on the jt3 is my homeboy....

[kghoya]

i promise to boycott this tee shirt if everybody that is posting on this thread removes their hat during the national anthem...is that fair???

where does it stop? when do we decide what is ok and what isnt ok? i dont know if we can figure that out on this thread

so until we do...keep on living in america and do whatever it is that makes you happy...

[kchoya]

Ron, you're throwing out the race card because you're trying to make race an issue where there is no issue. Your pathetic attempt to make a mountain out of a molehill is what's really sad.

No, I wouldn't walk up to JT3, or JT2, and call him homeboy. I wouldn't call anyone I don't know homeboy, buddy, dude or anything like that, be it the President of the University or the President of the Country. All the times I ran in to JT2 or Esherick at McDonough, I just called them "coach."

I bet if you went up to either JT2 or JT3 with the t-shirt and asked him about it, he'd just laugh it off as a couple of college kids having fun supporting their basketball program. JT2 dealt with real racism, with banner unfurling in the gym and such - I don't think he'd be bothered at all by the t-shirts.

[kchoya]

Since this whole thread is about a stupid t-shirt, I thought i'd post a pic of the front of the shirt and see if the moderators let this one picture stay in the thread:



static.flickr.com/97/269042141_cd4a8c1031.jpg?v=1160804625

[miamihoya]

I honestly find the shirts to just be in good fun. Its a funny takeoff from the orignial jesus shirts. I don't know this as fact, but i'm pretty sure JTII and JTIII would find them humorous, and are probably encouraged by the fact that students now care enough about to program to make t-shirts like these. Would that have happened a couple years ago? Obviously most of us don't know JTIII well enough to call him a "homeboy" to his face, but thats not the point. Its not trying to be racist, its just a tagline. Like someone mentioned, coaches across the country become the face of the program and people make shirts about them. Whether it be Coach K, Joe Pa, or Bobby Bowden, these guys become more than just a person, but a legend and symbol. Why not encourage students to show support for the program and the man who leads it?

[FLHoya]

guhoya2007 said:

hoyasincebirth said:

I really don't see the problem with these shirts. Especially since JTIII bought one himself. They have versions of shirts all over the place starting with The JEsus one's they have the Damon ones, I believe they also made one for Nat burton. I haven't heard complaints about these shirts. They just exprese support of the person on the shirt. I don't see the phrase homboy to be a negative thing. I wouldn't use that phrase to JTIII's face because i don't actually have a close enough reltationship where that would be appropriate.

That being siad they should not be worn at game because of their color but ehy're a great shirt to wear abotu campus or outside of school. I like the father son and hoya spirit on the back as well.

they being FLHoya

I guess that was my cameo appearance in this thread.

For the record, that avatar to your left says NAT BURTON IS MY HOMEBOY. It has been my avatar for over a year now (EDIT: possibly two, i couldn't recall), ever since I came up with the idea of copying the Jesus/Johnny Damon shirts and having my girlfriend make one for me. I've had the shirt since the beginning of last school year, I wear it the night before games for good luck, and I occasionally wear it in public. Never had a single negative comment about it...that's just my personal experience.

I think anyone who knows me or my body of work can probably guess what motivated me to make the shirt. And yes, I spoke to Nat Burton once, and no I didn't call him "homeboy".

I personally find the JT3 shirts clever and I plan to buy one but not wear it at the Verizon Center.

On the subject at hand, I think that the racial aspect may be something of a red herring. Not to deny the importance of language and imagery here, or the racial connotations that may exist (although I confess that it's news to me)...but I think the more relevant issue is the one being discussed about how it relates to the Coach Thompson as an authority figure.

Do I personally think it minimizes Coach Thompson's authority or standing as a respected member of the University community to purchase a shirt? No...in fact I find them to be a clever parody that honors a well-respected and downright adored member of said community. And if he finds them funny, all the better. But I see the argument I guess.

The same issue came up with regard to the Kurt Shirts and the use of the "JT3" chant at games. Does that promote too much of a silly "cult" of the individual? Perhaps...but if you're turned off by silly, then student fandom and college athletics in general probably aren't gonna mesh well with you anyways. It's objectively rather silly to walk around with a "Nat Burton is My Homeboy" t-shirt. But that's the point IMO--sometimes being a fan of a team lets you relax and have fun...long as you don't go overboard I'm cool with that.


An interesting test case comes to mind. I heard an idea earlier this season to make giant posters of the outline of JT3's face, a la a Big Brother, and post them in Red Square. I'm curious how that strikes some people in this thread. On one hand, there's no racial element implicit in the poster. On the other, there's a clear parallel with folks such as Mao Zedong, Stalin, and Che Guevara, to name a few. Would people be wary of "comparing" JT3 to a revolutionary leader or a communist dictator by implication?

Tongue and cheek can go a long way though. A few months ago for my job, I had to work an event for a Conservative youth political action-type group (NOT!! my choice). One of their more popular items were "Viva la Reagan Revolucion" shirts or something to that effect, with the former President in the Che Guevara pose. Clearly most people at the event would find Che Guevara reprehensible...but here they are appropriating an image for the purpose of a little humor. I found it mildly amusing, and I don't think anyone at the event appeared to believe it crossed a line.

At the very least, the mini-controversy has given the shirt-makers a tremendous amount of publicity on Hoyatalk.

[FormerHoya]

Love the high school debate here, well done folks, proud to be a Hoya.

I think the point that everyone is missing is whether anyone would call Jesus their "homeboy" when they met. Unfortunately I will never have that chance (being destined for somewhere far worse for having once laughed at an off-color joke).

[TBird41]

And to hopefully put this debate to rest, I got confirmation last night that JT3 did in fact buy a shirt for his dad.

So I guess him and his dad have no problem with the shirts whatsoever.

[hoyatables]

Race and religion aside, I just don't think its an attractive shirt. Give me the WAG style any day of the week. Besides, the blue strikes me as too bright--it looks more like *gasp* Duke blue. Did we trade in the days of Carolina blue for an even uglier stepsister?

Georgetown's blue is, has, and will always be navy blue.

And what's wrong with simple college grey shirts and "GEORGETOWN" lettering?

As for the substance of this thread. Ron's got a good point, and I think he made it quite well. It isn't whether the shirt is actually offensive in anyway, it is whether those who look at it will "get the joke." Contrary to some suggestions, I don't think there will be any conflicts or altercations (even suggesting such indicates a certain degree of ... well, of something) -- but I suspect that there will be more than a few quizzical looks and laughs at the Georgetown students wearing the shirts.

[StPetersburgHoya (Inactive)]

I'm sorry. Like Stephen Colbert I don't see color - what's the issue here?

[StPetersburgHoya (Inactive)]

Here's a potential solution - in the future replace the phrase "JTIII is my homeboy" with "JTIII: Stuntin' Like My Daddy"

[ZagHoya04]

I like that-- probably exactly what weezy and the birdman had in mind

[heartofahoya]

this is much more entertaining than anything i could possibly be doing at work right now. i don't have an opinion of the shirts (EXCEPT DONT WEAR THEM IN VERIZON! I HAVE SEEN WHAT 007 CAN DO TO YOU!!!!). but i will say this...

during my 52nd minute in line for a gugs burger (about 22 minutes after my 16 year old brother bear-hugged roy and told him that he was his hero), JT3 came out of mcdonough to mingle with the crowd (apostles, if you will). laughing at the shirts, he joked about when he was going to get his cut of the tshirt sales and then took a picture with the guys (or dudes, whichever you prefer) who were the masterminds of the whole operation. he was smiling.

[kchoya]

heartofahoya said:

this is much more entertaining than anything i could possibly be doing at work right now. i don't have an opinion of the shirts (EXCEPT DONT WEAR THEM IN VERIZON! I HAVE SEEN WHAT 007 CAN DO TO YOU!!!!). but i will say this...

during my 52nd minute in line for a gugs burger (about 22 minutes after my 16 year old brother bear-hugged roy and told him that he was his hero), JT3 came out of mcdonough to mingle with the crowd (apostles, if you will). laughing at the shirts, he joked about when he was going to get his cut of the tshirt sales and then took a picture with the guys (or dudes, whichever you prefer) who were the masterminds of the whole operation. he was smiling.

Yeah, but don't you get it? None of that matters. What really counts is the EFFECT these shirts have on ron.

[Deleted]

Zag... is that Stan Gable in your avatar?

[ZagHoya04]

Alpha Betas rule. I've been lurking so long I forgot what my avatar was--haven't posted but a handful of times since the sportsonly board...

[thebin]

Ron at some point you will understand that people who see racism where none exists are actually part of the racism problem, not its solution.

[Gold Hoya]

thebin is back ... this should be good for at least 10 more pages

[Coast2CoastHoya]

I only have one issue in this fight:

ron said:

also, dude started in the 50's and 60s with black guys calling themselves that...not the surfer crowd. my grandmother calls people dudes..and ironically its not in a totally positive light.

Couple little things from the resident Hoyatalk surfer guy (I'll keep my race to myself - the global surfer tribe knows no racial lines):
1) I think it's really funny when people think drumsgobang is being serious.
2) The term "dude" was being used by my grandfather as early as the 30's with his surfing buddies in Orange County and San Diego. I'm pretty sure they used it in the Old West too, albeit in a different context. According to a brief but relatively thorough search, the term "dude" first appeared in print as early as 1877, and appeared in the titles of a silent film in 1893 (Some Dudes Can Fight), and a western in 1933 (The Dude Bandit - interestingly, the "Dude" character is a drunk played by Dean Martin). Closer to my heart, it was used prominently in the original Endless Summer, shot in the late 50's and early 60's, suggesting that use of "dude" was already mainstreamed there. By all accounts from the people I've asked about this -- people who were actually there, by the way -- surfer dudes (at least in So Cal) were calling each other dude long before the 50's or 60's. Kinda puts the whole "you co-opted my cultural terminology and I don't like the way you're using it" argument in a different perspective doesn't it Ron?

C2C
Defending Dudeness Since 1980.

[SFHoya99]

Thank you, Coast to Coast. Dude originally meant pansy or dandy in the 19th century. As Big City easterners came west with their finery, they were called dudes (hence "dude ranches" for tourist ranches).

Essentially, it was a term for metrosexuals, to put it in a modern context. As far as I know, the metrosexual crowd does not get angry with anyone for using it as a term of endearment.

[kghoya]

the history of dudes...that is why this board is great...thanks for the slang lesson guys