hoyapac
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 188
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Post by hoyapac on Nov 16, 2016 20:51:44 GMT -5
Anyone see the common denominator with trimble's penetrating drives? ...Govan. Wow
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lda05816
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 606
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Post by lda05816 on Nov 16, 2016 20:57:37 GMT -5
Anyone see the common denominator with trimble's penetrating drives? ...Govan. Wow Said this is another thread but the ball screen defense was atrocious down the stretch last night. It kept MD afloat to allow the self destruction that was the final minute of the game.
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Post by bicentennial on Nov 16, 2016 23:02:13 GMT -5
I overall felt the refs did a good job for most of the game despite the many first half foul calls. I do question two of the calls that allowed Maryland to come back in the last minute. Firs was the Copeland foul on Cowan where Cowan wrapped both his arms around Copeland's one arm and then the traveling call. I have to question how the official came up with those calls. Someone should have the Big East review the calls! The worst one was the travelling call when the floor was wet and the player slipped. As I recall, he landed on both feet and then slid on both feet coming to a stop then he passed the ball. I have copied the relevant section of the basketball manual. I am unable to grasp how our player traveled and why Maryland received the ball!
Section 5. Traveling Art. 1. A player shall not travel with the ball. Art. 2. Traveling occurs when a player holding the ball moves a foot or both feet in any direction in excess of prescribed limits described in this section. Art. 3. A player who catches the ball with both feet on the playing court may pivot, using either foot. When one foot is lifted, the other is the pivot foot. Art. 4. A player who catches the ball while moving or ends a dribble may stop and establish a pivot foot as follows: a. When both feet are off the playing court and the player lands: 1. Simultaneously on both feet, either may be the pivot foot; 2. On one foot followed by the other, the first foot to touch shall be the pivot foot; 3. On one foot, the player may jump off that foot and simultaneously land on both, in which case neither foot can be the pivot foot. b. When one foot is on the playing court: 1. That foot shall be the pivot foot when the other foot touches in a step; 2. The player may jump off that foot and simultaneously land on both, in which case neither foot can then be the pivot foot. Art. 5. After coming to a stop and establishing the pivot foot: a. The pivot foot may be lifted, but not returned to the playing court, before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal; b. The pivot foot shall not be lifted before the ball is released to start a dribble. Art. 6. After coming to a stop when neither foot can be the pivot foot: a. One or both feet may be lifted, but may not be returned to the playing court, before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal; b. Neither foot shall be lifted, before the ball is released, to start a dribble. Art. 7. It is traveling when a player falls to the playing court while holding the ball without maintaining a pivot foot. Section 6. Kick, Fist, Through Basket
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Nov 16, 2016 23:06:36 GMT -5
I believe he didn't just slide, he actually kind of 'bunny hopped" as he slid. Terrible break.
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95hoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,298
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Post by 95hoya on Nov 16, 2016 23:36:00 GMT -5
I overall felt the refs did a good job for most of the game despite the many first half foul calls. I do question two of the calls that allowed Maryland to come back in the last minute. Firs was the Copeland foul on Cowan where Cowan wrapped both his arms around Copeland's one arm and then the traveling call. I have to question how the official came up with those calls. Someone should have the Big East review the calls! The worst one was the travelling call when the floor was wet and the player slipped. As I recall, he landed on both feet and then slid on both feet coming to a stop then he passed the ball. I have copied the relevant section of the basketball manual. I am unable to grasp how our player traveled and why Maryland received the ball! Section 5. Traveling Art. 1. A player shall not travel with the ball. Art. 2. Traveling occurs when a player holding the ball moves a foot or both feet in any direction in excess of prescribed limits described in this section. Art. 3. A player who catches the ball with both feet on the playing court may pivot, using either foot. When one foot is lifted, the other is the pivot foot. Art. 4. A player who catches the ball while moving or ends a dribble may stop and establish a pivot foot as follows: a. When both feet are off the playing court and the player lands: 1. Simultaneously on both feet, either may be the pivot foot; 2. On one foot followed by the other, the first foot to touch shall be the pivot foot; 3. On one foot, the player may jump off that foot and simultaneously land on both, in which case neither foot can be the pivot foot. b. When one foot is on the playing court: 1. That foot shall be the pivot foot when the other foot touches in a step; 2. The player may jump off that foot and simultaneously land on both, in which case neither foot can then be the pivot foot. Art. 5. After coming to a stop and establishing the pivot foot: a. The pivot foot may be lifted, but not returned to the playing court, before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal; b. The pivot foot shall not be lifted before the ball is released to start a dribble. Art. 6. After coming to a stop when neither foot can be the pivot foot: a. One or both feet may be lifted, but may not be returned to the playing court, before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal; b. Neither foot shall be lifted, before the ball is released, to start a dribble. Art. 7. It is traveling when a player falls to the playing court while holding the ball without maintaining a pivot foot. Section 6. Kick, Fist, Through Basket It's a travel and it's silly to harp on that one play.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,319
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Post by tashoya on Nov 17, 2016 0:06:32 GMT -5
JT3 isn't a HOF in-game coach but that was a comedy of errors on the execution side of things. The time out discussion is a non-starter, as has been pointed out, because there were multiple breaks. Too many, in fact. UMD was out of time outs and it benefitted them more by having them than it did us. We expect better from the vets like Tre and LJ and we should and, likely, part of that is on the coaching.
But slipping on a painted line or wet spot and Pryor playing like a freshman for the second half isn't on the coaching just yet. The former never being on anything but bad luck, IMO. The fouling without time expiring can't happen. I don't know what Isaac could have done when his arm was grabbed and the refs bought it. Savvy play by them since the call went their way. If it goes the other way (the proper call on replay), it's horrendous "coaching" on their side of things. Same with the technical on Turgeon. If they lost, he got outcoached I guess. Our guys were winning for 39 minutes and not winning by as much as they should have been due to the offense. I guess that's because the players are good and the coach sucks. 39 out of 40 minutes. There's plenty to criticize but the coaching wasn't the main problem in this one. It has been in many games. But we inbounded better than in the past. We pressured better on D than in the past. We got to the line and freaking hit the shots better than in the past. And, outside of Isaac for decent stretches and Pryor on a number of occasions, the defensive switches and rotations were better. Govan needs to learn to catch and hold the damn ball. With Bradley unavailable and Marcus, apparently, still injured to some extent, what "accountability" can be meted out during the game? I'm for Akoy getting more run but he had turnovers too and isn't yet 100% to boot. It's disheartening because we have more talent. On paper. We also have guys with experience but that are new to the program. That can, in some cases, work against you if you're used to a different style and different demands. There's an unlearning process.
The fact that Tre was on the floor at the end, however, is a huge coaching mistake, IMO. I was baffled by that. I can understand the desire to go with a more seasoned guy in a close game situation but you put your best/fastest defender on Trimble at the end and that's Mulmore. Tre may be faster in a straight line but his defensive game leaves a lot to be desired against an agile guard. I'd rather Tre sell out whenever he's in the game and go for steals and if he picks up fouls, so be it. He's fast and has quick hands but he's not good laterally. Find a high dribble or pick off a crossover and go for the turnover.
LJ Peak. For whatever reasons, I love the kid. And he looks like he's in great basketball shape and carried our collective butts in the second half and then the foul. Ugh. And the early ones too. It's a tough call because aggression is a big part of his game. I think he's going to be very susceptible to how a game is being called. He picks up a lot of "let them play" type fouls. I know we need him on the floor more but, if he scales back what makes his game go (again, just my opinion), I don't know if he's as valuable in the time he does have on the floor. I do think that plays need to be designed around him for end of shot clock situations. It was really obvious that the winding clock plays were just give it to Pryor and let him work. And that's fine in the games in which he's on. Yesterday wasn't one of those games. And multiple options alleviates pressure on Pryor and makes the opponent work harder.
I didn't get to watch the second half until tonight because I got home really late from work and could only do the first last night. Unfortunately, a guy in my office has a stepson that attends Maryland (great kid though I feel bad about not hating him) so I already knew the result when I watched it. I still found it difficult to believe, up until about a minute left, that the Hoyas lost. If you wrote that in a basketball version of a Bad News Bears first game of the season script, you'd get laughed at. I can't remember seeing anything like that. I've seen more brutal comebacks but not in that fashion. I had no problem deleting that one from the DVR when I was done watching it. It's not a game I'd ever queue up in the offseason to see what went wrong with the season because that stuff just doesn't happen in succession like that. By rookies and vets alike. Painful.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,319
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Post by tashoya on Nov 17, 2016 0:13:06 GMT -5
I believe he didn't just slide, he actually kind of 'bunny hopped" as he slid. Terrible break. I saw it that way too. I think he slipped on the left and hopped on the right to keep himself from falling down.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,319
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Post by tashoya on Nov 17, 2016 0:16:18 GMT -5
Believe it or not, when it happens to you, it's like the sky has fallen, the sky has fallen. However, upsets and "debacles" happen almost every week. As tough as it was for many of you, it was even more tough for me. The DVR did not capture the last 2-3 minutes, Our Hoyas were up by six or seven, then the next thing I am hearing during halftime of the Creighton game is that we lost. Still reeling. Umm.. how's that worse for you? You didn't have to watch it. Not to mention, strengthen up your DVR game my friend. This is CBB in 2016. Set that thing for 3 hours every time.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,319
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Post by tashoya on Nov 17, 2016 0:19:42 GMT -5
I literally threw up right after the game. True story.... I think it was the Panda Express though and not the Hoyas. I like the way we competed. if we stay committed to this style of play think we'll be fine even though it hurts right now... You probably wanted to blame the line cook for not doing what he/she knows how to do and do well but just happened to mess it up that one time. Clearly, you should blame the head chef for not checking on the fact that 99 times out of 100, the line cook cooks it properly because that's what line cooks do. #coaching #butitfitsmynarrative
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,401
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Post by SaxaCD on Nov 17, 2016 2:25:17 GMT -5
I believe he didn't just slide, he actually kind of 'bunny hopped" as he slid. Terrible break. You could see after that when the kid was mopping the floor, it wasn't just a bit of humidity, it was a BIG slick spot, and took a while to soak up. Unbelievable that he had to catch it right in that spot.
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deacon
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,850
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Post by deacon on Nov 17, 2016 9:00:23 GMT -5
I thought I was over the loss until I saw this. Now I'm way more upset than I was after the game. The fact that we allowed them the opening for this makes me furious to no end.
I didn't think it was possible to despise another team as much as I despise Syracuse, but here we are. We should play them every year. No excuses. Make it happen and bury them.
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EtomicB
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Member is Online
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Post by EtomicB on Nov 17, 2016 9:33:26 GMT -5
JT3 isn't a HOF in-game coach but that was a comedy of errors on the execution side of things. The time out discussion is a non-starter, as has been pointed out, because there were multiple breaks. Too many, in fact. UMD was out of time outs and it benefitted them more by having them than it did us. We expect better from the vets like Tre and LJ and we should and, likely, part of that is on the coaching. But slipping on a painted line or wet spot and Pryor playing like a freshman for the second half isn't on the coaching just yet. The former never being on anything but bad luck, IMO. The fouling without time expiring can't happen. I don't know what Isaac could have done when his arm was grabbed and the refs bought it. Savvy play by them since the call went their way. If it goes the other way (the proper call on replay), it's horrendous "coaching" on their side of things. Same with the technical on Turgeon. If they lost, he got outcoached I guess. Our guys were winning for 39 minutes and not winning by as much as they should have been due to the offense. I guess that's because the players are good and the coach sucks. 39 out of 40 minutes. There's plenty to criticize but the coaching wasn't the main problem in this one. It has been in many games. But we inbounded better than in the past. We pressured better on D than in the past. We got to the line and freaking hit the shots better than in the past. And, outside of Isaac for decent stretches and Pryor on a number of occasions, the defensive switches and rotations were better. Govan needs to learn to catch and hold the damn ball. With Bradley unavailable and Marcus, apparently, still injured to some extent, what "accountability" can be meted out during the game? I'm for Akoy getting more run but he had turnovers too and isn't yet 100% to boot. It's disheartening because we have more talent. On paper. We also have guys with experience but that are new to the program. That can, in some cases, work against you if you're used to a different style and different demands. There's an unlearning process. The fact that Tre was on the floor at the end, however, is a huge coaching mistake, IMO. I was baffled by that. I can understand the desire to go with a more seasoned guy in a close game situation but you put your best/fastest defender on Trimble at the end and that's Mulmore. Tre may be faster in a straight line but his defensive game leaves a lot to be desired against an agile guard. I'd rather Tre sell out whenever he's in the game and go for steals and if he picks up fouls, so be it. He's fast and has quick hands but he's not good laterally. Find a high dribble or pick off a crossover and go for the turnover. LJ Peak. For whatever reasons, I love the kid. And he looks like he's in great basketball shape and carried our collective butts in the second half and then the foul. Ugh. And the early ones too. It's a tough call because aggression is a big part of his game. I think he's going to be very susceptible to how a game is being called. He picks up a lot of "let them play" type fouls. I know we need him on the floor more but, if he scales back what makes his game go (again, just my opinion), I don't know if he's as valuable in the time he does have on the floor. I do think that plays need to be designed around him for end of shot clock situations. It was really obvious that the winding clock plays were just give it to Pryor and let him work. And that's fine in the games in which he's on. Yesterday wasn't one of those games. And multiple options alleviates pressure on Pryor and makes the opponent work harder. I didn't get to watch the second half until tonight because I got home really late from work and could only do the first last night. Unfortunately, a guy in my office has a stepson that attends Maryland (great kid though I feel bad about not hating him) so I already knew the result when I watched it. I still found it difficult to believe, up until about a minute left, that the Hoyas lost. If you wrote that in a basketball version of a Bad News Bears first game of the season script, you'd get laughed at. I can't remember seeing anything like that. I've seen more brutal comebacks but not in that fashion. I had no problem deleting that one from the DVR when I was done watching it. It's not a game I'd ever queue up in the offseason to see what went wrong with the season because that stuff just doesn't happen in succession like that. By rookies and vets alike. Painful. Ike could have gotten his hands up the way JT3 & the team has talked about practicing for 8 months.. Did Cowan play it up absolutely but Cope moved into with his hands low & created the initial contact.. Ike is a terrible defender, his man set the screen on Mosely that freed Trimble on the layup to bring the score to 75-74 Gtown.. While his man is going to set the screen Ike just half asses it in no mans land, either hedge it hard or get back far enough to cut him off after he gets by Mosely.. Ike did neither which allowed Trimble to easily blow by him to the basket.. After watching the game again and the ending several times, in hindsight JT3 probably should have doubled Trimble on all inbounds for them, make someone else handle it..
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2016 9:52:30 GMT -5
JT3 isn't a HOF in-game coach but that was a comedy of errors on the execution side of things. The time out discussion is a non-starter, as has been pointed out, because there were multiple breaks. Too many, in fact. UMD was out of time outs and it benefitted them more by having them than it did us. We expect better from the vets like Tre and LJ and we should and, likely, part of that is on the coaching. But slipping on a painted line or wet spot and Pryor playing like a freshman for the second half isn't on the coaching just yet. The former never being on anything but bad luck, IMO. The fouling without time expiring can't happen. I don't know what Isaac could have done when his arm was grabbed and the refs bought it. Savvy play by them since the call went their way. If it goes the other way (the proper call on replay), it's horrendous "coaching" on their side of things. Same with the technical on Turgeon. If they lost, he got outcoached I guess. Our guys were winning for 39 minutes and not winning by as much as they should have been due to the offense. I guess that's because the players are good and the coach sucks. 39 out of 40 minutes. There's plenty to criticize but the coaching wasn't the main problem in this one. It has been in many games. But we inbounded better than in the past. We pressured better on D than in the past. We got to the line and freaking hit the shots better than in the past. And, outside of Isaac for decent stretches and Pryor on a number of occasions, the defensive switches and rotations were better. Govan needs to learn to catch and hold the damn ball. With Bradley unavailable and Marcus, apparently, still injured to some extent, what "accountability" can be meted out during the game? I'm for Akoy getting more run but he had turnovers too and isn't yet 100% to boot. It's disheartening because we have more talent. On paper. We also have guys with experience but that are new to the program. That can, in some cases, work against you if you're used to a different style and different demands. There's an unlearning process. The fact that Tre was on the floor at the end, however, is a huge coaching mistake, IMO. I was baffled by that. I can understand the desire to go with a more seasoned guy in a close game situation but you put your best/fastest defender on Trimble at the end and that's Mulmore. Tre may be faster in a straight line but his defensive game leaves a lot to be desired against an agile guard. I'd rather Tre sell out whenever he's in the game and go for steals and if he picks up fouls, so be it. He's fast and has quick hands but he's not good laterally. Find a high dribble or pick off a crossover and go for the turnover. LJ Peak. For whatever reasons, I love the kid. And he looks like he's in great basketball shape and carried our collective butts in the second half and then the foul. Ugh. And the early ones too. It's a tough call because aggression is a big part of his game. I think he's going to be very susceptible to how a game is being called. He picks up a lot of "let them play" type fouls. I know we need him on the floor more but, if he scales back what makes his game go (again, just my opinion), I don't know if he's as valuable in the time he does have on the floor. I do think that plays need to be designed around him for end of shot clock situations. It was really obvious that the winding clock plays were just give it to Pryor and let him work. And that's fine in the games in which he's on. Yesterday wasn't one of those games. And multiple options alleviates pressure on Pryor and makes the opponent work harder. I didn't get to watch the second half until tonight because I got home really late from work and could only do the first last night. Unfortunately, a guy in my office has a stepson that attends Maryland (great kid though I feel bad about not hating him) so I already knew the result when I watched it. I still found it difficult to believe, up until about a minute left, that the Hoyas lost. If you wrote that in a basketball version of a Bad News Bears first game of the season script, you'd get laughed at. I can't remember seeing anything like that. I've seen more brutal comebacks but not in that fashion. I had no problem deleting that one from the DVR when I was done watching it. It's not a game I'd ever queue up in the offseason to see what went wrong with the season because that stuff just doesn't happen in succession like that. By rookies and vets alike. Painful. Ike could have gotten his hands up the way JT3 & the team has talked about practicing for 8 months.. Did Cowan play it up absolutely but Cope moved into with his hands low & created the initial contact.. Ike is a terrible defender, his man set the screen on Mosely that freed Trimble on the layup to bring the score to 75-74 Gtown.. While his man is going to set the screen Ike just half asses it in no mans land, either hedge it hard or get back far enough to cut him off after he gets by Mosely.. Ike did neither which allowed Trimble to easily blow by him to the basket.. After watching the game again and the ending several times, in hindsight JT3 probably should have doubled Trimble on all inbounds for them, make someone else handle it.. Zone might have worked to slow them down also, just don't know how much time they've had to work on that...
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