prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,658
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Post by prhoya on Feb 28, 2023 14:15:23 GMT -5
Pitino and his assistants have always been able to recruit. A quick perusal of some his past rosters at Providence, Kentucky and Louisville: Jamal Mashburn, Tony Delk, Antoine Walker, Ron Merce, Billy Donovan, Derek Anderson, Russ Smith, Wayne Turner, Francisco Garcia, Nazr Mohammed, Donovan Mitchell, Terrance Williams, Earl Clark, Samardo Samuels, Montrezl Harrell, Peyton Siva, Rodrick Rhodes, Travis Ford, Walter McCarty, Mark Pope, Scott Padgett, Jamaal Magloire, and Edgar Sosa. Almost all of those guys ended up in the NBA. Also, Pitino has been able to build staffs and attract great assistants. Here's a partial list of his some his past assistants: Mick Cronin, Scott Davenport, Billy Donovan, Travis Ford, Marvin Menzies, Richard Pitino, Kareem Richardson, Steve Masiello, Herb Sendek, Tubby Smith, Reggie Theus, Kevin Willard, Sean Woods, Jeff Van Gundy, Jim O' Brien, Herb Sendek, Frank Vogel, Ralph Willard, and Kevin Keatts. In all likelihood, Pitino not only will be able to recruit an all star bench but it's just as likely there's assistant already at Iona who is a strong candidate. Finally, I'd be willing to be that the portals will open if and when Pitino ends up a high major school like Georgetown. The fact of the matter is that recruiting HS players is not as important as it was. Look at Iowa State or Kansas State where a coach arrives and builds a roster through the portal. It's even arguable that a better coach -- i.e. anyone else -- could have taking the Nickelberry All Stars that Georgetown has and turned it into a winning team. I understand when people who don't really pay attention think that Pitino is some shady character ... it's wrong, but I understand it. What is not understandable is the anyone who even casually follows college basketball could think that Pitino can't recruit in any environment. You are bringing up Pitino of lore not current Pitino and his actual reputation with players TODAY. This is my point. Disagree. If there’s a coaching change, our players will be aware of what’s going on. Most probably will enter the portal, but want to wait and see who is our next coach. After this year, I don’t think they will be in high demand. If Pitino comes, then he can have a sit down with each. My bet is that if Pitino is the coach, most will want to stay. Then, it depends on Pitino. Will he have enough scholarships between the kids who want to stay, those he brings from Iona, those he recruited, studs who want to play right away at a brand like Georgetown under Pitino, etc…? The roster will be competitive in no time. |
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saxagael
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,055 
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Post by saxagael on Feb 28, 2023 14:16:52 GMT -5
I agree with you in what Pitino can do. The draw of Pitino with players is important and the last eight years (and particularly six years) is important for players. I don't know what his recruiting book looks like these days, likely decent. Recruiting is about brand and relationship, the second part is most important. Recruiting of players is a 6+ year process usually with top programs talking to coaches when the player is in middle school (coaches / recruiters can't talk to players nor their family directly until after the player's high school freshman season - unless the player is playing up on a high school team and is at a tournament with approved college coaches look in, or the coach is at a game to watch a relative). That long term relationship is key and the coaches recruiting book is essential as that will likely follow the coach(es). That post-St. John's game discussion about what current players and high school players think about schools and coaches from their perspective really hit. A player is (mostly - the new 1 free transfer for players to not sit out changed a lot of things) looking at what will I get from this coach over my four years. The best college programs in the NCAA tournament are almost all programs that have built with four year plans and even red-shirting. Many of the NBA players after the top 10 to 15 come out of these programs with long builds (one and done years have been over for two or three years). This long process is also where age of the coach comes in. I know a couple local players in the DMV who had Boeheim recruit them a few years back and age was an important consideration as they weren't sure about four years with a coach. Pitino is about 8 years younger, but a long term coach and relationship comes up and can be important to players. Pitino has serious lore. But, to players now? Being able to get the right players and over the next 4 to 6 years build the Hoya program back, from a player's perspective? I don't know (not saying he can't, just exactly that I don't know). As an alum and long time Hoya fan, and huge fan of the game, I would love to see a Hoya coach rebuild and have something solid for 10 years or much longer. I want Pitino to teach that coach for at least 4 years. Great answer! Given the ND and Pitio rumors I don't know the Hoyas have a solid Pitino option in front of them. |
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CTHoya08
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Bring back Izzo!
Posts: 2,960
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Post by CTHoya08 on Feb 28, 2023 14:32:55 GMT -5
Pitino is doing very well at Iona. Iona. In the MAAC. Of course his recruiting to Iona—in the MAAC—is not going to be gangbusters. I have full faith that he’d be able to assemble competitive Big East rosters if given a Big East job, and then get the most out of them.
There are legitimate reasons to question whether Pitino is the best choice. Age, past scandals, sure. But I don’t doubt for a second that he’d be able to recruit here.
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daveg023
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,422
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Post by daveg023 on Feb 28, 2023 14:35:10 GMT -5
Don’t want mediocre or unaccomplished coaches. And, yet, your preferred option is more Pat Ewing. Beard nor Wright are realistic options though by any measure. Even Pitino is far from a sure thing for us. So why not put Coach K and Roy Williams on your list too? |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Feb 28, 2023 15:14:19 GMT -5
I want Pitino to teach that coach for at least 4 years. Great answer! Given the ND and Pitio rumors I don't know the Hoyas have a solid Pitino option in front of them. The ACC and South Bend, Indiana do not seem like a natural fit for someone like Pitino, but they do have plenty of money. So I suppose that’d be possible. |
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Post by professorhoya on Feb 28, 2023 15:18:18 GMT -5
Great answer! Given the ND and Pitio rumors I don't know the Hoyas have a solid Pitino option in front of them. The ACC and South Bend, Indiana do not seem like a natural fit for someone like Pitino, but they do have plenty of money. So I suppose that’d be possible. Can’t they still move to the Big 10? Thought there ACC association is just a temporary thing due to pandemic |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Feb 28, 2023 15:26:14 GMT -5
The ACC and South Bend, Indiana do not seem like a natural fit for someone like Pitino, but they do have plenty of money. So I suppose that’d be possible. Can’t they still move to the Big 10? Thought there ACC association is just a temporary thing due to pandemic No, it wasn’t temporary because of the pandemic. They moved basketball to the ACC after 2013 when the old Big East fell apart. They’re still technically independent for football, but have the ACC affiliation otherwise. Pitino said he wouldn’t coach in the Big 10, for what it’s worth. If some people just don’t like Pitino, think he’s too old, or want someone from the Georgetown family, fine, say that. But people trying to pretend like Pitino doesn’t have it, or would get us maximum to .500 are talking nonsense. Pitino has really masterminded a number of turnarounds. Providence skyrocketed under him, he fixed a messy period at Kentucky, he did the same thing at Louisville, and now at Iona. We need a turnaround so why not hire a Hall of Fame coach who has done it, and done it recently? As I’ve said before MAAC has only had 16 teams in the top 100 since 2002 on KenPom and he has two. That’s not a small achievement given that he’s in a one bid conference that is hard to recruit to, and which has little in the way of resources. He’s still got it. |
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,481
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Post by TC on Feb 28, 2023 15:53:40 GMT -5
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Post by professorhoya on Feb 28, 2023 16:09:36 GMT -5
Can’t they still move to the Big 10? Thought there ACC association is just a temporary thing due to pandemic No, it wasn’t temporary because of the pandemic. They moved basketball to the ACC after 2013 when the old Big East fell apart. They’re still technically independent for football, but have the ACC affiliation otherwise. Pitino said he wouldn’t coach in the Big 10, for what it’s worth. If some people just don’t like Pitino, think he’s too old, or want someone from the Georgetown family, fine, say that. But people trying to pretend like Pitino doesn’t have it, or would get us maximum to .500 are talking nonsense. Pitino has really masterminded a number of turnarounds. Providence skyrocketed under him, he fixed a messy period at Kentucky, he did the same thing at Louisville, and now at Iona. We need a turnaround so why not hire a Hall of Fame coach who has done it, and done it recently? As I’ve said before MAAC has only had 16 teams in the top 100 since 2002 on KenPom and he has two. That’s not a small achievement given that he’s in a one bid conference that is hard to recruit to, and which has little in the way of resources. He’s still got it. I could see them leaving if they decide to join the Big 10 in football. Little point in joining the ACCs b level football conference |
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kettlehill
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,202
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Post by kettlehill on Feb 28, 2023 16:14:38 GMT -5
Barry Svrluga had a Q&A re DMV sports at WAPO today. In answer to a question about when will Ewing be fired:
This has to end. I wrote that more than a month ago, but it has been apparent for longer than that. I'd trust Georgetown to do it in a way that doesn't embarrass arguably the greatest player in program history, though I would say that Ewing has seemed defiant. It's clear he cares, and it'll be interesting to see if they're able to quickly and amicably come to a conclusion on the best way to put a bow on his career there.
The question you ask is bedeviling: Who is the right person to bring Georgetown back to national (or even local) prominence? More than that, can it be done?
Tommy Amaker, the current Harvard coach and Fairfax native, makes some sense to me. He grew up here when the Hoyas were in their salad days (though he ended up playing at Duke) and would have a great feel for what the program once was but also has experience coaching at a rigorous academic institution. One thing that seems clear: Whoever's next can't be chosen simply because he has ties to John Thompson Jr. The late coach's imprint can still be felt on the program, and it feels like there needs to be a clean break.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,481
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Post by TC on Feb 28, 2023 16:19:25 GMT -5
Tommy Amaker, the current Harvard coach and Fairfax native, makes some sense to me. He grew up here when the Hoyas were in their salad days (though he ended up playing at Duke) and would have a great feel for what the program once was but also has experience coaching at a rigorous academic institution. One thing that seems clear: Whoever's next can't be chosen simply because he has ties to John Thompson Jr. The late coach's imprint can still be felt on the program, and it feels like there needs to be a clean break. Need a clean break, should choose the guy with the deepest ties to JT Jr and who will continue Ronny's influence. Got it. |
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,675
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Post by guru on Feb 28, 2023 17:01:09 GMT -5
Tommy Amaker, the current Harvard coach and Fairfax native, makes some sense to me. He grew up here when the Hoyas were in their salad days (though he ended up playing at Duke) and would have a great feel for what the program once was but also has experience coaching at a rigorous academic institution. One thing that seems clear: Whoever's next can't be chosen simply because he has ties to John Thompson Jr. The late coach's imprint can still be felt on the program, and it feels like there needs to be a clean break. Need a clean break, should choose the guy with the deepest ties to JT Jr and who will continue Ronny's influence. Got it. Svrluga's a Duke guy, so that may factor into this as well. But his take on Amaker is probably a common one for those not deeply invested in the program. Without knowing all the JT Jr ties, he does have merit (though I'm certainly not in favor of his hiring) |
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,481
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Post by TC on Feb 28, 2023 17:04:03 GMT -5
Svrluga's a Duke guy, so that may factor into this as well. But his take on Amaker is probably a common one for those not deeply invested in the program. Without knowing all the JT Jr ties, he does have merit (though I'm certainly not in favor of his hiring) If Coach K explicitly lobbied against him for the Duke job, why would he be our first choice? |
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thedragon
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Posts: 2,428
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Post by thedragon on Feb 28, 2023 17:12:07 GMT -5
Not on topic - but just happy to see how that takeover of NYC and MSG is going for Cuse and the ACC.
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Post by augustusfinknottle on Feb 28, 2023 17:45:57 GMT -5
Is there any concern that Brey (whom I, for one, most definitely do not want) would be willing to tolerate Ronny and that that would give him an advantage over others? Talk about a lose lose.
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Loyal Hoya
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 555
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Post by Loyal Hoya on Feb 28, 2023 17:59:57 GMT -5
If Cooley is being considered might as well go for Jay Wright. The call should be made for sure. No way he thumbs his nose at Villanova and says yes, though. That would almost be like John Thompson stepping down when he did from Georgetown and then taking the Syracuse job a year later. Or considering a job at UNLV??? |
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Post by professorhoya on Feb 28, 2023 18:00:46 GMT -5
Need a clean break, should choose the guy with the deepest ties to JT Jr and who will continue Ronny's influence. Got it. Svrluga's a Duke guy, so that may factor into this as well. But his take on Amaker is probably a common one for those not deeply invested in the program. Without knowing all the JT Jr ties, he does have merit (though I'm certainly not in favor of his hiring) I’m out, if medicore Tommy Amaker is the next coach. |
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kettlehill
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,202
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Post by kettlehill on Feb 28, 2023 18:49:32 GMT -5
Svrluga says that " this needs to end...." and that it needs to be a "clean break" from the Thompson regime. But then goes on to advocate for Amaker. As has been said above, it just shows that he - like many in the media- really have no clue about the program or the depths to which it has sunk.
Its a pity that the program is so meaningless that no one in the media thinks it worth a real in depth story.
I am so worried that we will end up with a Brey or Amaker or Dawkins: 4 or 5 BE victories a year will look like a turnaround.
As Raf might say- grow some onions Degoia and make a REAL change: Pitino
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Post by augustusfinknottle on Feb 28, 2023 19:07:48 GMT -5
Barry Svrluga had a Q&A re DMV sports at WAPO today. In answer to a question about when will Ewing be fired: This has to end. I wrote that more than a month ago, but it has been apparent for longer than that. I'd trust Georgetown to do it in a way that doesn't embarrass arguably the greatest player in program history, though I would say that Ewing has seemed defiant. It's clear he cares, and it'll be interesting to see if they're able to quickly and amicably come to a conclusion on the best way to put a bow on his career there. The question you ask is bedeviling: Who is the right person to bring Georgetown back to national (or even local) prominence? More than that, can it be done? Tommy Amaker, the current Harvard coach and Fairfax native, makes some sense to me. He grew up here when the Hoyas were in their salad days (though he ended up playing at Duke) and would have a great feel for what the program once was but also has experience coaching at a rigorous academic institution. One thing that seems clear: Whoever's next can't be chosen simply because he has ties to John Thompson Jr. The late coach's imprint can still be felt on the program, and it feels like there needs to be a clean break. Never heard of this guy (Out of the area since graduation) but his take just seems way too influenced by the fact that he’s a local. I wouldn’t put much stock in it. |
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Highsmith
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,490
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Post by Highsmith on Feb 28, 2023 19:13:47 GMT -5
Barry Svrluga had a Q&A re DMV sports at WAPO today. In answer to a question about when will Ewing be fired: This has to end. I wrote that more than a month ago, but it has been apparent for longer than that. I'd trust Georgetown to do it in a way that doesn't embarrass arguably the greatest player in program history, though I would say that Ewing has seemed defiant. It's clear he cares, and it'll be interesting to see if they're able to quickly and amicably come to a conclusion on the best way to put a bow on his career there. The question you ask is bedeviling: Who is the right person to bring Georgetown back to national (or even local) prominence? More than that, can it be done? Tommy Amaker, the current Harvard coach and Fairfax native, makes some sense to me. He grew up here when the Hoyas were in their salad days (though he ended up playing at Duke) and would have a great feel for what the program once was but also has experience coaching at a rigorous academic institution. One thing that seems clear: Whoever's next can't be chosen simply because he has ties to John Thompson Jr. The late coach's imprint can still be felt on the program, and it feels like there needs to be a clean break. Never heard of this guy (Out of the area since graduation) but his take just seems way too influenced by the fact that he’s a local. I wouldn’t put much stock in it. I'd even question his overall college basketball acumen if he is suggesting Amaker for any job. |
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