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Post by reformation on Feb 25, 2024 15:23:45 GMT -5
Freshman can absolutely start in the BE/certainly on Gtwn. Freshman certainly start in other P5 conferences. I've seen a decent amt of elite HS basketball this year. A lot of the guys I've seen would be big and immediate upgrades for Gtwn.
We just have to be able to recruit those guys.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Feb 25, 2024 21:50:40 GMT -5
103 minutes total (36 in conference play). What's the plus/minus score? 103 minutes total (36 in conference play). What was their D-Rating? 36 minutes is obviously an already extremely low number. But I bet even those minutes were mostly in a couple games where we had injury (Massoud out with broken hand/multiple guys sick) or foul trouble and the staff had no choice. First, to answer EtomicB's question: The Cook/Fielder +/- for their 103 minutes played together is -8. If you limit it to conference play, the +/- with both playing is 0. Second, to answer thedragon, the D rating during these 103 minutes is 112.3 (20th percentile). It's even worse if you only look at conference play (very small sample size). In the 36 minutes where Cook and Fielder have played together in Big East games, the D rating is 127.5. With Fielder playing, but Cook off it's 116.6. With both off, it's 130.7. With Cook playing but Fielder off it's 126.9.
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 26, 2024 10:47:45 GMT -5
Thought experiment - the final defensive lineup to this game was
Epps-Rowan-Heath-Massoud-Cook
If they were available, would any of the 2024 recruits have been sitting for the last play of the game?
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Feb 26, 2024 10:56:06 GMT -5
Thought experiment - the final defensive lineup to this game was Epps-Rowan-Heath-Massoud-Cook If they were available, would any of the 2024 recruits have been sitting for the last play of the game? Williams for sure. Obviously Styles had fouled out, Bristol too - correct? That's why Heath and Massoud were on the floor. Replace those two with Styles and Bristol and DePaul likely wouldn't have gotten a wide open layup. But yes, Sorber and Mulready should be able to help in those instances as well.
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Post by BeantownHoya on Feb 26, 2024 10:57:27 GMT -5
Thought experiment - the final defensive lineup to this game was Epps-Rowan-Heath-Massoud-Cook If they were available, would any of the 2024 recruits have been sitting for the last play of the game? Maybe 2? Cook simply for his rebounding/size... Maybe Brumbaugh just because of his height and IQ as a guard but I am sure everyone will point out that he was beaten on the last play. Cook - Sorber - McKenna - Mulready - Brumbaugh...would have made me feel a hell of a lot better on a last minute defensive possession because I would assume someone else would have been covering Henley...
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Post by BeantownHoya on Feb 26, 2024 10:59:10 GMT -5
Thought experiment - the final defensive lineup to this game was Epps-Rowan-Heath-Massoud-Cook If they were available, would any of the 2024 recruits have been sitting for the last play of the game? Maybe 2? Cook simply for his rebounding/size... Maybe Brumbaugh just because of his height and IQ as a guard but I am sure everyone will point out that he was beaten on the last play. Cook - Sorber - McKenna - Mulready - Brumbaugh...would have made me feel a hell of a lot better on a last minute defensive possession because I would assume someone else would have been covering Henley... Shoot Bristol for Brumbaugh...my bad ...and to the post right before mine is Williams that good defensively...honest question I wasn't aware...
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Feb 26, 2024 11:05:49 GMT -5
Maybe 2? Cook simply for his rebounding/size... Maybe Brumbaugh just because of his height and IQ as a guard but I am sure everyone will point out that he was beaten on the last play. Cook - Sorber - McKenna - Mulready - Brumbaugh...would have made me feel a hell of a lot better on a last minute defensive possession because I would assume someone else would have been covering Henley... Shoot Bristol for Brumbaugh...my bad ...and to the post right before mine is Williams that good defensively...honest question I wasn't aware... Williams is slow laterally...think Kyle Anderson. He is unlikely to be a plus defender at the Big East level.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Feb 26, 2024 11:15:23 GMT -5
Shoot Bristol for Brumbaugh...my bad ...and to the post right before mine is Williams that good defensively...honest question I wasn't aware... Williams is slow laterally...think Kyle Anderson. He will not be a plus defender at the Big East level. He's a better athlete than Anderson, he reminds me a lot of Terrence Williams from Michigan.
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Feb 26, 2024 11:19:40 GMT -5
Williams is slow laterally...think Kyle Anderson. He will not be a plus defender at the Big East level. He's a better athlete than Anderson, he reminds me a lot of Terrence Williams from Michigan. That's fine, Williams is slow too...Chris Ledlum is another I might use as a comp.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Feb 26, 2024 11:36:47 GMT -5
Thought experiment - the final defensive lineup to this game was Epps-Rowan-Heath-Massoud-Cook If they were available, would any of the 2024 recruits have been sitting for the last play of the game? Individual defensive stats are inherently limited because defense is a really a five-person activity, more so I think than offense. That said, here are the D ratings are each of our guys when they are on the floor. D Ratings, On Floor: - Mutombo: 86.5 (100th percentile) (extremely small sample, 56 minutes) - Epps: 106.7 (52nd percentile) - Heath: 107.2 (48th percentile) - Cook: 109.9 (32nd percentile) - Fielder: 110.6 (28th percentile) - Styles: 111.0 (26th percentile) - Brumbaugh: 112.1 (20th percentile) - Massoud: 113.6 (15th percentile) - Bristol: 114.6 (11th percentile) I have actually never understood why people dump on Epps all the time on defense. He's not the most athletic but I do think his on ball defense is decent on a team where basically everybody defends horribly. Also interesting that Bristol is the worst, even though he's often considered a good defender. Massoud's number confirms what our eyeballs see--he's horrible. Mutombo's number is good solely because of the small minutes mostly in garbage time. Edit: If you look at 2 person combos, it is truly horrible. Once you get rid of the small sample sizes, every two player combo's D rating on our team is almost 110 or above. Truly horrible.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Feb 26, 2024 11:44:51 GMT -5
I also looked at lineup stats. If you limit things to 50 possessions minimum (out of 1800 total this year), we have only 7 lineups meeting those parameters, which makes sense given our small rotation. The best defensive lineup is also the smallest sample (50 possessions): Epps, Heath, Bristol, Styles, Fielder have played 50 possessions (33 minutes) together and have a 99.7 D rating, which is 64th percentile.
The next best lineup's D rating is 109.6. And our most frequently used lineup (Epps, Heath, Styles, Massoud, Cook) is horrendous at 128.9 (10th percentile).
The worst defensive lineup is Epps, Heath, Brumbaugh, Styles, Cook (122 possessions, 73 minutes) at 131.5 (8th percentile).
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Feb 26, 2024 11:51:19 GMT -5
Thought experiment - the final defensive lineup to this game was Epps-Rowan-Heath-Massoud-Cook If they were available, would any of the 2024 recruits have been sitting for the last play of the game? Individual defensive stats are inherently limited because defense is a really a five-person activity, more so I think than offense. That said, here are the D ratings are each of our guys when they are on the floor. D Ratings, On Floor: - Mutombo: 86.5 (100th percentile) (extremely small sample, 56 minutes) - Epps: 106.7 (52nd percentile) - Heath: 107.2 (48th percentile) - Cook: 109.9 (32nd percentile) - Fielder: 110.6 (28th percentile) - Styles: 111.0 (26th percentile) - Brumbaugh: 112.1 (20th percentile) - Massoud: 113.6 (15th percentile) - Bristol: 114.6 (11th percentile) I have actually never understood why people dump on Epps all the time on defense. He's not the most athletic but I do think his on ball defense is decent on a team where basically everybody defends horribly. Also interesting that Bristol is the worst, even though he's often considered a good defender. Massoud's number confirms what our eyeballs see--he's horrible. Mutombo's number is good solely because of the small minutes mostly in garbage time. Edit: If you look at 2 person combos, it is truly horrible. Once you get rid of the small sample sizes, every two player combo's D rating on our team is almost 110 or above. Truly horrible. I get on Epps because he's a terrible off-ball defender and an even worse transition defender. He has the ability to be much better at both
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 26, 2024 12:07:23 GMT -5
He's a better athlete than Anderson, he reminds me a lot of Terrence Williams from Michigan. That's fine, Williams is slow too...Chris Ledlum is another I might use as a comp. This is just clowntown level hate. Williams is going to be a really good defender for us.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Feb 26, 2024 13:11:10 GMT -5
That's fine, Williams is slow too...Chris Ledlum is another I might use as a comp. This is just clowntown level hate. Williams is going to be a really good defender for us. Boya compared him to Ledlum, I'm happy about that.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Feb 26, 2024 15:07:45 GMT -5
Thought experiment - the final defensive lineup to this game was Epps-Rowan-Heath-Massoud-Cook If they were available, would any of the 2024 recruits have been sitting for the last play of the game? Individual defensive stats are inherently limited because defense is a really a five-person activity, more so I think than offense. That said, here are the D ratings are each of our guys when they are on the floor. D Ratings, On Floor: - Mutombo: 86.5 (100th percentile) (extremely small sample, 56 minutes) - Epps: 106.7 (52nd percentile) - Heath: 107.2 (48th percentile) - Cook: 109.9 (32nd percentile) - Fielder: 110.6 (28th percentile) - Styles: 111.0 (26th percentile) - Brumbaugh: 112.1 (20th percentile) - Massoud: 113.6 (15th percentile) - Bristol: 114.6 (11th percentile) I have actually never understood why people dump on Epps all the time on defense. He's not the most athletic but I do think his on ball defense is decent on a team where basically everybody defends horribly. Also interesting that Bristol is the worst, even though he's often considered a good defender. Massoud's number confirms what our eyeballs see--he's horrible. Mutombo's number is good solely because of the small minutes mostly in garbage time. Edit: If you look at 2 person combos, it is truly horrible. Once you get rid of the small sample sizes, every two player combo's D rating on our team is almost 110 or above. Truly horrible. It's not really people; it's a couple of posters, one of whom is well known for grinding axes for years despite all evidence to the contrary. Epps isn't a good defender, for sure. But he gets lost less than Heath or Massoud, and he's actually pretty good at using his strength when someone backs him down. He's never going to be a lockdown guy one on one, and he's doesn't have big size to contest outside shots well, so he's never going to be good, but he's far from our worst.
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hoyas315
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Post by hoyas315 on Feb 26, 2024 15:09:03 GMT -5
As was shown to me by another poster ... watch Massoud on that play. He runs to the corner where there is no Depaul player, then helplessly watches and backs away as DePaul almost wins. Not defending Ish because he is not close to being average defensively but there is a DePaul player in that corner.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Feb 26, 2024 15:09:11 GMT -5
This is just clowntown level hate. Williams is going to be a really good defender for us. Boya compared him to Ledlum, I'm happy about that. Remember, Mac McClung is not a D1 level player.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Feb 26, 2024 15:17:42 GMT -5
Was actually in Chicago for whatever that was. Well, it should have been a 20 point win, but it ended up being not losing to a team that wants to lose worse.
The only consideration I can give us is that there was one ref calling a ton of ticky tack stuff on us -- he was terrible, and ended up constantly arguing with our team and staff (and me) because the dude could not get a call right. That's what put Bristol and Styles on the bench for most of the second half, and that's what killed our lead. Heath at least hit a couple of shots, but Massoud is on his second straight game of almost single handedly losing a game for us.
I get the idea that Fielder can't guard most 4s on the perimeter ... but neither can Massoud. And Fielder can defend down low, rebound and actually make a bucket. I don't really get it; it'd be one thing if Massoud was making shots or alternatively was providing smart, veteran play, but clearly not. You have to try a Cook / Fisher combo there, and I'd actually swap them -- Fisher at C defensively and Cook at PF. No, it's not good, but if you could swap out two guys from our roster for passable players, we're probably looking at something like 3 more BE wins.
Let's give it a try, Cooley.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Feb 26, 2024 15:19:02 GMT -5
He’s never going to be a lockdown guy one on one, and he's doesn't have big size to contest outside shots well, so he's never going to be good, but he's far from our worst. The UVa coach, who has the #3 defense in the NCAA, took Dante Harris precisely for his defense and quickness, and Dante is 6’1” on a good day. It’s not about size at PG in college basketball.
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Post by BeantownHoya on Feb 26, 2024 15:19:33 GMT -5
As was shown to me by another poster ... watch Massoud on that play. He runs to the corner where there is no Depaul player, then helplessly watches and backs away as DePaul almost wins. The biggest problem I have with him at this point is he now also brings zero offense. Look if anyone watched any of him at K State you knew what you were getting...a 6' 8" guy who does not rebound or play much defense that is really more of a 3 BUT can knock down 3's at a very effective rate...except he is not doing that one thing anymore. This is not a typo...over the last 6 games he has played 90 minutes...he has scored 6 points and has 16 fouls...that is on 10% shooting...he is just been plain awful. Fielder has played 55 minutes over those last 6 games. Yes I realize that Fielder is primarily subbing in for Cook and I assume that is where Cooley must see him long term BUT are you telling me when we go into that 3-2 zone we can't have Cook and Fielder as the base instead of Massoud or someone else? The answer is we can... I am not saying all of a sudden we become defensive juggernauts but I will take Fielder's offense and willingness to try on defense over anything Massoud is doing now. Fielder is already a better PF then he is. That's a fact. I feel bad for Massoud I am sure he thought he was going to be a key piece this season on at least a competitive team and that hasn't happened but we shouldn't compound that issue by having him take up minutes that Fielder could grow with. ...and if the argument is well he's a Center and Cook has been decent than tell me what happens next season if Cook is still here? Fielder continues to get 10-15 minutes a night for another season? Good luck keeping him around after that. He is better than Massoud at everything right now even if he's playing out of position which is exactly what Massoud is doing as a 4 already...playing out of position...
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