SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
Posts: 18,373
|
Post by SSHoya on Dec 16, 2022 13:44:22 GMT -5
Not sure why this is essentially a transcript from a private event but that’s for another conversation. Ooh, let's have that conversation because I think it is very interesting - he's made 0 public comment on the program for how many years now - 2? 3? 4? Has he made any public comment on the program since Ewing's announcement as Head Coach? There were 0 public comments last year after 0-20. However, at a private event in front of donors, he shows a really surprising knowledge of the program from someone we've kind of assumed didn't really follow it that closely (7 transfers which was exactly right) Would anyone else on the board know the exact number of transfers in last year? I follow this program and I couldn't have told you the number off the top of my head. He knew the W-L record, knew when the next game was. Kind of says to me he's following the progress this year pretty closely. Jack D certainly has never publicly acknowledge Ewing's contract extension.
|
|
bigskyhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,094
|
Post by bigskyhoya on Dec 16, 2022 13:44:45 GMT -5
The comments made me feel depressed. It just seems like he was outlining the framework for reducing the size and scope of the basketball program into something far outside of a major national program. It felt like we're starting the process of walking away from basketball being big and more into a minor/small conference program. It feels like we will read this statement in the future. "We tried it with Patrick and he gave it his best. During his time leading the program, we learned Georgetown is not compatible with the current landscape of top NCAA basketball." That’s the likely outcome if Locust Club is successful in ousting Ewing/Thompson and erasing them from history with a clean break. Less money will be spent on the program and maybe 200k for a head coach and we won’t even try. I guess that’s good for the football folks though as leaves possibility of more money funneled there. There you go again.
|
|
hoyaguy
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,861
|
Post by hoyaguy on Dec 16, 2022 13:50:13 GMT -5
What did you want him to say, they stink? Of course he’s not saying that in that audience. It’s both hopeful and noncommittal which is how these Q&A sessions go. Not sure why this is essentially a transcript from a private event but that’s for another conversation. I also am surprised people are surprised by his statements. Just seemed like a diplomatic response given the situation. Didn’t really divulge much or show his cards. A diplomatic response is expected but the boneheaded statements like calling non-conf “preseason”, basically saying only Ewing can turn it around and then complaining about NIL and not being prepared when he has a role in the NCAA and it was obvious the ruling was coming. JD needs to touch grass and look outside the university and realize that his golden boy is not the only one facing issues in the new landscape but we still can’t beat 200+ teams that don’t have NIL programs. All of this just makes him sound like a fool and he’s the one with all the power to make changes. The way i see this, it comes down to him either being disastrously oblivious, or so wrapped up in the cronyism he thinks he can just keep that power he’s not qualified for, ignore the glaring issues, and insult the intelligence of the few remaining fans with these comments. And even if this is a “private event” unless there’s an NDA, this would get out anyway especially if there is a single basketball fan among the attendees
|
|
playtyler
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 246
|
Post by playtyler on Dec 16, 2022 13:50:54 GMT -5
What is particularly concerning is that JD discussed the NCAA changes that he worked on at length. But said nothing about his expectations for the program. After a winless "season" last year, he owes it to the fans to publicly put Ewing on notice of his expectations for the program and demand accountability and results. And to lay the groundwork to make a change if expectations are not met. He did take ownership of the Basketball Program.
He could have said: "We need to return to our winning tradition." "We have high expectations for the program. We expect to be competitive in the Big East and make the tournament." "We have some talented players and want to see success on the court." "We feel we can compete in this new world order." "We have invested in the program with the state of the art facilities, highest salaries in the Big East, NIL support and expect returns on our investment."
|
|
hoyaguy
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,861
|
Post by hoyaguy on Dec 16, 2022 13:56:04 GMT -5
Ooh, let's have that conversation because I think it is very interesting - he's made 0 public comment on the program for how many years now - 2? 3? 4? Has he made any public comment on the program since Ewing's announcement as Head Coach? There were 0 public comments last year after 0-20. However, at a private event in front of donors, he shows a really surprising knowledge of the program from someone we've kind of assumed didn't really follow it that closely (7 transfers which was exactly right) Would anyone else on the board know the exact number of transfers in last year? I follow this program and I couldn't have told you the number off the top of my head. He knew the W-L record, knew when the next game was. Kind of says to me he's following the progress this year pretty closely. Jack D certainly has never publicly acknowledge Ewing's contract extension. Yeah because it happened in secret originally while the students were stuck at home, salaries were cut and there was the hiring freeze so it would’ve ruffled a lot of feathers to announce it. But once they got called out on it, they already embarked on the worst season in the last 50 years and thus it would’ve made him look like a royal idiot. So I fully expect it to never be mentioned even if Ewing rides the rest of his ghost contract out. Accountability starts at the top and has been a problem for a long time here and children seem to be better at taking responsibility than the supposed multi millionaire adults
|
|
Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 10,495
|
Post by Elvado on Dec 16, 2022 13:58:25 GMT -5
What is particularly concerning is that JD discussed the NCAA changes that he worked on at length. But said nothing about his expectations for the program. After a winless "season" last year, he owes it to the fans to publicly put Ewing on notice of his expectations for the program and demand accountability and results. And to lay the groundwork to make a change if expectations are not met. He did take ownership of the Basketball Program. He could have said: "We need to return to our winning tradition." "We have high expectations for the program. We expect to be competitive in the Big East and make the tournament." "We have some talented players and want to see success on the court." "We feel we can compete in this new world order." "We have invested in the program with the state of the art facilities, highest salaries in the Big East, NIL support and expect returns on our investment." It is painfully obvious that while Father Healy taught Jack everything Jack knows, it was not everything Father Healy knew…
|
|
trillesthoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,855
Member is Online
|
Post by trillesthoya on Dec 16, 2022 14:06:59 GMT -5
I also am surprised people are surprised by his statements. Just seemed like a diplomatic response given the situation. Didn’t really divulge much or show his cards. A diplomatic response is expected but the boneheaded statements like calling non-conf “preseason”, basically saying only Ewing can turn it around and then complaining about NIL and not being prepared when he has a role in the NCAA and it was obvious the ruling was coming. JD needs to touch grass and look outside the university and realize that his golden boy is not the only one facing issues in the new landscape but we still can’t beat 200+ teams that don’t have NIL programs. All of this just makes him sound like a fool and he’s the one with all the power to make changes. The way i see this, it comes down to him either being disastrously oblivious, or so wrapped up in the cronyism he thinks he can just keep that power he’s not qualified for, ignore the glaring issues, and insult the intelligence of the few remaining fans with these comments. And even if this is a “private event” unless there’s an NDA, this would get out anyway especially if there is a single basketball fan among the attendees The preseason comment just felt like a small attempt at humor. If you think Jack doesn’t understand that non-conference games impact the team’s standing in March but understands every other detail to the letter otherwise based on his comments, not sure how that would even be possible. I don’t think he said Ewing is the only guy for the job either. The admission that we’re not where need to be on NIL was annoying but at least he was honest and recognizes it as something that we need to work on. I was actually encouraged that he recognizes it as something that is a priority. To be honest though with how the team has gotten any comment Jack could’ve said short of “we need to fire this guy expeditiously” would’ve inevitably irritated most of us. Just the nature of where the program is at, but in a vacuum I just found his comments to be hedging around the real issue which is probably what you should do in these situations.
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,951
|
Post by EtomicB on Dec 16, 2022 14:09:08 GMT -5
What did you want him to say, they stink? Of course he’s not saying that in that audience. It’s both hopeful and noncommittal which is how these Q&A sessions go. Not sure why this is essentially a transcript from a private event but that’s for another conversation. Of course not, he should have given the oft used PE response of "we're not where we want to be right now but we can't lose faith" I think it's out there because some folks in attendance knew it was a terrible response to the question...
|
|
SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
Posts: 18,373
|
Post by SSHoya on Dec 16, 2022 14:36:51 GMT -5
What did you want him to say, they stink? Of course he’s not saying that in that audience. It’s both hopeful and noncommittal which is how these Q&A sessions go. Not sure why this is essentially a transcript from a private event but that’s for another conversation. Of course not, he should have given the oft used PE response of "we're not whethere want to be right now but we can't lose faith" I think it's out there because some folks in attendance knew it was a terrible response to the question... Here's a responsive answer without the irrelevant word salad about his tenure at the NCAA, NIL, the Thompson IAC, and the changing landscape of college basketball. "Thank you for the question. I know that Hoya fans are not satisified with last season and where the basketball program is now. Nor am I. However, Coach Ewing did finish the 2021 season strong and led us to a BE tournament championship in 2021. I believe that indicates to me that Coach Ewing certainly has the capability to coach a winning team and we should always have that expectation." Not a lot of excess verbiage and very little inaccuracies in that answer. Except, perhaps, you could drop the "Nor am I."
|
|
|
Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Dec 16, 2022 14:40:53 GMT -5
What did you want him to say, they stink? Of course he’s not saying that in that audience. It’s both hopeful and noncommittal which is how these Q&A sessions go. Not sure why this is essentially a transcript from a private event but that’s for another conversation. Jack DeGioia's comments essentially demonstrate why he is not qualified to run our premier sports program, and likely illustrate why his time as Georgetown's President should come to a close sooner rather than later. And this has nothing to do with Ewing. Jack DeGioia was Chairman of the NCAA Board of Governors and still serves on the Board. He was literally responsible for the NCAA's approach to paying players, and its failure to see that NIL was coming, even when it was widely expected by others. And yet, we are sitting here a few years later, and he says "We do not have a coherent framework for addressing NIL right now." Why? What's taking so long? If anything, Georgetown should have been on the cutting edge of NIL given DeGioia's familiarity with those issues, and addressing the various legal decisions that affected it, but instead we are somehow behind the curve? Because we need a new law? Please. What also aggravates me, and tells me that DeGioia is clueless is that the new landscape affects everybody. Patrick Ewing is not unique in any way, he's one of 363 college coaches. I mean, take a look at the programs ranked just above us on KenPom, do any of these programs have NIL problems? Murray State, Vermont, Southern Miss, Old Dominion, Seattle, Cal Baptist (hi Tim Ighoefe), the list goes on. There are plenty of programs, with no NIL hopes who are exceeding our performance. In fact, DeGioia's comments make the case for an experienced coach like Pitino. Even if Ewing is fired, the unsettled landscape only heightens the need to hire someone who has already dealt with it, succeeded, and who won't be overwhelmed by those changes. And to top it all off, DeGioia KNEW these changes were happening when the extension was granted in 2021, and yet he signed Ewing up anyway. Tell me a world where this makes sense? So to answer your question, "What did you want him to say?" - NOT THIS. There are many ways he could have propped up Patrick and advocated for our program without relying on facts that (a) are easily debunked or (b) demonstrate further why DeGioia is out of step.
|
|
alleninxis
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,216
|
Post by alleninxis on Dec 16, 2022 14:44:43 GMT -5
There is a key line in this all that people seem to have glossed over: "..but we put a good deal of support around him."
That to me, was the biggest tell in the whole thing. The excuses are nonsense, but that one line made me think he knows this hasn't been acceptable/will make a change.
|
|
|
Post by augustusfinknottle on Dec 16, 2022 14:51:45 GMT -5
“No one has been working harder to turn this thing around than him. And if it can be done, I think he can do it. “ This is the Georgetown’s problem in a nutshell. A President who never worked anywhere else, says that a basketball coach who never would be hired anywhere else is just the guy to turn the program around, “if it can be done.” It’s like there is no world outside of Georgetown and solutions can only come from inside. And if those solutions fail, well, they tried and “it can’t be done.” I do think it’s telling however that DiGioia spent so much time talking about the NCAA. I wonder if his time as chair has made him hesitant to make changes to the program in light of all the uncertainty about where college athletics is headed, and whether it offers a future to GU Exactly who is it that should be “working harder than (he)”?
|
|
|
Post by hsaxon on Dec 16, 2022 15:25:24 GMT -5
So if OOC is just the "preseason" ... then how was our actual season last year? And with last "season"'s performance, who decided it was a good idea to run it back? Jack was the hall director at New South for several years and is now the President for life. I think he probably is best suited somewhere in between these roles. Nice guy and Hoya. Our endowment and school stature have not improved proportionate to other schools since 2001 when he took over. Ewing is the symptom, Jack is the problem. The Harvard Corporation just appointed its fourth president since Jack took over for us. No University President ever serves this long at any other respectable school. I invite all of you to look at the University Presidents for the top 50 schools and let me know if there is one who has served as long (hint: No - I looked). Jack became Georgetown's longest serving president in 2014 and is the first lay president of any American Jesuit college ever. I am sure the Board can find a suitable replacement (oh wait Jack is on the Board and the rest of the Board is beholden to Jack...). Maybe we should see if the New South hall director is interested? This is astounding. I bet some of our putative peers have had two presidents since 2014. I believe Harvard has had three in the last 12 or so years.
|
|
mfk24
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,759
|
Post by mfk24 on Dec 16, 2022 15:26:46 GMT -5
The comments made me feel depressed. It just seems like he was outlining the framework for reducing the size and scope of the basketball program into something far outside of a major national program. It felt like we're starting the process of walking away from basketball being big and more into a minor/small conference program. It feels like we will read this statement in the future. "We tried it with Patrick and he gave it his best. During his time leading the program, we learned Georgetown is not compatible with the current landscape of top NCAA basketball." That’s the likely outcome if Locust Club is successful in ousting Ewing/Thompson and erasing them from history with a clean break. Less money will be spent on the program and maybe 200k for a head coach and we won’t even try. I guess that’s good for the football folks though as leaves possibility of more money funneled there. So what's your solution to this mess? Maintain the status quo, turning over our entire roster year after year? Hoping that after 6 years, 8 years, 10 years, PE finally finds the right combination to secure a middle of the pack BE finish? Let Ronny take over? There is no Thompson coaching tree from which to pull. There's no one else "in the family" with proven success coaching at this level. Continued losing will hasten our demise quicker than firing Ewing will. Perpetually losing teams do not routinely attract high level talent. Ewing had one chance (too many if you ask me) to turn it around this season and he failed...again. Better talent is not coming next year if we go 0-fer again in conference. We are so far beneath the level of competition of our conference brethren that despite the money we are spending, we in no way resemble a major national program. We are the dregs of the BE. At least a new coach buys a few seasons to turn things around. Or we just continue being the new DePaul.
|
|
Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 10,495
|
Post by Elvado on Dec 16, 2022 15:31:31 GMT -5
This is astounding. I bet some of our putative peers have had two presidents since 2014. I believe Harvard has had three in the last 12 or so years. Inertia is strong at GU….
|
|
playtyler
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 246
|
Post by playtyler on Dec 16, 2022 15:48:01 GMT -5
I believe Harvard has had three in the last 12 or so years. Inertia is strong at GU…. There is a reason for Big University's to cyclically hire new School Presidents. New Presidents bring new energy, excitement, money, prestige, media interest, campaigns and strategic plans. "Big Donors/Alums come and meet the new President of Georgetown, she is a preeminent scholar in XXX or a famous public figure. You will be excited to get to know Georgetown again, give to support the new direction/vision/expansion/campaign and re-engage with the school in a new way." The school profile will be raised, money will flow in (maybe enough to pay off some bad old debts from the old regime), a new energy and excitement will abound. There will be media profiles and Georgetown will be part of a new conversation and set for a new era of growth. Or we can keep going as we have and the excitement in Georgetown will stay as it is in the Capital One Arena during the "preseason".
|
|
|
Post by aleutianhoya on Dec 16, 2022 15:51:45 GMT -5
There is a key line in this all that people seem to have glossed over: "..but we put a good deal of support around him." That to me, was the biggest tell in the whole thing. The excuses are nonsense, but that one line made me think he knows this hasn't been acceptable/will make a change. Yes, that stuck out to me too. His overall comments sounded like CYA type stuff. Not commendable. But not surprising.
|
|
EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,951
|
Post by EtomicB on Dec 16, 2022 16:10:28 GMT -5
There is a key line in this all that people seem to have glossed over: "..but we put a good deal of support around him." That to me, was the biggest tell in the whole thing. The excuses are nonsense, but that one line made me think he knows this hasn't been acceptable/will make a change. I didn't read it that way, that line was preceded by JD saying that Gtown doesn't have its ducks in a row with the NIL and that PE is being asked to do his job at a place that's "strict about rules".. So in essence he's being hamstrung right now his view
|
|
hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,207
|
Post by hoya9797 on Dec 16, 2022 16:13:23 GMT -5
There is a key line in this all that people seem to have glossed over: "..but we put a good deal of support around him." That to me, was the biggest tell in the whole thing. The excuses are nonsense, but that one line made me think he knows this hasn't been acceptable/will make a change. I didn't read it that way, that line was preceded by JD saying that Gtown doesn't have its ducks in a row with the NIL and that PE is being asked to do his job at a place that's "strict about rules".. So in essence he's being hamstrung right now his view So, according to the president of the university, GU does not have an NIL program in place yet. But, the word was that GU was making very competitive offers to players like Brandon Murray and Tyrell Ward. I wonder which is true or, if both are true, how exactly those offers came about.
|
|
|
Post by augustusfinknottle on Dec 16, 2022 16:29:08 GMT -5
There is a key line in this all that people seem to have glossed over: "..but we put a good deal of support around him." That to me, was the biggest tell in the whole thing. The excuses are nonsense, but that one line made me think he knows this hasn't been acceptable/will make a change. In his mind Ronny Thompson is probably one who provides much of that “support”. Good Lord!
|
|