prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 28, 2023 21:42:54 GMT -5
I'll agree with boya in that Cooley couldn't fill a college basketball roster in his first year, and don't tell me he intended to play the season with 9 or 10 scholarship players. I don't believe that at all - there is intention in our roster looking the way it does. I think he absolutely could have gone into the lower conferences this summer with some NIL and signed some rando 2* bigs with minutes promises, or do a Patrick Ewing and sign a couple of 2023 HS kids and then recruit over them and force them to transfer the next year. The point isn't just to have bodies and to have people around that you don't intend to develop, and having people around who you aren't fulfilling promises to is bad for building a culture. I don't understand. I can see Cooley recruiting a mid-level big without a pt promise and keeping him. Why do you think it ends with Cooley pushing him out? Why can't that player develop under Cooley? There's plenty of space. As we know, we're not going to have a rotation of 13 players, but we need bodies for practice, injuries, foul trouble, etc... |
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TC
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Post by TC on Aug 28, 2023 21:51:30 GMT -5
Leaving an open scholarship is fine. Sitting on three empties is absurd. And if McKenna ends up being ineligible...? Oof. Basically right now we have a less experienced version of the '20 team AFTER all of the defections (Allen, Robinson, McClung, Blair, Mosely, Pickett, Wahab, Yurt, Big Tim). What happens when Mac (Epps) & Yurt (Cook) get hurt this time around? Rowan & Heath start going 38mpg/night? Ryan has to play 28-30mpg? What other team has intentionally started a season that way? Well for starters, let's look at Notre Dame : fightingirish.com/sports/mbball/roster/11 players listed, 1 of whom is a walkon. |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 28, 2023 21:54:49 GMT -5
I get your point. I just believed Cooley's words at the JCW in April. Either he misjudged the situation, he's fine with what we have and we're going to be better than you think, or Cooley has something up his sleeve. I understand what you mean and I understand why people are disappointed with this roster given what Cooley said at the John Carroll weekend. Perhaps Cooley thought he would be in a different position now via the transfer portal, maybe he was trying to be optimistic or was too optimistic, or maybe he is a ruthless competitor trying to trick everybody to cover for his own weaknesses (I don't believe that, but I am channeling hoyaboya to cover all grounds). I am not sure we will ever know. The fact is the 2024 class is good thus far--Sorber, and while boya calls Mulready and Willaims "dime a dozen," that makes no sense given that they are both about top 150 or better kids, and if that's true they're clearly not a dime a dozen. We need guys like that if we are going to suceed long time, and so boya's comments are an exaggeration, in my mind. As far as Cooley not "closing" on guys like Dickinson, that's fair. But, based on reports, other schools were offering him $2 million plus in NIL, and Georgetown did not. So, do we have more NIL than we once had? Yes. Do we have that kind of money for one guy, for one year? I am not so sure. I still stand by my position that people are focusing way too much on the walk-ons as if that is a meaningful metric. It's almost surely for practice purposes and/or catastrophic injury purposes. I do not expect Cooley to be playing tons of walk-ons. The blunt fact is that there are tons of coaches who play rotations of 7-8 guys. Now, that may not be ideal, but it's doable, and so if the guys we have do perform, I think it may be fine. If we get a lot of injuries, or if some of our young guys are just plain bad, it might be a long season. I have some of the same concerns about the roster that everybody else has here, but I also am going to wait to see the guys on the court before I get alarmed. Ed Cooley has never had a problem recruiting or had to resort to walk ons. To the extent that is the case this year, it would likely be because Cooley made a specific choice not to bloat the roster with guys from small conferences (cough cough, Primo Spears) who really aren't good enough to get a lot of minutes on a Georgetown team. And you know what? If people compare us to Pitino they are going to be disappointed. I wanted Pitino too, badly, but we didn't get him. I'm happy with Cooley as the next choice. But, some people aren't going to get over Jack DeGioia not considering Pitino. I get that, but in the world we live in Georgtown isn't rolling out Coach Pitino. So, we need to live with it and see what happens. If Cooley doesn't get the job done, I'm happy to say that. But we haven't even seen the guy coach a game yet. As I've written here, I really like our roster on paper (I liked last year's roster before the season too, so...). Cooley has done a great job in keeping 3 key upperclassmen from last year, getting rid of others, adding 4-star talent, plus getting experienced strongman Cook and NCAAT-experienced Masoud. The problem is that, any way you look at it, 9 players will not last through the season. What if one or more players do not play as expected? But, don't get me wrong, they could exceed expectations too. There has to be something else. The Pitino (and probably English) comparison will be inevitable, but I'm very happy with Cooley. |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 28, 2023 22:38:07 GMT -5
A Coach in the SEC: “Money talks. If you want a kid, you’re going to have to pay for him. It’s a win-now era in college basketball. You can turn a program around in one year with a roster flip. If you’re a top ten transfer portal team, and your team doesn’t perform, what does that say about you as a coach?” www.on3.com/news/college-coaches-confidential-how-has-nil-changed-how-you-recruit-a-player/NIL has made it easier than ever to turn a program around. Especially an established coach with all the advantages Georgetown has. This nonsense talk of what happened this last few years used to matter. Look what Jerome Tang did at KSU. A team that was awful for the 3 years before he got there. Great look at NIL and recruiting... |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Aug 29, 2023 0:04:37 GMT -5
I understand what you mean and I understand why people are disappointed with this roster given what Cooley said at the John Carroll weekend. Perhaps Cooley thought he would be in a different position now via the transfer portal, maybe he was trying to be optimistic or was too optimistic, or maybe he is a ruthless competitor trying to trick everybody to cover for his own weaknesses (I don't believe that, but I am channeling hoyaboya to cover all grounds). I am not sure we will ever know. The fact is the 2024 class is good thus far--Sorber, and while boya calls Mulready and Willaims "dime a dozen," that makes no sense given that they are both about top 150 or better kids, and if that's true they're clearly not a dime a dozen. We need guys like that if we are going to suceed long time, and so boya's comments are an exaggeration, in my mind. As far as Cooley not "closing" on guys like Dickinson, that's fair. But, based on reports, other schools were offering him $2 million plus in NIL, and Georgetown did not. So, do we have more NIL than we once had? Yes. Do we have that kind of money for one guy, for one year? I am not so sure. I still stand by my position that people are focusing way too much on the walk-ons as if that is a meaningful metric. It's almost surely for practice purposes and/or catastrophic injury purposes. I do not expect Cooley to be playing tons of walk-ons. The blunt fact is that there are tons of coaches who play rotations of 7-8 guys. Now, that may not be ideal, but it's doable, and so if the guys we have do perform, I think it may be fine. If we get a lot of injuries, or if some of our young guys are just plain bad, it might be a long season. I have some of the same concerns about the roster that everybody else has here, but I also am going to wait to see the guys on the court before I get alarmed. Ed Cooley has never had a problem recruiting or had to resort to walk ons. To the extent that is the case this year, it would likely be because Cooley made a specific choice not to bloat the roster with guys from small conferences (cough cough, Primo Spears) who really aren't good enough to get a lot of minutes on a Georgetown team. And you know what? If people compare us to Pitino they are going to be disappointed. I wanted Pitino too, badly, but we didn't get him. I'm happy with Cooley as the next choice. But, some people aren't going to get over Jack DeGioia not considering Pitino. I get that, but in the world we live in Georgtown isn't rolling out Coach Pitino. So, we need to live with it and see what happens. If Cooley doesn't get the job done, I'm happy to say that. But we haven't even seen the guy coach a game yet. As I've written here, I really like our roster on paper (I liked last year's roster before the season too, so...). Cooley has done a great job in keeping 3 key upperclassmen from last year, getting rid of others, adding 4-star talent, plus getting experienced strongman Cook and NCAAT-experienced Masoud. The problem is that, any way you look at it, 9 players will not last through the season. What if one or more players do not play as expected? But, don't get me wrong, they could exceed expectations too. There has to be something else. The Pitino (and probably English) comparison will be inevitable, but I'm very happy with Cooley. I agree. If we are faced with a ton of injuries we will be pretty screwed. Let’s hope that doesn’t happen. |
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Aug 29, 2023 8:11:05 GMT -5
I understand what you mean and I understand why people are disappointed with this roster given what Cooley said at the John Carroll weekend. Perhaps Cooley thought he would be in a different position now via the transfer portal, maybe he was trying to be optimistic or was too optimistic, or maybe he is a ruthless competitor trying to trick everybody to cover for his own weaknesses (I don't believe that, but I am channeling hoyaboya to cover all grounds). I am not sure we will ever know. The fact is the 2024 class is good thus far--Sorber, and while boya calls Mulready and Willaims "dime a dozen," that makes no sense given that they are both about top 150 or better kids, and if that's true they're clearly not a dime a dozen. We need guys like that if we are going to suceed long time, and so boya's comments are an exaggeration, in my mind. As far as Cooley not "closing" on guys like Dickinson, that's fair. But, based on reports, other schools were offering him $2 million plus in NIL, and Georgetown did not. So, do we have more NIL than we once had? Yes. Do we have that kind of money for one guy, for one year? I am not so sure. I still stand by my position that people are focusing way too much on the walk-ons as if that is a meaningful metric. It's almost surely for practice purposes and/or catastrophic injury purposes. I do not expect Cooley to be playing tons of walk-ons. The blunt fact is that there are tons of coaches who play rotations of 7-8 guys. Now, that may not be ideal, but it's doable, and so if the guys we have do perform, I think it may be fine. If we get a lot of injuries, or if some of our young guys are just plain bad, it might be a long season. I have some of the same concerns about the roster that everybody else has here, but I also am going to wait to see the guys on the court before I get alarmed. Ed Cooley has never had a problem recruiting or had to resort to walk ons. To the extent that is the case this year, it would likely be because Cooley made a specific choice not to bloat the roster with guys from small conferences (cough cough, Primo Spears) who really aren't good enough to get a lot of minutes on a Georgetown team. And you know what? If people compare us to Pitino they are going to be disappointed. I wanted Pitino too, badly, but we didn't get him. I'm happy with Cooley as the next choice. But, some people aren't going to get over Jack DeGioia not considering Pitino. I get that, but in the world we live in Georgtown isn't rolling out Coach Pitino. So, we need to live with it and see what happens. If Cooley doesn't get the job done, I'm happy to say that. But we haven't even seen the guy coach a game yet. As I've written here, I really like our roster on paper (I liked last year's roster before the season too, so...). Cooley has done a great job in keeping 3 key upperclassmen from last year , getting rid of others, adding 4-star talent, plus getting experienced strongman Cook and NCAAT-experienced Masoud. The problem is that, any way you look at it, 9 players will not last through the season. What if one or more players do not play as expected? But, don't get me wrong, they could exceed expectations too. There has to be something else. The Pitino (and probably English) comparison will be inevitable, but I'm very happy with Cooley. Not sure how one could argue that Mutombo, Bristol and Heath are "3 key upperclassmen" and that Cooley has done a "great job" keeping them. Ryan Mutombo has barely played in 2 seasons on the Hilltop. His dad, who is a Hoya legend and has served on the University's board, is battling a brain tumor. Keeping Ryan Mutombo on the Hilltoop likely required very little persuasion from Cooley - it's not likely that there were a ton of high major basketball programs knocking down his door to transfer. Wayne Bristol averaged 3.3 ppg, 1.9 rpg and 0.5 apg for a Georgetown team that went 7-25 last season. He's already used a transfer and would have had to sit another season if he had gone somewhere else. Again, highly unlikely that better programs than Georgetown (academically and athletically) were knocking down Bristol's door. Jay Heath has played 4 seasons of college basketball. In those seasons, his teams have gone a collective 38-77. Having already transferred twice, Heath would have had to sit a year if he transferred somewhere else. There aren't good high major programs waiting a year to get one season of Jay Heath in 2024-2025. |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 29, 2023 9:10:41 GMT -5
As I've written here, I really like our roster on paper (I liked last year's roster before the season too, so...). Cooley has done a great job in keeping 3 key upperclassmen from last year , getting rid of others, adding 4-star talent, plus getting experienced strongman Cook and NCAAT-experienced Masoud. The problem is that, any way you look at it, 9 players will not last through the season. What if one or more players do not play as expected? But, don't get me wrong, they could exceed expectations too. There has to be something else. The Pitino (and probably English) comparison will be inevitable, but I'm very happy with Cooley. Ryan Mutombo has barely played in 2 seasons on the Hilltop. His dad, who is a Hoya legend and has served on the University's board, is battling a brain tumor. Keeping Ryan Mutombo on the Hilltoop likely required very little persuasion from Cooley - it's not likely that there were a ton of high major basketball programs knocking down his door to transfer. Wayne Bristol averaged 3.3 ppg, 1.9 rpg and 0.5 apg for a Georgetown team that went 7-25 last season. He's already used a transfer and would have had to sit another season if he had gone somewhere else. Again, highly unlikely that better programs than Georgetown (academically and athletically) were knocking down Bristol's door. Jay Heath has played 4 seasons of college basketball. In those seasons, his teams have gone a collective 38-77. Having already transferred twice, Heath would have had to sit a year if he transferred somewhere else. Simple. Do you have other key players with experience and a team-first mentality on last year’s team? Cooley managed to keep an upperclass center, wing and guard, who now are his core of leadership. Also, “better programs than Georgetown” has not stopped the plethora of players from transferring. Do you think, for example, some team was knocking Tim’s door? Now to your “where would they have gone” line. As usual, you’re making a lot of assumptions. What does Dikembe’s health have to do with it? Given his lack of pt without explanation, Ryan could’ve easily gone the way of Wilson, Tim I and Qudus. After the departure of Akok and the thin frontcourt, an upperclass Ryan with something to prove might be the most important player on the team. Also, correct me if I’m wrong, but we have no idea if there were schools knocking his door. Second, Bristol was misused by Ewing, who had him on a leash and surrounded by me-first players. Even though Bristol wanted to stay, Cooley could’ve used those stats to say bye. Instead, Cooley sat down with him, liked what he saw and kept him. Third, Jay Heath is the only proven double-digit perimeter player. What does the record of his teams have to do with it? He’s been in terrible teams and I’m not hoing to blame him for Ewing’s debacle. Just as he got rid of some other players, Cooley could’ve said bye to Jay. But, after their sit-down, Cooley liked him and kept him. Finally, these three upperclassmen are outstanding, smart representatives of the school and will make a major difference this year. We’ll see if I’m right after the season. I’m glad that Cooley was smart enough to keep these players. |
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kghoya
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Post by kghoya on Aug 29, 2023 9:16:39 GMT -5
Not sure how one could argue that Mutombo, Bristol and Heath are "3 key upperclassmen" and that Cooley has done a "great job" keeping them. Ryan Mutombo has barely played in 2 seasons on the Hilltop. His dad, who is a Hoya legend and has served on the University's board, is battling a brain tumor. Keeping Ryan Mutombo on the Hilltoop likely required very little persuasion from Cooley - it's not likely that there were a ton of high major basketball programs knocking down his door to transfer. Wayne Bristol averaged 3.3 ppg, 1.9 rpg and 0.5 apg for a Georgetown team that went 7-25 last season. He's already used a transfer and would have had to sit another season if he had gone somewhere else. Again, highly unlikely that better programs than Georgetown (academically and athletically) were knocking down Bristol's door. Jay Heath has played 4 seasons of college basketball. In those seasons, his teams have gone a collective 38-77. Having already transferred twice, Heath would have had to sit a year if he transferred somewhere else. Simple. Do you have other key players with experience and a team-first mentality on last year’s team? Cooley managed to keep an upperclass center, wing and guard, who now are his core of leadership. Also, “better programs than Georgetown” has not stopped the plethora of players from transferring. Do you think, for example, some team was knocking Tim’s door? Now to your “where would they have gone” line. As usual, you’re making a lot of assumptions. What does Dikembe’s health have to do with it? Given his lack of pt without explanation, Ryan could’ve easily gone the way of Wilson, Tim I and Qudus. After the departure of Akok and the thin frontcourt, an upperclass Ryan with something to prove might be the most important player on the team. Also, correct me if I’m wrong, but we have no idea if there were schools knocking his door. Second, Bristol was misused by Ewing, who had him on a leash and surrounded by me-first players. Even though Bristol wanted to stay, Cooley could’ve used those stats to say bye. Instead, Cooley sat down with him, liked what he saw and kept him. Third, Jay Heath is the only proven double-digit perimeter player. What does the record of his teams have to do with it? He’s been in terrible teams and I’m not hoing to blame him for Ewing’s debacle. Just as he got rid of some other players, Cooley could’ve said bye to Jay. But, after their sit-down, Cooley liked him and kept him. Finally, these three upperclassmen are outstanding, smart representatives of the school and will make a major difference this year. We’ll see if I’m right after the season. I’m glad that Cooley was smart enough to keep these players. Who did Cooley get rid of? Or, put different, who wanted to stay but wasn't allowed to do so? |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 29, 2023 9:21:17 GMT -5
Simple. Do you have other key players with experience and a team-first mentality on last year’s team? Cooley managed to keep an upperclass center, wing and guard, who now are his core of leadership. Also, “better programs than Georgetown” has not stopped the plethora of players from transferring. Do you think, for example, some team was knocking Tim’s door? Now to your “where would they have gone” line. As usual, you’re making a lot of assumptions. What does Dikembe’s health have to do with it? Given his lack of pt without explanation, Ryan could’ve easily gone the way of Wilson, Tim I and Qudus. After the departure of Akok and the thin frontcourt, an upperclass Ryan with something to prove might be the most important player on the team. Also, correct me if I’m wrong, but we have no idea if there were schools knocking his door. Second, Bristol was misused by Ewing, who had him on a leash and surrounded by me-first players. Even though Bristol wanted to stay, Cooley could’ve used those stats to say bye. Instead, Cooley sat down with him, liked what he saw and kept him. Third, Jay Heath is the only proven double-digit perimeter player. What does the record of his teams have to do with it? He’s been in terrible teams and I’m not hoing to blame him for Ewing’s debacle. Just as he got rid of some other players, Cooley could’ve said bye to Jay. But, after their sit-down, Cooley liked him and kept him. Finally, these three upperclassmen are outstanding, smart representatives of the school and will make a major difference this year. We’ll see if I’m right after the season. I’m glad that Cooley was smart enough to keep these players. Who did Cooley get rid of? Or, put different, who wanted to stay but wasn't allowed to do so? Cooley didn’t name the players. Paraphrasing from his interviews, he said that he didn’t want anyone who didn’t want to be here or who didn’t understand what it meant to be here. |
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Aug 29, 2023 10:00:06 GMT -5
Who did Cooley get rid of? Or, put different, who wanted to stay but wasn't allowed to do so? Cooley didn’t name the players. Paraphrasing from his interviews, he said that he didn’t want anyone who didn’t want to be here or who didn’t understand what it meant to be here. I have no problem with Cooley ditching talented but selfish players like Brandon Murray and Primo Spears, particularly as he tries to build a culture. Cooley likely opened up a bunch of NIL money when he got rid of those guys as well. That said, both ended up at programs that are probably in better situations than Georgetown is right now (Ole Miss and Florida State, respectively). There was a market for them as other really good coaches (including Bill Self at Kansas, who recruited Spears) saw the talent, even though they were horrribly mismanaged by Patrick Ewing. Qudus Wahab went to Penn State, a program arguably as good or better than Georgetown. We absolutely could have used him in 2023-2024, particularly knowing what our bigs rotation is now (I recognize hindsight is 20-20). Akok Akok trained with us all summer and the program was putting him in Twitter videos a week before he left, so pretty clear the coaching staff wanted to keep him. He's going to a West Virginia program that is probably in a better position than Georgetown heading into the 2023-2024 season. Those are 4 talented guys who, with the right coaching, could have helped the 2023-2024 team. That's not even counting guys like Ezewiro and Riley who went to high-end mid-majors and could probably have helped as well. |
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kghoya
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Post by kghoya on Aug 29, 2023 10:06:50 GMT -5
Who did Cooley get rid of? Or, put different, who wanted to stay but wasn't allowed to do so? Cooley didn’t name the players. Paraphrasing from his interviews, he said that he didn’t want anyone who didn’t want to be here or who didn’t understand what it meant to be here. I took that to mean that he wasn't going to beg players to reconsider that were already in the portal. He didn't kick any of the players to the curb (or Cal Baptist). |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 29, 2023 10:11:35 GMT -5
Cooley didn’t name the players. Paraphrasing from his interviews, he said that he didn’t want anyone who didn’t want to be here or who didn’t understand what it meant to be here. I took that to mean that he wasn't going to beg players to reconsider that were already in the portal. He didn't kick any of the players to the curb (or Cal Baptist). Again, we don’t know what happened with each player. If someone knows and can tell, please do or pm. |
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TC
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Post by TC on Aug 29, 2023 10:13:01 GMT -5
Cooley didn’t name the players. Paraphrasing from his interviews, he said that he didn’t want anyone who didn’t want to be here or who didn’t understand what it meant to be here. I have no problem with Cooley ditching talented but selfish players like Brandon Murray and Primo Spears, particularly as he tries to build a culture. Cooley likely opened up a bunch of NIL money when he got rid of those guys as well. That said, both ended up at programs that are probably in better situations than Georgetown is right now (Ole Miss and Florida State, respectively). There was a market for them as other really good coaches (including Bill Self at Kansas, who recruited Spears) saw the talent, even though they were horrribly mismanaged by Patrick Ewing. Qudus Wahab went to Penn State, a program arguably as good or better than Georgetown. We absolutely could have used him in 2023-2024, particularly knowing what our bigs rotation is now (I recognize hindsight is 20-20). Akok Akok trained with us all summer and the program was putting him in Twitter videos a week before he left, so pretty clear the coaching staff wanted to keep him. He's going to a West Virginia program that is probably in a better position than Georgetown heading into the 2023-2024 season. Those are 4 talented guys who, with the right coaching, could have helped the 2023-2024 team. That's not even counting guys like Ezewiro and Riley who went to high-end mid-majors and could probably have helped as well. Which one of them was willing to put aside their feelings about 2022-2023 and stay? (answer : only Akok, everyone else was disgruntled and in the portal within a week) Which one of them would take less NIL $ than Patrick Ewing was handing them to free it up for the players we brought in? Which one of them adds enough to make us a tournament team? Which one of them is going to take a big minutes reduction because we have talented Cooley players at their positions (Epps/Brumbaugh/Cook)? |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 29, 2023 10:32:01 GMT -5
Those are 4 talented guys who, with the right coaching, could have helped the 2023-2024 team. Disagree on all but Akok. The other three were black holes and would not be happy with a reduced role. It would have been a risk to team chemistry. As for Akok, he was going to be a starter, but I guess he wanted a change of $cenery. Looking at our roster right now, he’s a big loss. |
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bigskyhoya
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Post by bigskyhoya on Aug 29, 2023 10:40:43 GMT -5
Cooley didn’t name the players. Paraphrasing from his interviews, he said that he didn’t want anyone who didn’t want to be here or who didn’t understand what it meant to be here. I have no problem with Cooley ditching talented but selfish players like Brandon Murray and Primo Spears, particularly as he tries to build a culture. Cooley likely opened up a bunch of NIL money when he got rid of those guys as well. That said, both ended up at programs that are probably in better situations than Georgetown is right now (Ole Miss and Florida State, respectively). There was a market for them as other really good coaches (including Bill Self at Kansas, who recruited Spears) saw the talent, even though they were horrribly mismanaged by Patrick Ewing. Qudus Wahab went to Penn State, a program arguably as good or better than Georgetown. We absolutely could have used him in 2023-2024, particularly knowing what our bigs rotation is now (I recognize hindsight is 20-20). Akok Akok trained with us all summer and the program was putting him in Twitter videos a week before he left, so pretty clear the coaching staff wanted to keep him. He's going to a West Virginia program that is probably in a better position than Georgetown heading into the 2023-2024 season. Those are 4 talented guys who, with the right coaching, could have helped the 2023-2024 team. That's not even counting guys like Ezewiro and Riley who went to high-end mid-majors and could probably have helped as well. I don't blame any player hightailing it out of here after the last few years. And of those that left, I only regret losing Akok, even if someone like Wahab may have helped this year. |
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TC
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Post by TC on Aug 29, 2023 10:56:17 GMT -5
I took that to mean that he wasn't going to beg players to reconsider that were already in the portal. He didn't kick any of the players to the curb (or Cal Baptist). Again, we don’t know what happened with each player. If someone knows and can tell, please do or pm. I mean....come on, we don't know exactly the circumstances but no one was Wilsonned or Ighoefed. I think people are forgetting that last season was such a disaster that multiple players had scrubbed Georgetown from their socials by the time the season had ended. Ewing fired : March 9th Dante Bass portal : March 9th Primo Spears portal : March 13th Jordan Riley portal : March 13th Denver Anglin portal : March 14th Malcolm Wilson portal : March 15th Ed Cooley accepts offer : March 20th Ed Cooley signing : March 22nd Qudus Wahab portal : March 25th Brandon Murray portal : March 26th Bradley Ezewiro portal : March 28th Three players waited around till Ed Cooley was hired to jump in the portal, all of them were NIL $ guys, none of those three showed up to the signing ceremony (Heath, Akok, Bristol, and Anglin were there). There's nothing here to even suggest that someone was told a scholarship wasn't there for them. Telling someone that NIL $ or playing time might not be there is very, very different from what Ewing did to Ighoefe and Wilson. |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 29, 2023 11:35:27 GMT -5
Again, we don’t know what happened with each player. If someone knows and can tell, please do or pm. I mean....come on, we don't know exactly the circumstances but no one was Wilsonned or Ighoefed. I think people are forgetting that last season was such a disaster that multiple players had scrubbed Georgetown from their socials by the time the season had ended. Ewing fired : March 9th Dante Bass portal : March 9th Primo Spears portal : March 13th Jordan Riley portal : March 13th Denver Anglin portal : March 14th Malcolm Wilson portal : March 15th Ed Cooley accepts offer : March 20th Ed Cooley signing : March 22nd Qudus Wahab portal : March 25th Brandon Murray portal : March 26th Bradley Ezewiro portal : March 28th Three players waited around till Ed Cooley was hired to jump in the portal, all of them were NIL $ guys, none of those three showed up to the signing ceremony (Heath, Akok, Bristol, and Anglin were there). There's nothing here to even suggest that someone was told a scholarship wasn't there for them. Telling someone that NIL $ or playing time might not be there is very, very different from what Ewing did to Ighoefe and Wilson. Entering the portal is not the same as leaving the school. All of the players were at GU when Cooley was hired. If Cooley wanted them, then he could have rerecruited them. Who knows how their intial interview with Cooley went. Unless someone talks, we only have Cooley’s statements. |
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wolveribe
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 405
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Post by wolveribe on Aug 29, 2023 11:50:49 GMT -5
There is not way Cooley comes on and keeps Spears, Ezewiro, Murray, and Wahab. The thing that fans aren't used to around here is legitimate roster building...about how players fit together, and how they can play together to achieve success on the court. That isn't happening with those 4 so you might as well move on without them and build a different culture/philosophy.
Hoyaboya has an impressive ability to flip flop arguments to argue against Cooley and Georgetown. He will take both sides to belittle them.
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calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,408
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Post by calhoya on Aug 29, 2023 12:23:53 GMT -5
Like some here, Cooley was not my first choice but he's here now, seemingly making a major effort to promote the program and also made a very aggressive effort to recruit kids to turn this program around. Very happy that they kept the 3 players they did and not worrying about any who chose to leave. I am not getting worked up over the misses on the recruiting trail and I am excited to see what Cooley can do this coming year.
I think that it is easy to forget just how far down this program had fallen over the past few years. I cannot understand why any high quality transfer with only 1-2 years of eligibility left would want to come to be part of a massive rebuild. I know that Pitino (not my choice for coach either) seemingly was able to bring in high level talent, but Pitino is in a very small group of coaches who have proven repeatedly they are able to produce immediate results. Good for St. Johns but 4 years from now they will likely be looking for a new coach. Let's just hold off on the early report cards on Cooley and judge him by what he accomplishes on the court this year. If you hold his recruiting class in low regard then any positive results with this team should be that much more impressive.
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,929
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Post by DFW HOYA on Aug 29, 2023 12:29:46 GMT -5
There are three different arguments here, just as there are three distinct groups of transfers.
1. Three players left at the start: Anglin, Bass and Riley. It didn't matter who was coming, they simply had a bad experience under Ewing & Co. and needed a fresh start. Jordan Riley could have been a solid four year player for Georgetown, along the lines of a Jagan Mosely, but his output had fallen so far (from POY in New York State to a 4 for 28 shooting slump in his last nine games to end the season) that he needed a clean break.
2. Two players left as graduate transfers: Wilson and Wahab. That's all GU could have asked of them. If Wilson is settling in Charlotte after college, a local MBA is a good fit, and he wasn't seeing much time here anyway. Wahab got his degree (good for him) and if NIL allows him to get his nine points a game at Penn State instead of nine at Georgetown, no issue there.
3. The third group is the Traveling Nickelberrys (Murray, Spears, Ezewiro). They did not come to Georgetown for cura personalis or the networking opportunities therein, and they left because someone offered them more elsewhere. These were the kind of players the elder Thompson famously steered clear of, because their work ethic and loyalty would never be more than who held out the best offer. Instead of working the high school ranks, Ewing went the short-term route with these three and they responded for him in kind.
To some degree, Akok appears to be somewhere between groups 2 and 3, though if he got a backdoor degree at UConn to get out of Georgetown and gain immediate eligibility, let him go.
The arguments about Cooley with nine scholarships on the roster come down to three arguments/questions:
1. Did the staff expect players to follow from Providence? There was initial chatter about this but English and the PC boosters cut this off at the start.
2. Is Georgetown ever going to be competitive with P3 collectives? Cooley was out early on the NIL train (remember the early pitch for TCU's Eddie Lampkin?) but every player GU was targeting then got a presumably better offer in a major conference. Putting aside the cloudy nature of where Hoyas Rising fits into all this, this isn't Michigan, and recruits know it.
3. Is 2023-24 a mulligan for Cooley anyway? Anything more than seven wins is progress, and if the staff ties these three grants to Top 100 candidates in 2024, that's what people will remember.
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