Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2022 12:34:11 GMT -5
I know this was an unintentional slip, but “get paid nil” (as in “nothing”) made me realize I don’t understand (capital) NIL at all if Don Carey’s getting money. On the one hand, dude seems like he could be a good spokesperson for something, but it’s not like he has even tens of thousands of social media followers. Maybe Under Armor Kevin is just slipping players a few hundred a week. After what we've done this offseason (hire $.05berry from LSU, successfully recruit Murray within a week, try to bring in Brooks, not bring him in when he fails to deliver Ward, offer Ward $200K in NIL before he signed, etc), it's bizarre to me that people keep making the "maybe the difference here is that X team is paying players under the table and cheating and we are not" argument. It's absurd - whatever other teams are doing, we're trying to do it too. UMD is in a better conference, they have a better coach, and organizationally, they care about winning and showed it in their administration's actions last year. Georgetown doesn't care and they demonstrated that clearly last year as well. That's the difference here. Yeah, not really my point. Probably should have finished law school so I could be more articulate. I just meant - what are players like Don Carey really getting in NIL (or what's the "promise" to them)?
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95hoya
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Post by 95hoya on May 14, 2022 13:22:45 GMT -5
Amen. Winning culture, stability, leadership, whatever traits winning programs have, we have none of them. Every other situation looks great in comparison. You know you can change your diaper, right? Apathetic fan bases like ours are why we allow a coach to go winless and keep his job. We can make fun of Maryland fans, they got rid of their coach because their fan base wasn’t happy even though he made the tournament most years. Any other fan base and we have a new coach. Wish more fans were passionate about winning but it clearly isn’t important enough.
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Omega
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Don Carey
May 14, 2022 13:27:07 GMT -5
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Post by Omega on May 14, 2022 13:27:07 GMT -5
You know you can change your diaper, right? Apathetic fan bases like ours are why we allow a coach to go winless and keep his job. We can make fun of Maryland fans, they got rid of their coach because their fan base wasn’t happy even though he made the tournament most years. Any other fan base and we have a new coach. Wish more fans were passionate about winning but it clearly isn’t important enough. 🥱
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on May 14, 2022 14:40:34 GMT -5
No offense, but, we didn't lose Allen Iverson. And, he's not going to a particularly good team. Even so, he'll probably have a lesser role than he did at Georgetown. Regardless, he found a place he felt better suited him. Good luck to Don. He'll be missed. We were 0-20. Is anyone irreplaceable? Nope. Though, I didn't say he wasn't replaceable. Only that he'll be missed for the type of player/representative of the University that he was.
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Elvado
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Don Carey
May 14, 2022 14:50:56 GMT -5
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Post by Elvado on May 14, 2022 14:50:56 GMT -5
We were 0-20. Is anyone irreplaceable? Nope. Though, I didn't say he wasn't replaceable. Only that he'll be missed for the type of player/representative of the University that he was. Did not mean to suggest you did. Just seems like an awful lot of weeping and gnashing of teeth over a guy who was part of that train wreck.
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CTHoya08
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Bring back Izzo!
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Post by CTHoya08 on May 14, 2022 16:23:08 GMT -5
It’s not so much that we’re losing Don Carey qua Don Carey. It’s that for the second year in a row, one of our top guys is leaving to go to Maryland of all places. It sends (or in this case, reinforces) the message that we’re an also-ran in the local pecking order, which stings.
I agree that we probably can afford to lose/replace everyone from the 0-20 roster, and that the depth chart has become crowded at Carey’s position. On the court, this isn’t a huge deal. But the optics of having multiple guys leave for Maryland isn’t good. (And Carey also joins Pickett, Blair, and Bile in opting not to take advantage of the free covid year to play another season at GU.)
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on May 14, 2022 16:23:38 GMT -5
A probably dumb question but how many degrees is Carey getting? Doesn't he have to take a minimum 9-12 credits to be eligible to play?
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on May 14, 2022 17:45:52 GMT -5
Just seems like an awful lot of weeping and gnashing of teeth over a guy who was part of that train wreck. So why keep Dante, Malcolm, Ryan and Riley? Surely they were not better than Don. Any team wants a shooter like Don. In fact, a better program than GU took him. This is simply sour grapes. There’s no way to justify substituting a proven BE player like him for unknowns. But, give creidt to Pat that he didn’t think like that because he said he wanted him back.
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miracles87
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Post by miracles87 on May 14, 2022 17:47:04 GMT -5
You know you can change your diaper, right? Apathetic fan bases like ours are why we allow a coach to go winless and keep his job. We can make fun of Maryland fans, they got rid of their coach because their fan base wasn’t happy even though he made the tournament most years. Any other fan base and we have a new coach. Wish more fans were passionate about winning but it clearly isn’t important enough. We seem to have more that enough “fans” who are passionate about whining. That cannot be the problem.
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conshyhoya
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Post by conshyhoya on May 14, 2022 17:47:41 GMT -5
It’s not so much that we’re losing Don Carey qua Don Carey. It’s that for the second year in a row, one of our top guys is leaving to go to Maryland of all places. It sends (or in this case, reinforces) the message that we’re an also-ran in the local pecking order, which stings. I agree that we probably can afford to lose/replace everyone from the 0-20 roster, and that the depth chart has become crowded at Carey’s position. On the court, this isn’t a huge deal. But the optics of having multiple guys leave for Maryland isn’t good. (And Carey also joins Pickett, Blair, and Bile in opting not to take advantage of the free covid year to play another season at GU.) Pickett, Blair and Bile are all making money now playing. Why would they have stayed? In Pickett's case he clearly made the right choice.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on May 14, 2022 17:55:09 GMT -5
Apathetic fan bases like ours are why we allow a coach to go winless and keep his job. We can make fun of Maryland fans, they got rid of their coach because their fan base wasn’t happy even though he made the tournament most years. Any other fan base and we have a new coach. Wish more fans were passionate about winning but it clearly isn’t important enough. We seem to have more that enough “fans” who are passionate about whining. That cannot be the problem. [insert comic rimshot here]
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miracles87
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Don Carey
May 14, 2022 18:01:43 GMT -5
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Post by miracles87 on May 14, 2022 18:01:43 GMT -5
We seem to have more that enough “fans” who are passionate about whining. That cannot be the problem. [insert comic rimshot here] I’m here all offseason, folks!! [insert disinterested cricket chirps here]
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on May 14, 2022 18:07:14 GMT -5
Apathetic fan bases like ours are why we allow a coach to go winless and keep his job. We can make fun of Maryland fans, they got rid of their coach because their fan base wasn’t happy even though he made the tournament most years. Any other fan base and we have a new coach. Wish more fans were passionate about winning but it clearly isn’t important enough. We seem to have more that enough “fans” who are passionate about whining. That cannot be the problem. There's a difference between whining and ignoring reality. The fact is that, even in this era of NIL and easy transfers, losing your best players is just not that common. Much less losing them to the program across the state line that is supposed to be an archrival (or at least was when people cared). As I've said before, it's easy to explain away any single part of the pattern, but it keeps happening: - Akinjo transfers to Arizona after essentially having freedom to do whatever he wanted in Ewing's system, even when it wasn't to the team's benefit. - McClung is essentially our featured player and leaves for Texas Tech, possibly because of Ewing's comments on McClung and the draft. - Wahab, shortly after Ewing says he could be the best big in the nation, or something to that effect, leaves for Maryland. - Carey, having one more year of eligibility, after being one of the few bright spots on our team last year, decides to go to Maryland (coached by a former Big East coach he's surely familiar with). And, I am not ignoring the other transfers or dismissals who played less (Walker, Sodom, LeBlanc, Carter, Alexander, Clark, Sibley, Holloway, Berger, Beard, Billingsly, King). I am not "whining" about it, but some of you act as though we aren't going to change anything (except swapping Kirby for Nickelberry) and yet somehow, Ewing and company are going to figure it out and turn it around. I really hope I am wrong, but there is essentially no indication that things will turn around. To put on my optimist's cap, I do think it's great that Ewing and Nickelberry got Murray, I also think Akok and Heath are really nice additions. So, I suppose it's nice that we will have them for one year before we have yet another tumultuous off season. But, if we cannot have any continuity going forward, it'll basically be a hamster wheel with the same discussions year after year until DeGioia and company decide to make a real change.
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iowa80
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Post by iowa80 on May 14, 2022 18:21:18 GMT -5
We seem to have more that enough “fans” who are passionate about whining. That cannot be the problem. There's a difference between whining and ignoring reality. The fact is that, even in this era of NIL and easy transfers, losing your best players is just not that common. Much less losing them to the program across the state line that is supposed to be an archrival (or at least was when people cared). As I've said before, it's easy to explain away any single part of the pattern, but it keeps happening: It does keep happening. The problem is that using Don as "yet another example" is a weak case which, to me anyway, appears to be driven by the "blame Pat for absolutely everything" group (not you). I am repeating myself, but Don 1) is on his fourth team in six years and obviously is OK with moving around; 2) has transferred to a hop, skip, and a jump from his hometown; 3) posted an incredibly respectful comment about Pat that went over and beyond what was necessary; 4) is only involved in "losing our captain" because Pat made him our Captain because he elected to stay for another year.I'm not disputing the pattern. You're right. But using Don as a further example is piling on.
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Post by professorhoya on May 15, 2022 0:20:11 GMT -5
Don has gotten more adoration and gooey eyed love in the last week from the anti Ewing-Thompson.crowd then he has in his entire last two year here.
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on May 15, 2022 4:47:55 GMT -5
Don has gotten more adoration and gooey eyed love in the last week from the anti Ewing-Thompson.crowd then he has in his entire last two year here. That a player at Don Carey’s level is getting this much discussion as he moves to his fourth school is proof positive of how far down the well this program has fallen.
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TC
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Post by TC on May 15, 2022 9:06:08 GMT -5
Don has gotten more adoration and gooey eyed love in the last week from the anti Ewing-Thompson.crowd then he has in his entire last two year here. I think it's weird that "it's bad that our best and most experienced player is transferring to another DMV school that is clearly now the area alpha program and has put us in a subordinate position" counts as "adoration and gooey-eyed love", but the homers that buy into the Ewing Cult of Personality will throw any player or standard under the bus in order to try to prop up our Coach and defend whatever new low is the status quo. Go ahead and mock people defending players - it's super weird to me that Ryan Mutombo actually decides to return to this mess and Ewing fans are bashing on him this week. I don't get how bashing on players makes Patrick Ewing look any better. Attack Don Carey for past transfers. Those transfers didn't matter when we brought him in, they didn't matter when he returned last year, but now apparently he's a flaky guy because he may have graduated Georgetown and doesn't want to stay at this mess. Don Carey is replaceable? We didn't replace his production. Unless you consider Brandon Murray the Don Carey replacement, we didn't bring in anyone that is Don Carey's caliber. Jay Heath might be decent, but he's not Don Carey and he may not even be eligible. Attack Don Carey for being older? Not sure anyone happened to see Providence last season, but having experienced, mature, older players actually helps in college basketball. Clear the decks / we need an entirely new team because we were 0-20? We didn't clear the decks whatsoever, three of our four coaches are returnees, and this is a college basketball team that ostensibly is supposed to be about education and graduating kids, not a company that was a hostile takeover by Carl Icahn. Don Carey isn't an NBA player / doesn't have huge upside? Who cares? We're rooting for a college basketball team, not an NBA team, and older players that don't have NBA upside win conference championships every year. I would rather have a winning program where no one gets drafted than a 0-20 program where one player sniffs the league barely.
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Post by FromTheBeginning on May 15, 2022 9:17:34 GMT -5
I love and respect what DC gave us over the last 2 years but the reality is that college basketball has become a business of rotatable replaceable parts. That’s just the way it is now. We get most excited about getting a 4-5 star recruit whose highest success level is that he’s good enough to be gone after one year.
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Post by trillesthoya on May 15, 2022 9:35:26 GMT -5
Don has gotten more adoration and gooey eyed love in the last week from the anti Ewing-Thompson.crowd then he has in his entire last two year here. I think it's weird that "it's bad that our best and most experienced player is transferring to another DMV school that is clearly now the area alpha program and has put us in a subordinate position" counts as "adoration and gooey-eyed love", but the homers that buy into the Ewing Cult of Personality will throw any player or standard under the bus in order to try to prop up our Coach and defend whatever new low is the status quo. Go ahead and mock people defending players - it's super weird to me that Ryan Mutombo actually decides to return to this mess and Ewing fans are bashing on him this week. I don't get how bashing on players makes Patrick Ewing look any better. Attack Don Carey for past transfers. Those transfers didn't matter when we brought him in, they didn't matter when he returned last year, but now apparently he's a flaky guy because he may have graduated Georgetown and doesn't want to stay at this mess. Don Carey is replaceable? We didn't replace his production. Unless you consider Brandon Murray the Don Carey replacement, we didn't bring in anyone that is Don Carey's caliber. Jay Heath might be decent, but he's not Don Carey and he may not even be eligible. Attack Don Carey for being older? Not sure anyone happened to see Providence last season, but having experienced, mature, older players actually helps in college basketball. Clear the decks / we need an entirely new team because we were 0-20? We didn't clear the decks whatsoever, three of our four coaches are returnees, and this is a college basketball team that ostensibly is supposed to be about education and graduating kids, not a company that was a hostile takeover by Carl Icahn. Don Carey isn't an NBA player / doesn't have huge upside? Who cares? We're rooting for a college basketball team, not an NBA team, and older players that don't have NBA upside win conference championships every year. I would rather have a winning program where no one gets drafted than a 0-20 program where one player sniffs the league barely. You’re wrong about Heath. He put up almost 15 ppg in the ACC. Admittedly on a terrible BC team but Don couldn’t score that much as the number one option in the BE. They’re basically a trade for one another, and I actually like Heath’s defense more. The eligibility point is valid, but I doubt the kid would transfer if he didn’t feel he had a solid shot at being immediately eligible. Carey may have been a good shooter and overall our most efficient player but he was extremely limited offensively and was meh on defense outside of a solid stretch to end the season. I’m not sweating the loss of the captain of an 0-20 team.
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bigskyhoya
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Don Carey
May 15, 2022 9:37:53 GMT -5
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Post by bigskyhoya on May 15, 2022 9:37:53 GMT -5
We seem to have more that enough “fans” who are passionate about whining. That cannot be the problem. There's a difference between whining and ignoring reality. The fact is that, even in this era of NIL and easy transfers, losing your best players is just not that common. Much less losing them to the program across the state line that is supposed to be an archrival (or at least was when people cared). As I've said before, it's easy to explain away any single part of the pattern, but it keeps happening: - Akinjo transfers to Arizona after essentially having freedom to do whatever he wanted in Ewing's system, even when it wasn't to the team's benefit. - McClung is essentially our featured player and leaves for Texas Tech, possibly because of Ewing's comments on McClung and the draft. - Wahab, shortly after Ewing says he could be the best big in the nation, or something to that effect, leaves for Maryland. - Carey, having one more year of eligibility, after being one of the few bright spots on our team last year, decides to go to Maryland (coached by a former Big East coach he's surely familiar with). And, I am not ignoring the other transfers or dismissals who played less (Walker, Sodom, LeBlanc, Carter, Alexander, Clark, Sibley, Holloway, Berger, Beard, Billingsly, King). I am not "whining" about it, but some of you act as though we aren't going to change anything (except swapping Kirby for Nickelberry) and yet somehow, Ewing and company are going to figure it out and turn it around. I really hope I am wrong, but there is essentially no indication that things will turn around. To put on my optimist's cap, I do think it's great that Ewing and Nickelberry got Murray, I also think Akok and Heath are really nice additions. So, I suppose it's nice that we will have them for one year before we have yet another tumultuous off season. But, if we cannot have any continuity going forward, it'll basically be a hamster wheel with the same discussions year after year until DeGioia and company decide to make a real change. Although you often come off as priggish this post strikes the right balance. As many here do, I watch in amazement as the Blindly Defend Ewing crowd has lowered the limbo bar to the point that no failure is attributable to the head coach.
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