njhoya78
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by njhoya78 on Feb 11, 2015 23:37:47 GMT -5
No. "No such luck." You're stuck with me for the foreseeable future.
Just done with posting the nefarious goings-on in South Orange.
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This Just In
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Bold Prediction: The Hoyas will win at least 1 BE game in 2023.
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Post by This Just In on Feb 12, 2015 9:10:31 GMT -5
From the Seton Hall campus paper, The Setonian: www.thesetonian.com/news/view.php/860218/Pirates-lose-ugly-one-to-Georgetown-as-lHeading into this game there was controversy surrounding the team following comments made by Mobley and tweets made by Whitehead after the Marquette loss on Saturday. Willard declined comment on the matter of team chemistry, simply saying that the issues had been addressed.
Meanwhile, multiple sources tell The Setonian that Whitehead and Gibbs came to near-blows in a team huddle during a second half timeout around the 11:19 mark of Tuesday's game. No punches were thrown but Gibbs had to be separated by associate head coach Shaheen Holloway as things escalated. Apparently, the two guards have been at the center of the team's ongoing locker room divide.
Seton Hall players were not made available to the media following the game, though Whitehead tweeted, “Imma Give Everybody What They Want That’s It Watch,” shortly after the game. He also changed both his profile picture and cover pictures to photos of pitch blackness on his Twitter account. Following the Marquette loss, Whitehead tweeted, "No More Of That Brother Stuff Strictly Business Partners."
And this is all before Jaren Sina dropped the bombshell today that he is immediately leaving the program. Those of you who criticize JT3 should appreciate that he has never allowed this kind of crap to occur on one of his teams. I know Jesse and Chris didn't get along and a few years ago Markel acted like an idiot and had to be benched but despite the calm demeanor, JT3 controls this team. Last year he suspended Josh to make this point and two years ago showed Whit the door. Just another reason I respect coach. Not just because he can control his players but he doesn't recruit knuckleheads like Whithead and Gibbs. I have a question for your or any other poster, do you think JTIII had the option to play an academically ineligible Josh Smith?
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Post by aleutianhoya on Feb 12, 2015 9:25:55 GMT -5
Those of you who criticize JT3 should appreciate that he has never allowed this kind of crap to occur on one of his teams. I know Jesse and Chris didn't get along and a few years ago Markel acted like an idiot and had to be benched but despite the calm demeanor, JT3 controls this team. Last year he suspended Josh to make this point and two years ago showed Whit the door. Just another reason I respect coach. Not just because he can control his players but he doesn't recruit knuckleheads like Whithead and Gibbs. I have a question for your or any other poster, do you think JTIII had the option to play an academically ineligible Josh Smith? I think you know the answer to that: Of course not. If Josh is ineligible because of either NCAA or Georgetown rules regarding eligibility Coach shouldn't and can't play him. That said, we've been led to believe that Georgetown has standards that are more difficult than the NCAA's regarding eligibility and, moreover, has certain standards and expectations that don't rise to the level of eligibility. That is, a player could break a "team academic rule" and be suspended by Coach, even if the NCAA and Georgetown would not require suspension.
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Cambridge
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Canes Pugnaces
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Post by Cambridge on Feb 12, 2015 9:33:48 GMT -5
Those of you who criticize JT3 should appreciate that he has never allowed this kind of crap to occur on one of his teams. I know Jesse and Chris didn't get along and a few years ago Markel acted like an idiot and had to be benched but despite the calm demeanor, JT3 controls this team. Last year he suspended Josh to make this point and two years ago showed Whit the door. Just another reason I respect coach. Not just because he can control his players but he doesn't recruit knuckleheads like Whithead and Gibbs. I have a question for your or any other poster, do you think JTIII had the option to play an academically ineligible Josh Smith? I guess it depends on what do you mean by option. I could be wrong but I don't think Josh was ineligible from the perspective of the NCAA, just with respect to the internal standards of Georgetown. The question then is who set and made the decision to enforce that standard: Healy, McDonough, or JTIII. I'm not sure we know the answer to that exactly, but if recent events at other institutions is any guide, I think we could all agree that many coaches and athletics departments around the country have taken the "option" of skirting the standards of the NCAA and even their own official internal standards.
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Buckets
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Post by Buckets on Feb 12, 2015 10:54:41 GMT -5
I have a question for your or any other poster, do you think JTIII had the option to play an academically ineligible Josh Smith? I guess it depends on what do you mean by option. I could be wrong but I don't think Josh was ineligible from the perspective of the NCAA, just with respect to the internal standards of Georgetown. The question then is who set and made the decision to enforce that standard: Healy, McDonough, or JTIII. I'm not sure we know the answer to that exactly, but if recent events at other institutions is any guide, I think we could all agree that many coaches and athletics departments around the country have taken the "option" of skirting the standards of the NCAA and even their own official internal standards. This was one of those things that got repeated enough despite a dearth of evidence that it eventually became accepted as common wisdom. I think it should be answered by the 2014 APR release in like three months, but for now we have to speculate. The facts are that exams ended 12/19, grades were due 12/27, and classes started 1/8. Josh played 12/21, 12/28, 12/31, 1/4, and then did not play 1/8 and subsequent. So either (1) Georgetown's own academic standards are such that you are allowed to play for over two weeks after exams end despite having outstanding assignments that are apparently preventing you from getting grades, then once these grades are finalized weeks later that just so coincidentally happens exactly that your suspension coincides with when an NCAA suspension would start, you are suspended and then unable to show sufficient academic progress over the next two months such that you regain the ability to play with the team; or (2) he failed NCAA standards. The amount of mental gymnastics required to get to (1) is extraordinary.
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Cambridge
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Post by Cambridge on Feb 12, 2015 11:33:38 GMT -5
Good point Buckets - after searching the internet I managed to find appears to be a Georgetown student athlete handbook from the 2011-2012 school year. While it doesn't really solve the mystery, there is some relevant and interesting information on pp 7-8 on "Progress Toward Degree Requirement", pp 20-21 on "Academic Expectations & Grades", and pp 38-39 on "Academic Standards": grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/gu/genrel/auto_pdf/2011-12/misc_non_event/SAHandbook.pdf
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Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Feb 12, 2015 15:24:59 GMT -5
I have to say, I've been calling for this lineup for quite some time. Copeland and White are like Porter and Whittington, only better. So which one will be the #3 pick in the draft? I personally think Copeland. More aggressive, definitely more athletic. I saw the post-game interview with him, DSR, and JTIII and it looks like he is at least 6'10".
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 12, 2015 17:02:26 GMT -5
I guess it depends on what do you mean by option. I could be wrong but I don't think Josh was ineligible from the perspective of the NCAA, just with respect to the internal standards of Georgetown. The question then is who set and made the decision to enforce that standard: Healy, McDonough, or JTIII. I'm not sure we know the answer to that exactly, but if recent events at other institutions is any guide, I think we could all agree that many coaches and athletics departments around the country have taken the "option" of skirting the standards of the NCAA and even their own official internal standards. This was one of those things that got repeated enough despite a dearth of evidence that it eventually became accepted as common wisdom. I think it should be answered by the 2014 APR release in like three months, but for now we have to speculate. The facts are that exams ended 12/19, grades were due 12/27, and classes started 1/8. Josh played 12/21, 12/28, 12/31, 1/4, and then did not play 1/8 and subsequent. So either (1) Georgetown's own academic standards are such that you are allowed to play for over two weeks after exams end despite having outstanding assignments that are apparently preventing you from getting grades, then once these grades are finalized weeks later that just so coincidentally happens exactly that your suspension coincides with when an NCAA suspension would start, you are suspended and then unable to show sufficient academic progress over the next two months such that you regain the ability to play with the team; or (2) he failed NCAA standards. The amount of mental gymnastics required to get to (1) is extraordinary. It is also possible Josh had until 1/8 to appeal any suspension and it wasn't until that date that JT3 could suspend him. Look, the point of my original post wasn't just that we run a "clean" program but that JT3 understands his responsibility as a coach not just on the court but off. The Seton Hall fiasco shows what happens when a coach doesn't do this. Willard has lost control of his players, something a coach can't let happen. He's the adult in the room and good coaches always ensure that his players understand this. I'm proud of JT3 because above all he doesn't recruit knuckleheads and if it turns out he has one on the team he makes sure to sit on him, e.g. Whit.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 12, 2015 17:38:41 GMT -5
So which one will be the #3 pick in the draft? I personally think Copeland. More aggressive, definitely more athletic. I saw the post-game interview with him, DSR, and JTIII and it looks like he is at least 6'10". Otto and Greg were a better pair as frosh. We will see where Ike and Paul go from here.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
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Post by DanMcQ on Feb 16, 2015 14:42:20 GMT -5
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Post by BubbleVisionBiff on Feb 16, 2015 14:46:12 GMT -5
Was just about to post that Dan. Yikes. I hope they have Danny Hurley on speed dial.
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njhoya78
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by njhoya78 on Feb 16, 2015 15:01:05 GMT -5
I had forgotten that Jaren Sina's father, Mergin Sina, had played college basketball at Seton Hall before transferring to Rhode Island; could this now be a family tradition (i.e., start off in South Orange and transfer away due to lack of playing time)?
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 16, 2015 15:30:41 GMT -5
Great publicity for the Big East.
No wonder we seem to tend to back off highly ranked kids with handlers/attitude. I am sure it is very hard to judge how much of that type of thing can be tolerated before it is no longer worth the risk.
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KHoyaNYC
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Feb 20, 2015 15:38:18 GMT -5
If Copeland plays like that going forward, and he is certainly capable of doing so, we become a real threat to challenge for the BET title and make a deep NCAA run. Imagine if JTIII had played Copeland more earlier and started him more often? Maybe it would have been too early to do that, maybe not. In any event, it's exactly the change we needed and restores my optimism when I had some serious concerns a major slide was on the horizon. Good heavens, people. Doesn't it ever occur to people to say "Man, JTIII really did a great job bring Isaac along this year, his development has been amazing." No, instead the assumption is that Copeland playing great now means that Coach Editeded it up. Ridiculous. Never said JTIII f'ed it up, and I'm not sure where you get that assumption since I clearly said maybe it would have been too early to do that. And clearly I'm happy JTIII made the switch. But, yeah, given the results I am seeing so far, I wonder if maybe we would have picked up another win or two if he had done it sooner (like, for example, at Providence).
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 20, 2015 16:11:54 GMT -5
You never know. Of course we could have lost one or two more of the close early games if Ike played more, especially since his defense was pretty spotty early on.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Feb 20, 2015 18:05:21 GMT -5
Never said JTIII f'ed it up, and I'm not sure where you get that assumption Maybe because you said this:
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Feb 20, 2015 20:25:43 GMT -5
III played him when he felt Cope was ready. I would not be surprised to see the rise in his mins correspond to his improving defense.
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KHoyaNYC
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Feb 20, 2015 22:10:40 GMT -5
Never said JTIII f'ed it up, and I'm not sure where you get that assumption Maybe because you said this: I followed that by saying maybe yes, maybe not which is a lot different than saying "JTIII screwed it up." And the point included this too: "In any event, it's exactly the change we needed and restores my optimism when I had some serious concerns a major slide was on the horizon." Look it's all speculation as to timing of changes in the past but can't deny that Hoyas with Copeland as a starter has provided a nice bounce for this team. Glad JTIII did it. Let's keep the momentum going. No reason we cant take 3 out of last 4 or even all 4 given what we have seen last 2 games.
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