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Post by professorhoya on Mar 13, 2023 12:53:34 GMT -5
No doubt he improved Providence and no doubt he'll improve Georgetown - it's impossible not to do so. But you don't pay a contract for Bill Self results when you get Ed Cooley results. Cooley should be thrilled that he's conned Providence into paying him almost $4M/year. To leave, we'd have to pay him at least $1M/year more, wouldn't you think? Plus there might be a buyout to pay as well. Before Kansas brought him in, Bill Self in 3 years at Illinois had gotten two 4 seeds and a 1 seed. He had gotten Tulsa (yes I said that correctly, TULSA) a 7 seed and a 9 seed. We are going to end up paying a guy a very bad contract because he's the most comfortable choice for proven poor decision makers. And if that's the case, I'm not going to financially support the institution anymore. They throw money away just to keep the old way of doing things intact. It's crony capitalism and breach of fiduciary duty. Providence was horrible before Cooley, and now they routinely contend in the NCAA tournament. By all accounts, he's also a good guy, good representative of Providence College, he's great with students/alumni, and he has brought Providence to a level they had not been at for decades. So, in that context, I absolutely think Providence paying Cooley $4 million a year is logical and rational. I don't think it's a "con" because Cooley gave them something they otherwise did not have--and substantially better than what preceded him. Now, I agree that spending all that money on Cooley when a clear better option exists in Pitino, who has no buyout, makes no sense whatsoever. In that sense, I think this "search" process is a joke, and I think DeGioia is doing the university a disservice. If Pitino were out of the picture (staying at Iona, or somewhere else already), I think spending the money on Cooley could be more defensible. As you said, Cooley will make us better, and not just because anybody can. He has a solid track record of getting teams to the NCAA tournament, and frankly, there aren't many coaches out there who do that on a yearly basis who are available. So, in that context, I get giving Cooley a big contract. But, in choosing Cooley over Pitino, will Georgetown spend a LOT more money? Probably, and that doesn't make sense in a rational world. But Jack DeGioia and the administration don't live in that rational world. Why would you give Cooley a lifetime contract. Then you are stuck with him and possibley Frodo forever. This makes no sense especially for people who supposedly dislike the Thompsons influence (and hate Frodo in particular.)
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TC
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Post by TC on Mar 13, 2023 13:05:24 GMT -5
It's Fredo, not Frodo.
Frodo was an uncorruptable force who threw the ring into Mount Doom, we'd love to have a Frodo on our side.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Mar 13, 2023 14:48:12 GMT -5
Providence was horrible before Cooley, and now they routinely contend in the NCAA tournament. By all accounts, he's also a good guy, good representative of Providence College, he's great with students/alumni, and he has brought Providence to a level they had not been at for decades. So, in that context, I absolutely think Providence paying Cooley $4 million a year is logical and rational. I don't think it's a "con" because Cooley gave them something they otherwise did not have--and substantially better than what preceded him. Now, I agree that spending all that money on Cooley when a clear better option exists in Pitino, who has no buyout, makes no sense whatsoever. In that sense, I think this "search" process is a joke, and I think DeGioia is doing the university a disservice. If Pitino were out of the picture (staying at Iona, or somewhere else already), I think spending the money on Cooley could be more defensible. As you said, Cooley will make us better, and not just because anybody can. He has a solid track record of getting teams to the NCAA tournament, and frankly, there aren't many coaches out there who do that on a yearly basis who are available. So, in that context, I get giving Cooley a big contract. But, in choosing Cooley over Pitino, will Georgetown spend a LOT more money? Probably, and that doesn't make sense in a rational world. But Jack DeGioia and the administration don't live in that rational world. Why would you give Cooley a lifetime contract. Then you are stuck with him and possibley Frodo forever. This makes no sense especially for people who supposedly dislike the Thompsons influence (and hate Frodo in particular.) I wouldn’t give him a lifetime contract. But if you hire any established coach like that you’re going to give him 5-6 years, at least.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 13, 2023 15:15:18 GMT -5
Why would you give Cooley a lifetime contract. Then you are stuck with him and possibley Frodo forever. This makes no sense especially for people who supposedly dislike the Thompsons influence (and hate Frodo in particular.) I wouldn’t give him a lifetime contract. But if you hire any established coach like that you’re going to give him 5-6 years, at least. He has a lifetime deal with Providence so you would have to top that for him to come here.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Mar 13, 2023 16:02:37 GMT -5
I wouldn’t give him a lifetime contract. But if you hire any established coach like that you’re going to give him 5-6 years, at least. He has a lifetime deal with Providence so you would have to top that for him to come here. Maybe, but this usually just refers to a really long contract, not a true "lifetime" contract. Nobody expects Cooley to be coaching until his 80s. While extra money can always move the needle and make someone feel valued, I feel like if Cooley leaves Providence, the main driving factor won't be money, but rather other factors, such as Georgetown's history/legacy, and what Cooley might perceive as a step up. While an extra $1-$2 million a year is a lot, I just don't think that alone would cause Cooley to leave what is surely a very comfortable (and still lucrative) situation for him in Providence. That's actually why I have been skeptical that he'd leave at all.
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Mar 13, 2023 18:52:04 GMT -5
Maybe I'll be the one with egg on my face, but I see very little likelihood of this happening. These guys are just remembering that the last time UConn won the national title, they were 9-9 in the Big East, and are figuring that history can repeat itself, more or less. I, for one, would not be shocked if they don't even make it to the Sweet 16.
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rhw485
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Post by rhw485 on Mar 14, 2023 10:51:47 GMT -5
Back when we used to talk about X's and O's on this site, we would break down all the issues with our defense. Here's an article on what makes Houston's defense so good. theathletic.com/4258051/2023/03/14/houstons-sampson-defense-ncaa-tournament/For those without a subscription, it focuses on two concepts: 1. "Monster" the post. It's basically both bigs hard doubling the post aggressively. The other three guys are in a zone. They always have two athletic bigs on the floor. Teams don't score off post ups against Houston and commit a turnover 30% of the time in the post! 2. Pick and roll coverage. He talked about how he used to do the hard hedge and it failed. So now they string it out more, basically tell the big to get to the "line of scrimmage" and be ahead of the ball. The ballhandler has to force the guard to use the screen. The defenders with two shooters on their side are responsible for tagging the roller. Super interesting stuff, the Big 12 teams and Creighton adopted drop coverage, which is super passive, to help avoid teams taking threes because a 3rd defender doesn't really have to help. Houston goes the other way, forces teams to be uncomfortable and gets rewarded with a ton of turnovers. Teams attempt 43% of their shots from 3 against Houston but they're out of desperation and contested, teams only make 27% of them. Just shows there's a ton of different ways to put together a competent defense. If Sasser is healthy, Houston is my pick to win it all.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Mar 14, 2023 12:07:34 GMT -5
It's Fredo, not Frodo. Frodo was an uncorruptable force who threw the ring into Mount Doom, we'd love to have a Frodo on our side. Thanks for this, it's been bugging me for a bit
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Mar 14, 2023 12:38:48 GMT -5
Back when we used to talk about X's and O's on this site, we would break down all the issues with our defense. Here's an article on what makes Houston's defense so good. theathletic.com/4258051/2023/03/14/houstons-sampson-defense-ncaa-tournament/For those without a subscription, it focuses on two concepts: 1. "Monster" the post. It's basically both bigs hard doubling the post aggressively. The other three guys are in a zone. They always have two athletic bigs on the floor. Teams don't score off post ups against Houston and commit a turnover 30% of the time in the post! 2. Pick and roll coverage. He talked about how he used to do the hard hedge and it failed. So now they string it out more, basically tell the big to get to the "line of scrimmage" and be ahead of the ball. The ballhandler has to force the guard to use the screen. The defenders with two shooters on their side are responsible for tagging the roller. Super interesting stuff, the Big 12 teams and Creighton adopted drop coverage, which is super passive, to help avoid teams taking threes because a 3rd defender doesn't really have to help. Houston goes the other way, forces teams to be uncomfortable and gets rewarded with a ton of turnovers. Teams attempt 43% of their shots from 3 against Houston but they're out of desperation and contested, teams only make 27% of them. Just shows there's a ton of different ways to put together a competent defense. If Sasser is healthy, Houston is my pick to win it all. This is the fun part of basketball. Hopefully, we can get back to it for our own team.
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This Just In
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Post by This Just In on Mar 15, 2023 12:03:10 GMT -5
NCAA Tournament Champion Qualifications: Correct last 20 of 21 years, lone exception Connecticut 1,2, or 3 seed from a major conference Score at least 73 pts Allow less than 73 pts per game Own avg scoring margin 7 or more pts per game Have a Top 75 schedule Head coach must have made 6 or more NCAA Tournament appearances and at least 1 Elite 8 Was in the tournament last year or a 1st All American this year 6 qualify this year: West (1) Kansas (2) UCLA (3) Gonzaga East (1) Purdue (2) Marquette Midwest (1) Houston South No one
Formula eliminates the top 4 Seeds in the each region below: South (1) Alabama-#1 overall seed (2) Arizona (3) Baylor (4) Virginia
Midwest (2) Texas (3) Xavier (4) Indiana
East (3) Kansas St. (4) UConn
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 15, 2023 12:28:18 GMT -5
NCAA Tournament Champion Qualifications: Correct last 20 of 21 years, lone exception Connecticut 1,2, or 3 seed from a major conference Score at least 73 pts Allow less than 73 pts per game Own avg scoring margin 7 or more pts per game Have a Top 75 schedule Head coach must have made 6 or more NCAA Tournament appearances and at least 1 Elite 8 Was in the tournament last year or a 1st All American this year 6 qualify this year: West (1) Kansas (2) UCLA (3) Gonzaga East (1) Purdue (2) Marquette Midwest (1) Houston South No one Formula eliminates the top 4 Seeds in the each region below: South (1) Alabama-#1 overall seed (2) Arizona (3) Baylor (4) Virginia Midwest (2) Texas (3) Xavier (4) Indiana East (3) Kansas St. (4) UConn How can Virginia be eliminated when Bennett one the whole thing with UVA already
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Post by FHillsNYHoya on Mar 15, 2023 12:57:49 GMT -5
NCAA Tournament Champion Qualifications: Correct last 20 of 21 years, lone exception Connecticut 1,2, or 3 seed from a major conference Score at least 73 pts Allow less than 73 pts per game Own avg scoring margin 7 or more pts per game Have a Top 75 schedule Head coach must have made 6 or more NCAA Tournament appearances and at least 1 Elite 8 Was in the tournament last year or a 1st All American this year 6 qualify this year: West (1) Kansas (2) UCLA (3) Gonzaga East (1) Purdue (2) Marquette Midwest (1) Houston South No one Formula eliminates the top 4 Seeds in the each region below: South (1) Alabama-#1 overall seed (2) Arizona (3) Baylor (4) Virginia Midwest (2) Texas (3) Xavier (4) Indiana East (3) Kansas St. (4) UConn How can Virginia be eliminated when Bennett one the whole thing with UVA already Because they don't meet at least one of the criterion mentioned above.
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lda05816
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Post by lda05816 on Mar 15, 2023 12:59:19 GMT -5
Maybe I'll be the one with egg on my face, but I see very little likelihood of this happening. These guys are just remembering that the last time UConn won the national title, they were 9-9 in the Big East, and are figuring that history can repeat itself, more or less. I, for one, would not be shocked if they don't even make it to the Sweet 16. UConn, along with Tenn, is the analytical darling from blowing out inferior opponents early in the season. The Alabama win is the only one that aged well. People see they are 4th in KP and get all excited. They are in the toughest region with a coach that has 2 tournament wins to his name. They don't have the guard play to win in March imo.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 15, 2023 13:29:46 GMT -5
So for those who have watched a lot of Marquette does Shaka still full court press a lot?
From the games I have seen he doesn’t seem to full court press like he did in the VCU days.
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Massholya
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Post by Massholya on Mar 15, 2023 18:39:47 GMT -5
This FDU team would crush our team this year.
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Mar 15, 2023 19:04:06 GMT -5
NCAA Tournament Champion Qualifications: Correct last 20 of 21 years, lone exception Connecticut 1,2, or 3 seed from a major conference Score at least 73 pts Allow less than 73 pts per game Own avg scoring margin 7 or more pts per game Have a Top 75 schedule Head coach must have made 6 or more NCAA Tournament appearances and at least 1 Elite 8 Was in the tournament last year or a 1st All American this year 6 qualify this year: West (1) Kansas (2) UCLA (3) Gonzaga East (1) Purdue (2) Marquette Midwest (1) Houston South No one Formula eliminates the top 4 Seeds in the each region below: South (1) Alabama-#1 overall seed (2) Arizona (3) Baylor (4) Virginia Midwest (2) Texas (3) Xavier (4) Indiana East (3) Kansas St. (4) UConn What's the definition of major conference? It obviously goes beyond the top 6 conferences, as that would eliminate Houston and Gonzaga.
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rhw485
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Post by rhw485 on Mar 16, 2023 6:46:09 GMT -5
So for those who have watched a lot of Marquette does Shaka still full court press a lot? From the games I have seen he doesn’t seem to full court press like he did in the VCU days. No not nearly as much press. Honestly Shaka kinda ditched it at Texas too. He tried it the first year there and it just didnt work. You'll see it from time to time but it's not a core part of their strategy. Marquette is where they are because of their offense more than their defense. There was a good article on the athletic about how Shaka realized he needed to change his strategy there and the game has to be fun for the players vs. a defense only focus. Good example of a coach not resting on his laurels and striving to get better. Bracket sets up well for them
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 16, 2023 9:37:11 GMT -5
So for those who have watched a lot of Marquette does Shaka still full court press a lot? From the games I have seen he doesn’t seem to full court press like he did in the VCU days. No not nearly as much press. Honestly Shaka kinda ditched it at Texas too. He tried it the first year there and it just didnt work. You'll see it from time to time but it's not a core part of their strategy. Marquette is where they are because of their offense more than their defense. There was a good article on the athletic about how Shaka realized he needed to change his strategy there and the game has to be fun for the players vs. a defense only focus. Good example of a coach not resting on his laurels and striving to get better. Bracket sets up well for them That’s what I thought regarding the full court press. Is the full court press obsolete now in college basketball? Is the skill level with the guards and forwards too high now like in the NBA where the full court press doesn’t work? For years on here people said all we have to do is full court press on defense. This year we tried it early but gave up after it didn’t work. If Shaka abandoned the full court press it leads me to believe that it no longer works in college basketball as a primary defensive scheme.
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Post by Lethal_Interjection on Mar 16, 2023 9:40:57 GMT -5
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Mar 16, 2023 9:45:54 GMT -5
No not nearly as much press. Honestly Shaka kinda ditched it at Texas too. He tried it the first year there and it just didnt work. You'll see it from time to time but it's not a core part of their strategy. Marquette is where they are because of their offense more than their defense. There was a good article on the athletic about how Shaka realized he needed to change his strategy there and the game has to be fun for the players vs. a defense only focus. Good example of a coach not resting on his laurels and striving to get better. Bracket sets up well for them That’s what I thought regarding the full court press. Is the full court press obsolete now in college basketball? Is the skill level with the guards and forwards too high now like in the NBA where the full court press doesn’t work? For years on here people said all we have to do is full court press on defense. This year we tried it early but gave up after it didn’t work. If Shaka abandoned the full court press it leads me to believe that it no longer works in college basketball as a primary defensive scheme. I think it depends on the roster and the coach. If the coach wants to play fast-pace offense, it will be hard having a full-court press defense as the only defensive scheme. Unless that coach rotates players in and out, his starters will get too tired to compete. I see the full-court press as situational, but not for the whole game.
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