hoyaroc
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Post by hoyaroc on Dec 5, 2022 14:52:35 GMT -5
The legend of Ronny Thompson. This guy will out live all the naysayers. He’s not going anywhere some of you guys will still be talking about RT in 2035. 😂
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boxout05
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Post by boxout05 on Dec 5, 2022 14:53:03 GMT -5
Agree with what you said except for the bolded part. JDG appears to be a fairly patient, hands off administrator who gives the leader of the basketball program resources to operate. Esh got an extension before running his mouth off and JT3 was around for years after the 1st round losses to 12th seeded Nobody State. You want a supportive, hands off boss. I’d argue he’s not supposed to do more than hire qualified people and put them in a position to succeed. The problem he hired two people manifestly unqualified to do their job and the results bear that out. If he cleans house and gave the keys to the program to someone like Pitino or Mack (or Smart in prior offseasons), I imagine they’d be happy to report directly to him. I don't think JD is hands-off & patient, I don't think he cares much one way or the other as DFW has told us on many occasions the MBB program is not anywhere near a priority for him at this time... Top coaches aren't coming to a school where the program isn't important to the top person in the University. Very possible, although his involvement in the NCAA Board of Governors and reported leadership during the split from the football schools paints a different picture. I think it’s likely important to him, but something he delegates because he has other responsibilities. More likely, it’s important to him that it’s run a certain way as opposed to winning at all costs.
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 5, 2022 14:56:18 GMT -5
I don't think JD is hands-off & patient, I don't think he cares much one way or the other as DFW has told us on many occasions the MBB program is not anywhere near a priority for him at this time... Top coaches aren't coming to a school where the program isn't important to the top person in the University. Very possible, although his involvement in the NCAA Board of Governors and reported leadership during the split from the football schools paints a different picture. I think it’s likely important to him, but something he delegates because he has other responsibilities. More likely, it’s important to him that it’s run a certain way as opposed to winning at all costs. This last point is very important. We are trying to win at all costs, bringing in an entire new roster of mercenaries for a single season to save Ewing and Ronny's hides, and we're not graduating players. That, along with our program's status hurting the Big East, should be enough to give DeGioia/the Board motivation to start anew, even if they would be able to stomach the poor basketball performance. We are losing off the court just as much as we're losing on the court. There is nothing to be proud of as a Georgetown leader.
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boxout05
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Post by boxout05 on Dec 5, 2022 15:03:51 GMT -5
If we hire Pitino or Mack, then you’ll know for sure winning is the most important thing. I’ll be shocked if that happens.
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hoyaroc
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Post by hoyaroc on Dec 5, 2022 15:04:22 GMT -5
Very possible, although his involvement in the NCAA Board of Governors and reported leadership during the split from the football schools paints a different picture. I think it’s likely important to him, but something he delegates because he has other responsibilities. More likely, it’s important to him that it’s run a certain way as opposed to winning at all costs. This last point is very important. We are trying to win at all costs, bringing in an entire new roster of mercenaries for a single season to save Ewing and Ronny's hides, and we're not graduating players. That, along with our program's status hurting the Big East, should be enough to give DeGioia/the Board motivation to start anew, even if they would be able to stomach the poor basketball performance. We are losing off the court just as much as we're losing on the court. There is nothing to be proud of as a Georgetown leader. It’s funny you guys waste your time on matters that don’t concern you DeGioia and the board members don’t give a damn about your opinions. 😂
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TC
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Post by TC on Dec 5, 2022 15:10:12 GMT -5
It’s funny you guys waste your time on matters that don’t concern you DeGioia and the board members don’t give a damn about your opinions. 😂 You sound like a Scooby Doo villain.
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bigskyhoya
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Post by bigskyhoya on Dec 5, 2022 15:12:20 GMT -5
This last point is very important. We are trying to win at all costs, bringing in an entire new roster of mercenaries for a single season to save Ewing and Ronny's hides, and we're not graduating players. That, along with our program's status hurting the Big East, should be enough to give DeGioia/the Board motivation to start anew, even if they would be able to stomach the poor basketball performance. We are losing off the court just as much as we're losing on the court. There is nothing to be proud of as a Georgetown leader. It’s funny you guys waste your time on matters that don’t concern you DeGioia and the board members don’t give a damn about your opinions. 😂 And nobody here gives a damn about yours.
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Dec 5, 2022 15:25:05 GMT -5
If you want to see a foretelling of the damage Ronnie would later do, find a video of the UTEP game from ’91 or so. Watch him get undeserved minutes and proceed to throw away the game with bad shots and decisions. “Inbound specialist”!!! I promise that one of the pre-season previews by the Basketball Program at the time had that as part of his bio. Kid you not! With that description, you would think he was the pillar of confidence for the team. Instead, he played like a nervous jittery bug. So you were there too?
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 5, 2022 15:48:12 GMT -5
I don't think JD is hands-off & patient, I don't think he cares much one way or the other as DFW has told us on many occasions the MBB program is not anywhere near a priority for him at this time... Top coaches aren't coming to a school where the program isn't important to the top person in the University. This doesn’t make sense when the Program has a $15M budget. It is just not his fiefdom. It’s understood that that’s the Thompson’s family business. JD doesn’t ruffle feathers. A top person who cares or has a clue never lets the program slip this far in my opinion. It can easily be argued that he deferred to JT2 back in the day but that ship has sailed or sunk whichever you prefer this mess is on him & him alone.. Gtown just went 0-19 in conference play yet we didn't hear or read one word about the program from JD, that speak volumes in my view... Also add in the fact that there have been ridiculous player turnover which has led to a terrible APR but still dead silence from the top person. The 15 million dollar price tag is irrelevant especially when a good chunk of it is generarted by tv & NCAA tournament money
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 5, 2022 16:13:11 GMT -5
“Inbound specialist”!!! I promise that one of the pre-season previews by the Basketball Program at the time had that as part of his bio. Kid you not! With that description, you would think he was the pillar of confidence for the team. Instead, he played like a nervous jittery bug. So you were there too? Yes, first row… was “fortunate” enough to see him play in person… 👀 and I can say that he was no inbound specialist…
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 5, 2022 16:14:54 GMT -5
This doesn’t make sense when the Program has a $15M budget. It is just not his fiefdom. It’s understood that that’s the Thompson’s family business. JD doesn’t ruffle feathers. A top person who cares or has a clue never lets the program slip this far in my opinion. It can easily be argued that he deferred to JT2 back in the day but that ship has sailed or sunk whichever you prefer this mess is on him & him alone.. Gtown just went 0-19 in conference play yet we didn't hear or read one word about the program from JD, that speak volumes in my view... Also add in the fact that there have been ridiculous player turnover which has led to a terrible APR but still dead silence from the top person. The 15 million dollar price tag is irrelevant especially when a good chunk of it is generarted by tv & NCAA tournament money I agree with you that JD is ultimately responsible for what’s happening to our basketball program.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Dec 5, 2022 16:21:01 GMT -5
A top person who cares or has a clue never lets the program slip this far in my opinion. It can easily be argued that he deferred to JT2 back in the day but that ship has sailed or sunk whichever you prefer this mess is on him & him alone.. Gtown just went 0-19 in conference play yet we didn't hear or read one word about the program from JD, that speak volumes in my view... Also add in the fact that there have been ridiculous player turnover which has led to a terrible APR but still dead silence from the top person. The 15 million dollar price tag is irrelevant especially when a good chunk of it is generarted by tv & NCAA tournament money I agree with you that JD is ultimately responsible for what’s happening to our basketball program. Exactly, so how would he go about convincing an in demand coach to choose Gtown over their other options? What does the program do well besides spend 15 million dollars?
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Dec 5, 2022 16:25:13 GMT -5
Yes, first row… was “fortunate” enough to see him play in person… 👀 and I can say that he was no inbound specialist… So my recollection was not clouded by my case of RTSD….
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 5, 2022 16:26:25 GMT -5
I agree with you that JD is ultimately responsible for what’s happening to our basketball program. Exactly, so how would he go about convincing an in demand coach to choose Gtown over their other options? What does the program do well besides spend 15 million dollars? A very rich program locared in a basketball hotbed which gives complete control to the coach must be very attractive to any coach… if the Ronnys are removed. Btw, I would prefer a post-ThompsonFamily program to go back to under the AD.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 5, 2022 16:29:00 GMT -5
Yes, first row… was “fortunate” enough to see him play in person… 👀 and I can say that he was no inbound specialist… So my recollection was not clouded by my case of RTSD…. No, I just wish I could find that preseason preview. Was it The Hoya or Voice? Do they have archives?
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Dec 5, 2022 17:00:49 GMT -5
I agree with you that JD is ultimately responsible for what’s happening to our basketball program. Exactly, so how would he go about convincing an in demand coach to choose Gtown over their other options? What does the program do well besides spend 15 million dollars? This is why you need to hire a coach that's a force of nature and that is going to craft the program as he wants it and push aside the nonsense that prevents him from achieving that goal. This will likely require cleaning house. Right now, the program is not doing anything well, but bring in a good coach and that would change overnight. You do point to the biggest problem, which is, I don't think DeGioia or the Board have the desire/inspiration to actually do a real search and hire someone who might actually turn things around. I think they're looking for the easy way out, which is why they ratified Patrick Ewing as John Thompson's favorite son. DeGioia likely figured it was a way to keep John Thompson Jr. happy, bring a famous alumni back into the fold, and go about his business. Georgetown does not have an interventionist President, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I think for some coaches, that would be seen as a good thing, in that the coach can do whatever they want, but that won't work if the new coach has to fit into the current structure where people like Ronny Thompson are gatekeepers. Really, I think this program and DeGioia are so far removed from anything resembling a real coaching search and running a real successful sports program that they are basically bumbling along with inertia, which is how we ended up with Ewing. I mean, even the successes we had was sort of lucky: 1999: John Thompson Jr. leaves at the age of 58 (one can even quibble that Thompson's last decade with the program were problematic other than the Iverson/Page years, but let's leave that for another day, he deserved to be coaching), and Esherick slots in. Would Esherick have gotten the job on his own? Who knows, because the mid-season departure sort of set Esherick on the path in motion. And clearly, Thompson was okay with it. So that's good enough. 2004: This is where the luck comes in. At the time, alumni and fans still care about the program in big enough numbers to throw a fit, especially after Esherick proclaims he'll be around for years. So, Esherick gets fired. As it so happens, there is an up-and-coming coach with real head coaching experience, who has had a lot of success at Princeton. And he happens to be a Thompson! Bingo! Jackpot. They hire JT3 (who I do think was qualified, though I am not sure that was why they hired him), and he has a lot of early success with the Final Four, it looks like a winner. 2017: By all accounts, alumni/fan unrest (most of which was rooted in wanting to chart a new path away from the Thompsons), Board unrest, combined with Alonzo Mourning whining about his son's playing time, force the issue, and John Thompson III got fired. I still think if JT3 had handled PR better, he might have squeezed more time. After all, his performance was not nearly as bad as Ewing's. Sure, he had the early exits, and fans were upset about it but not necessarily rational (saying he should be fired because of Ohio or FGCU made no sense, most of us would kill to be a high seed in the tournament and be over .500 at this point, I'd take JT3's tenure from 2005-2013 any day), but it wasn't until 2016/2017 that the wheels fell off. I am confident there was no desire by either DeGioia or John Thompson Jr. to make a move, but it was forced. So what do they do? Follow the same formula, next man up! Except, there as no next Thompson up, as Ronny had already disgraced himself at Ball State. So, John Thompson calls Patrick Ewing (who by all reports wanted an NBA head coaching job and never even thought of coaching college before the intervention), and convinces him to come back to his alma mater. Sure, he had no experience with college ball, no familiarity with the college game, but he was in the "family," he had great name recognition, and he was an alumnus. Oh, and they can quietly bring Ronny Thompson back into the fold to help Ewing out after all (especially given his stellar Ball State experience), while hiding his role and employment status for a few years. Checks all the boxes. First few years are rough, players leave, but hey in 2021 we win the BET! This is great. Patrick has had some success, let's keep him around forever, and give him a $12 million extension despite, at the time, having a 37% winning percentage in the Big East regular season games, never finishing above .500, and never even getting close to an at-large bid. But, Patrick won the BET! Let's give him an extension, even though he's got 2 years left on the original deal. And, on top of that, let's lock ourselves into that contract by not including a buyout for a reasonable fee. But, hey, shhh. COVID is happening, and we need to raise funds, so let's keep the extension a secret. [NOTE: No rational person or program allows that extension, which makes me extremely suspect of how the whole program and decision-making operates, and makes me pessimistic that even if there is a change, it'll be a good one.] March 2022: Ewing has an abysmal season. So, we need change! So, we need to clean house, except for Ronny Thompson, who is actually going to help find some new assistants. Per reports, he reaches out to guys like Kevin Broadus, thinking that he's going to leave a head coaching role to join our program as an assistant to Patrick Ewing. And presumably, Ronny reached out to Nickelberry and Baldwin, but on the latter, not before we try to hire Jordan Brooks, who cannot bring his prized recruit along, so never mind. Oh, and by the way, we owe Ewing a ton of money, and the university at large might not like paying that out (if they even know, they probably don't, so let's not tell them!), so let's not even consider a parting of ways. Have to keep it on the down low. December 2022: Fast forward to today. The season begins terribly, despite better talent. What to do? In all likelihood, the powers that involved are trying to figure out ways to just keep the same train moving forward. If I had to guess, if Ewing somehow survives this season, you'll see one of the assistants fired or scapegoated, and the players thrown even more under the bus than they already are. Then we'll restock with new players (after all, cannot trade for them like in the NBA), and show them video, point out their mistakes, and act befuddled and confused as to what else can possibly be done to get better.
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mfk24
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Post by mfk24 on Dec 5, 2022 17:23:07 GMT -5
The legend of Ronny Thompson. This guy will out live all the naysayers. He’s not going anywhere some of you guys will still be talking about RT in 2035. 😂 I don’t find anything remotely funny about the current state of our men’s basketball program. Not only are we producing a terrible on court product, but we don’t even graduate kids any longer. Program is literally in the pits, an absolute laughingstock. To the point where the coach even says, “I don’t know what else to do”. So what the hell is so funny? If RT wants to remain captain of a ship that‘s already sunk, then he deserves all the criticism sent his way. Clearly he has no pride and no balls or he’d have fired PE himself.
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hoyaguy
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Post by hoyaguy on Dec 5, 2022 18:54:22 GMT -5
The legend of Ronny Thompson. This guy will out live all the naysayers. He’s not going anywhere some of you guys will still be talking about RT in 2035. 😂 I mean yeah he might, but not because he is actually contributing to the program. And I don't think "naysayers" is an accurate title for people fairly criticizing the chief of staff who has over seen the biggest decline in Georgetown basketball ever and does not even treat his position as a full time job. How do the graduation rates alone not infuriate you, if you are a devout fan of the Georgetown program that was built on the premise that a team can be competitive and retain players to get them a great education?
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 5, 2022 19:17:41 GMT -5
The legend of Ronny Thompson. This guy will out live all the naysayers. He’s not going anywhere some of you guys will still be talking about RT in 2035. 😂 I mean yeah he might, but not because he is actually contributing to the program. And I don't think "naysayers" is an accurate title for people fairly criticizing the chief of staff who has over seen the biggest decline in Georgetown basketball ever and does not even treat his position as a full time job. How do the graduation rates alone not infuriate you, if you are a devout fan of the Georgetown program that was built on the premise that a team can be competitive and retain players to get them a great education? Because he is not an alum and he believes the Thompson/Ewing Cult should be above Georgetown University.
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HoyaNyr320
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Post by HoyaNyr320 on Dec 5, 2022 19:17:44 GMT -5
Exactly, so how would he go about convincing an in demand coach to choose Gtown over their other options? What does the program do well besides spend 15 million dollars? This is why you need to hire a coach that's a force of nature and that is going to craft the program as he wants it and push aside the nonsense that prevents him from achieving that goal. This will likely require cleaning house. Right now, the program is not doing anything well, but bring in a good coach and that would change overnight. You do point to the biggest problem, which is, I don't think DeGioia or the Board have the desire/inspiration to actually do a real search and hire someone who might actually turn things around. I think they're looking for the easy way out, which is why they ratified Patrick Ewing as John Thompson's favorite son. DeGioia likely figured it was a way to keep John Thompson Jr. happy, bring a famous alumni back into the fold, and go about his business. Georgetown does not have an interventionist President, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I think for some coaches, that would be seen as a good thing, in that the coach can do whatever they want, but that won't work if the new coach has to fit into the current structure where people like Ronny Thompson are gatekeepers. Really, I think this program and DeGioia are so far removed from anything resembling a real coaching search and running a real successful sports program that they are basically bumbling along with inertia, which is how we ended up with Ewing. I mean, even the successes we had was sort of lucky: 1999: John Thompson Jr. leaves at the age of 58 (one can even quibble that Thompson's last decade with the program were problematic other than the Iverson/Page years, but let's leave that for another day, he deserved to be coaching), and Esherick slots in. Would Esherick have gotten the job on his own? Who knows, because the mid-season departure sort of set Esherick on the path in motion. And clearly, Thompson was okay with it. So that's good enough. 2004: This is where the luck comes in. At the time, alumni and fans still care about the program in big enough numbers to throw a fit, especially after Esherick proclaims he'll be around for years. So, Esherick gets fired. As it so happens, there is an up-and-coming coach with real head coaching experience, who has had a lot of success at Princeton. And he happens to be a Thompson! Bingo! Jackpot. They hire JT3 (who I do think was qualified, though I am not sure that was why they hired him), and he has a lot of early success with the Final Four, it looks like a winner. 2017: By all accounts, alumni/fan unrest (most of which was rooted in wanting to chart a new path away from the Thompsons), Board unrest, combined with Alonzo Mourning whining about his son's playing time, force the issue, and John Thompson III got fired. I still think if JT3 had handled PR better, he might have squeezed more time. After all, his performance was not nearly as bad as Ewing's. Sure, he had the early exits, and fans were upset about it but not necessarily rational (saying he should be fired because of Ohio or FGCU made no sense, most of us would kill to be a high seed in the tournament and be over .500 at this point, I'd take JT3's tenure from 2005-2013 any day), but it wasn't until 2016/2017 that the wheels fell off. I am confident there was no desire by either DeGioia or John Thompson Jr. to make a move, but it was forced. So what do they do? Follow the same formula, next man up! Except, there as no next Thompson up, as Ronny had already disgraced himself at Ball State. So, John Thompson calls Patrick Ewing (who by all reports wanted an NBA head coaching job and never even thought of coaching college before the intervention), and convinces him to come back to his alma mater. Sure, he had no experience with college ball, no familiarity with the college game, but he was in the "family," he had great name recognition, and he was an alumnus. Oh, and they can quietly bring Ronny Thompson back into the fold to help Ewing out after all (especially given his stellar Ball State experience), while hiding his role and employment status for a few years. Checks all the boxes. First few years are rough, players leave, but hey in 2021 we win the BET! This is great. Patrick has had some success, let's keep him around forever, and give him a $12 million extension despite, at the time, having a 37% winning percentage in the Big East regular season games, never finishing above .500, and never even getting close to an at-large bid. But, Patrick won the BET! Let's give him an extension, even though he's got 2 years left on the original deal. And, on top of that, let's lock ourselves into that contract by not including a buyout for a reasonable fee. But, hey, shhh. COVID is happening, and we need to raise funds, so let's keep the extension a secret. [NOTE: No rational person or program allows that extension, which makes me extremely suspect of how the whole program and decision-making operates, and makes me pessimistic that even if there is a change, it'll be a good one.] March 2022: Ewing has an abysmal season. So, we need change! So, we need to clean house, except for Ronny Thompson, who is actually going to help find some new assistants. Per reports, he reaches out to guys like Kevin Broadus, thinking that he's going to leave a head coaching role to join our program as an assistant to Patrick Ewing. And presumably, Ronny reached out to Nickelberry and Baldwin, but on the latter, not before we try to hire Jordan Brooks, who cannot bring his prized recruit along, so never mind. Oh, and by the way, we owe Ewing a ton of money, and the university at large might not like paying that out (if they even know, they probably don't, so let's not tell them!), so let's not even consider a parting of ways. Have to keep it on the down low. December 2022: Fast forward to today. The season begins terribly, despite better talent. What to do? In all likelihood, the powers that involved are trying to figure out ways to just keep the same train moving forward. If I had to guess, if Ewing somehow survives this season, you'll see one of the assistants fired or scapegoated, and the players thrown even more under the bus than they already are. Then we'll restock with new players (after all, cannot trade for them like in the NBA), and show them video, point out their mistakes, and act befuddled and confused as to what else can possibly be done to get better. This is a "post of the year" candidate. All 100% accurate, and absolutely mind-boggling. Thanks for giving us a much-needed good laugh.
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