prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 22, 2021 13:53:56 GMT -5
While some suggest the latest surge may trigger the return of such protocols, the college athletics world—including some medical experts—believes the opposite: Protocols should be further relaxed in response to a strain that, while more contagious, has shown far less severity of illness than its troubling predecessor, delta. In fact, NCAA leaders have been in conversation with officials from the CDC about adjusting the mandatory 10-day quarantine for young people who test positive, multiple physicians and college administrators tell Sports Illustrated. Their argument? Vaccinated young people are showing either no symptoms or very mild symptoms, and their symptoms are subsiding within two to three days. “The question that needs to be asked is, if the risk of severe illness—hospitalization, death, dying—is not there, if we’re not seeing that, how is this different than the common cold?” asks Jeff Dugas, Troy’s team doctor and an orthopedic surgeon in Birmingham who chairs the Sun Belt’s COVID-19 advisory panel. “Do we need to be freaking out just because it is a variant of COVID-19? Do we need to apply the same rules or change the rules?” www.si.com/college/2021/12/22/college-sports-omicron-protocolsBirmingham? www.google.com/amp/s/www.al.com/news/2021/12/alabama-school-covid-cases-up-as-hospitalizations-climb-50-state-death-rate-2nd-highest-in-us.html%3foutputType=amp
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 22, 2021 13:57:33 GMT -5
While some suggest the latest surge may trigger the return of such protocols, the college athletics world—including some medical experts—believes the opposite: Protocols should be further relaxed in response to a strain that, while more contagious, has shown far less severity of illness than its troubling predecessor, delta. In fact, NCAA leaders have been in conversation with officials from the CDC about adjusting the mandatory 10-day quarantine for young people who test positive, multiple physicians and college administrators tell Sports Illustrated. Their argument? Vaccinated young people are showing either no symptoms or very mild symptoms, and their symptoms are subsiding within two to three days. “The question that needs to be asked is, if the risk of severe illness—hospitalization, death, dying—is not there, if we’re not seeing that, how is this different than the common cold?” asks Jeff Dugas, Troy’s team doctor and an orthopedic surgeon in Birmingham who chairs the Sun Belt’s COVID-19 advisory panel. “Do we need to be freaking out just because it is a variant of COVID-19? Do we need to apply the same rules or change the rules?” www.si.com/college/2021/12/22/college-sports-omicron-protocolsBirmingham? www.google.com/amp/s/www.al.com/news/2021/12/alabama-school-covid-cases-up-as-hospitalizations-climb-50-state-death-rate-2nd-highest-in-us.html%3foutputType=ampHow many deaths are vaccinated 18-24 year old highly conditioned athletes?
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Post by RockawayHoya on Dec 22, 2021 14:13:34 GMT -5
"Big East rules in force for this season mandate that any team which cannot field a minimum seven scholarship players must forfeit its game in the conference standings."
No one can say for certain how many COVID positives the team currently has, so I won't go there. And I'm definitely not going to get into a debate about how serious the virus should be taken (very seriously, IMO) or what the priority should be (player/staff safety first, as always). But there's a lot of way to poke holes in that rule and I don't believe the powers that may be really thought it through as well as they should have.
If I read this right, you could theoretically have enough injuries to the point where you'd have 6 healthy scholarship players and have to forfeit despite 0 COVID positives? If you have walk-ons who can legitimately be rotation-level players in desperate situations (Azinge, G. Muresan in previous years, etc.), they don't matter and can't be given a chance to contribute? And let's not even begin discussing in-season transfers... the '19-20 team would've had to forfeit 2/3rd of the season under these rules. God forbid we have another incident. Does it get to a point where injured guys have to fake being healthy (dress but don't play) so we can just even play the games?
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 22, 2021 14:16:32 GMT -5
How many deaths are vaccinated 18-24 year old highly conditioned athletes? That’s a myopic way to look at it. It’s about the community. The virus once again is overloading hospitals in that area. Think of those hospital workers and their families. Think about all the people affected, and by that I don’t mean those losing out on being entertained by college basketball.
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 22, 2021 14:23:10 GMT -5
How many deaths are vaccinated 18-24 year old highly conditioned athletes? That’s a myopic way to look at it. It’s about the community. The virus once again is overloading hospitals in that area. Think of those hospital workers and their families. Think about all the people affected, and by that I don’t mean those losing out on being entertained by college basketball. Hospitals are not being “overloaded” like they were in early-2020. Vaccines and effective therapeutics exist. Politically the ruling class cannot live in a world of perpetual shutdowns. If there are certain areas that are having specific issues, adjust, but there shouldn’t be a one-size fits all policy. The Big East is going to get left behind by other conferences yet again, if it insists on continuing with its poorly conceived policy.
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SDHoya
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Post by SDHoya on Dec 22, 2021 14:25:11 GMT -5
While some suggest the latest surge may trigger the return of such protocols, the college athletics world—including some medical experts—believes the opposite: Protocols should be further relaxed in response to a strain that, while more contagious, has shown far less severity of illness than its troubling predecessor, delta. In fact, NCAA leaders have been in conversation with officials from the CDC about adjusting the mandatory 10-day quarantine for young people who test positive, multiple physicians and college administrators tell Sports Illustrated. Their argument? Vaccinated young people are showing either no symptoms or very mild symptoms, and their symptoms are subsiding within two to three days. “The question that needs to be asked is, if the risk of severe illness—hospitalization, death, dying—is not there, if we’re not seeing that, how is this different than the common cold?” asks Jeff Dugas, Troy’s team doctor and an orthopedic surgeon in Birmingham who chairs the Sun Belt’s COVID-19 advisory panel. “Do we need to be freaking out just because it is a variant of COVID-19? Do we need to apply the same rules or change the rules?” www.si.com/college/2021/12/22/college-sports-omicron-protocolsBirmingham? www.google.com/amp/s/www.al.com/news/2021/12/alabama-school-covid-cases-up-as-hospitalizations-climb-50-state-death-rate-2nd-highest-in-us.html%3foutputType=ampIts still early days, but while hospitalizations are creeping up nationwide, they are nowhere near the delta peak earlier in 2021. In New York state, which is experiencing the daily highest case numbers since this began, hospitalizations are a less than a quarter of the delta peak. NY COVID Numbers South Africa and the UK, which are a bit ahead of the US, experienced similar trends. I think that by the end of the year, we will have a much better idea of what exactly this variant is. It seems to me that caution is warranted now--and thus a brief circuit breaker type pause in the season similar to the NHL would make sense. But that thereafter, if the South Africa trends are along the lines of what is seen here and the rest of the world, I think that society moves into a new phase where the focus is on vaccination and protection of the most vulnerable and away from measures aimed at brining down raw case numbers in less vulnerable segments (e.g., college students and pro athletes).
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Post by johnnysnowplow on Dec 22, 2021 14:40:32 GMT -5
How many deaths are vaccinated 18-24 year old highly conditioned athletes? That’s a myopic way to look at it. It’s about the community. The virus once again is overloading hospitals in that area. Think of those hospital workers and their families. Think about all the people affected, and by that I don’t mean those losing out on being entertained by college basketball. Almost 90% of the cases resulting in serious illness, hospitalization or death are unvaccinated people. The vaccines exist. The boosters exist. As a society we cannot continue to be paralyzed by the fear that a virus will continue to bring harm to people who refuse to utilize the tools to fight it. There are people who die from the flu every year, many of whom probably refuse to get a flu shot. We don’t shut down society because people get the flu. It’s time to start the push to return to normal life. Callous take? Yes probably. That said, to bring this back to the conversation about the big East, I agree that this policy is likely going to destroy the season if they don’t walk it back. And I still maintain that every league that doesn’t adopt the NFLs policy is going to have massive hurdles to clear to try and complete their seasons with any semblance of normalcy. Whether you agree with the NFLs stance or not, objectively, it’s probably the only way to ensure we don’t see the level of postponements and cancellations that we’re already seeing
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 22, 2021 14:42:38 GMT -5
"Big East rules in force for this season mandate that any team which cannot field a minimum seven scholarship players must forfeit its game in the conference standings." No one can say for certain how many COVID positives the team currently has, so I won't go there. And I'm definitely not going to get into a debate about how serious the virus should be taken (very seriously, IMO) or what the priority should be (player/staff safety first, as always). But there's a lot of way to poke holes in that rule and I don't believe the powers that may be really thought it through as well as they should have. If I read this right, you could theoretically have enough injuries to the point where you'd have 6 healthy scholarship players and have to forfeit despite 0 COVID positives? If you have walk-ons who can legitimately be rotation-level players in desperate situations (Azinge, G. Muresan in previous years, etc.), they don't matter and can't be given a chance to contribute? And let's not even begin discussing in-season transfers... the '19-20 team would've had to forfeit 2/3rd of the season under these rules. God forbid we have another incident. Does it get to a point where injured guys have to fake being healthy (dress but don't play) so we can just even play the games? It also can be manipulated say by a .500 team decimated by injuries left with inexperienced players who have to face an away game at a historically difficult place to win versus a team full of 22/23 year-olds. A forfeit doesn’t count for NCAAT purposes. Imagine if that team then had to immediately follow that trip with a visit to another historically difficult place to play far away from home. It would mean two forfeits (i.e., no NCAAT losses) of games where that hypothetical team’s coach has won only once in various tries, while that team prepares for a home game. It would give that hypothetical team a much needed 10-day break and time to work the new guys.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 22, 2021 14:44:19 GMT -5
That’s a myopic way to look at it. It’s about the community. The virus once again is overloading hospitals in that area. Think of those hospital workers and their families. Think about all the people affected, and by that I don’t mean those losing out on being entertained by college basketball. Hospitals are not being “overloaded” like they were in early-2020. Vaccines and effective therapeutics exist. Politically the ruling class cannot live in a world of perpetual shutdowns. If there are certain areas that are having specific issues, adjust, but there shouldn’t be a one-size fits all policy. The Big East is going to get left behind by other conferences yet again, if it insists on continuing with its poorly conceived policy. I think the BE will adjust its policy.
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 22, 2021 14:45:07 GMT -5
"Big East rules in force for this season mandate that any team which cannot field a minimum seven scholarship players must forfeit its game in the conference standings." No one can say for certain how many COVID positives the team currently has, so I won't go there. And I'm definitely not going to get into a debate about how serious the virus should be taken (very seriously, IMO) or what the priority should be (player/staff safety first, as always). But there's a lot of way to poke holes in that rule and I don't believe the powers that may be really thought it through as well as they should have. If I read this right, you could theoretically have enough injuries to the point where you'd have 6 healthy scholarship players and have to forfeit despite 0 COVID positives? If you have walk-ons who can legitimately be rotation-level players in desperate situations (Azinge, G. Muresan in previous years, etc.), they don't matter and can't be given a chance to contribute? And let's not even begin discussing in-season transfers... the '19-20 team would've had to forfeit 2/3rd of the season under these rules. God forbid we have another incident. Does it get to a point where injured guys have to fake being healthy (dress but don't play) so we can just even play the games? It also can be manipulated say by a .500 team decimated by injuries left with inexperienced players who have to face an away game at a historically difficult place to win versus a team full of 22/23 year-olds. A forfeit doesn’t count for NCAAT purposes. Imagine if that team then had to immediately follow that trip with a visit to another historically difficult place to play far away from home. It would mean two forfeits (i.e., no NCAAT losses) of games where that hypothetical team’s coach has won only once in various tries, while that team prepares for a home game. It would give that hypothetical team a much needed 10-day break and time to work the new guys. Ready for an extremely unpopular take - what “proof” must such a team show that it has been ravaged by COVID? Is the forfeiting team required to provide positive tests? What kind of positive tests - rapid/PCR? How many positive tests/person over how long a period of time?
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 22, 2021 14:47:01 GMT -5
It also can be manipulated say by a .500 team decimated by injuries left with inexperienced players who have to face an away game at a historically difficult place to win versus a team full of 22/23 year-olds. A forfeit doesn’t count for NCAAT purposes. Imagine if that team then had to immediately follow that trip with a visit to another historically difficult place to play far away from home. It would mean two forfeits (i.e., no NCAAT losses) of games where that hypothetical team’s coach has won only once in various tries, while that team prepares for a home game. It would give that hypothetical team a much needed 10-day break and time to work the new guys. Ready for an extremely unpopular take - what “proof” must such a team show that it has been ravaged by COVID? Is the forfeiting team required to provide positive tests? What kind of positive tests - rapid/PCR? How many positive tests/person over how long a period of time? provide proof?! Joke of the day!
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 22, 2021 15:01:49 GMT -5
Ready for an extremely unpopular take - what “proof” must such a team show that it has been ravaged by COVID? Is the forfeiting team required to provide positive tests? What kind of positive tests - rapid/PCR? How many positive tests/person over how long a period of time? provide proof?! Joke of the day! What's interesting is, if the Big East adjusts its policy as you and I both believe it will have to, will Providence even want to play Georgetown at a later date? The forfeit benefits Providence as well. Beating Georgetown at home will not impress the NCAA Tournament committee and losing would be devestating. A "forfeit due to Georgetown's COVID" is a win-win this week for both teams.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Dec 22, 2021 15:14:31 GMT -5
"Big East rules in force for this season mandate that any team which cannot field a minimum seven scholarship players must forfeit its game in the conference standings." No one can say for certain how many COVID positives the team currently has, so I won't go there. And I'm definitely not going to get into a debate about how serious the virus should be taken (very seriously, IMO) or what the priority should be (player/staff safety first, as always). But there's a lot of way to poke holes in that rule and I don't believe the powers that may be really thought it through as well as they should have. If I read this right, you could theoretically have enough injuries to the point where you'd have 6 healthy scholarship players and have to forfeit despite 0 COVID positives? If you have walk-ons who can legitimately be rotation-level players in desperate situations (Azinge, G. Muresan in previous years, etc.), they don't matter and can't be given a chance to contribute? And let's not even begin discussing in-season transfers... the '19-20 team would've had to forfeit 2/3rd of the season under these rules. God forbid we have another incident. Does it get to a point where injured guys have to fake being healthy (dress but don't play) so we can just even play the games? It also can be manipulated say by a .500 team decimated by injuries left with inexperienced players who have to face an away game at a historically difficult place to win versus a team full of 22/23 year-olds. A forfeit doesn’t count for NCAAT purposes. Imagine if that team then had to immediately follow that trip with a visit to another historically difficult place to play far away from home. It would mean two forfeits (i.e., no NCAAT losses) of games where that hypothetical team’s coach has won only once in various tries, while that team prepares for a home game. It would give that hypothetical team a much needed 10-day break and time to work the new guys. If there's one thing this team is good at, it's conjuring up COVID-break magic to prep for the 4 games in 4 days trick! May as well play along, I guess.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 22, 2021 16:51:54 GMT -5
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 22, 2021 17:02:05 GMT -5
If the Big East follows this policy, I expect the Georgetown - Providence game not to get rescheduled, for the reasons outlined earlier. Providence doesn’t benefit from the game, even if it wins, and Ewing avoids another Big East loss on his brutal 5-year resume.
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Post by hoyaatheart55 on Dec 22, 2021 17:45:59 GMT -5
If the Big East follows this policy, I expect the Georgetown - Providence game not to get rescheduled, for the reasons outlined earlier. Providence doesn’t benefit from the game, even if it wins, and Ewing avoids another Big East loss on his brutal 5-year resume. Boya you were doing so well with your common sense takes earlier in the thread. Why ruin it with another Ewing dig lol??
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 22, 2021 18:16:45 GMT -5
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 24, 2021 15:54:24 GMT -5
"Big East rules in force for this season mandate that any team which cannot field a minimum seven scholarship players must forfeit its game in the conference standings." No one can say for certain how many COVID positives the team currently has, so I won't go there. And I'm definitely not going to get into a debate about how serious the virus should be taken (very seriously, IMO) or what the priority should be (player/staff safety first, as always). But there's a lot of way to poke holes in that rule and I don't believe the powers that may be really thought it through as well as they should have. If I read this right, you could theoretically have enough injuries to the point where you'd have 6 healthy scholarship players and have to forfeit despite 0 COVID positives? If you have walk-ons who can legitimately be rotation-level players in desperate situations (Azinge, G. Muresan in previous years, etc.), they don't matter and can't be given a chance to contribute? And let's not even begin discussing in-season transfers... the '19-20 team would've had to forfeit 2/3rd of the season under these rules. God forbid we have another incident. Does it get to a point where injured guys have to fake being healthy (dress but don't play) so we can just even play the games? It also can be manipulated say by a .500 team decimated by injuries left with inexperienced players who have to face an away game at a historically difficult place to win versus a team full of 22/23 year-olds. A forfeit doesn’t count for NCAAT purposes. Imagine if that team then had to immediately follow that trip with a visit to another historically difficult place to play far away from home. It would mean two forfeits (i.e., no NCAAT losses) of games where that hypothetical team’s coach has won only once in various tries, while that team prepares for a home game. It would give that hypothetical team a much needed 10-day break and time to work the new guys. My hypothetical team is looking more and more like GU (and without the forfeits)... 😷
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 29, 2021 14:30:23 GMT -5
Providence fans speculating that open dates that may work for a reschedule include Thursday, 2/3 or Friday, 2/4 - would make for an interesting back-to-back with the Friars scheduled to be at Capital One Arena on Sunday, 2/6.
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MassHoya
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Post by MassHoya on Jan 1, 2022 12:33:13 GMT -5
The game is rescheduled for January 20 at 5:00 PM in Providence.
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