EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 9, 2017 15:43:05 GMT -5
Remember too that one of the leaders in analytics training right now was a manager on the FF4 team..
RBhoya posted about him awhile back..
His name is Justin Zormello iirc..
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Post by Lethal_Interjection on Jan 9, 2017 15:47:27 GMT -5
Maybe this can be placed into the bball budget going forward. JT3 hiring actual assistants who're well versed in providing that specified breakdown and using stats to help out the players and new recruits coming in. It doesn't even need to be an assistant. This is easily something somebody like Ewing Jr. or Wallace could do. In fact, it's the type of thing they'd be smart to add to their duties even if nobody wants them too. Advanced analytics are here to stay and if they are serious about coaching themselves, eventually, they should incorporate it into their approach, even now. The program spends so much money on so many things, advanced analytics would be a drop in the bucket. I agree, we as fans I have to see if this will be implemented from the staff.
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gujake
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Post by gujake on Jan 9, 2017 16:07:09 GMT -5
You could also deploy some of the 3.8 million in salary and higher a guy for 200K who could do all this for you. Just a thought. You don't need anywhere near 200k for this, even if you hire people full time. There is plenty of demand for jobs in sports analytics. Heck, you could probably find a couple grad students who would help out for next to nothing. I could be wrong about this, but I believe the type of thing Copeland is referring to (efficiency at different areas on the floor) is available with a Synergy subscription anyway. According to this article, over 300 D1 teams had a subscription as of 2013. So either Georgetown is one of the few teams that still doesn't have it, or the coaches aren't sharing that info with the players.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 9, 2017 16:20:49 GMT -5
You could also deploy some of the 3.8 million in salary and higher a guy for 200K who could do all this for you. Just a thought. You don't need anywhere near 200k for this, even if you hire people full time. There is plenty of demand for jobs in sports analytics. Heck, you could probably find a couple grad students who would help out for next to nothing. I could be wrong about this, but I believe the type of thing Copeland is referring to (efficiency at different areas on the floor) is available with a Synergy subscription anyway. According to this article, over 300 D1 teams had a subscription as of 2013. So either Georgetown is one of the few teams that still doesn't have it, or the coaches aren't sharing that info with the players. We should have it. It's another recruiting tool that can be used against GU. As we know, JT3 is reactionary (too slow in many situations). So, now that that cat is out of the bag, luckily it will mean that he will incorporate it this season or for the next.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Jan 9, 2017 16:51:28 GMT -5
I have no idea what, if any, analytics we use.
But I can pretty much guarantee this - when Ike says he has never been told areas of his game to work on, he is blowing smoke. Hell, we smucks on the board, with our limited expertise (actual expertise, not perceived) can crystallize at least 3 or 4 parts of his game that need major improvement. I have zero doubt that our staff has emphasized plenty of things for Ike to work on. So it makes me wonder whether he was not comprehending, or exactly where the disconnect was.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 9, 2017 18:11:38 GMT -5
I have no idea what, if any, analytics we use. But I can pretty much guarantee this - when Ike says he has never been told areas of his game to work on, he is blowing smoke. Hell, we smucks on the board, with our limited expertise (actual expertise, not perceived) can crystallize at least 3 or 4 parts of his game that need major improvement. I have zero doubt that our staff has emphasized plenty of things for Ike to work on. So it makes me wonder whether he was not comprehending, or exactly where the disconnect was. He didn't say he was never told what he needed to work on, he said Miles pointed out things about his game that he had never heard of before.. Miles also told him how he planned on using him with that information Cope said he knows what he needs to work on in the off-season..
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 9, 2017 18:25:59 GMT -5
I have no idea what, if any, analytics we use. But I can pretty much guarantee this - when Ike says he has never been told areas of his game to work on, he is blowing smoke. Hell, we smucks on the board, with our limited expertise (actual expertise, not perceived) can crystallize at least 3 or 4 parts of his game that need major improvement. I have zero doubt that our staff has emphasized plenty of things for Ike to work on. So it makes me wonder whether he was not comprehending, or exactly where the disconnect was. I agree, in this sense. Copeland's problems way exceeded analytics. He had fundamental problems on both offense and defense that need to be corrected before analytics can help refine him. Still, there are ways in which using analytics would help overall and they should be used.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Jan 9, 2017 19:29:29 GMT -5
Remember too that one of the leaders in analytics training right now was a manager on the FF4 team.. RBhoya posted about him awhile back.. His name is Justin Zormello iirc.. Yep, coaches stars like KD on their best spots, etc.
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Post by HometownHoya on Jan 9, 2017 19:34:50 GMT -5
I have no idea what, if any, analytics we use. But I can pretty much guarantee this - when Ike says he has never been told areas of his game to work on, he is blowing smoke. Hell, we smucks on the board, with our limited expertise (actual expertise, not perceived) can crystallize at least 3 or 4 parts of his game that need major improvement. I have zero doubt that our staff has emphasized plenty of things for Ike to work on. So it makes me wonder whether he was not comprehending, or exactly where the disconnect was. I agree, in this sense. Copeland's problems way exceeded analytics. He had fundamental problems on both offense and defense that need to be corrected before analytics can help refine him. Still, there are ways in which using analytics would help overall and they should be used. Agreed, his strengths were always clear but we needed more then a spot 3-pt and midrange shooter. All of us hoped he'd develop the rest of his skills but the opposite happened.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on Jan 9, 2017 19:47:57 GMT -5
If those advanced analytics help him with his lower body strength, he should be good to go.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Jan 9, 2017 20:08:05 GMT -5
I have no idea what, if any, analytics we use. But I can pretty much guarantee this - when Ike says he has never been told areas of his game to work on, he is blowing smoke. Hell, we smucks on the board, with our limited expertise (actual expertise, not perceived) can crystallize at least 3 or 4 parts of his game that need major improvement. I have zero doubt that our staff has emphasized plenty of things for Ike to work on. So it makes me wonder whether he was not comprehending, or exactly where the disconnect was. He didn't say he was never told what he needed to work on, he said Miles pointed out things about his game that he had never heard of before.. Miles also told him how he planned on using him with that information Cope said he knows what he needs to work on in the off-season.. Actually, what he said was: Things I'd never even heard about: areas on the floor where I'm really effective and stuff like that and things I need to work on. He'd never heard about where he's effective and stuff like that? Puh-leeze. Any casual fan cringing in the stands when he'd take the lazy 3 or the top of the key flat jumper could have told him that he "wasn't effective" there. Georgetown may not be on the cutting edge in terms of analytics (I have no idea but I really doubt that we are) but there's zero chance that Isaac wasn't made aware of what a good shot for him was or what he should do if his shot wasn't falling. I also don't need analytics to mention that he hasn't been very effective in the "want to" category or at all on the defensive end. Also, not breaking news to any of us or to Isaac. Personally, I think he needs the year to work on his body and, more likely than not, the rest will follow for him. In HS, he could get away with not being very strong because he had superior athleticism to most everyone he was opposing. That's not the case at the college level. He's still a plus athlete but he's no athletic freak. He needs a strong base at a minimum in terms of his overall strength. Add that to the list of things he needs to improve to find the level of success he's hoping for. Improve the handle, figure out his shot mechanics, learning defensive posture and rotations, etc. None of this can be news to Isaac because it isn't news to us. I hope the year does wonders for him in terms of his game and I wish him every success at his new school and with his new team.
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dreamhoya
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Post by dreamhoya on Jan 9, 2017 20:12:34 GMT -5
"Copeland said watching Nebraska's double-overtime win over Iowa on his official visit and then going over other game film with head coach Tim Miles made it clear he would fit right into the Huskers' system. "I saw a lot in the game and also in the meeting the next day," Copeland said. "Coach Miles did a great job of breaking my game down from a freshman to the little bit I played in my junior year, and he had all my stats, all my shots and everything. Things I'd never even heard about: areas on the floor where I'm really effective and stuff like that and things I need to work on." I'm not sure if this falls into the lack of development plan from the GU staff in not using analytics. Yet another WTF insight into our basketball program. First it was the opponent revealing what they think of us and now it's a former member of the team revealing he didn't get important analytical info from our staff. I'm not sure if GU does not use analytics but this is something i've been talking about for a while: development. And myself and others got shot down when talking about players who don't seem to be developed.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 9, 2017 20:32:46 GMT -5
He didn't say he was never told what he needed to work on, he said Miles pointed out things about his game that he had never heard of before.. Miles also told him how he planned on using him with that information Cope said he knows what he needs to work on in the off-season.. Actually, what he said was: Things I'd never even heard about: areas on the floor where I'm really effective and stuff like that and things I need to work on. He'd never heard about where he's effective and stuff like that? Puh-leeze. Any casual fan cringing in the stands when he'd take the lazy 3 or the top of the key flat jumper could have told him that he "wasn't effective" there. Georgetown may not be on the cutting edge in terms of analytics (I have no idea but I really doubt that we are) but there's zero chance that Isaac wasn't made aware of what a good shot for him was or what he should do if his shot wasn't falling. I also don't need analytics to mention that he hasn't been very effective in the "want to" category or at all on the defensive end. Also, not breaking news to any of us or to Isaac. Personally, I think he needs the year to work on his body and, more likely than not, the rest will follow for him. In HS, he could get away with not being very strong because he had superior athleticism to most everyone he was opposing. That's not the case at the college level. He's still a plus athlete but he's no athletic freak. He needs a strong base at a minimum in terms of his overall strength. Add that to the list of things he needs to improve to find the level of success he's hoping for. Improve the handle, figure out his shot mechanics, learning defensive posture and rotations, etc. None of this can be news to Isaac because it isn't news to us. I hope the year does wonders for him in terms of his game and I wish him every success at his new school and with his new team. You're mentioning where he wasn't effective though, Where do you think he was most effective Tas? Edit: The bolded text is what has folks most interested I think.. It's not about Copeland in my view..
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by tashoya on Jan 9, 2017 20:46:38 GMT -5
Actually, what he said was: Things I'd never even heard about: areas on the floor where I'm really effective and stuff like that and things I need to work on. He'd never heard about where he's effective and stuff like that? Puh-leeze. Any casual fan cringing in the stands when he'd take the lazy 3 or the top of the key flat jumper could have told him that he "wasn't effective" there. Georgetown may not be on the cutting edge in terms of analytics (I have no idea but I really doubt that we are) but there's zero chance that Isaac wasn't made aware of what a good shot for him was or what he should do if his shot wasn't falling. I also don't need analytics to mention that he hasn't been very effective in the "want to" category or at all on the defensive end. Also, not breaking news to any of us or to Isaac. Personally, I think he needs the year to work on his body and, more likely than not, the rest will follow for him. In HS, he could get away with not being very strong because he had superior athleticism to most everyone he was opposing. That's not the case at the college level. He's still a plus athlete but he's no athletic freak. He needs a strong base at a minimum in terms of his overall strength. Add that to the list of things he needs to improve to find the level of success he's hoping for. Improve the handle, figure out his shot mechanics, learning defensive posture and rotations, etc. None of this can be news to Isaac because it isn't news to us. I hope the year does wonders for him in terms of his game and I wish him every success at his new school and with his new team. You're mentioning where he wasn't effective though, Where do you think he was most effective Tas? Edit: The bolded text is what has folks most interested I think.. It's not about Copeland in my view.. Fair enough. Effective? This year? He wasn't. Last year I'd say around the paint and the left corner 3. He was one of the main reasons to be excited about seeing what we could do against an effective Syracuse zone because he should have been one of the guys that could knock down the free throw jumper. Unfortunately, that shot was often stretched beyond the free throw line and we were often teased by the top of the key shot early in a game only to have it turn into an overused cement mixer of a shot.
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hoyazeke
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Post by hoyazeke on Feb 15, 2017 9:26:46 GMT -5
Hate to dig up this thread but I saw Ike on Nebraska's bench last night. Man it was a sad feeling to see him knowing that he never lived up to his potential in GTown. I wish him well but man it sucked seeing Ike amongst all that red and white......😭😭😭
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Feb 16, 2017 10:41:29 GMT -5
Yes...he's enrolled already.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Feb 16, 2017 12:49:36 GMT -5
No reason to be sad. Unfortunately, for Isaac and the Hoyas, it just didn't work out. Best of luck to him. I'm hoping he heals up and comes back better than ever. If he does, we'll all regret him not blowing up in the blue and gray. But, I think, it'll be pretty easy to cheer for his success. I know nothing but Isaac seems like a good guy that just needed a change. I hope it works out for him.
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 16, 2017 15:05:26 GMT -5
You know, I'd like to be all magnanimous and say that I wish Ike well. But unless he really had an issue with academics or there was a personal reason unrelated to basketball or academics, I really feel like he let the school and the program down. He was awarded a scholarship to an elite University to play basketball on an elite team in an elite conference. Kids around the country would kill for the opportunity Ike had. Yet he seemed to treat this opportunity as a right and performed like someone who thought we should be happy to have him here. I hope he plays the same way in Nebraska that he played here and next year, when Nebraska is trolling around the bottom of the Big 10 he can look over here and wish he was on the 2017-2018 Georgetown team that is fighting for the BE championship.
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Post by bicentennial on Feb 16, 2017 21:36:41 GMT -5
I tend to agree, I feel like the timing of when Isaac left says something very different than most of our other transfers. I have always rooted for transfers to do well wherever they end up and I will do so for Isaac Copeland as well! Ultimately, I will always wonder if Isaac Copeland staying for less than a semester forced Paul White to transfer and cost us a player who potentially would have given the Hoyas many different high IQ options on the court!
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Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Feb 16, 2017 21:50:53 GMT -5
You know, I'd like to be all magnanimous and say that I wish Ike well. But unless he really had an issue with academics or there was a personal reason unrelated to basketball or academics, I really feel like he let the school and the program down. He was awarded a scholarship to an elite University to play basketball on an elite team in an elite conference. Kids around the country would kill for the opportunity Ike had. Yet he seemed to treat this opportunity as a right and performed like someone who thought we should be happy to have him here. I hope he plays the same way in Nebraska that he played here and next year, when Nebraska is trolling around the bottom of the Big 10 he can look over here and wish he was on the 2017-2018 Georgetown team that is fighting for the BE championship. I disagree. I think it was simply a case of having too many people at the same position. Couple that with the fact that he really was playing well at all, seemed to have lost his confidence with his shooting, lack of defensive play, and Coach's seemingly new philosophy of playing those who were contributing, brought him to a decision point. I think we should wish him well in his future endeavors.
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