Hoyas 80 @ Seton Hall 75 Game Discussion

[sleepy]

Jan 18, 2011 21:14:55 GMT -5 JohnJacquesLayup said:

Jan 18, 2011 21:12:29 GMT -5 sleepy said:

You and anyone else who thinks that is a complete idiot. Losing this game and the season would be OVER. OVER. No they aren't playing well and they didn't play well(well I don't think, i didn't get to watch), but they are still alive and in better position than they were just a few hours ago. Game by game, and a win is a freaking win, especially on the road. Jesus, anyone who thinks we should be blowing ANYONE out right now is slightly out of their mind. We have a long way to go and have to get a lot better, so I'll take the wins as we are clearly not there yet.
.

I'll take the "complete idiot" comments to heart from someone who actually watched the game. Until then, go Edited yourself.

You don't get it. It doesn't matter how we played. WE ARE NOT A GOOD TEAM, right now. You don't all of a sudden go from a team that gets blown out by Pitt and Notre Dame and loses to St Johns and at home to WVU to a team that should be expected to blow out Seton Hall on the road. What don't you people get about that? It will take TIME to get better, if we get better at all. And it certainly easier to get better being 3-4 in the Big East than 2-5. So, yes, we SHOULD be happy our season is still alive and that we actually won a game we probably shouldn't have won.
The spread was +4, we won by five, we did what we should have expected us to do

[whatmaroon]

Once again, I'm definitely in the "a win is a win is a win" camp. This team could've easily given up down 7 with 8 to play and said "we're not winning this game," and made that happen. Instead, they kept at it and pulled out a win by, oh btw, the same number of points SUcks won by there.

[Nevada Hoya]

I gather the win was not impressive (reading the last four pages of this thread). One stat that pleased me was our 18 assists, which have been lacking in the past few games. Now if get our D working better...

[JohnJacquesLayup]

Jan 18, 2011 21:20:35 GMT -5 sleepy said:

Jan 18, 2011 21:14:55 GMT -5 JohnJacquesLayup said:

I'll take the "complete idiot" comments to heart from someone who actually watched the game. Until then, go Edited yourself.

You don't get it. It doesn't matter how we played. WE ARE NOT A GOOD TEAM, right now. You don't all of a sudden go from a team that gets blown out by Pitt and Notre Dame and loses to St Johns and at home to WVU to a team that should be expected to blow out Seton Hall on the road. What don't you people get about that? It will take TIME to get better, if we get better at all. And it certainly easier to get better being 3-4 in the Big East than 2-5. So, yes, we SHOULD be happy our season is still alive and that we actually won a game we probably shouldn't have won.

In a weird way, we're saying the same thing. This team is playing terrible ball. But where some can be excited about stealing one from a cellar dweller, the big picture is that we're still not going anywhere. And sorry for the harsh words in my previous response, just overreacted to the "complete idiot" comment.

[tjm62]

The defense is certainly troubling, but we're in a good position to get back to .500 against St. Johns and it will be a whole lot better for team morale during the long layover to come away with the road win against a pesky pirates squad.

[sleepy]

Jan 18, 2011 21:17:13 GMT -5 gunny said:

I will take the win. How about two weeks ago when #3 Pitt was losing to Providence with less than 2 minutes to play at Providence? They ended up winning by 4 and the last time I checked, Providence is 0-6 in Big East play.

Winning on the road is tough. We got two road wins. Be happy and on to St. John's

And didn't they beat the mighty demons of Depaul by 1 on the road? A win is a win is a win. Everyone needs to stop acting like we lost and actually support the team they are supposed to be fans of.

[skyhoya]

For once we didn't get out coached late in the game. The team took advantage of the Hall foul situation. Good move

[bronxhoya87]

our defense is rancid....we need athletes

[sleepy]

Jan 18, 2011 21:24:22 GMT -5 JohnJacquesLayup said:

Jan 18, 2011 21:20:35 GMT -5 sleepy said:

You don't get it. It doesn't matter how we played. WE ARE NOT A GOOD TEAM, right now. You don't all of a sudden go from a team that gets blown out by Pitt and Notre Dame and loses to St Johns and at home to WVU to a team that should be expected to blow out Seton Hall on the road. What don't you people get about that? It will take TIME to get better, if we get better at all. And it certainly easier to get better being 3-4 in the Big East than 2-5. So, yes, we SHOULD be happy our season is still alive and that we actually won a game we probably shouldn't have won.

In a weird way, we're saying the same thing. This team is playing terrible ball. But where some can be excited about stealing one from a cellar dweller, the big picture is that we're still not going anywhere. And sorry for the harsh words in my previous response, just overreacted to the "complete idiot" comment.

Except I don't think we are aren't going anywhere. At the very least this team is showing fight that teams that go no where just don't have. I think people underestimate the power of "mental strength" and momentum in sports sometimes. When you keep surviving, even if its barely, good things can start happening. We just need to keep holding on until we figure out all issues, if we ever do figure them out.

[GUJook97]

Jan 18, 2011 21:20:35 GMT -5 sleepy said:

Jan 18, 2011 21:14:55 GMT -5 JohnJacquesLayup said:

I'll take the "complete idiot" comments to heart from someone who actually watched the game. Until then, go Edited yourself.

You don't get it. It doesn't matter how we played. WE ARE NOT A GOOD TEAM, right now. You don't all of a sudden go from a team that gets blown out by Pitt and Notre Dame and loses to St Johns and at home to WVU to a team that should be expected to blow out Seton Hall on the road. What don't you people get about that? It will take TIME to get better, if we get better at all. And it certainly easier to get better being 3-4 in the Big East than 2-5. So, yes, we SHOULD be happy our season is still alive and that we actually won a game we probably shouldn't have won.
The spread was +4, we won by five, we did what we should have expected us to do

i still say we are a good team on offense. Even though we had 13 TOs, 5 of them were by Lubick and Starks, i think. And, some of them were just flat out unlucky. I think Chris slipped 1 or 2 times. Julian lost the ball going up. At home, that's probably even a foul call. We scored at will down the stretch. We hit FTs.

Obviously, the problem is that when teams have a lead, they can play 25 seconds of offense, and then throw the ball down low and go to the bucket. We just have no answer. We may have to just call up Boeheim and borrow the 2-3

[superan]

Jan 18, 2011 21:30:02 GMT -5 sleepy said:

Jan 18, 2011 21:24:22 GMT -5 JohnJacquesLayup said:

In a weird way, we're saying the same thing. This team is playing terrible ball. But where some can be excited about stealing one from a cellar dweller, the big picture is that we're still not going anywhere. And sorry for the harsh words in my previous response, just overreacted to the "complete idiot" comment.

Except I don't think we are aren't going anywhere. At the very least this team is showing fight that teams that go no where just don't have. I think people underestimate the power of "mental strength" and momentum in sports sometimes. When you keep surviving, even if its barely, good things can start happening. We just need to keep holding on until we figure out all issues, if we ever do figure them out.

Exactly my thoughts. We shot 9-10 from the FT line late. SHU was having a field day in the second half but we forced them into difficult shots late. We drove the basket and got 2 fouls on Herb Pope late in the game to foul him out. We definitely executed well down the stretch.

JTIII was right a couple days ago when he said this team is NOTHING like the '08-'09 team despite the seeming collapse in performance. Our team chemistry is still working and everyone on the team buys in to the system. Winning buys us time to right the ship when it needs to be performing at its peak (March).

[sleepy]

Jan 18, 2011 21:35:04 GMT -5 GUJook97 said:

Jan 18, 2011 21:20:35 GMT -5 sleepy said:

You don't get it. It doesn't matter how we played. WE ARE NOT A GOOD TEAM, right now. You don't all of a sudden go from a team that gets blown out by Pitt and Notre Dame and loses to St Johns and at home to WVU to a team that should be expected to blow out Seton Hall on the road. What don't you people get about that? It will take TIME to get better, if we get better at all. And it certainly easier to get better being 3-4 in the Big East than 2-5. So, yes, we SHOULD be happy our season is still alive and that we actually won a game we probably shouldn't have won.
The spread was +4, we won by five, we did what we should have expected us to do

i still say we are a good team on offense. Even though we had 13 TOs, 5 of them were by Lubick and Starks, i think. And, some of them were just flat out unlucky. I think Chris slipped 1 or 2 times. Julian lost the ball going up. At home, that's probably even a foul call. We scored at will down the stretch. We hit FTs.

Obviously, the problem is that when teams have a lead, they can play 25 seconds of offense, and then throw the ball down low and go to the bucket. We just have no answer. We may have to just call up Boeheim and borrow the 2-3

Oh please no, we have the absolute worst 2-3 in all of basketball. Its scored on 99.9% of the time and in ways 2-3s are NOT supposed to be scored on.

[hoyarooter]

I didn't see the game and don't have time to read through all of these pages, but I would note a couple of things (one of which I suspect has been pointed out a googol of times):

1. We just don't play good defense. We gave up 75 to the team that is last in scoring in the Big East. Now granted, they were without Hazell for a few games, but there is no way that is satisfactory. Did we press at all tonight?

2. I don't know if anyone has pointed this out, but we scored on our last 11 possessions (a couple of those possessions we scored only one point on one of two free throws, but still, no empty trips). That is remarkable with the game on the line, and is a credit to the team's gumption, as is coming back from that 2-19 stretch.

So I agree with Sleepy. This team is far from great, but I'll definitely take this win with a sigh of relief - it just would have been nice to have it wrapped up prior to the last two seconds.

[GUJook97]

Yeah, our 2-3 is bad, too, believe me I know. But, we just cant let players like Robinson and Pope coach the ball on the wing and back in like that. There were a couple of times,where I just thought our best defensive play would be for Freeman to completely leave his player and just double team. Robinson wasn't going to pass.

[BubbleVisionBiff]

Jan 18, 2011 21:36:27 GMT -5 superan said:

Exactly my thoughts. We shot 9-10 from the FT line late. SHU was having a field day in the second half but we forced them into difficult shots late. We drove the basket and got 2 fouls on Herb Pope late in the game to foul him out. We definitely executed well down the stretch.

JTIII was right a couple days ago when he said this team is NOTHING like the '08-'09 team despite the seeming collapse in performance. Our team chemistry is still working and everyone on the team buys in to the system. Winning buys us time to right the ship when it needs to be performing at its peak (March).

March may be too late unless we can win 4 in a row in BET. .500 in BE is looking very difficult.

How Vee gets no time and Moses has seen nothing of the floor is beyond me. How often did we press tonight?

[jld54]

All you can say is that a game is 40 minutes and we got a W. A loss would have been a major problem for may reasons discussed here. A win lets us live another day, and keeps hope alive.

This team is too small to be a top tier team in the BE, and we cannot get away with offense like we do OOC because we are fully scouted by the BE opponents. The team fought back so they are still buying in.

The jury is still out as to whether we can eke out an NCAA bid but a loss tonight would have made it doubtful. A week off may help -- it has already been a long season with the tough OOC schedule. Hopefully the week at home will allow the team to get some rest and regroup.

[PushyGuyFanClub]

To be fair, if you net out the 19-2 run, we played pretty well, particularly with our interior passing, which had been in decline with our guards pounding the ball into the court during the losing streak a la the early season Miami Heat.

Now, that's a pretty big "if," but it was a silly run keyed by quick threes on our part that led to run-outs and easy baskets for them. Coach should have called a time out at some point there, but it is what it is. I think he hopes these guys will learn on the fly...disappointingly we're hoping seniors can learn and get better when they already should be vets.

[GUJook97]

We couldnt press much tonight because Seton Hall was running up the ball pretty quickly, to their credit. We really just have a zone press and it's not going to work if the other team gets the ball to a guard running up the floor pretty quickly.

[wrestlemania]

Jan 18, 2011 21:27:00 GMT -5 bronxhoya87 said:

our defense is rancid....we need athletes

Don't know if rancid is the right word, but you've hit the problem -they are too slow footed, especially on the ball -- I think in the last ten minutes SH scored on about seven or eight straight possessions. Although I thought they rebounded pretty well.

The win is great news (particularly how the seniors played), but Cuse and UConn would have beaten GU by 20 tonight.

[Nevada Hoya]

Arg, I just read the ESPN recap and found out why the fans were complaining: a 10 point lead turned into a seven point deficit, when SHU went 19-2. Oh, my!