The Official Geek Thread

[Boz]

Speaking of Lost, it seems fairly logical, but is Lost the reason we have "white walkers" and not "The Others" in this TV show?

Just wondering if that was ever mentioned in all of the many, many production videos made about this show.

I guess I don't really mind that much. The only thing I'll miss is hearing characters in the show use the fairly common curse from the books: "The Others take you/him/her!"

("White walkers take you!" doesn't seem to have the same ring to it.)

[hoopsmccan]

Apr 18, 2011 13:43:06 GMT -5 Boz said:

Speaking of Lost, it seems fairly logical, but is Lost the reason we have "white walkers" and not "The Others" in this TV show?

Just wondering if that was ever mentioned in all of the many, many production videos made about this show.

I guess I don't really mind that much. The only thing I'll miss is hearing characters in the show use the fairly common curse from the books: "The Others take you/him/her!"

("White walkers take you!" doesn't seem to have the same ring to it.)

Probably. I didn't read much of the buildup to the show, so I didn't see anything about the others vs. white walkers. I know a producer of Lost had a slap fight with Martin, but that was over something else. The name white walkers is pretty lame (I don't recall them even being white on the show), but not a big deal.

hm

[kchoya]

Mar 4, 2011 13:08:59 GMT -5 hoyatables said:

Switching gears -- Feb 10, 2012. Star Wars in 3D. Sadly they are starting with Phantom Menace instead of A New Hope. Who's going to see it? I hate the idea of plunking down more money for the first three episodes, but man, the idea of 3D is too hard to pass up.

And by the time the "classic" trilogy rolls around, it will be worth it.

A little closer in time, I bought front row tickets for 3D Imax Thor today. Not a huge 3d fan, but it was the choices were: 3D Imax, 3D regular screen, or non-3D regular screen. I'd rather see it on Imax, so I went the 3d route.

[FormerHoya]

I feel my geek cred flagging. Has anyone read "The Name of The Wind" or "The Wise Man's Fear" by Patrick Rothfuss? I just finished "Wind" and couldn't put it down.

It reminded me of Tolkein if I didn't secretly hate Tolkien. There goes my cred again.

[rosslynhoya]

Apr 21, 2011 11:35:06 GMT -5 FormerHoya said:

I feel my geek cred flagging. Has anyone read "The Name of The Wind" or "The Wise Man's Fear" by Patrick Rothfuss? I just finished "Wind" and couldn't put it down.

Name of the Wind is truly outstanding. I won't say that it's better than Hobbit/LotR, but it trounces Wheel of Time, Sword of Truth, and Harry Potter without question.

I just finished The Wise Man's Fear last week and was spellbound from beginning to end, although the "action" happens in bursts, leaving the pacing more than a bit uneven. If you only like Kvothe when he's banging skulls together for example, then it won't be as enjoyable for you.

One word of warning: TWMF is one heck of a dense, dense book. I'm seeing more books these days with oversized fonts and larger-than-normal margins, but Rothfuss doesn't use either of these tricks to pad the 1,000 pages or so. It seemingly goes on forever.

[SFHoya99]

I liked both Name of the Wind and Wise Man's Fear, but it's weird to me how the two books don't seem to mesh much for me. For lack of a better term, Name of the Wind was much more realistic -- WMF seems to have a slightly more mythical, fairy tale feel to it - it reads more like a picaresque story like the Labors of Hercules or Huck Finn. I like both, but you can tell he wrote a former at one point and the latter at another.

It's very good, but I hope it's only three volumes. The Kvothe-Denna sequences are starting to go all Richard-Kahlan or everything in WOT. Their dynamic is much more real/mature, but there's too much of it; much like real life, it can get a bit repetitive.

[SFHoya99]

Apr 18, 2011 8:42:01 GMT -5 Boz said:

TV thread or geek thread?

Geek thread or TV thread?

Wherever it should go, I was perfectly happy with last night's premiere. Some minor quibbles (who are these "white walkers" anyway?), but overall it was a strong start.

I won't say much about the acting, but since he is probably one of the most talented actors in the cast, I will say I think Peter Dinklage is playing Tyrion a bit wrong.*

He seems far to happy in his sarcasm, at least initially. His scene with Jon Snow was good though & there was a hint of the anger, resentment and self image issues that are a big part of his character.

Not sure I like the actress playing Cat either. I'm pretty sure she wasn't the first choice for that role. We'll see how she does, but she didn't really impress me out of the gate.

But, as I said, mostly minor quibbles. This series should be a lot of fun.

(*EDIT: In fairness, I was just thinking about this, and realizing that I know far more about Tyrion's character because I've read all the books. I'm trying to remember what my first impressions were of him at this early stage, and maybe Dinklage isn't that far off after all).

Having read the pilot (but will be watching it tonight), Cat seems to be the character most changed from the book. I know they killed the old actress because they didn't like her interpretation, so I'd give Fairley a shot -- just expect some differences.

That kind of goes for the whole thing. This season is very faithful, but if it survives, more and more will get cut. Actors will want to add things, and so will writers and directors. It will diverge more and more while hopefully keeping major plot points and the general feel. The producers have even talked about certain characters who die living longer -- I hope they mean the supporting actors so people don't have to relearn them (like a servant) and not the major ones for marketing reasons. That would kill it.

[whatmaroon]

My general refusal to read series in progress, which has kept/is keeping me away from GRRM/ASOIAF and WoT, was relaxed for Name of the Wind back when Wise Man's Fear was first supposed to come out, and I didn't regret that. It had been a while since I'd enjoyed the pure act of reading as much as I enjoyed Wise Man's Fear. That said, endings are hard and I could easily see the third book being disappointing.

Lord of the Rings was too much travelogue for me. The Hobbit may have been pitched at a more child-friendly level, but it's also a better, more concise story.

[rosslynhoya]

Apr 21, 2011 22:59:11 GMT -5 whatmaroon said:

My general refusal to read series in progress, which has kept/is keeping me away from GRRM/ASOIAF and WoT, was relaxed for Name of the Wind back when Wise Man's Fear was first supposed to come out, and I didn't regret that. It had been a while since I'd enjoyed the pure act of reading as much as I enjoyed Wise Man's Fear. That said, endings are hard and I could easily see the third book being disappointing.

I plunged into ASOIF in 2001, when it was clear that an installment was being released every 2 years on schedule. The fact that George R.R. Martin has gotten away with delivering one half of a volume (Feast for Crows) in the last 11 years defies all belief.

Per SF's comment above, I think the best neutral word to describe A Wise Man's Fear is "episodic" but for me the Adventures of Sinbad or Voyage of the Dawn Treader came to mind more so than the 12 labors of Hercules. There is no real unifying arc to the plot; Kvothe just bounces from task to task for the last 3/5 of the book, with each major plot episode lasting about 100 pages or so.

For what it's worth it almost feels like it was set up for, I don't know, a 13 week mini-series on a premium cable channel.

[Boz]

Interesting geek question, as long as we're on the subject.

(FWIW, I have not read Rothfuss' books, did not know about them; but I devour this type of fiction, and I have a Nook now, so based on the board's discussion, I will probably check it out soon)

Back to the question. What is your favorite epic sci-fi/fantasy series that you have ever read?

I should probably rephrase that. What is your second favorite epic sci-fi/fantasy series that you have ever read. Because if your top choice ISN'T Lord of the Rings, you're probably an idiot.
;D

Just kidding. LOTR certainly is my favorite. I think I've read the books in their entirety more than 25 times. No, seriously. Not to mention all of the supporting materials, such as The Silmarillion.

But after that, I have maybe an unexpected favorite. The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, by Stephen R. Donaldson. I loved that series. It was really my first exposure to a flawed hero as a young reader and it really kind of blew me away. I have only read the first two series, not the third yet, so I can't comment on that, but I loved the first two quite a bit.

I'm actually not going to be on the board today. Going to be visiting a relative in the hospital in Baltimore most of the day (he's going to be OK). But I look forward to reading any responses fellow geeks have to this question. Chances are, you'll mention some things I also have not read and give me some new reading material for the summer.

Good weekend, all!

[rosslynhoya]

Great idea Boz!!! I'll add another small-market favorite - The Coldfire Trilogy by C.S. Friedman is hands-down the second best epic series I've read. It's an SF-Fantasy hybrid a la Anne McCaffrey's Pern novels, where a far, far future Earth colony has lapsed into an Iron Age level of development and is hospitable to dragons/sorcery, but with a totally scientifically plausible basis for their development. The protagonist is a lapsing Jesuit-y warrior-priest in the mode of Damien Karras who is tasked with confronting the world's antichrist figure, who everyone recognizes as the seeming embodiment of pure evil but who might not be such a bad guy after all, particularly after an even more dangerous threat to the human race emerges.

The trilogy consists of Black Sun Rising, When True Night Falls, and Crown of Shadows. All are equally engaging and the conclusion is entirely satisfying. Although I have heard rumors of a potential follow-on trilogy, in my opinion, it's unnecessary.

[nodak89]

is this thread the yin to the old school hip hop yang?

The best I could add to that thread is what is the best weird al parody of hip hop song? amish paradise or all about the pentiums?

[SFHoya99]

General fantasy recommendations:

A Song of Ice and Fire and the Patrick Rothfuss stuff is top-notch. So is Martin's other stuff. The other author I love is China Meiville -- especially Perdido Street Station, Iron Council and The Scar. Meiville is an amazing writer who is absurdly creative in these three books.

Another top-notch guy who kind of ranges around there is Neal Stephenson - Anathem is fantastic (kind of fantasy/sci-fi), and his fantastic historical fiction is very good. Guy Gavriel Kay is very good in the latter vein as well.

In the more light-hearted, sometimes comedic vein -- and easy to read, I love The Lies of Locke Lamora and stuff by Neil Gaiman. I'm also a huge fan of the Harry Dresden books -- they aren't high literature, but they are fun. Brandon Sanderson's Mistborn and Elantris are good as well, if lighter. The first Mistborn is better than the sequels. He's got a new series, Way of Kings which seems pretty good.

There's a series of newer fantasy that is darker and there is some good and bad. If you liked Lost, you may love the Malazan Book of the Fallen series by Stephen Erikson -- some great writing, and huge worldbuilding and creative -- but it rambles and badly needs an editor. People do love it, but I think it's unorganized at times. Still enjoyed it.

The new Scott Bakker series seems pretty okay. I'm not enthralled, though.

If you liked the Thomas Covenant stuff, you'll like KJ Parker's Devices and Desires -- there's no real hero there but it can be fascinating.

I LOVED the setup to David Farland's Runelords but he kind of had two angles -- and he took the one less interesting to me.

[SFHoya99]

Game of Thrones episode two was last night.

There were quite a few highlights -- Maisie Williams as Arya is fantastic, and the direwolves were pretty darn cool. The scene with Ned and Robert was good, as well as the created scene with Cersei and Catelyn. Oh, and the added scene with Jaime and John.

But it's moving too fast. I feel like we are not learning the characters properly and not enough is explicit. The river scene falls a bit flat, although the judgement scene is decent. More problematically is Dany's whole plotline. It's basically just repeated sex scenes and if you don't know the books, I feel like the lesson is that Dany either learns she needs to please her man or she's just horny. You really have to work to understand the motivation intended. Frankly, if I showed that episode to my mom, she'd stop watching forever.

Some of that is sticking too close to the novel, I think. So much of it is internal dialogue -- you need to show that somehow. And it was less clear that it needed to be, IMO. Hopefully, the rest of her storyline gets clearer.

[hoopsmccan]

Apr 25, 2011 14:56:21 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

Game of Thrones episode two was last night.

There were quite a few highlights -- Maisie Williams as Arya is fantastic, and the direwolves were pretty darn cool. The scene with Ned and Robert was good, as well as the created scene with Cersei and Catelyn. Oh, and the added scene with Jaime and John.

But it's moving too fast. I feel like we are not learning the characters properly and not enough is explicit. The river scene falls a bit flat, although the judgement scene is decent. More problematically is Dany's whole plotline. It's basically just repeated sex scenes and if you don't know the books, I feel like the lesson is that Dany either learns she needs to please her man or she's just horny. You really have to work to understand the motivation intended. Frankly, if I showed that episode to my mom, she'd stop watching forever.

Some of that is sticking too close to the novel, I think. So much of it is internal dialogue -- you need to show that somehow. And it was less clear that it needed to be, IMO. Hopefully, the rest of her storyline gets clearer.

Did you like Dany's storyline in the book at the outset? I recall groaning when it was her chapter...not much has changed except some soft core porn is mixed in.

hm

[rosslynhoya]

The bigger shock to me is that they all but flat out said that Jon Snow's mother was a peasant girl named Wyla. Seriously? They dance around this "mystery" throughout the books and it just gets treated as fact in the second episode of the TV series. Very odd.

Bran awakens without the help of the "Crow" dreams. Isn't that essential to really set up his later plotlines? Speaking of which, I don't recall any appearance by the littlest Stark. Has Rickon been written out altogether?

All in all, I am pleasantly surprised by how much of Martin's dialogue has been preserved verbatim. I agree with SF though that the Dany/dothraki scenes are really appearing very shallow compared to the Westeros scenes. I'm also not sure why she's meeting Jorah Mormont for the first time at her wedding (nor why he's so scrawny) .... I suspect there are going to be a lot of liberties taken with her storyline altogether, which should be feasible considering how little interaction she has with the main plot arcs.

[SFHoya99]

I can't honestly remember how I felt about her story at the outset -- it's been too long. But yeah, I can see what you are saying.

I think introspective storylines -- and that one is -- are very tough.

[Boz]

I remember being bewildered as hell at the outset, trying to keep track of everyone's names, relationships and histories.

If I'm honest, I don't think I fully caught up to everything until the war started.

I think they've narrowed that scope sufficiently, and have done a pretty good job with exposition (without giving away things that are best kept for revealing later), but I could definitely see people who are not really familiar with the books being just a bit confused at this point.

[SFHoya99]

Apr 25, 2011 16:44:09 GMT -5 rosslynhoya said:

The bigger shock to me is that they all but flat out said that Jon Snow's mother was a peasant girl named Wyla. Seriously? They dance around this "mystery" throughout the books and it just gets treated as fact in the second episode of the TV series. Very odd.

Wylla's mentioned early in the book as well - though not necessarily a direct Ned verification. It's safe to assume that the mystery in the book is still in the show from what I've read.

Bran awakens without the help of the "Crow" dreams. Isn't that essential to really set up his later plotlines?

I've heard next week's installment begins to deal with Bran's dreams. It's obviously hard to translate to the screen, I think.

Speaking of which, I don't recall any appearance by the littlest Stark. Has Rickon been written out altogether?

Nope, he's been shown in a few scenes and mentioned several times. (Lastly when Robb tells Catelyn that Rickon needs her.)

All in all, I am pleasantly surprised by how much of Martin's dialogue has been preserved verbatim. I agree with SF though that the Dany/dothraki scenes are really appearing very shallow compared to the Westeros scenes. I'm also not sure why she's meeting Jorah Mormont for the first time at her wedding (nor why he's so scrawny) .... I suspect there are going to be a lot of liberties taken with her storyline altogether, which should be feasible considering how little interaction she has with the main plot arcs.

I expect her plotline to start getting better starting right after Vaes Dothrak -- right now it's just kind of set-up.

[whatmaroon]

Apr 22, 2011 21:03:33 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

General fantasy recommendations:

A Song of Ice and Fire and the Patrick Rothfuss stuff is top-notch. So is Martin's other stuff. The other author I love is China Meiville -- especially Perdido Street Station, Iron Council and The Scar. Meiville is an amazing writer who is absurdly creative in these three books.

Another top-notch guy who kind of ranges around there is Neal Stephenson - Anathem is fantastic (kind of fantasy/sci-fi), and his fantastic historical fiction is very good. Guy Gavriel Kay is very good in the latter vein as well.

In the more light-hearted, sometimes comedic vein -- and easy to read, I love The Lies of Locke Lamora and stuff by Neil Gaiman. I'm also a huge fan of the Harry Dresden books -- they aren't high literature, but they are fun. Brandon Sanderson's Mistborn and Elantris are good as well, if lighter. The first Mistborn is better than the sequels. He's got a new series, Way of Kings which seems pretty good.

There's a series of newer fantasy that is darker and there is some good and bad. If you liked Lost, you may love the Malazan Book of the Fallen series by Stephen Erikson -- some great writing, and huge worldbuilding and creative -- but it rambles and badly needs an editor. People do love it, but I think it's unorganized at times. Still enjoyed it.

The new Scott Bakker series seems pretty okay. I'm not enthralled, though.

If you liked the Thomas Covenant stuff, you'll like KJ Parker's Devices and Desires -- there's no real hero there but it can be fascinating.

I LOVED the setup to David Farland's Runelords but he kind of had two angles -- and he took the one less interesting to me.

I have a sort of like/hate relationship with Parker's books. I haven't read her/his latest (The Hammer), but have read Engineer Trilogy and a couple standalones. They've all been ok, but I haven't particularly liked any of them.

I liked the first Locke Lamora book, but hated the second one. (I think my roommate, who I believe is not a HTer, had the same reaction.) It doesn't feel like a true series, more like a series of standalones involving the same characters.

I finished Bakker's first trilogy, Prince of Nothing, over the weekend, and don't see what all the fuss is about. If I read the current trilogy(?) after it's completed, it'll be because I'm really bored and/or have nothing else I want to read.

For some reason I tend to buy Stephenson books then not read them for a couple years, and I've done just that with Anathem. With Reamde coming out this fall, I guess I should finally read it.

Rothfuss's The Princess and Mr. Whiffle is disturbing enough I could've written it, not that I write fiction.

I'm not sure about Sanderson's new Way of Kings series. With all the other stuff he writes, I'm not sure I want to get involved in a 10 book series that may not be completed for 15 years.