Georgetown - Mount St. Mary's Discussion 11/20/24

[prhoya]

Nov 20, 2024 21:41:16 GMT -5 RusskyHoya said:

Nov 20, 2024 20:52:18 GMT -5 daveg023 said:

It wasn’t meant to be taken literally, but that said while I know the school is in NW Maryland, I probablycouldn’t pick out where in NW Maryland it is.

Put some respeck on the name of "The Oldest Jesuit College in the 50 United States."

Emmitsburg is also home to the primary Federal emergency management training and education complex.

Preferred Mt. Weather…

[daveg023]

Nov 20, 2024 22:31:02 GMT -5 Massholya said:

Not often in modern era of basketball that you can shoot 6-20 from 3 and still win by 28. We are not gonna be able to survive shooting the 3 this poorly.

Started 4-5 too.

[HoyaFanNY]

Good win after the ND debacle. 20 3's is about the max I would like to see from this team. Focus on getting high % 2's and fast break points. Still too many TO's and the 7 minute scoring drought in the first half can't happen vs good teams. Good game from the starters, especially Sorber, Peavy and Drew. Mack needs to be more efficient. Julius provided some scoring off the bench but 1 rebound in 17 minutes is inexcusable.

[jpj]

Happy for a Hoya Win, but this game should have been played on campus

[rhw485]

A win that I think was generally moving us in the right direction. Will be tough to believe it until we do it against a high major but you saw small steps of progress, which is all you can ask for against that opponent:

• Lets just start off by acknowledging it's not easy to blow teams out by 30.  You can scoff at it all you want, but bad teams struggle to do it and good teams get it done yet.  We're clearly not a good team but for a night we took care of business 
• There were two rotation shifts that I think are relevant.  First, Fielder starting over Burks and playing his most minutes of the season.  13 minutes the first two games he played, 22 tonight.  I think that speaks to Cooley realizing he needs to find some way to get his shooting on the floor.  It hasn't worked yet but he's more of a threat than Burks.  And it really goes back to the question I posed before the season started, can Fielder or Sorber survive defensively at the 4? This isn't the opponent to challenge it but if they can be on the court together it helps immensely
• Second, Curtis Williams dropped from the rotation.  We all saw how disastrous his stint was against ND.  Mulready seems well ahead of him in the pecking order.  I get why Cooley wanted to see if there was shooting juice from Williams but Mulready's defense is too impactful to keep off the court
• Non Mack/Epps 3 point shooters: 2-8, both from Peavy.  We simply have to find it somewhere.  Mulready and Williams attempts didnt look like they ever had a chance.  
• I thought the defense looked better, but you can just see the difference in how some guys can fight over screens vs. others.  Epps and Mack struggle to do it and then watch Peavy, Mulready and even Caleb Williams just make it more difficult for the ball handler.  I'm also a little worried about our defensive rebounding, right now we let opponents grab 30% of their misses which is 190th in country.  When our forced turnover rate comes down against better competition, that wont be sustainable

Hoya Saxa

[vv83]

I really enjoyed the way Caleb Williams played in this one. He got a few defensive rebounds out of his area, flying in and assertively attacking the ball. He was very active and effective defensively. Offensively - he was always moving, never let the ball stick in his hands, made one or two nice passes/cuts, etc. He brings a lot of energy, and seems to have a pretty good feel for the game for a freshman. i'm looking forward to seeing how he develops.

[RusskyHoya]

Nov 21, 2024 3:15:10 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Nov 20, 2024 21:41:16 GMT -5 RusskyHoya said:

Put some respeck on the name of "The Oldest Jesuit College in the 50 United States."

Emmitsburg is also home to the primary Federal emergency management training and education complex.

Preferred Mt. Weather…

Talk about a place with Hoya Paranoia vibes...

[hoyajmw]

Two quick things: (1) Roy Hibbert in the house/can’t remember seeing him at all in a while (floor seat opposite Mt. St. Mary’s coach); (2j I doubt even half the announced attendance was in the building. I’ve been to a LOT of games over the years, and this was most intimate gathering I can remember — and from gear being worn, I think probably 40% were St. Mary’s fans…

[jwp91]

Nov 21, 2024 7:28:43 GMT -5 rhw485 said:

A win that I think was generally moving us in the right direction. Will be tough to believe it until we do it against a high major but you saw small steps of progress, which is all you can ask for against that opponent:

• Lets just start off by acknowledging it's not easy to blow teams out by 30.  You can scoff at it all you want, but bad teams struggle to do it and good teams get it done yet.  We're clearly not a good team but for a night we took care of business 
• There were two rotation shifts that I think are relevant.  First, Fielder starting over Burks and playing his most minutes of the season.  13 minutes the first two games he played, 22 tonight.  I think that speaks to Cooley realizing he needs to find some way to get his shooting on the floor.  It hasn't worked yet but he's more of a threat than Burks.  And it really goes back to the question I posed before the season started, can Fielder or Sorber survive defensively at the 4? This isn't the opponent to challenge it but if they can be on the court together it helps immensely
• Second, Curtis Williams dropped from the rotation.  We all saw how disastrous his stint was against ND.  Mulready seems well ahead of him in the pecking order.  I get why Cooley wanted to see if there was shooting juice from Williams but Mulready's defense is too impactful to keep off the court
• Non Mack/Epps 3 point shooters: 2-8, both from Peavy.  We simply have to find it somewhere.  Mulready and Williams attempts didnt look like they ever had a chance.  
• I thought the defense looked better, but you can just see the difference in how some guys can fight over screens vs. others.  Epps and Mack struggle to do it and then watch Peavy, Mulready and even Caleb Williams just make it more difficult for the ball handler.  I'm also a little worried about our defensive rebounding, right now we let opponents grab 30% of their misses which is 190th in country.  When our forced turnover rate comes down against better competition, that wont be sustainable

Hoya Saxa

Agree with what you said. A couple of other chip shots-

I like that Drew Fielder found a way to be active and make an offensive contribution. He is more skilled in the post offensively than Burks who has the advantage over Fielder athletically and defensively.

We had strong team rebounding with 6 players with 4+ rebounds.

While Kayvaun hasn't found himself offensively, I really like what I saw defensively. How long has it been since we watched a Hoya guard pick the opposing guard's pocket and take it in for a 2? I like the rotation between the guards.

Caleb keeps making smart plays when he is on the floor.

Epps really had a great game.

Thomas is going to be so much fun to watch.

[calhoya]

Hoyas looked much better at the outset on defense. Got sloppy at times particularly inside on drives into the lane. Really like the effort from Mulready, Williams and Burks on the perimeter.

Offense still tends to come and go as periodically the guards revert to "my turn" basketball or simply dribble out the clock. That is what the bench is for and wish Cooley would sit them when they lose focus--even for a minute.

My God this is a poor perimeter shooting team. Four games in and only Epps looks like a decent perimeter shooter. Would like to see Fielder get more opportunities on the offensive end and possibly stretch the floor.

If they cannot do a better job on the defensive boards this team is going to struggle again in BE play. Too many offensive rebounds and second and third chances for the opponent. Fortunate that the opponent could not shoot well.

Building chemistry among the rotation players is a worthy goal, but up by 30 and three minutes left, seems more important to reward the kids at the end of the bench who work their tails off in practice. Very Ewing like and not a good look no matter what the justification.

[FrazierFanatic]

Nov 21, 2024 7:04:01 GMT -5 jpj said:

Happy for a Hoya Win, but this game should have been played on campus

Again - they have a contract with Capital One Arena regarding the number of games there every season.

[bostonfan]

A good win against an average mid major team. MSM had been having a decent year and had shown that they were capable of scoring, so the fact that the Hoyas were able to shut down their offense for most of the night was a good sign. They played defense with much more force and commitment, and I think when they play that way, with the athletes and length that they have, they can be a good defensive team. MSM did not shoot the ball well last night, but most of their shots were contested and when you contest everything, teams will usually struggle to score. They need to build on that defensive effort and continue to get better on that end.

At times the offense looked really good and they created consistent good looks. For a short period of time in the first half, they got stagnant and seemed to not all be on the same page as to what they were trying to accomplish. In fairness they seemed to be able to get back to consistent ball and player movement and that created more good chances in the second half. The 3 point shooting is still a concern and needs to improve. There were a few times that they took some quick open 3's in transition, that are not really bad shots, but they were not really even close to making those and those shots normally turn into transition for the other team. I don't see this team becoming a "good" 3 point shooting team this year, but if they can get marginally better, and be more selective on the 3's that they take, I think they can still have an efficient offense. They seem to run some good action that gets them good post looks and the bigs they have this year should do a good job finishing those chances.

[aleutianhoya]

I thought we played a better overall game but not wildly better.

I think Mack will be the key to whether we have a decent year. He's not a great defender so he has to be a plus offensive player to be effective. And he hasn't been yet in really any of our games. Last night he cleaned up some of the turnovers, which was great. But I still thought he settled too often for difficult, contested shots.

This group overall is a much better passing team than the last few years. So, I would love for Cooley to put in some sort of basic continuity read and react motion set. It doesn't have to be what we run a lot. But I think it would okay to this group's strengths. Where the offense gets stuck is the times where we can't make the initial entry pass to start the other actions. You saw it happen for a stretch in the 1H where we ran the shot clock down a few times. Having different read and react options eliminates that problem.

I thought our intent on D was much better. You could tell it was a focus in practice. Execution still not always there but that's OK.

I'd like us to enter the ball to the post more. There were several times when one of our bigs had good low post depth and a good angle and we just didn't do it. Sorber is our most efficient player. You want your most efficient player touching the ball in dangerous spots as often as possible.

[wolveribe]

I think Cooley is easing into what the rotation is going to be going forward.I thought Curtis Williams showed some defensive potential but Mulready does that with intensity and more of an offense game right now.

I've been very disappointed in Fielder but its early. Just doesn't have focus on defense and offensively seems lost. Burks has the defensive acumen but nothing on offense. So basically hurt the offense or hurt the defense situation.

Hala- looks promising at times. Glad to have someone as a backup that isn't a complete disaster.

Mack needs to get it going. People are going to say its the leap to the Big East but it also might be adjusting to a new team. He seems unsure when to attack and when to give it up.

People have hammered Epps but Epps a willingness to be a team player and seems to be doing what he can to try to help the team win. Yeah, he's gonna have some 5 for 15 shooting nights but I like the growth.

Our Freshman are going to be really good.

[prhoya]

Fielder, one of our best shooters, has only 4 3pt FGAs, all misses. Cooley needs to incorporate Fielder more into the offensive scheme to make him shoot and get him going offensively. His skill is too valuable, esp. in a roster like ours. The next four games present the perfect opportunity.

[DallasHoya]

Nov 21, 2024 8:27:40 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Nov 21, 2024 7:04:01 GMT -5 jpj said:

Happy for a Hoya Win, but this game should have been played on campus

Again - they have a contract with Capital One Arena regarding the number of games there every season.

Have we even tried to renegotiate the contractual requirement? You would think an alumni like Leonsis wouldn’t want his alma mater to be embarrassed on national TV over and over again.

It’s like he donates $ to the university and we launder it back to him in the form of rent we wouldn’t agree to pay anyone else.

[SSHoya]

Nov 21, 2024 9:43:20 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

Nov 21, 2024 8:27:40 GMT -5 FrazierFanatic said:

Again - they have a contract with Capital One Arena regarding the number of games there every season.

Have we even tried to renegotiate the contractual requirement? You would think an alumni like Leonsis wouldn’t want his alma mater to be embarrassed on national TV over and over again.

It’s like he donates $ to the university and we launder it back to him in the form of rent we wouldn’t agree to pay anyone else.

Other than occasional lip service about the Hoya basketball program, I don't think my classmate cares that much about it. I know others may disagree but as an example of a visible sign of support, could Uncle Ted not have made an effort to attend the 1984 NCAA Men's Basketball Championship celebration? Perhaps he did and it just didn't fit into his schedule. As an aside, David Welch, apart from his $4 million donation, has attended every game this year. In most of life, you make the time for that which is most important to you.

IMO, he has bigger fish to fry with his professional franchises, gambling and media interests.

[kettlehill]

I am worried about the 4-5 minute offensive droughts- and that is mostly on the point guard (s).

[RockawayHoya]

Nov 21, 2024 7:28:43 GMT -5 rhw485 said:

A win that I think was generally moving us in the right direction. Will be tough to believe it until we do it against a high major but you saw small steps of progress, which is all you can ask for against that opponent:

• Lets just start off by acknowledging it's not easy to blow teams out by 30.  You can scoff at it all you want, but bad teams struggle to do it and good teams get it done yet.  We're clearly not a good team but for a night we took care of business 
• There were two rotation shifts that I think are relevant.  First, Fielder starting over Burks and playing his most minutes of the season.  13 minutes the first two games he played, 22 tonight.  I think that speaks to Cooley realizing he needs to find some way to get his shooting on the floor.  It hasn't worked yet but he's more of a threat than Burks.  And it really goes back to the question I posed before the season started, can Fielder or Sorber survive defensively at the 4? This isn't the opponent to challenge it but if they can be on the court together it helps immensely
• Second, Curtis Williams dropped from the rotation.  We all saw how disastrous his stint was against ND.  Mulready seems well ahead of him in the pecking order.  I get why Cooley wanted to see if there was shooting juice from Williams but Mulready's defense is too impactful to keep off the court
• Non Mack/Epps 3 point shooters: 2-8, both from Peavy.  We simply have to find it somewhere.  Mulready and Williams attempts didnt look like they ever had a chance.  
• I thought the defense looked better, but you can just see the difference in how some guys can fight over screens vs. others.  Epps and Mack struggle to do it and then watch Peavy, Mulready and even Caleb Williams just make it more difficult for the ball handler.  I'm also a little worried about our defensive rebounding, right now we let opponents grab 30% of their misses which is 190th in country.  When our forced turnover rate comes down against better competition, that wont be sustainable

Hoya Saxa

Your last bullet is key. We get eaten alive by better teams simply because guys don't fight around screens. Not sure if this is by design sometimes, but there will be a lot less instances of requiring help if the man on the ball shows some pride in preventing the ball handler from getting by him. Less help should lead to less open 3s. IMO this is the single biggest deficiency our team currently has on defense. At some point, Ed has to tell his guys... look if you can't guard the guy in front of you without help, you can't stay on the floor.

Yes, there will be players we'll see later this season that can't be defended without help, and at that point you pick your poison. But we haven't seen anyone of that caliber yet, ND included.

[hoyariv71]

Nov 21, 2024 10:12:03 GMT -5 kettlehill said:

I am worried about the 4-5 minute offensive droughts- and that is mostly on the point guard (s).

yes it is, with someone like Sorber, who has the ability to get to the live, we should never have droughts like this