daveg23
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by daveg23 on Jan 11, 2023 5:47:16 GMT -5
The bigger concern isn’t Kentucky but the school they steal from. For example, Kentucky or UT might not ever need to give Pitino a serious look, but if they steal Oats from Bama or Musselman from Arkansas, then those programs might give him a look. It’s why time is of the essence here. If you find the guy you like and can reach an agreement on the $$, you have to seal the deal and not fall victim to the coaching carousel. And I’d say that concern is heightened for the candidates a bit farther down our list. Let’s say the admin doesn’t want Pitino or Cooley strikes out. A lot of the up-and-coming types would also be candidates for jobs like Alabama and Arkansas, especially the guys currently coaching in the south or Midwest. Exactly. One more open job and the trickle down effect is what I was after. |
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Jan 11, 2023 7:27:27 GMT -5
Other schools will move quicker, offer good money and may not come with as much administrative baggage.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 11, 2023 8:53:46 GMT -5
Other schools will move quicker, offer good money and may not come with as much administrative baggage. There's no "may" about it... I doubt very very much there's a worse run program than Gtown.. If they fail to make some moves prior to the season ending why would anyone take them seriously? |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 11, 2023 9:36:19 GMT -5
This game really confirms the "mathematical" problem I have raised in other threads in explaining why I think it is virtually impossible for us to win any games. This was among our better games on the defense end (giving up .84 ppp first half, 1.08 second half, definitely way better than any other Big East game) and we still had no shot. Now, of course, was our defense really better or was Seton Hall's offense just really bad? I think our defense was a bit better, but I do think most of it is attributable to Seton Hall's horrible offense.
This is the first time I have seen Seton Hall all year, but their offense was incredibly slow paced last night, and statistically their tempo is below average. I really think that is the biggest factor in our defense doing a bit better. Our defense really falls apart when opposing teams use a lot of passing, ball movement, motion, etc. because our guys have no idea how to cope with it. By playing so slowly and not moving the ball, Seton Hall essentially played in a style that helps to prop up our defense a bit.
So, regardless of whether Seton Hall's offense stunk or we played better, we essentially had our best defensive game all Big East season--AND WE STILL LOST BY 15 POINTS. This really illustrates why we simply cannot win games. Even when things go pretty well for us (relatively speaking), we aren't even close (even if Ewing tries to claim games that weren't close, like Villanova, were close). I was one of those people who thought we could not possibly go 0-20 again before the season, but I think it's a very distinct possibility. The next DePaul game is really our best shot at a win, if we lose that, the odds of a winless Big East season go way up.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Jan 11, 2023 9:37:08 GMT -5
If there is a change, we need a coach who wants to be at GU, period, baggage and all. Even if there are widescale changes, there will be baggage. We need someone who embraces that and has no fear.
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mfk24
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by mfk24 on Jan 11, 2023 9:40:38 GMT -5
If there is a change, we need a coach who wants to be at GU, period, baggage and all. Even if there are widescale changes, there will be baggage. We need someone who embraces that and has no fear. there is change?! What else do you need to see? Consecutive 0-fer seasons are not enough? |
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 11, 2023 9:44:41 GMT -5
If there is a change, we need a coach who wants to be at GU, period, baggage and all. Even if there are widescale changes, there will be baggage. We need someone who embraces that and has no fear. If Ronny and his cronies are no longer around, what "baggage" do you speak of? It's a great job. It pays highly, is located in a recruiting hotbed on a gorgeous campus and plays in a high profile conference. Sure, we don't have some of the advantages the Power 5 football schools have, but it's a very good job particularly for somebody with ties east of the Mississippi. |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 11, 2023 9:45:54 GMT -5
If there is a change, we need a coach who wants to be at GU, period, baggage and all. Even if there are widescale changes, there will be baggage. We need someone who embraces that and has no fear. This thought process is exactly why Gtown is mired in a 27 game losing streak in conference... |
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Jan 11, 2023 9:46:49 GMT -5
Start with the low hanging but extremely important fruit. Announce that Ronny and Howze are done effective immediately. Then get one win and have Patrick step down and put Nickleberry in until year end (kind of the only option at this point). He would be coaching for a position somewhere else at that point. Make it clear we are cleaning the house all the way down to the ketchup drawer in the kitchen.
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 11, 2023 9:50:27 GMT -5
While he would be a horrid candidate, I like that a national figure would put this out there on Twitter:
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 11, 2023 9:58:27 GMT -5
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by TC on Jan 11, 2023 10:11:52 GMT -5
While he would be a horrid candidate, I like that a national figure would put this out there on Twitter: |
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Jan 11, 2023 10:15:42 GMT -5
If there is a change, we need a coach who wants to be at GU, period, baggage and all. Even if there are widescale changes, there will be baggage. We need someone who embraces that and has no fear. If Ronny and his cronies are no longer around, what "baggage" do you speak of? It's a great job. It pays highly, is located in a recruiting hotbed on a gorgeous campus and plays in a high profile conference. Sure, we don't have some of the advantages the Power 5 football schools have, but it's a very good job particularly for somebody with ties east of the Mississippi. There is tons of relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III, and Patrick that will stay with the program for years. High school and AAU coaches who will torpedo us. Parents who will not consider us. Recruits in certain parts of the country who still believe GU is a HBCU (there are many here in North Carolina, sadly). And remnants of the lack of NCAA success for years and recent landslide. Certainly, a good coach can overcome that baggage. But it will be there, and it will take time. |
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 11, 2023 10:23:53 GMT -5
If Ronny and his cronies are no longer around, what "baggage" do you speak of? It's a great job. It pays highly, is located in a recruiting hotbed on a gorgeous campus and plays in a high profile conference. Sure, we don't have some of the advantages the Power 5 football schools have, but it's a very good job particularly for somebody with ties east of the Mississippi. There is tons of relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III, and Patrick that will stay with the program for years. High school and AAU coaches who will torpedo us. Parents who will not consider us. Recruits in certain parts of the country who still believe GU is a HBCU (there are many here in North Carolina, sadly). And remnants of the lack of NCAA success for years and recent landslide. Certainly, a good coach can overcome that baggage. But it will be there, and it will take time. In all seriousness, what "relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III and Patrick" are you talking about? Are you hinting that there are a bunch of people loyal to those guys that won't send players to Georgetown in the future under a different coach? Who are those "high school and AAU coaches", why would they do that, and how will they "torpedo us"? I hate to break it to you, but we don't have very good relationships with most local high school and AAU coaches as is. We have had a terrible lack of success recruiting locally - nobody is delivering players to us. If you're talking about regional or national programs (the IMG Acacemys of the world), how could they send us fewer prospects than they're sending us now? What are these loyalties to the Thompson/Ewing folks getting us today? We've recruited a team of mercenaries through the portal and our high school recruiting appears to be dead in the water due to the team's performance, we've lost 27 straight Big East games - so how could it get any worse? |
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Buckets
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by Buckets on Jan 11, 2023 10:37:31 GMT -5
There is tons of relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III, and Patrick that will stay with the program for years. High school and AAU coaches who will torpedo us. Parents who will not consider us. Recruits in certain parts of the country who still believe GU is a HBCU (there are many here in North Carolina, sadly). And remnants of the lack of NCAA success for years and recent landslide. Certainly, a good coach can overcome that baggage. But it will be there, and it will take time. In all seriousness, what "relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III and Patrick" are you talking about? Are you hinting that there are a bunch of people loyal to those guys that won't send players to Georgetown in the future under a different coach? Who are those "high school and AAU coaches", why would they do that, and how will they "torpedo us"? I hate to break it to you, but we don't have very good relationships with most local high school and AAU coaches as is. We have had a terrible lack of success recruiting locally - nobody is delivering players to us. If you're talking about regional or national programs (the IMG Acacemys of the world), how could they send us fewer prospects than they're sending us now? What are these loyalties to the Thompson/Ewing folks getting us today? We've recruited a team of mercenaries through the portal and our high school recruiting appears to be dead in the water due to the team's performance, we've lost 27 straight Big East games - so how could it get any worse?  Probably tens of thousands of involved parties between players, parents and other relatives, coaches involved in every recruiting class and the primarily Thompson/Ewing-faithful who would be upset by a new coach are out here like |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 11, 2023 10:37:38 GMT -5
If Ronny and his cronies are no longer around, what "baggage" do you speak of? It's a great job. It pays highly, is located in a recruiting hotbed on a gorgeous campus and plays in a high profile conference. Sure, we don't have some of the advantages the Power 5 football schools have, but it's a very good job particularly for somebody with ties east of the Mississippi. There is tons of relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III, and Patrick that will stay with the program for years. High school and AAU coaches who will torpedo us. Parents who will not consider us. Recruits in certain parts of the country who still believe GU is a HBCU (there are many here in North Carolina, sadly). And remnants of the lack of NCAA success for years and recent landslide. Certainly, a good coach can overcome that baggage. But it will be there, and it will take time. Georgetown was never an HBCU in any capacity. Because John Thompson was one of the first successful African American coaches that was a key part of the culture at our program, it's something the program became associated with. But, I find it hard to believe that many people, who know anything about Georgetown, really think we are in any way an HBCU. You say, "High school and AAU coaches who will torpedo us. Parents who will not consider us." Well, there's no indication that these people are considering us now, either. Relationships with the local DC area programs are not exactly in great shape. So how would getting rid of Ewing make this worse? |
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Jan 11, 2023 10:41:53 GMT -5
I am not saying getting rid of Ewing will make it worse; I am saying it is a mess for any new coach to deal with.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Jan 11, 2023 10:48:53 GMT -5
There is tons of relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III, and Patrick that will stay with the program for years. High school and AAU coaches who will torpedo us. Parents who will not consider us. Recruits in certain parts of the country who still believe GU is a HBCU (there are many here in North Carolina, sadly). And remnants of the lack of NCAA success for years and recent landslide. Certainly, a good coach can overcome that baggage. But it will be there, and it will take time. In all seriousness, what "relational baggage attached to Big John, Esh to some extent, III and Patrick" are you talking about? Are you hinting that there are a bunch of people loyal to those guys that won't send players to Georgetown in the future under a different coach? Who are those "high school and AAU coaches", why would they do that, and how will they "torpedo us"? I hate to break it to you, but we don't have very good relationships with most local high school and AAU coaches as is. We have had a terrible lack of success recruiting locally - nobody is delivering players to us. If you're talking about regional or national programs (the IMG Acacemys of the world), how could they send us fewer prospects than they're sending us now? What are these loyalties to the Thompson/Ewing folks getting us today? We've recruited a team of mercenaries through the portal and our high school recruiting appears to be dead in the water due to the team's performance, we've lost 27 straight Big East games - so how could it get any worse? Hoyaboya- we are in agreement that the relationships with coaches and recruiting sources is in shambles. My point is that those issues are something a new coach will inherit. If the idea is that a new coach somehow clears the slate, I disagree with that vehemently. I think it will be a slow thaw over the course of years or perhaps a decade or more. |
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alleninxis
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by alleninxis on Jan 11, 2023 10:50:19 GMT -5
Anyone still loyal to Pat, Ronny or anyone inside of this program is part of the problem and is a group that we do not need to associate with anymore.
Anyone who has an issue with this program breaking free at this point - I have to consider they have an agenda of their own, or they are simply not very intelligent when it comes to the matters of a Division I program. If they want to take their ball and run home, good riddance.
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by hoya9797 on Jan 11, 2023 11:10:18 GMT -5
If there is a change, we need a coach who wants to be at GU, period, baggage and all. Even if there are widescale changes, there will be baggage. We need someone who embraces that and has no fear. there is change?! What else do you need to see? Consecutive 0-fer seasons are not enough? This is only year 6. hoyalove4ever thinks a coach needs at least 8 years before he can be properly evaluated. |
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