TC
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Post by TC on Feb 26, 2020 22:36:56 GMT -5
The Red Panda jinx continues.
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This Just In
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Bold Prediction: The Hoyas will win at least 1 BE game in 2023.
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Post by This Just In on Feb 26, 2020 22:37:29 GMT -5
Another uncontested 3pt shot by Marquette
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Feb 26, 2020 22:37:36 GMT -5
Sweet, we got some Azinge. And Donny Marshall is officially annoying.
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saxagael
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Post by saxagael on Feb 26, 2020 22:40:45 GMT -5
Whew. No big injuries.
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thedragon
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Post by thedragon on Feb 26, 2020 22:45:53 GMT -5
Clearly we had no shot at winning this game from the start, but I don’t think PE even gave this team a chance. No idea why he takes a timeout a minute into the game at 4-0 when it is clear we’ll need to use TO’s to give our only 5 players a breather later. And then tries to go full court pressure when we have no bench. Speeding this game up played right into Marquette’s hands. I disagree. The timeout down 4 - 0 was to try to ward off getting down big early, AGAIN. It didnt end up mattering but I like the timeout. And the press is to try to force turnovers and get easy baskets. Without Mac and Yurt there isnt anyone who can create their own shot very well or run the offense to consistently in the post. Even with tired bodies, any chance of winning is in transition, not the halfcourt. Its depressing to watch. And the attrition is demoralizing. But putting any blame on Ewings tactics in this one seems ridiculous to me.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on Feb 26, 2020 22:46:09 GMT -5
Clearly we had no shot at winning this game from the start, but I don’t think PE even gave this team a chance. No idea why he takes a timeout a minute into the game at 4-0 when it is clear we’ll need to use TO’s to give our only 5 players a breather later. And then tries to go full court pressure when we have no bench. Speeding this game up played right into Marquette’s hands. Speeding up the game was the only thing that cut the lead twice though. I think we scored more than 20 points off turnovers today. If we hadn't pressed we would have lost by even more (prob down 20+ at the half). Right now, with such a tiny rotation that features exactly one forward (and one who has underachieved significantly) and no shooters, we need guys to have career nights every night to win a game. It's a shame, but it is what it is right now.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on Feb 26, 2020 22:46:46 GMT -5
Clearly we had no shot at winning this game from the start, but I don’t think PE even gave this team a chance. No idea why he takes a timeout a minute into the game at 4-0 when it is clear we’ll need to use TO’s to give our only 5 players a breather later. And then tries to go full court pressure when we have no bench. Speeding this game up played right into Marquette’s hands. I disagree. The timeout down 4 - 0 was to try to ward off getting down big early, AGAIN. It didnt end up mattering but I like the timeout. And the press is to try to force turnovers and get easy baskets. Without Mac and Yurt there isnt anyone who can create their own shot very well or run the offense to consistently in the post. Even with tired bodies, any chance of winning is in transition, not the halfcourt. Its depressing to watch. And the attrition is demoralizing. But putting any blame on Ewings tactics in this one seems ridiculous to me. Spot on.
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mdtd
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Post by mdtd on Feb 26, 2020 22:55:30 GMT -5
Ever since we had Patrick Ewing BE Coach of the Year conversations, the team has been losing. There is only one way to change this. I think you know where this is going...
Patrick Ewing is the worst coach in America. So selfish. He only cares about himself. And he has never had any offensive success. This team has been so bad for three years and it is all his fault. Has anyone even improved? I think he should be fired today. This team has never even shown a glimpse of hope. It's as if he gave up on his team. If there was an award for BE Worst Coach of the Millennium, Patrick Ewing should get that. Worst Coach of the Decade, Year, Century, Millennium and any other time term he's been the worst. A butterfly would be a better basketball coach.
Now, I think we're on the right track. 3-0 finish. Because of the players, of course, not coaching *wink wink*.
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kbones17
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Post by kbones17 on Feb 26, 2020 22:56:05 GMT -5
I disagree. The timeout down 4 - 0 was to try to ward off getting down big early, AGAIN. It didnt end up mattering but I like the timeout. And the press is to try to force turnovers and get easy baskets. Without Mac and Yurt there isnt anyone who can create their own shot very well or run the offense to consistently in the post. Even with tired bodies, any chance of winning is in transition, not the halfcourt. Its depressing to watch. And the attrition is demoralizing. But putting any blame on Ewings tactics in this one seems ridiculous to me. Spot on. Agree to disagree. I am fine with trying press in spurts, but we stayed with it way too long. Marquette is a guard heavy team that loves playing fast and jacking up threes. We played right into their hands with the press. If we try that against Creighton we will lose by 50.
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Post by wisconsinhoya on Feb 26, 2020 22:57:20 GMT -5
Does anyone think we will win another game this year? Even St Johns on weds at the BET has not been kind to us over the recent past. Assuming Mac is done for the year..... The simple answer is no. However, there is a possibility of beating a bad Xavier team at home this weekend. Next week at Creighton could be an embarrassing loss when you consider what that margin could be. Don't see us beating Villanova at home to end the regular season. We are at such an alarming talent disparity, that we need a lot of help from the opponent to keep a game close so that we have a chance to steal a win.
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 26, 2020 23:01:06 GMT -5
The worse takeaway from tonight's game was how weak our bigs looked. Granted they weren't expected to do much this year but they looked really lost in the paint both offensively and defensively. I expected more from them after a year of PE coaching. Where's the meanery?
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Post by RockawayHoya on Feb 26, 2020 23:03:12 GMT -5
Team is out of gas. We may not have won regardless tonight, but thought the game wasn't managed well by the staff at all. We were able to beat Butler by being efficient in a slow paced game. Keep turnovers down, limit possessions, use the press sparingly but in short spurts, and be smart about managing energy reserves with key timeouts to buy rest and stop momentum shifts. Ewing was extremely poor with the timeout usage tonight: needlessly burned one at the 18 min mark down 4-0. Then, with Pickett cramping early in the 2nd half, refused to burn one even though he had three and allowed a 12 pt deficit to balloon to 18 in a blink of an eye and eventually 24 before calling one after he would have gotten one at the U12.
The other killer by Ewing: continuing to press until basically the 2 min mark of the 2nd half, mostly still with 3-4 starters on the floor. Down 25 with 8 to go, you aren't coming back and there's no difference in losing by 30 vs. 40. I would've been fine playing the walk-ons and Timmy once the game was out of reach just to maybe at least conserve some legs for Sunday.
Said it at halftime: I think Cooley provided the book on how to defend Georgetown the rest of the way in that 2nd Providence game, and the good teams with smart coaches are going to do the same: crowd shooters and don't help, force guards to dribble drive and finish tough floaters in traffic, and allow Pickett to challenge your frontline at the rim because odds are, he won't be efficient enough to make a difference. At this point, given how poorly we are shooting contested 2's, we are almost better off shooting contested 3's even though we aren't a great perimeter shooting team.
Tough pill to swallow because I do think for the most part, our guys are giving maximum effort and doing what they can. But again, I'm not sure the staff gets a pass tonight for simply getting their guys to play hard. They need to do a much better job of putting their guys in positions to succeed with a better plan to conserve energy and get better shots. Trying to turn games into a track meet is literally the worst thing we can do right now as shorthanded as we are. There was no plan B tonight for how to get our shooters open, and save for a press that worked for awhile until we completely tired out, there weren't really any adjustments made the entire game.
Obviously it's win out or go home, and with the upcoming gauntlet, the chances are next to zero. But I would still like to see a little bit more from the staff on the in-game side of things. They made some baby strides the past 2-3 weeks, but nothing more than that. It can't just be breaking out an occasional zone and calling it a day. I'll save the rest of the program approach stuff for the other thread and another day.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on Feb 26, 2020 23:07:25 GMT -5
The worse takeaway from tonight's game was how weak our bigs looked. Granted they weren't expected to do much this year but they looked really lost in the paint both offensively and defensively. I expected more from them after a year of PE coaching. Where's the meanery? Eh, I saw a few good things, but it looked like Ighoefe backed off after he got a horrible goaltend call and 2 phantom fouls. He needs footwork help more than meanery, I think, and he has to stop hedging so hard, because he NEVER recovers in time. Wahab showed things in spurts, and I think he could develop into a good Big East center, just not one who would be a focal point, which is fine with me. Once the game was blown open, they both played a little indifferently, or tired, or both. I think it's much more important to get a solid PF who can shoot it a little, and wings who can shoot it very well. I think Wahab and Ighoefe could be more than adequate supporting pieces.
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kbones17
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Post by kbones17 on Feb 26, 2020 23:08:10 GMT -5
Team is out of gas. We may not have won regardless tonight, but thought the game wasn't managed well by the staff at all. We were able to beat Butler by being efficient in a slow paced game. Keep turnovers down, limit possessions, use the press sparingly but in short spurts, and be smart about managing energy reserves with key timeouts to buy rest and stop momentum shifts. Ewing was extremely poor with the timeout usage tonight: needlessly burned one at the 18 min mark down 4-0. Then, with Pickett cramping early in the 2nd half, refused to burn one even though he had three and allowed a 12 pt deficit to balloon to 18 in a blink of an eye and eventually 24 before calling one after he would have gotten one at the U12. The other killer by Ewing: continuing to press until basically the 2 min mark of the 2nd half, mostly still with 3-4 starters on the floor. Down 25 with 8 to go, you aren't coming back and there's no difference in losing by 30 vs. 40. I would've been fine playing the walk-ons and Timmy once the game was out of reach just to maybe at least conserve some legs for Sunday. Said it at halftime: I think Cooley provided the book on how to defend Georgetown the rest of the way in that 2nd Providence game, and the good teams with smart coaches are going to do the same: crowd shooters and don't help, force guards to dribble drive and finish tough floaters in traffic, and allow Pickett to challenge your frontline at the rim because odds are, he won't be efficient enough to make a difference. At this point, given how poorly we are shooting contested 2's, we are almost better off shooting contested 3's even though we aren't a great perimeter shooting team. Tough pill to swallow because I do think for the most part, our guys are giving maximum effort and doing what they can. But again, I'm not sure the staff gets a pass tonight for simply getting their guys to play hard. They need to do a much better job of putting their guys in positions to succeed with a better plan to conserve energy and get better shots. Trying to turn games into a track meet is literally the worst thing we can do right now as shorthanded as we are. There was no plan B tonight for how to get our shooters open, and save for a press that worked for awhile until we completely tired out, there weren't really any adjustments made the entire game. Obviously it's win out or go home, and with the upcoming gauntlet, the chances are next to zero. But I would still like to see a little bit more from the staff on the in-game side of things. They made some baby strides the past 2-3 weeks, but nothing more than that. It can't just be breaking out an occasional zone and calling it a day. I'll save the rest of the program approach stuff for the other thread and another day. Well put. I agree with everything in this post.
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,401
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Post by SaxaCD on Feb 26, 2020 23:12:32 GMT -5
Team is out of gas. We may not have won regardless tonight, but thought the game wasn't managed well by the staff at all. We were able to beat Butler by being efficient in a slow paced game. Keep turnovers down, limit possessions, use the press sparingly but in short spurts, and be smart about managing energy reserves with key timeouts to buy rest and stop momentum shifts. Ewing was extremely poor with the timeout usage tonight: needlessly burned one at the 18 min mark down 4-0. Then, with Pickett cramping early in the 2nd half, refused to burn one even though he had three and allowed a 12 pt deficit to balloon to 18 in a blink of an eye and eventually 24 before calling one after he would have gotten one at the U12. The other killer by Ewing: continuing to press until basically the 2 min mark of the 2nd half, mostly still with 3-4 starters on the floor. Down 25 with 8 to go, you aren't coming back and there's no difference in losing by 30 vs. 40. I would've been fine playing the walk-ons and Timmy once the game was out of reach just to maybe at least conserve some legs for Sunday. Said it at halftime: I think Cooley provided the book on how to defend Georgetown the rest of the way in that 2nd Providence game, and the good teams with smart coaches are going to do the same: crowd shooters and don't help, force guards to dribble drive and finish tough floaters in traffic, and allow Pickett to challenge your frontline at the rim because odds are, he won't be efficient enough to make a difference. At this point, given how poorly we are shooting contested 2's, we are almost better off shooting contested 3's even though we aren't a great perimeter shooting team. Tough pill to swallow because I do think for the most part, our guys are giving maximum effort and doing what they can. But again, I'm not sure the staff gets a pass tonight for simply getting their guys to play hard. They need to do a much better job of putting their guys in positions to succeed with a better plan to conserve energy and get better shots. Trying to turn games into a track meet is literally the worst thing we can do right now as shorthanded as we are. There was no plan B tonight for how to get our shooters open, and save for a press that worked for awhile until we completely tired out, there weren't really any adjustments made the entire game. Obviously it's win out or go home, and with the upcoming gauntlet, the chances are next to zero. But I would still like to see a little bit more from the staff on the in-game side of things. They made some baby strides the past 2-3 weeks, but nothing more than that. It can't just be breaking out an occasional zone and calling it a day. I'll save the rest of the program approach stuff for the other thread and another day. Well put. I agree with everything in this post. I will agree to disagree
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Post by centercourt400s on Feb 26, 2020 23:13:42 GMT -5
If future fully manned teams can keep up this effort level, the sky is the limit.
Anyone posting negatives about this game and this team needs to take a long hard look at themselves in the mirror.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 26, 2020 23:17:17 GMT -5
When you are undermanned you have to make every shot count. Keep the ball moving and hit the open man. We must have taken a dozen or more off balance floaters that missed or were blocked.
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thedragon
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Post by thedragon on Feb 26, 2020 23:23:23 GMT -5
Team is out of gas. We may not have won regardless tonight, but thought the game wasn't managed well by the staff at all. We were able to beat Butler by being efficient in a slow paced game. Keep turnovers down, limit possessions, use the press sparingly but in short spurts, and be smart about managing energy reserves with key timeouts to buy rest and stop momentum shifts. Ewing was extremely poor with the timeout usage tonight: needlessly burned one at the 18 min mark down 4-0. Then, with Pickett cramping early in the 2nd half, refused to burn one even though he had three and allowed a 12 pt deficit to balloon to 18 in a blink of an eye and eventually 24 before calling one after he would have gotten one at the U12. The other killer by Ewing: continuing to press until basically the 2 min mark of the 2nd half, mostly still with 3-4 starters on the floor. Down 25 with 8 to go, you aren't coming back and there's no difference in losing by 30 vs. 40. I would've been fine playing the walk-ons and Timmy once the game was out of reach just to maybe at least conserve some legs for Sunday. Said it at halftime: I think Cooley provided the book on how to defend Georgetown the rest of the way in that 2nd Providence game, and the good teams with smart coaches are going to do the same: crowd shooters and don't help, force guards to dribble drive and finish tough floaters in traffic, and allow Pickett to challenge your frontline at the rim because odds are, he won't be efficient enough to make a difference. At this point, given how poorly we are shooting contested 2's, we are almost better off shooting contested 3's even though we aren't a great perimeter shooting team. Tough pill to swallow because I do think for the most part, our guys are giving maximum effort and doing what they can. But again, I'm not sure the staff gets a pass tonight for simply getting their guys to play hard. They need to do a much better job of putting their guys in positions to succeed with a better plan to conserve energy and get better shots. Trying to turn games into a track meet is literally the worst thing we can do right now as shorthanded as we are. There was no plan B tonight for how to get our shooters open, and save for a press that worked for awhile until we completely tired out, there weren't really any adjustments made the entire game. Obviously it's win out or go home, and with the upcoming gauntlet, the chances are next to zero. But I would still like to see a little bit more from the staff on the in-game side of things. They made some baby strides the past 2-3 weeks, but nothing more than that. It can't just be breaking out an occasional zone and calling it a day. I'll save the rest of the program approach stuff for the other thread and another day. I appreciate your posts and knowledge. But as kbones said above, agree to disagree. On almost everything you said. Lol. But seriously, plan B? We have 6 non walk ons that can play. One of which had played 10 minutes total prior to the Big East. And Ewing has said for a while that it's about instilling a culture. Having the guys press and compete no matter the score will never be something I criticize. Blair had a horrid offensive game - yet, when he was on the floor in the last 2 minutes with Jaden, Muresan, Azinge, and Tim - he was pressing and recovering as hard as he was late in the 1st half when Gtown was making a push. This is a guy that took plays off all the time earlier in his career even when playing only limited minutes. I dont give the staff a pass on the attrition that has us in this position. But I have been wildly impressed with the staff in how they've kept this team together and even pulled out some surprising wins while missing Akinjo, Leblanc, Mac, Yurt. Think about that - if any of us had said the day before game 1 that we would be playing a large portion of our season without those 4 guys, every single person on this board would have never expected us to win a single game, let alone be competitive in most. Maybe its rose colored glasses on my part, but I have been around the periphery of basketball at different levels for many years - and the blood the staff is getting out of this turnip should be commended, not criticized.
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SaxaCD
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Post by SaxaCD on Feb 26, 2020 23:29:02 GMT -5
If future fully manned teams can keep up this effort level, the sky is the limit. Anyone posting negatives about this game and this team needs to take a long hard look at themselves in the mirror. I think as fans sometimes we dive into the micro and ignore the macro -- even before the game, the in studio guys were talking about how hard the team was playing but how it looked like we were running out of gas because of all the forced minutes AND lack of two highest scorers. Sometimes it's easier to see the obvious from a bit more distance. I still think we have a chance to win a game before it's lights out, but we will need a good helping of luck and some career games from guys with lots of mileage on the tires. But I totally agree -- this level of effort with a more fully filled out team (say, LeBlanc and Gardner on this squad), and we'd be talking in much different terms today. I hope the staff can pull a few recruiting coups, although our last two pulls seem to be really good gets. Need some flat-out shooters, or to develop some. Ewing & Co have changed the culture significantly in terms of playing with heart and effort.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Feb 26, 2020 23:34:47 GMT -5
Team is out of gas. We may not have won regardless tonight, but thought the game wasn't managed well by the staff at all. We were able to beat Butler by being efficient in a slow paced game. Keep turnovers down, limit possessions, use the press sparingly but in short spurts, and be smart about managing energy reserves with key timeouts to buy rest and stop momentum shifts. Ewing was extremely poor with the timeout usage tonight: needlessly burned one at the 18 min mark down 4-0. Then, with Pickett cramping early in the 2nd half, refused to burn one even though he had three and allowed a 12 pt deficit to balloon to 18 in a blink of an eye and eventually 24 before calling one after he would have gotten one at the U12. The other killer by Ewing: continuing to press until basically the 2 min mark of the 2nd half, mostly still with 3-4 starters on the floor. Down 25 with 8 to go, you aren't coming back and there's no difference in losing by 30 vs. 40. I would've been fine playing the walk-ons and Timmy once the game was out of reach just to maybe at least conserve some legs for Sunday. Said it at halftime: I think Cooley provided the book on how to defend Georgetown the rest of the way in that 2nd Providence game, and the good teams with smart coaches are going to do the same: crowd shooters and don't help, force guards to dribble drive and finish tough floaters in traffic, and allow Pickett to challenge your frontline at the rim because odds are, he won't be efficient enough to make a difference. At this point, given how poorly we are shooting contested 2's, we are almost better off shooting contested 3's even though we aren't a great perimeter shooting team. Tough pill to swallow because I do think for the most part, our guys are giving maximum effort and doing what they can. But again, I'm not sure the staff gets a pass tonight for simply getting their guys to play hard. They need to do a much better job of putting their guys in positions to succeed with a better plan to conserve energy and get better shots. Trying to turn games into a track meet is literally the worst thing we can do right now as shorthanded as we are. There was no plan B tonight for how to get our shooters open, and save for a press that worked for awhile until we completely tired out, there weren't really any adjustments made the entire game. Obviously it's win out or go home, and with the upcoming gauntlet, the chances are next to zero. But I would still like to see a little bit more from the staff on the in-game side of things. They made some baby strides the past 2-3 weeks, but nothing more than that. It can't just be breaking out an occasional zone and calling it a day. I'll save the rest of the program approach stuff for the other thread and another day. I appreciate your posts and knowledge. But as kbones said above, agree to disagree. On almost everything you said. Lol. But seriously, plan B? We have 6 non walk ons that can play. One of which had played 10 minutes total prior to the Big East. And Ewing has said for a while that it's about instilling a culture. Having the guys press and compete no matter the score will never be something I criticize. Blair had a horrid offensive game - yet, when he was on the floor in the last 2 minutes with Jaden, Muresan, Azinge, and Tim - he was pressing and recovering as hard as he was late in the 1st half when Gtown was making a push. This is a guy that took plays off all the time earlier in his career even when playing only limited minutes. I dont give the staff a pass on the attrition that has us in this position. But I have been wildly impressed with the staff in how they've kept this team together and even pulled out some surprising wins while missing Akinjo, Leblanc, Mac, Yurt. Think about that - if any of us had said the day before game 1 that we would be playing a large portion of our season without those 4 guys, every single person on this board would have never expected us to win a single game, let alone be competitive in most. Maybe its rose colored glasses on my part, but I have been around the periphery of basketball at different levels for many years - and the blood the staff is getting out of this turnip should be commended, not criticized. Actually, KBones agreed with me. Saxa was just mad about criticizing the timeout at 4-0. It's just you who is disagreeing. I remember FLHoya a long time ago remarking that coaches shouldn't be commended for just getting their guys to play hard. That should be a given, and if that's not the case, that's a huge red flag. No doubt Ewing has gotten his guys to play hard and not give up. But I think he's been getting a bit more credit overall for that than he actually deserves. You still have to do other things as well. While I will agree with you that not having the 4 guys (and really, most importantly Akinjo and Leblanc) that left the program hurt the ceiling of this team, this team still had plenty of shots with both Mac and Yurt in the lineup. Even when healthy, on more occasions than not in conference play, one or both of them weren't good enough to get us some wins we should have had. So I don't fully buy the argument that we are doing the best we can with what we have. Maybe the last 2 weeks, sure it's closer to that. But November through beginning of February? Questionable, even with the defections. I appreciate the effort just as much as anyone else. But killing ourselves by pressing the entire 2nd half to lose by 5-10 points less tonight instead of giving ourselves a better chance to win on Sunday just isn't smart. When you're down 10-15 points, that's one thing. When you're down 25-30, that's another story.
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