hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Mar 14, 2022 22:34:51 GMT -5
You need an elite recruiter and then an elite defensive guru (Pack line or No Middle savant) And then you have to let go of Orr and bring in an offensive wiz. If we do all that and don't have Ewing coach at all we may be on to something.
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Mar 14, 2022 23:04:59 GMT -5
You need an elite recruiter and then an elite defensive guru (Pack line or No Middle savant) And then you have to let go of Orr and bring in an offensive wiz. If we do all that and don't have Ewing coach at all we may be on to something. This is exactly what we’re doing. Weekend at Bernie’s. Assistants having to prop up an ineffective coach who makes $3.5 plus per year.
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CTHoya08
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Bring back Izzo!
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Post by CTHoya08 on Mar 15, 2022 6:07:43 GMT -5
I would love to see Wright and Freeman move into coaching, but I don’t think either of them is a good candidate for a full assistant position now—for GU or for themselves. As others have noted, this is probably a stopgap thing. Either Ewing gets fired in a year or three, or we dump the assistants again in the same timeframe to shift blame. Chris is still playing, and Austin just started coaching at DeMatha. I wouldn’t wish having a doomed assistant role at GU as the only resume line on either of them.
I think that the best thing, long-term, would be for Freeman to get the head job at DeMatha (I think he’s interviewing for that?), and for Wright to get a DOBO-like position as he starts his career. Then, in a few years, either or both might be ready to be a full assistant (or maybe Freeman stays at DeMatha long-term and we have a feeder).
Honest question in this regard—what can or can’t the DOBO do re recruiting? I know that only the three assistants can go on the road to recruit, but how is that defined? If Chris Wright were our DOBO, would he be barred from going to watch WCAC games? I wouldn’t want to set the program up to get hit with ticky-tack NCAA violations because our DOBO went to watch his alma mater play or his buddy coach.
To be clear, I don’t think the goal here should be to hand out jobs to former players. Keeping it “in the family” hasn’t exactly worked out for us. But both of these guys are popular former players who are local and are openly lobbying for jobs. It seems like discussion of their names (here, if not in the TAC), is inevitable, so I thought I’d throw in my two cents.
What’s ironic about all of this is that the former player who is probably most qualified to take on an assistant role, based on actually having some experience, is . . . Patrick Ewing, Jr. [ducks].
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cas92
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Post by cas92 on Mar 15, 2022 6:17:08 GMT -5
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Post by RockawayHoya on Mar 15, 2022 8:02:25 GMT -5
A couple of good takeaway from this update. We had an analytics coordinator? Really? Find it hard to believe based on the quality of our game planning and attention to detail. I hope for his sake his output was being ignored by the staff. Hope that the strength and conditioning guy follows him next, along with Team Super Best Friends. Positive development that Broadus is unwilling to take a step back just to return. Not sold on Crouch moving up a level. He seems like a good guy and at least is active and puts in the effort. But not sure he has consistently delivered the results yet to warrant a promotion. Still would rather him being given a chance than 80-90% of that 2nd list. Back to the larger discussion... Agree that former HCs like Frank Martin, Cuonzo, Weber, etc. are probably not giving an assistants job a look here. The first two, especially, have enough of a resume to land another high major job if they want it. Weber is likely too old and probably just as likely to retire as he is to continue coaching. Response to the general comments of "why would anyone want to come here just to board a sinking ship?" Quote probably is relevant for a good number of guys on the first list, but for a guy like Jordan Brooks it'd be a clear promotion at a time when he might get fired any minute at his current job anyways. The other factors being money and the opportunity to come home for guys like Jones, Pegues, Webster, Skinn (to a lesser degree)... all guys who if you gave them a significant raise to come home, they'd probably at least take a phone call. If we aren't going to shell out the cash for a buyout, then we better be prepared to sink ~$2M into some proper assistants who know the area. With other staffs already beginning to take shape and the portal starting to heat up, if we're still here having this discussion next Monday, it will be too late. Just have to hope teams like Xavier/Va Tech/Ohio St. lose early this week. McD should already be calling up Pegues and PBS if they haven't already.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Mar 15, 2022 8:45:42 GMT -5
Pegues would be a great fit.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2022 9:04:57 GMT -5
SVG
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Mar 15, 2022 9:37:39 GMT -5
Honest question in this regard—what can or can’t the DOBO do re recruiting? I know that only the three assistants can go on the road to recruit, but how is that defined? If Chris Wright were our DOBO, would he be barred from going to watch WCAC games? I wouldn’t want to set the program up to get hit with ticky-tack NCAA violations because our DOBO went to watch his alma mater play or his buddy coach. The DOBO can recruit on campus. So if a recruit comes on campus for an unofficial or official visit, the DOBO can handle the recruiting responsibilities. They also usually will maintain the recruiting database and coordinate the logistics of visits. I haven't necessarily seen this officially, but it seems like a DOBO and a special assistant can do a little bit more than advertised. For instance, they are not allowed to initiate communications with recruits, but I believe they are not prohibited from responding to recruits. So if a recruit DM's a special assistant or DOBO on Twitter, that staff member is allowed to continue the communication. Also, I'm not positive, but I believe they can go to local games but not in a recruiting capacity, though they might be able to attend representing the school if they attend with the head coach or a recruiting assistant. Again, it gets fuzzy and I thought that was all prohibited, but we've certainly seen non-recruiting assistants doing those recruiting activities in recent years.
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playtyler
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Post by playtyler on Mar 15, 2022 10:43:05 GMT -5
Fire the assistants so we can pay top dollar for new assistants because we can't afford to fire Ewing and eat the $12 million. If things go badly next year or the year after we will have to let him go and we will have paid the $12 million, plus additional money for the shiny new assistants. At this point it is sunk costs. We are paying the money either way. In the interim we will lose tons of money from lost season tickets, gameday ticket sales, nike Georgetown gear, licensing, etc. I just don't see the financial side of this decision any more.
Of course I recognize the tremendous mistake that Jack made in giving the extension. And I have said before that should be the end of his career as President (soft landing, take a nice President Emeritus job and stay on teaching a class every semester). But the idea that we have to continue to pay for this mistake for the next few years because we can't afford a change is so sad. Georgetown basketball is a joke because we can't afford to fire him? We can't afford not to fire him.
The money we are going to lose over the next couple years balances out the cost of hiring a new coach. We don't have to raise the money to pay off Ewing. That is Jack's problem. He apparently has already determined that Georgetown can afford to pay that and for the shiny new assistants, even in an environment with NO TICKET SALES. The only new money we need is a new coaches salary. Aside from the possibility that this could mostly come from the lost revenue that a new coach might bring from excitement back in the program, this seems like something that the alumni could get behind and we might be able to find donors willing to pay the first couple years' salary of a young and exciting new coach.
I just can't believe that we are stuck in this situation solely because of the extension. And that we as a collective are accepting of this situation. I also don't think that financially it even makes sense. If we are talking $2 million for new assistants as stated above (my guess would be half that), that gets us most of the way to a new coach. We have to move on from Coach Ewing and literally everyone knows that. Except for the contract extension, it would have already been announced.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Mar 15, 2022 11:17:43 GMT -5
Fire the assistants so we can pay top dollar for new assistants because we can't afford to fire Ewing and eat the $12 million. If things go badly next year or the year after we will have to let him go and we will have paid the $12 million, plus additional money for the shiny new assistants. At this point it is sunk costs. We are paying the money either way. In the interim we will lose tons of money from lost season tickets, gameday ticket sales, nike Georgetown gear, licensing, etc. I just don't see the financial side of this decision any more. Of course I recognize the tremendous mistake that Jack made in giving the extension. And I have said before that should be the end of his career as President (soft landing, take a nice President Emeritus job and stay on teaching a class every semester). But the idea that we have to continue to pay for this mistake for the next few years because we can't afford a change is so sad. Georgetown basketball is a joke because we can't afford to fire him? We can't afford not to fire him. The money we are going to lose over the next couple years balances out the cost of hiring a new coach. We don't have to raise the money to pay off Ewing. That is Jack's problem. He apparently has already determined that Georgetown can afford to pay that and for the shiny new assistants, even in an environment with NO TICKET SALES. The only new money we need is a new coaches salary. Aside from the possibility that this could mostly come from the lost revenue that a new coach might bring from excitement back in the program, this seems like something that the alumni could get behind and we might be able to find donors willing to pay the first couple years' salary of a young and exciting new coach. I just can't believe that we are stuck in this situation solely because of the extension. And that we as a collective are accepting of this situation. I also don't think that financially it even makes sense. If we are talking $2 million for new assistants as stated above (my guess would be half that), that gets us most of the way to a new coach. We have to move on from Coach Ewing and literally everyone knows that. Except for the contract extension, it would have already been announced. I'm with you. The extension was a horrible financial decision for all the reasons you mention. Unfortunately, every signal out of McD right now is that they are unwilling to entertain a HC change. So the only slim chance we have to dig out of this hole is also unfortunately, to spend more money. Definitely not the most fiscally responsible path, but in the next 7-10 days it's the only path back to even being halfway OK on the court IF they make right moves. At the end of the day, they have to spend money to make money (I know, a concept completely foreign to our university's leadership). You just hope they'd do it much more wisely than they have been. Amazingly, I don't know how much the university necessarily cares about things like ticket sales, basketball donors, etc. If the hurt to their bottom line was that significant, by now I think they would have come to the same conclusion as us. They obviously haven't. If we're still in this position next week (no status on assistants or no significant hires that can move the needle quickly, etc.), I'll be on team fires and pitchforks along with the rest of you.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 15, 2022 11:26:20 GMT -5
Fire the assistants so we can pay top dollar for new assistants because we can't afford to fire Ewing and eat the $12 million. If things go badly next year or the year after we will have to let him go and we will have paid the $12 million, plus additional money for the shiny new assistants. At this point it is sunk costs. We are paying the money either way. In the interim we will lose tons of money from lost season tickets, gameday ticket sales, nike Georgetown gear, licensing, etc. I just don't see the financial side of this decision any more. Of course I recognize the tremendous mistake that Jack made in giving the extension. And I have said before that should be the end of his career as President (soft landing, take a nice President Emeritus job and stay on teaching a class every semester). But the idea that we have to continue to pay for this mistake for the next few years because we can't afford a change is so sad. Georgetown basketball is a joke because we can't afford to fire him? We can't afford not to fire him. The money we are going to lose over the next couple years balances out the cost of hiring a new coach. We don't have to raise the money to pay off Ewing. That is Jack's problem. He apparently has already determined that Georgetown can afford to pay that and for the shiny new assistants, even in an environment with NO TICKET SALES. The only new money we need is a new coaches salary. Aside from the possibility that this could mostly come from the lost revenue that a new coach might bring from excitement back in the program, this seems like something that the alumni could get behind and we might be able to find donors willing to pay the first couple years' salary of a young and exciting new coach. I just can't believe that we are stuck in this situation solely because of the extension. And that we as a collective are accepting of this situation. I also don't think that financially it even makes sense. If we are talking $2 million for new assistants as stated above (my guess would be half that), that gets us most of the way to a new coach. We have to move on from Coach Ewing and literally everyone knows that. Except for the contract extension, it would have already been announced. I'm with you. The extension was a horrible financial decision for all the reasons you mention. Unfortunately, every signal out of McD right now is that they are unwilling to entertain a HC change. So the only slim chance we have to dig out of this hole is also unfortunately, to spend more money. Definitely not the most fiscally responsible path, but in the next 7-10 days it's the only path back to even being halfway OK on the court IF they make right moves. At the end of the day, they have to spend money to make money (I know, a concept completely foreign to our university's leadership). You just hope they'd do it much more wisely than they have been. Amazingly, I don't know how much the university necessarily cares about things like ticket sales, basketball donors, etc. If the hurt to their bottom line was that significant, by now I think they would have come to the same conclusion as us. They obviously haven't. If we're still in this position next week (no status on assistants or no significant hires that can move the needle quickly, etc.), I'll be on team fires and pitchforks along with the rest of you. Is it known how long the extension is for? In terms of spending more money, if they fired coach they would have had to pay his salary and the new coach and assistants salaries. So if you look at it from that perspective there should be money to hire expensive assistants.
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Mar 15, 2022 12:13:12 GMT -5
Pegues would be a great fit. Pegues is interesting because Louisville is going to hire a new coach soon and he'll be on the market. If Mack gets another job he may follow. But theoretically he might be interested in an offer that would let him come back to the DMV at a high major. He's got the experience and the resume, he's at least worth a call. But... Pegues is a Morgan Wooten guy. The Georgetown/DeMatha friction thawed a bit during the JT3 years, but I wouldn't guess Pegues is in the "inner circle" or somebody who Ronny would call if left to his own devices. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he is in the mix.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by EtomicB on Mar 15, 2022 12:48:45 GMT -5
Im having a hard time figuring out how a coach without a clear identity in any facet of the game is going to interview established assistants?
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Post by johnnysnowplow on Mar 15, 2022 12:50:36 GMT -5
Im having a hard time figuring out how a coach without a clear identity in any facet of the game is going to interview established assistants? He’s not. Ronny is.
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kghoya
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Post by kghoya on Mar 15, 2022 13:15:40 GMT -5
I like to see the ideas presented here but sadly we all know none of the exciting/promising options are actual possibilities.
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Mar 15, 2022 13:25:40 GMT -5
No matter who the Hoyas hire, the risk of failure is great. I am more inclined to see them go for a young aggressive and ambitious assistant than a former head coach, even though I recognize the value of hiring a proven former coach over an assistant. I just keep thinking that there are no guarantees and just 5 years ago several of us pushed for Wade, Keatts and Christian. Wade turned out to be a sleaze, Keatts is ok for NC State but certainly not a rousing success and Christian is now unemployed. Obviously would prefer a clean start but if you are keeping Ewing would rather see an ambitious and aggressive young assistant.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Mar 15, 2022 13:29:09 GMT -5
Im having a hard time figuring out how a coach without a clear identity in any facet of the game is going to interview established assistants? He’s not. Ronny is. Do you think Ronny is working off a list of attributes given to him by PE at least? Did we ever hear what both Kirby and Waheed did besides recruit? Folks saying get a defensive guru sounds good but from hearing Coach PE’s pressers he seems to believe the issue is execution of the plan not the plan itself so how will he gel with a DC or OC for that matter?
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TC
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Post by TC on Mar 15, 2022 13:31:27 GMT -5
No matter who the Hoyas hire, the risk of failure is great. I am more inclined to see them go for a young aggressive and ambitious assistant than a former head coach, even though I recognize the value of hiring a proven former coach over an assistant. I just keep thinking that there are no guarantees and just 5 years ago several of us pushed for Wade, Keatts and Christian. Wade turned out to be a sleaze, Keatts is ok for NC State but certainly not a rousing success and Christian is now unemployed. Obviously would prefer a clean start but if you are keeping Ewing would rather see an ambitious and aggressive young assistant. On the other hand, the people the "search committee" were rumored to look at : Danny Hurley, Ed Cooley, Shaka Smart, Randy Bennett - all have been very successful. The JT2 favored candidates - Patrick Ewing and Tommy Amaker - not so much.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Mar 15, 2022 13:41:10 GMT -5
I'm with you. The extension was a horrible financial decision for all the reasons you mention. Unfortunately, every signal out of McD right now is that they are unwilling to entertain a HC change. So the only slim chance we have to dig out of this hole is also unfortunately, to spend more money. Definitely not the most fiscally responsible path, but in the next 7-10 days it's the only path back to even being halfway OK on the court IF they make right moves. At the end of the day, they have to spend money to make money (I know, a concept completely foreign to our university's leadership). You just hope they'd do it much more wisely than they have been. Amazingly, I don't know how much the university necessarily cares about things like ticket sales, basketball donors, etc. If the hurt to their bottom line was that significant, by now I think they would have come to the same conclusion as us. They obviously haven't. If we're still in this position next week (no status on assistants or no significant hires that can move the needle quickly, etc.), I'll be on team fires and pitchforks along with the rest of you. Is it known how long the extension is for? In terms of spending more money, if they fired coach they would have had to pay his salary and the new coach and assistants salaries. So if you look at it from that perspective there should be money to hire expensive assistants. Extension is for another 3 years, which when tacked on to the end of the 6th year of his initial 6-year contract, runs through 2026. From what I've read, it looks like this: 2022-2023: $3.6M 2023-2024: $3.95M 2024-2025: $3.95M 2025-2026: $3.95M
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TC
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Post by TC on Mar 15, 2022 14:16:24 GMT -5
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