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Post by trillesthoya on Jan 6, 2023 15:14:03 GMT -5
Agree about Amaker and Nickleberry, but it would be very Hoya-ish to throw some bucks at soon to be 59-year-old James Jones of Yale. He's had a recent run of success and brings an "academic pedigree." I am absolutely not endorsing this, but the guy might be ready for a pay day as he nears 60. Plus he only lost to Butler by 10 on the road. If I had to bet money today, he's the one I'd bet on. He is the most anodyne possible hire. He's objectively a better basketball coach than Ewing, nobody can argue that. He's coming from Yale, and I imagine in most cases when Georgetown is able to hire someone away from Yale it's a coup. For that reason it will go over well with the academic-types DeGioia hangs out with, and he can talk up in the press conference how Jones understands recruiting successful "student athletes" to a demanding academic institution etc. And because Jones is black, JD will be insulated from any criticism that might come from handing over the program to a white guy (I don't need a reminder on Esherick and not trying to be provocative on this point, just saying that we all know there are going to be some people who will be loudly critical if the next head coach is white). It's a nice, safe hire for Jack who nobody can really criticize too much in the short-term, and in the longer-term JD will have retired and it'll be somebody else's problem. Will recruits be lining up to play for James Jones? Will he grab headlines or win the press conference? Does he have any NIL experience? Probably not to all of the above. But he's a very very safe pick that at the very beginning will shield JD from criticism from the basketball-minded people, the academics, the DEI-focused, and pretty much every major constituency that's watching the hire closely. And that's what I think someone like him is going to want. The constituency you’re missing is the donors. If we have the money to pay Ewing’s buyout, it’s because the big ticket donors actually want to win and win big. They’re the ones that will ultimately guide the next hire imo, and I highly doubt anyone takes James Jones as an exciting hire. The importance of academics to the hire is pretty irrelevant to the admin as evidenced by the way we bent over backwards to try to make things work under Ewing and what has happened to our student athletes in the program the last six years. |
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3xhoya
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Post by 3xhoya on Jan 6, 2023 15:31:25 GMT -5
Agree about Amaker and Nickleberry, but it would be very Hoya-ish to throw some bucks at soon to be 59-year-old James Jones of Yale. He's had a recent run of success and brings an "academic pedigree." I am absolutely not endorsing this, but the guy might be ready for a pay day as he nears 60. Plus he only lost to Butler by 10 on the road. If I had to bet money today, he's the one I'd bet on. He is the most anodyne possible hire. He's objectively a better basketball coach than Ewing, nobody can argue that. He's coming from Yale, and I imagine in most cases when Georgetown is able to hire someone away from Yale it's a coup. For that reason it will go over well with the academic-types DeGioia hangs out with, and he can talk up in the press conference how Jones understands recruiting successful "student athletes" to a demanding academic institution etc. And because Jones is black, JD will be insulated from any criticism that might come from handing over the program to a white guy (I don't need a reminder on Esherick and not trying to be provocative on this point, just saying that we all know there are going to be some people who will be loudly critical if the next head coach is white). It's a nice, safe hire for Jack who nobody can really criticize too much in the short-term, and in the longer-term JD will have retired and it'll be somebody else's problem. Will recruits be lining up to play for James Jones? Will he grab headlines or win the press conference? Does he have any NIL experience? Probably not to all of the above. But he's a very very safe pick that at the very beginning will shield JD from criticism from the basketball-minded people, the academics, the DEI-focused, and pretty much every major constituency that's watching the hire closely. And that's what I think someone like him is going to want. This is why the university as a whole needs new leadership. A new hire isn’t about Jack getting a pat on the back from every group out there. It should be about reestablishing ourselves as a national program. The safe pick is never going to get the results you want. A true leader has vision and takes a risk. |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 6, 2023 15:43:04 GMT -5
As useless as the administration has been lately, I think even they would have to recognize that Amaker or Nickelberry would be terrible hires. If it's true the donors are starting to put pressure on Jack, then I think even he knows he needs to get this right as far as the next head coach is concerned. We need a big time coach, who is as good a sure thing as you can get. We can't hire some mediocre guy with the hope that things turn out well, because that is exactly what has put us in this position (and I don't think Ewing is mediocre for the record, I think it's painfully obvious he's a poor coach at the college level). The program is losing fans, even die-hard ones at a rapid rate from what I'm seeing. The team is setting records for extremely poor play. The grapevine seems to be reporting that donors won't put up with this anymore, and if you lose the donors, then there's a whole other problem to deal with. I think Jack HAS to be smart enough to realize that his needs to be fixed, and it needs to be gutted from the coach, to Ronny and I'm sure countless others (BILL HOWZE ANYONE!?). If he's not smart enough to realize that, and hires Amaker while keeping Ronny in his current job, then he can fall on his own sword. If his decision is to continue hiring Ronny's cronies, then it's highly likely this program goes completely down the tubes, and the remaining fans will have no choice but to leave. I truly believe the future of the program is at stake here. Agree about Amaker and Nickleberry, but it would be very Hoya-ish to throw some bucks at soon to be 59-year-old James Jones of Yale. He's had a recent run of success and brings an "academic pedigree." I am absolutely not endorsing this, but the guy might be ready for a pay day as he nears 60. Plus he only lost to Butler by 10 on the road. Yes, please.. |
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 6, 2023 17:04:27 GMT -5
If I had to bet money today, he's the one I'd bet on. He is the most anodyne possible hire. He's objectively a better basketball coach than Ewing, nobody can argue that. He's coming from Yale, and I imagine in most cases when Georgetown is able to hire someone away from Yale it's a coup. For that reason it will go over well with the academic-types DeGioia hangs out with, and he can talk up in the press conference how Jones understands recruiting successful "student athletes" to a demanding academic institution etc. And because Jones is black, JD will be insulated from any criticism that might come from handing over the program to a white guy (I don't need a reminder on Esherick and not trying to be provocative on this point, just saying that we all know there are going to be some people who will be loudly critical if the next head coach is white). It's a nice, safe hire for Jack who nobody can really criticize too much in the short-term, and in the longer-term JD will have retired and it'll be somebody else's problem. Will recruits be lining up to play for James Jones? Will he grab headlines or win the press conference? Does he have any NIL experience? Probably not to all of the above. But he's a very very safe pick that at the very beginning will shield JD from criticism from the basketball-minded people, the academics, the DEI-focused, and pretty much every major constituency that's watching the hire closely. And that's what I think someone like him is going to want. The constituency you’re missing is the donors. If we have the money to pay Ewing’s buyout, it’s because the big ticket donors actually want to win and win big. They’re the ones that will ultimately guide the next hire imo, and I highly doubt anyone takes James Jones as an exciting hire. The importance of academics to the hire is pretty irrelevant to the admin as evidenced by the way we bent over backwards to try to make things work under Ewing and what has happened to our student athletes in the program the last six years. Agree with the above comments and I don't think James Jones at all satisifies the "basketball-minded people" RB mentions, even though he does satisfy the other constituencies. If JD hires James Jones and St. John's hires Pitino, JD will have lost his entire base of basketball donors. |
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Post by hsaxon on Jan 6, 2023 17:49:48 GMT -5
The idea that Chris Beard could even be in the mix is insane because of the charges leveled at him. It doesn't matter what "has been proven" at this point. If full facts come out showing that Beard did not engage in abuse, then there will be plenty of chance for him to get another job as a college coach. But, it's way too premature for that now. I feel like it is crazy I even need to say this. And by the way, in reference to what the good professorhoya said about Pitino, I've looked at some articles analyzing the Texas opening, and some of them do not even mention Pitino. It is not impossible, but I don't see Pitino landing in Texas. You asked who is comparable to Pitino in terms of “win now” Beard is really the only other one from a coaching standpoint. For the reasons I mentioned, especially his friendship and mentorship of Ewing, the chances of Pitino coming here are less than 1%. Beard has no options and can’t even get a TV gig so more likely to grab the best thing he can get. Even if that means coming to Georgetown. Realistically if there’s a change it’s going to end up being Nickleberry, Ronnie or some mediocre no name Coach (Dave Leitao type). And you will be completely disillusioned and demoralized. That’s the danger in going all in on Pitino a guy who is least likely to come here. Are you serious re Ronnie?
And it will not be Nickleberry.
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Jan 6, 2023 18:09:20 GMT -5
I firmly believe that JD would never have hired JT2. Not a risk taker.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 6, 2023 19:43:39 GMT -5
I firmly believe that JD would never have hired JT2. Not a risk taker. He hired PE Bigs, he's definitely a risk taker |
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Jan 6, 2023 21:35:18 GMT -5
The constituency you’re missing is the donors. If we have the money to pay Ewing’s buyout, it’s because the big ticket donors actually want to win and win big. They’re the ones that will ultimately guide the next hire imo, and I highly doubt anyone takes James Jones as an exciting hire. The importance of academics to the hire is pretty irrelevant to the admin as evidenced by the way we bent over backwards to try to make things work under Ewing and what has happened to our student athletes in the program the last six years. Agree with the above comments and I don't think James Jones at all satisifies the "basketball-minded people" RB mentions, even though he does satisfy the other constituencies. If JD hires James Jones and St. John's hires Pitino, JD will have lost his entire base of basketball donors. To be clear I do not think the basketball minded people would be thrilled with Jones. I wouldn't be. But I also don't think there'd be tremendous uproar if he was the choice. If for one reason or another we cannot get an A-lister (Pitino, Cooley, others currently coaching at high majors) he's somewhere in the next group along with guys like McCasland and ahead of guys like Amaker, English or Mike Jones. I think most of the basketball people would say "He wouldn't have been my choice, but I'll see how it plays out for a couple years." Which is perfect for DeGioia. And of course I hope trillesthoya is right and the same donors facilitating the buyout are guiding the decision making for the next hire and are preparing us to land a big fish. But I feel like every fan base wants and expects a big fish when they have a job opening, and most schools don't have the resources or the clout to pull it off. So I am readying myself for that possibility, though I hope you are right. |
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Post by BeantownHoya on Jan 6, 2023 21:59:51 GMT -5
Agree with the above comments and I don't think James Jones at all satisifies the "basketball-minded people" RB mentions, even though he does satisfy the other constituencies. If JD hires James Jones and St. John's hires Pitino, JD will have lost his entire base of basketball donors. To be clear I do not think the basketball minded people would be thrilled with Jones. I wouldn't be. But I also don't think there'd be tremendous uproar if he was the choice. If for one reason or another we cannot get an A-lister (Pitino, Cooley, others currently coaching at high majors) he's somewhere in the next group along with guys like McCasland and ahead of guys like Amaker, English or Mike Jones. I think most of the basketball people would say "He wouldn't have been my choice, but I'll see how it plays out for a couple years." Which is perfect for DeGioia. And of course I hope trillesthoya is right and the same donors facilitating the buyout are guiding the decision making for the next hire and are preparing us to land a big fish. But I feel like every fan base wants and expects a big fish when they have a job opening, and most schools don't have the resources or the clout to pull it off. So I am readying myself for that possibility, though I hope you are right. The crazy thing is...say it's a guy like J Jones...maybe he's not a home run...but Ewing is so awful that anyone similar to Jones will immediately feel like a grand slam... |
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BSM
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Post by BSM on Jan 6, 2023 22:02:30 GMT -5
If not Pitino then hire * a young coach with (at least) mid major head coaching experience * who likes his team to play end to end, and * who has a swagger (an edge) to him * has no existing ties to Georgetown University. Pat Kelsey if we're making phone calls? |
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alleninxis
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Post by alleninxis on Jan 6, 2023 22:25:27 GMT -5
He'd be an obvious choice for any program looking for a young, energetic hire - but he is a special kind of jackass. Can not see it being a personality fit at all.
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vv83
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Post by vv83 on Jan 6, 2023 22:35:23 GMT -5
He'd be an obvious choice for any program looking for a young, energetic hire - but he is a special kind of jackass. Can not see it being a personality fit at all. "Special kind of jackass" - love that description. Really captures a certain kind of coaching personality |
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hoyaguy
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Post by hoyaguy on Jan 6, 2023 23:46:18 GMT -5
He'd be an obvious choice for any program looking for a young, energetic hire - but he is a special kind of jackass. Can not see it being a personality fit at all. He has been successful which also wouldn't be a fit with this administration (also successful as an assistant to good teams at Wake and Xavier). If he is the kind of jackass that won't tolerate someone like Ronny Thompson meddling, then I am on board. He broke the good kind of records after reviving Winthrop (2nd most conference wins all time) and is now taking College of Charleston on the war path in his second season to their first tournament since 2018. If we aren't going to go with the obvious option (Pitino) then my vote might be him and Mccasland because I can't imagine other established coaches willing to leave P6 programs to fix this and might as well go for broke if it's either them or an Ivy League coach |
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hoya9797
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Post by hoya9797 on Jan 7, 2023 17:23:07 GMT -5
Can you imagine, in a billion years, Pat Ewing doing anything like this? And, if he did, what would he even say?
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Jan 7, 2023 18:39:59 GMT -5
Can you imagine, in a billion years, Pat Ewing doing anything like this? And, if he did, what would he even say? There is a reason why Pat was never hired as a head coach. He just doesn’t have the capacity. He’s 60 now, he’s is what he is. |
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CTHoya08
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Post by CTHoya08 on Jan 7, 2023 20:43:24 GMT -5
Can you imagine, in a billion years, Pat Ewing doing anything like this? And, if he did, what would he even say? MOVE REBOUND |
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smokeyjack
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Post by smokeyjack on Jan 7, 2023 22:24:16 GMT -5
To be clear I do not think the basketball minded people would be thrilled with Jones. I wouldn't be. But I also don't think there'd be tremendous uproar if he was the choice. If for one reason or another we cannot get an A-lister (Pitino, Cooley, others currently coaching at high majors) he's somewhere in the next group along with guys like McCasland and ahead of guys like Amaker, English or Mike Jones. I think most of the basketball people would say "He wouldn't have been my choice, but I'll see how it plays out for a couple years." Which is perfect for DeGioia. And of course I hope trillesthoya is right and the same donors facilitating the buyout are guiding the decision making for the next hire and are preparing us to land a big fish. But I feel like every fan base wants and expects a big fish when they have a job opening, and most schools don't have the resources or the clout to pull it off. So I am readying myself for that possibility, though I hope you are right. The crazy thing is...say it's a guy like J Jones...maybe he's not a home run...but Ewing is so awful that anyone similar to Jones will immediately feel like a grand slam... 💯- anybody but Pat. Anybody. He’s literally the single worst coach in D1 presently…and maybe ever. Let that sink in. Name me anyone ever who has done less with his level of decent to very good talent. My dog would do as well. It’s beyond embarrassing at this point. He’s a punchline…as is GU and all of us as alums by association. It’s outrageously unacceptable. |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 8, 2023 0:34:02 GMT -5
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Jan 8, 2023 0:48:14 GMT -5
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nbhoya
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Post by nbhoya on Jan 8, 2023 16:58:55 GMT -5
Agree about Amaker and Nickleberry, but it would be very Hoya-ish to throw some bucks at soon to be 59-year-old James Jones of Yale. He's had a recent run of success and brings an "academic pedigree." I am absolutely not endorsing this, but the guy might be ready for a pay day as he nears 60. Plus he only lost to Butler by 10 on the road. If I had to bet money today, he's the one I'd bet on. He is the most anodyne possible hire. He's objectively a better basketball coach than Ewing, nobody can argue that. He's coming from Yale, and I imagine in most cases when Georgetown is able to hire someone away from Yale it's a coup. For that reason it will go over well with the academic-types DeGioia hangs out with, and he can talk up in the press conference how Jones understands recruiting successful "student athletes" to a demanding academic institution etc. And because Jones is black, JD will be insulated from any criticism that might come from handing over the program to a white guy (I don't need a reminder on Esherick and not trying to be provocative on this point, just saying that we all know there are going to be some people who will be loudly critical if the next head coach is white). It's a nice, safe hire for Jack who nobody can really criticize too much in the short-term, and in the longer-term JD will have retired and it'll be somebody else's problem. Will recruits be lining up to play for James Jones? Will he grab headlines or win the press conference? Does he have any NIL experience? Probably not to all of the above. But he's a very very safe pick that at the very beginning will shield JD from criticism from the basketball-minded people, the academics, the DEI-focused, and pretty much every major constituency that's watching the hire closely. And that's what I think someone like him is going to want. Do people really think that handing the keys of the basketball program of a predominantly white institution to a white coach would result in blowback? |
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