Century (over 100 posts)
The foe long since in silence slept; Alike the conqueror silent sleeps.
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Post by concord on Apr 3, 2017 12:02:16 GMT -5
www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19063479/patrick-ewing-meet-georgetown-hoyas-officials-head-coach-vacancyListen to the audio accompanying this article - Wilbon totally rips our search, and confirms some of the things Thamel said about this search being the talk of the town at the Final Four. - "If you're going to fire John Thompson III, don't you have someone in mind? ... They don't seem to have thought of that, and I'm stunned." - "I don't know what they're doing. I think they're delusional in some ways." - "If they're not careful, they're going to be DePaul. And DePaul was a place that went through this." - "You have to be really realistic about what you've got." He also said he was stunned that they fired JT3 and thought it was wrong. Wilbon has no idea what he's talking about. His argument about "realistic expectations" is apparently that Georgetown should be totally cool with 2 consecutive losing seasons and a roster so devastated by abrupt departures, it looks like Earth at the beginning of Wall-E. Even as a longtime JTIII defender, how anyone could follow the program over the last few seasons and not see the wheels coming off is beyond me. Obviously, the search team had at least a few people in mind and are working their way down the list. Should they not even have tried to get Smart or Mack? Reasonable people can argue whether it's better to go legacy with Ewing, up and coming with Hurley, "retread" with Amaker or Crean, or out of the box with Christian (among other options) but the idea that this is some tragic debacle is hyperbole. Most of this is going to come down to how the next coach is able to recruit, and it seems ludicrous to dismiss the probability that any of these guys can recruit well at this juncture. Perhaps this search is less than a well-oiled machine, but that's just part and parcel of Georgetown's administrative operations, particularly around sports. What did people expect, we were suddenly going to turn into Ohio State or Florida and have our all powerful AD name a new coach in 24 hours? There are multiple options in the mix that I consider satisfactory as a fan, and what Wilbon and Thamel think of it is frankly irrelevant.
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HoyaSC
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Post by HoyaSC on Apr 3, 2017 12:02:32 GMT -5
We are debating whether Ewing as coach will be able to keep a 75 year old man from screaming at his players and bursting in at halftime to order people around. We are DEBATING this. Do people not see the lunacy of even having such a discussion? If this is something you have to wonder about your new coach, then maybe he ain't the guy.
If guru's post is correct, things are way worse than we thought. Thompson Legacy camp people-- can you defend that behavior?
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TC
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Post by TC on Apr 3, 2017 12:03:03 GMT -5
Someone earlier hit the nail on the head. Two camps: Thompson legacy camp and non-Thompson clean break camp. How about also Camp C : have an actual process where we interview people like Hurley, Ed Cooley, Christian, and Becker - not one where we throw a few Hail Mary's and pretend we're interested in guys we know we can't get and then settle? Quite honestly, I find the version of events put forth by this board (Alonzo gets the board to fire JT3 over the wishes of the President because his son doesn't get playing time, we hire his buddy Ewing) to be more depressing than anything that Pete Thamel wrote. It's what happens in a dysfunctional kid's soccer league - not a major university. I'm so cynical at this point that I wonder if Shaka Smart was interested whether we'd actually interview him, or whether we'd make up some excuse (he's too expensive! he's not academic enough!) to run him out of the field so we could debate Amaker/Ewing. I was all for keeping JT3 - because I figured we'd end up with guys like Amaker and Crean and Ewing in the process - JT3 has the best resume of that group to turn this thing around, and we would not have to pay a buyout or a Korn Ferry to disguise our motivations. If you fire him, you need to look outside and see what's there and it doesn't look at all like we did that.
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GUMBA
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Post by GUMBA on Apr 3, 2017 12:04:57 GMT -5
If Pat gets the job and rebuilds the current wreck in 2-3 years, gets us into the NCAAs regularly, and in the top 3-4 in the BE, you will not follow the program? Nonsense.[/quote]
Nonsense? I am willing to bet you a steak dinner at Bobby Vans with a $200 bottle of Cab that our beloved Hoyas won't be back in the NCAAs and a top team in the Big East two to three years from now. Are you willing to do the same? I've been a season ticket holder since 1989. I went to Georgetown University, not Thompson University. I will always root for my school. I don't want Patrick Ewing to fail but I think the chances of success given the shadow JT Jr. casts over this program is impossible to overcome. This "search" was absurd from the start. I am done with supporting the program financially until the situation is remedied. I'm guessing many other boosters will take the same path. With all the defections you can expect the team will lose a ton of games next year. I may not be Nostradamus but it doesn't take much to predict where the program is heading following this charade of a coaching search.
And whoever wrote about traveling the country for an NBA team on Chartered first class aircraft compared to flying with the masses on commercial planes hasn't flown both. There is a huge difference. Unless the new job comes with a Gulf Stream I didn't hear about...
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TC
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Post by TC on Apr 3, 2017 12:06:12 GMT -5
The depressing thing is that I think Wilbon isn't cynical enough. I think they had Amaker/Ewing in mind from the get-go.
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concord
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The foe long since in silence slept; Alike the conqueror silent sleeps.
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Post by concord on Apr 3, 2017 12:08:00 GMT -5
I am done with supporting the program financially until the situation is remedied. I'm guessing many other boosters will take the same path. If they do hire Ewing, I'm honestly curious to see if this is true over the next 12-24 months.
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Post by augustusfinknottle on Apr 3, 2017 12:10:06 GMT -5
I have my reservations as to whether Ewing will be able to recruit and adjust from the NBA to the college game. Make no mistakes, those are serious risks. But I believe they are largely outweighed by the potential upside. It is hard to imagine another candidate with the same depth and breadth of exposure to some of the biggest legends in the history of the game. Think about the great coaches Patrick has played or coached with throughout his youth, college, NBA and team USA experiences: Leo Papille, Mike Jarvis, John Thompson Jr., Bob Knight, George Raveling, Don Donoher, C.M. Newton, Hubie Brown, Rick Pitino, Pat Riley, Chuck Daly, Mike Krzyzewski, PJ Carlesimo, Lenny Wilkins, Don Nelson, Jeff Van Gundy, Doc Rivers, Doug Collins, Stan Van Gundy, and Steve Clifford. Or the teammates he's played with like Rod Strickland, Mark Jackson, Anthony Mason, Bernard King, Charles Oakley, Karl Malone, Charles Barkley, Magic Johnson, Clyde Drexler, John Stockton, Larry Bird, David Robinson, Scottie Pippen, and Michael Jordan. Or the players he's coached like Tyronn Lue, Jerry Stackhouse, Yao Ming, Mark Jackson, Tracy McGrady, Dwight Howard, JJ Redick, Jameer Nelson, Vince Carter, Martin Gortat, Jason Richardson, Glen Davis, Al Harrington, Cody Zeller, Al Jefferson, Kemba Walker, Lance Stephenson, Noah Vonleh, and Jeremy Lamb. Fact is, there are very, very few people out there with a basketball network anything close to that. There are even fewer with such strong Georgetown bloodlines. When you add in the fact that from all accounts Patrick has a sharp basketball mind, is well-regarded from an Xs and Os perspective, is keenly aware that recruiting will be his biggest challenge, has a reputation for working hard and always striving to improve, and known for connecting well with teammates and players, it seems like it is well worth the risk. You had me at Tyronn Lue.
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bamahoya11
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by bamahoya11 on Apr 3, 2017 12:12:24 GMT -5
Someone earlier hit the nail on the head. Two camps: Thompson legacy camp and non-Thompson clean break camp. How about also Camp C : have an actual process where we interview people like Hurley, Ed Cooley, Christian, and Becker - not one where we throw a few Hail Mary's and pretend we're interested in guys we know we can't get and then settle? Quite honestly, I find the version of events put forth by this board (Alonzo gets the board to fire JT3 over the wishes of the President because his son doesn't get playing time, we hire his buddy Ewing) to be more depressing than anything that Pete Thamel wrote. It's what happens in a dysfunctional kid's soccer league - not a major university. I'm so cynical at this point that I wonder if Shaka Smart was interested whether we'd actually interview him, or whether we'd make up some excuse (he's too expensive! he's not academic enough!) to run him out of the field so we could debate Amaker/Ewing. I was all for keeping JT3 - because I figured we'd end up with guys like Amaker and Crean and Ewing in the process - JT3 has the best resume of that group to turn this thing around, and we would not have to pay a buyout or a Korn Ferry to disguise our motivations. If you fire him, you need to look outside and see what's there and it doesn't look at all like we did that. To be very fair, you warned about this sort of thing way back in the season, well before this happened. I didn't believe you. I thought if we moved on from JTIII we could have an open process that yielded a plainly qualified candidate. It appears that I will be wrong. Much like you, I would rather have given JTIII another chance than to have gone for Ewing as his replacement. Though, if Guru's account or the state of the program is correct, all of these debates may be academic. Hard to imagine winning much in that environment.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2017 12:15:27 GMT -5
What the Anti Ewing camp doesn't understand is Coaching is overrated bruh! Best coaches just roll the balls out!
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Apr 3, 2017 12:17:29 GMT -5
It will be interesting to see where the other potential candidates land (if anywhere) and how successful they become, compared to whoever we ultimately end up hiring. Crean especially will be one to watch. Crean should sit out a year, and then Depaul should hire him next year when they cut ties with Leitao. To contribute something a little more on topic, I see both sides of the discussion. I too am dissatisfied with the way the search seems to have gone, and that we looked hard at a guy like Amaker while ignoring some pretty good candidates. But, I think I can easily talk myself into Patrick being a pretty good hire in the end. So much of this stuff is about identifying and acquiring talent. Last year I watched the championship won by two guys who we'd misidentified as not being quite good enough in Hart and Jenkins. On Saturday the two best players were probably Meeks and Williams-Goss, a couple of guys who we were heavily in the mix with but couldn't close on. I know Patrick has no real recruiting experience, but it isn't rocket science, and as a new coach and a Hall of Famer I think he will have some good momentum out of the gate--more than someone like Amaker would have had for sure. If we hire Patrick we'll get a LOT more buzz and positive attention than we would have with basically any of the other candidates, which is a nice bonus and hopefully plants some seeds in the minds of potential recruits. With the right assistants I think he'll be able to land some pretty good players (not for 2017, but thereafter), and from there he will sink or swim based on his actual coaching ability. While again there are certainly risks, and probably a little more risk than a lot of the other candidates, there's good reason to believe that the guy can coach. He's going to be easy to root for, so I'm happy to just be a fan for a few years until we see how this thing goes. I do think that there are major issues to be resolved within our athletic department (the state of the art Thompson facility hasn't fixed a thoroughly 1980s mindset), but if Pat's the choice he'll have 100% of my support and I do hope that all our fans will rally behind him, even if they don't love the way the selection process was handled.
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GIGAFAN99
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Post by GIGAFAN99 on Apr 3, 2017 12:17:33 GMT -5
We can be against this "philosophically" all we want but here's the bottom line;
If Pat takes this job he's going to want to absolutely crush it.
Let's face facts; an NCAA title as a player, played in the NBA finals, and coached in the NBA finals...Pat is good at basketball and he wants to win. He won't take this unless he knows he can kill it.
And JT2 and 3 have zero successful coaches in their respective trees outside of Pat. So he's as close to a Jay Wright hire as we're going to get.
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Post by centercourt400s on Apr 3, 2017 12:22:06 GMT -5
www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19063479/patrick-ewing-meet-georgetown-hoyas-officials-head-coach-vacancyListen to the audio accompanying this article - Wilbon totally rips our search, and confirms some of the things Thamel said about this search being the talk of the town at the Final Four. - "If you're going to fire John Thompson III, don't you have someone in mind? ... They don't seem to have thought of that, and I'm stunned." - "I don't know what they're doing. I think they're delusional in some ways." - "If they're not careful, they're going to be DePaul. And DePaul was a place that went through this." - "You have to be really realistic about what you've got." He also said he was stunned that they fired JT3 and thought it was wrong. I'm a PTI fan and I enjoy watching Wilbon and Kornheiser shout at each other. Its a fun watch but you gotta understand that Wilbon basically exists these days to promote himself. Everything he says sports-wise is to create headlines and if ripping Georgetown can get him headlines/tweets/mentions then he's going to rip Georgetown. Can't really take him seriously.
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,604
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Post by guru on Apr 3, 2017 12:23:19 GMT -5
www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19063479/patrick-ewing-meet-georgetown-hoyas-officials-head-coach-vacancyListen to the audio accompanying this article - Wilbon totally rips our search, and confirms some of the things Thamel said about this search being the talk of the town at the Final Four. - "If you're going to fire John Thompson III, don't you have someone in mind? ... They don't seem to have thought of that, and I'm stunned." - "I don't know what they're doing. I think they're delusional in some ways." - "If they're not careful, they're going to be DePaul. And DePaul was a place that went through this." - "You have to be really realistic about what you've got." He also said he was stunned that they fired JT3 and thought it was wrong. I'm a PTI fan and I enjoy watching Wilbon and Kornheiser shout at each other. Its a fun watch but you gotta understand that Wilbon basically exists these days to promote himself. Everything he says sports-wise is to create headlines and if ripping Georgetown can get him headlines/tweets/mentions then he's going to rip Georgetown. Can't really take him seriously. Yep, quoting Wilbon doesn't advance many conversations these days. Too bad. He was a really good columnist at one point.
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Post by practice on Apr 3, 2017 12:23:39 GMT -5
If Pat gets the job and rebuilds the current wreck in 2-3 years, gets us into the NCAAs regularly, and in the top 3-4 in the BE, you will not follow the program? Nonsense. Nonsense? I am willing to bet you a steak dinner at Bobby Vans with a $200 bottle of Cab that our beloved Hoyas won't be back in the NCAAs and a top team in the Big East two to three years from now. Are you willing to do the same? I've been a season ticket holder since 1989. I went to Georgetown University, not Thompson University. I will always root for my school. I don't want Patrick Ewing to fail but I think the chances of success given the shadow JT Jr. casts over this program is impossible to overcome. This "search" was absurd from the start. I am done with supporting the program financially until the situation is remedied. I'm guessing many other boosters will take the same path. With all the defections you can expect the team will lose a ton of games next year. I may not be Nostradamus but it doesn't take much to predict where the program is heading following this charade of a coaching search. And whoever wrote about traveling the country for an NBA team on Chartered first class aircraft compared to flying with the masses on commercial planes hasn't flown both. There is a huge difference. Unless the new job comes with a Gulf Stream I didn't hear about... [/quote] Who eats at Bobby Van's anymore? That's a lose/lose proposition of a bet. I'm fairly certain that Ewing would be flying first class should he get the job. I'd predict a boost in season ticket sales if Ewing is announced. JT2 is a 77 year old man. He's outspoken, opinionated and loud. He rightly thinks that he created what is now considered Georgetown basketball. His presence and continuing involvement have clearly affected the search process. However, he is a 77 year old man. His alleged "reign of terror" is not going to go on indefinitely. Frankly, Ewing will likely want to coach a style of defense that echoes the success of the past. He's a great candidate for many reasons .. but I think his UNIQUE relationship with the Thompsons is a major selling point. I do think if they leaked that he's interviewing to the press then it's pretty much a done deal that Ewing is the next head coach ...
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Post by augustusfinknottle on Apr 3, 2017 12:26:05 GMT -5
Easiest money Korn Ferry ever made.
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Post by jld54 on Apr 3, 2017 12:30:35 GMT -5
If Pat gets the job and rebuilds the current wreck in 2-3 years, gets us into the NCAAs regularly, and in the top 3-4 in the BE, you will not follow the program? Nonsense. Nonsense? I am willing to bet you a steak dinner at Bobby Vans with a $200 bottle of Cab that our beloved Hoyas won't be back in the NCAAs and a top team in the Big East two to three years from now. Are you willing to do the same? I've been a season ticket holder since 1989. I went to Georgetown University, not Thompson University. I will always root for my school. I don't want Patrick Ewing to fail but I think the chances of success given the shadow JT Jr. casts over this program is impossible to overcome. This "search" was absurd from the start. I am done with supporting the program financially until the situation is remedied. I'm guessing many other boosters will take the same path. With all the defections you can expect the team will lose a ton of games next year. I may not be Nostradamus but it doesn't take much to predict where the program is heading following this charade of a coaching search. And whoever wrote about traveling the country for an NBA team on Chartered first class aircraft compared to flying with the masses on commercial planes hasn't flown both. There is a huge difference. Unless the new job comes with a Gulf Stream I didn't hear about... [/quote] Yes, nonsense. you did not answer the question re: what if Ewing succeeds? Will the "situation be remedied", if he turns things around? Yes, he may not succeed, but sticking with JT3 was not a viable option, putting aside "process", please name a better, realistic candidate...
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Post by centercourt400s on Apr 3, 2017 12:34:46 GMT -5
I have my reservations as to whether Ewing will be able to recruit and adjust from the NBA to the college game. Make no mistakes, those are serious risks. But I believe they are largely outweighed by the potential upside. It is hard to imagine another candidate with the same depth and breadth of exposure to some of the biggest legends in the history of the game. Think about the great coaches Patrick has played or coached with throughout his youth, college, NBA and team USA experiences: Leo Papille, Mike Jarvis, John Thompson Jr., Bob Knight, George Raveling, Don Donoher, C.M. Newton, Hubie Brown, Rick Pitino, Pat Riley, Chuck Daly, Mike Krzyzewski, PJ Carlesimo, Lenny Wilkins, Don Nelson, Jeff Van Gundy, Doc Rivers, Doug Collins, Stan Van Gundy, and Steve Clifford. Or the teammates he's played with like Rod Strickland, Mark Jackson, Anthony Mason, Bernard King, Charles Oakley, Karl Malone, Charles Barkley, Magic Johnson, Clyde Drexler, John Stockton, Larry Bird, David Robinson, Scottie Pippen, and Michael Jordan. Or the players he's coached like Tyronn Lue, Jerry Stackhouse, Yao Ming, Mark Jackson, Tracy McGrady, Dwight Howard, JJ Redick, Jameer Nelson, Vince Carter, Martin Gortat, Jason Richardson, Glen Davis, Al Harrington, Cody Zeller, Al Jefferson, Kemba Walker, Lance Stephenson, Noah Vonleh, and Jeremy Lamb. Fact is, there are very, very few people out there with a basketball network anything close to that. There are even fewer with such strong Georgetown bloodlines. When you add in the fact that from all accounts Patrick has a sharp basketball mind, is well-regarded from an Xs and Os perspective, is keenly aware that recruiting will be his biggest challenge, has a reputation for working hard and always striving to improve, and known for connecting well with teammates and players, it seems like it is well worth the risk. Great post. Throw in those quotes from Van Gundy and I'm sold. Ewing was always an intimidating warrior for the Hoyas and the Knicks. Why is there any doubt that he would bring the same presence to the Hoyas as a coach? Combine that basic nature with all the NBA experience, the HOF career and his hire is looking to me more and more like a gift home run.
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gunny
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
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Post by gunny on Apr 3, 2017 12:35:30 GMT -5
I see what everyone is doing here. They are just trying to increase the page count so this becomes higher than the "JT3 on the hot seat, etc" thread. How high did that get?
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Cambridge
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Canes Pugnaces
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Post by Cambridge on Apr 3, 2017 12:37:06 GMT -5
You had me at Tyronn Lue. He's worth including in any list because of who he coaches.
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