SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 24, 2023 10:14:40 GMT -5
I really like Dusty May and did even before his team was in the Elite 8. Florida Atlantic was nothing before he was there and he has built them into a pretty special team this year. Plus he's only 46 and learned from Bobby Knight, how do you not like that? It's a small sample but my intuition is that he'll be a good one. Interested to see if PSU gives him a look. FAU is going to the AAC next year, so offers like Temple, GMU, USF etc. don't seem like they'd be enough to lure him, it'd have to be a high major. All that said, I agree with seaweed's post above. He might be a really good coach, so might be Shrewsbury, McCasland and many others. We do not need to constantly point out every possible way to look at every coach in the country as better than ours. We hired him, he has not coached a game yet, let's see how he does. None of us knows for sure whether Ed Cooley or Dusty May or anyone else will be viewed as the superior coach 5 or 10 years from now, so just let it unfold. Yes. The college basketball landscape is not exactly devoid of coaches who made runs in the tournament only to never be seen again, even in better recruiting environments. Neither Shaka Smart nor Jim Larranaga have made it back to a Final Four -- and Shaka's been a tournament underperformer ever since despite being in very good situations. |
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 24, 2023 10:16:17 GMT -5
I really like Dusty May and did even before his team was in the Elite 8. Florida Atlantic was nothing before he was there and he has built them into a pretty special team this year. Plus he's only 46 and learned from Bobby Knight, how do you not like that? It's a small sample but my intuition is that he'll be a good one. Interested to see if PSU gives him a look. FAU is going to the AAC next year, so offers like Temple, GMU, USF etc. don't seem like they'd be enough to lure him, it'd have to be a high major. All that said, I agree with seaweed's post above. He might be a really good coach, so might be Shrewsbury, McCasland and many others. We do not need to constantly point out every possible way to look at every coach in the country as better than ours. We hired him, he has not coached a game yet, let's see how he does. None of us knows for sure whether Ed Cooley or Dusty May or anyone else will be viewed as the superior coach 5 or 10 years from now, so just let it unfold. You have to wonder if teams like Syracuse (Autry) and Providence (English) are happy that they rushed to hire their new coaches before seeing how things in the Tournament played out. It's not like other high major programs were banging down those guys' doors so they had to get them in immediately. A Dusty May hire would look a lot more attractive than those guys, based on resumes. But I agree, I expect Penn State will come after May, but he will have the opporunity to be choosy. Would Florida-based teams with old coaches like Florida State or even Miami look to move on if they could bring in May? As for your Cooley/May points, I didn't say anything about their futures and how they are going to do, it's pretty obvious none of us know that. All I pointed out is that May has his FAU team ranked higher in KenPom than any of Ed Cooley's teams in Cooley's 17 seasons of being head coach. May probably already has negotiated to go to a certain school. Not sure whose left but it would be naive to think schools are only gonna contact him after he is eliminated |
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 24, 2023 10:19:36 GMT -5
I really like Dusty May and did even before his team was in the Elite 8. Florida Atlantic was nothing before he was there and he has built them into a pretty special team this year. Plus he's only 46 and learned from Bobby Knight, how do you not like that? It's a small sample but my intuition is that he'll be a good one. Interested to see if PSU gives him a look. FAU is going to the AAC next year, so offers like Temple, GMU, USF etc. don't seem like they'd be enough to lure him, it'd have to be a high major. All that said, I agree with seaweed's post above. He might be a really good coach, so might be Shrewsbury, McCasland and many others. We do not need to constantly point out every possible way to look at every coach in the country as better than ours. We hired him, he has not coached a game yet, let's see how he does. None of us knows for sure whether Ed Cooley or Dusty May or anyone else will be viewed as the superior coach 5 or 10 years from now, so just let it unfold. Yes. The college basketball landscape is not exactly devoid of coaches who made runs in the tournament only to never be seen again, even in better recruiting environments. Neither Shaka Smart nor Jim Larranaga have made it back to a Final Four -- and Shaka's been a tournament underperformer ever since despite being in very good situations. Shakas only done it with Anthony Grants guys. If they hadn’t won their conference tourney he would have been gone that season. Kind of like when Coughlin and the Giants were falling apart and Shockey was being a cancer in the lockerroom. Coughlin would have been canned but they were able to keep Shokey away from the team ( injury iirc) and then they went on to beat “the greatest team ever” and win the Super Bowl. |
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hoyaboya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by hoyaboya on Mar 24, 2023 10:42:59 GMT -5
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 24, 2023 10:56:00 GMT -5
Napollo Clown Search Committee |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Mar 24, 2023 11:00:59 GMT -5
Yes. The college basketball landscape is not exactly devoid of coaches who made runs in the tournament only to never be seen again, even in better recruiting environments. Neither Shaka Smart nor Jim Larranaga have made it back to a Final Four -- and Shaka's been a tournament underperformer ever since despite being in very good situations. Shakas only done it with Anthony Grants guys. If they hadn’t won their conference tourney he would have been gone that season. Kind of like when Coughlin and the Giants were falling apart and Shockey was being a cancer in the lockerroom. Coughlin would have been canned but they were able to keep Shokey away from the team ( injury iirc) and then they went on to beat “the greatest team ever” and win the Super Bowl. It is interesting to think of an alternative scenario where Chris Wright doesn't break his hand and Georgetown beats VCU in the first round in 2011. Would Shaka Smart's career look a lot different? Since he stayed at VCU for several years after and is a good coach, probably not - but the Final Four definitely jump-started interest in him. |
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,143
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Post by RBHoya on Mar 24, 2023 11:04:54 GMT -5
As for your Cooley/May points, I didn't say anything about their futures and how they are going to do, it's pretty obvious none of us know that. All I pointed out is that May has his FAU team ranked higher in KenPom than any of Ed Cooley's teams in Cooley's 17 seasons of being head coach. Right, except you're not "just pointing it out". There was no reason to make that point except for the fact that you want to take every chance you can possibly get to tell us how every other candidate can be viewed as better than Cooley. We get it, he isn't the hire you wanted. We ALL get it. There is no point in constantly comparing everybody else's resume to Ed Cooley's. Ed's career record is 0-0 right now as far as I'm concerned, because I couldn't give two sh!ts less what he did at PC and certainly not what he was doing at Fairfield in 2006. There is no scenario where we are going to rescind our hire of EC and call up May or Mack or anyone else who you might like better. So just accept reality. It is totally possible to say good things about guys like May without framing everything in the context of "Here's how this person is better than Ed Cooley. Here's how this person compares to Ed Cooley on KenPom. Here's how many times this person has been to the Sweet 16 compared to Ed Cooley." We all know that's what you're doing, and regardless of what anybody thinks of the Cooley hire, it's annoying to everyone. There is no point in comparing anymore. The hire is made, no turning back. |
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SDHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,376
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Post by SDHoya on Mar 24, 2023 11:24:07 GMT -5
I really like Dusty May and did even before his team was in the Elite 8. Florida Atlantic was nothing before he was there and he has built them into a pretty special team this year. Plus he's only 46 and learned from Bobby Knight, how do you not like that? It's a small sample but my intuition is that he'll be a good one. Interested to see if PSU gives him a look. FAU is going to the AAC next year, so offers like Temple, GMU, USF etc. don't seem like they'd be enough to lure him, it'd have to be a high major. All that said, I agree with seaweed's post above. He might be a really good coach, so might be Shrewsbury, McCasland and many others. We do not need to constantly point out every possible way to look at every coach in the country as better than ours. We hired him, he has not coached a game yet, let's see how he does. None of us knows for sure whether Ed Cooley or Dusty May or anyone else will be viewed as the superior coach 5 or 10 years from now, so just let it unfold. Yes. The college basketball landscape is not exactly devoid of coaches who made runs in the tournament only to never be seen again, even in better recruiting environments. Neither Shaka Smart nor Jim Larranaga have made it back to a Final Four -- and Shaka's been a tournament underperformer ever since despite being in very good situations. Not sure I would say Shaka and Larranaga are great examples of guys who made deep runs "never to be seen again". Fair to say that Shaka has underperformed in the Tournament (although he has consistently gotten his teams at least that far), but Larranaga took over a Miami team that hadn't been to the second weekend of the NCAA tournament in over a decade, and has since gotten them to four Sweet Sixteens and one (could well be two later today) Elite Eight. That being said, I agree with the general sentiment that an isolated Cinderella run does not necessarily predict that coach's future high major success. The tournament is a bit of a crap shoot, which is what makes it so fun and so maddening. |
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DanMcQ
Moderator 
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 24, 2023 11:29:53 GMT -5
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 24, 2023 12:18:21 GMT -5
Yes. The college basketball landscape is not exactly devoid of coaches who made runs in the tournament only to never be seen again, even in better recruiting environments. Neither Shaka Smart nor Jim Larranaga have made it back to a Final Four -- and Shaka's been a tournament underperformer ever since despite being in very good situations. Not sure I would say Shaka and Larranaga are great examples of guys who made deep runs "never to be seen again". Fair to say that Shaka has underperformed in the Tournament (although he has consistently gotten his teams at least that far), but Larranaga took over a Miami team that hadn't been to the second weekend of the NCAA tournament in over a decade, and has since gotten them to four Sweet Sixteens and one (could well be two later today) Elite Eight. That being said, I agree with the general sentiment that an isolated Cinderella run does not necessarily predict that coach's future high major success. The tournament is a bit of a crap shoot, which is what makes it so fun and so maddening. Shaka certainly is a better example, but I'm just pointing out that despite much better situations, neither has ever been back. This seems relevant in light of the current argument that the coach of FDU is clearly better now than any coach who hasn't been to an Elite Eight, purely by definition. The NCAA tournament is a ton of fun, but let's not pretend a deep run in the NCAA tourney means continued NCAA success at that level. There's a list miles long. Elite eights and final four runs come mostly in two versions: supremely talented teams and amazing runs where everything comes together. This guy may be a great coach, but an Elite Eight run is hardly a sure thing. |
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kghoya
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,071
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Post by kghoya on Mar 24, 2023 20:14:21 GMT -5
Shakas only done it with Anthony Grants guys. If they hadn’t won their conference tourney he would have been gone that season. Kind of like when Coughlin and the Giants were falling apart and Shockey was being a cancer in the lockerroom. Coughlin would have been canned but they were able to keep Shokey away from the team ( injury iirc) and then they went on to beat “the greatest team ever” and win the Super Bowl. It is interesting to think of an alternative scenario where Chris Wright doesn't break his hand and Georgetown beats VCU in the first round in 2011. Would Shaka Smart's career look a lot different? Since he stayed at VCU for several years after and is a good coach, probably not - but the Final Four definitely jump-started interest in him. In this hypothetical of an injury free Chris Wright, the Hoyas aren't a 6 seed so VCU would have to play someone else |
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 26, 2023 0:23:19 GMT -5
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Post by Lethal_Interjection on Mar 26, 2023 13:56:33 GMT -5
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
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Post by the_way on Mar 26, 2023 14:15:54 GMT -5
Jerome Tang is that dude. That is respect. Love the way his K-state team played. |
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 26, 2023 14:17:21 GMT -5
Dustin May a lot better imo |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Mar 26, 2023 20:35:44 GMT -5
If true, I hope this officially starts his retirement as an HC.
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,930
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Post by DFW HOYA on Mar 26, 2023 20:48:31 GMT -5
If true, I hope this officially starts his retirement as an HC. He signed the contract 23 years ago. I'll give him that. |
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playtyler
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 250
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Post by playtyler on Mar 26, 2023 21:25:09 GMT -5
I really like Dusty May and did even before his team was in the Elite 8. Florida Atlantic was nothing before he was there and he has built them into a pretty special team this year. Plus he's only 46 and learned from Bobby Knight, how do you not like that? It's a small sample but my intuition is that he'll be a good one. Interested to see if PSU gives him a look. FAU is going to the AAC next year, so offers like Temple, GMU, USF etc. don't seem like they'd be enough to lure him, it'd have to be a high major. All that said, I agree with seaweed's post above. He might be a really good coach, so might be Shrewsbury, McCasland and many others. We do not need to constantly point out every possible way to look at every coach in the country as better than ours. We hired him, he has not coached a game yet, let's see how he does. None of us knows for sure whether Ed Cooley or Dusty May or anyone else will be viewed as the superior coach 5 or 10 years from now, so just let it unfold. Yes. The college basketball landscape is not exactly devoid of coaches who made runs in the tournament only to never be seen again, even in better recruiting environments. Neither Shaka Smart nor Jim Larranaga have made it back to a Final Four -- and Shaka's been a tournament underperformer ever since despite being in very good situations. This didn't age well at all. I missed this post. If I had seen it I would have pointed out that Miami had been to the sweet 16 one time ever before Larranaga and now have been to four sweet 16s in last twelve years, back to back elite 8s and now a final four. Shaka has Marquette ranked in the Top 10 for much of the year this year. There are some outliers (Kevin Ollie, Frank Martin to name a few recent ones). But I think Larranaga and Smart are two the best coaches in college basketball right now. |
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 26, 2023 21:39:20 GMT -5
Yes. The college basketball landscape is not exactly devoid of coaches who made runs in the tournament only to never be seen again, even in better recruiting environments. Neither Shaka Smart nor Jim Larranaga have made it back to a Final Four -- and Shaka's been a tournament underperformer ever since despite being in very good situations. This didn't age well at all. I missed this post. If I had seen it I would have pointed out that Miami had been to the sweet 16 one time ever before Larranaga and now have been to four sweet 16s in last twelve years, back to back elite 8s and now a final four. Shaka has Marquette ranked in the Top 10 for much of the year this year. There are some outliers (Kevin Ollie, Frank Martin to name a few recent ones). But I think Larranaga and Smart are two the best coaches in college basketball right now. Not at all! But the Shaka Smart part has -- I'm not sure how you rate him as one of the best coaches based on any kind of results. And I think if you looked at the list of those coaches that make runs like this, they don't necessarily go on to dominate in new digs. |
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 26, 2023 21:42:36 GMT -5
If true, I hope this officially starts his retirement as an HC. It would be pretty appalling if he actually didn’t understand that. |
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