SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 9, 2021 18:19:56 GMT -5
Except that he doesn't have a poor efficiency rating on the season. Year to date, his efficiency rating is 122.4 by Kenpom which would put him in the top 15% of all NCAA starters and with far higher usage than most players with higher offensive ratings. Efficiency ratings are averaged at 15.0. Not sure what stat you are looking at. His is just above 15 which is poor for a starter especially if you consider our SOS is below 300 and he's coming off a ridiculous shooting performance. What metric are you talking about? PER? (And his current PER from sports ref is 19). PER is an outdated metric that has a high usage bias. Regardless of the name, it's not a pure efficiency metric, and is not a very good overall metric, either, frankly. Rice's offensive rating is 122. That's a very efficient number. His usage isn't even that low. If Rice has an issue, it's defensive.
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HoyaChris
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Post by HoyaChris on Dec 9, 2021 19:01:22 GMT -5
Efficiency ratings are averaged at 15.0. Not sure what stat you are looking at. His is just above 15 which is poor for a starter especially if you consider our SOS is below 300 and he's coming off a ridiculous shooting performance. What metric are you talking about? PER? (And his current PER from sports ref is 19). PER is an outdated metric that has a high usage bias. Regardless of the name, it's not a pure efficiency metric, and is not a very good overall metric, either, frankly. Rice's offensive rating is 122. That's a very efficient number. His usage isn't even that low. If Rice has an issue, it's defensive. For reference, Otto Porter's full season offensive rating for his All American season in 2012-3 was 118.8.
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Dec 9, 2021 19:05:24 GMT -5
We have plenty to argue about on here Kaiden should be an open and shut discussion. I have never seen anyone like him. Out of 8 games I would say he has only had 1 "normal" shooting game. He is either bad or great. He plays no D, isn't a great rebounder, is going to have more turnovers than assists yet we need him. If we overachieve at all this year it's going to be because he gets hot and carries us to a few wins we otherwise wouldn't get. If I had to guess in the end his overall effect evens out the good with the bad and we are just along for the ride. There is no reason to break him down game by game because he is what he is and we know what that is.
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thedragon
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Post by thedragon on Dec 9, 2021 19:15:01 GMT -5
We have plenty to argue about on here Kaiden should be an open and shut discussion. I have never seen anyone like him. Out of 8 games I would say he has only had 1 "normal" shooting game. He is either bad or great. He plays no D, isn't a great rebounder, is going to have more turnovers than assists yet we need him. If we overachieve at all this year it's going to be because he gets hot and carries us to a few wins we otherwise wouldn't get. If I had to guess in the end his overall effect evens out the good with the bad and we are just along for the ride. There is no reason to break him down game by game because he is what he is and we know what that is. I do think the one area that Kaiden could actually improve on successfully is knowing when he should be a decoy. Good teams are going to face guard him and tell that man not to help off. Ewing made a comment in his post-game presser yesterday that Kaidens shooting is key for Aminu because his best skill is to get downhill. Kaiden learning when to simply space instead of look for the shot will be a big help as the season progresses.
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Dec 9, 2021 20:20:14 GMT -5
I guess we are just going to have to live with his inconsistency and hope there are more good nights than bad. Hopefully no more 0 for 10's, but I also don't expect any more nights like last night. That was crazy.
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DallasHoya
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Post by DallasHoya on Dec 9, 2021 20:56:51 GMT -5
The nice thing at least from great games to complete duds to everything in between he is shooting 45% overall from 3. To put in perspective he was a 35% shooter for 4 years at the Citadel. Don't think that changes that at Citadel he was more of a volume shooter but maybe he has a career year with us and that would be extremely welcomed. Along those lines I heard Barkley on Inside the NBA recently talking about a player (mind too old to remember who but a star on his team) who had gone for 30 pts that night but went for 10 the prior night and Barkely's quote was something like "that's not a good way to average 20". Granted as opposed to Rice the player he was talking about was the #1 or #2 option on the team, but the point was that the inconsistency was a killer, even if the average looked good. He and Shaq were talking about Porzingis.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Dec 9, 2021 22:08:30 GMT -5
I think Kaiden has shown that if Patrick is going to continue to run the type of offense he's been running (no signs of changing), he's going to need to be recruiting guys like Kaiden heavily and regularly. Clearly, he knows this as he picked up a commitment from Anglin. If he can round that out with long, agile guys that can be drilled in defense, we'd have a much better shot at being competitive.
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saxagael
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Post by saxagael on Dec 9, 2021 22:22:11 GMT -5
I think Kaiden has shown that if Patrick is going to continue to run the type of offense he's been running (no signs of changing), he's going to need to be recruiting guys like Kaiden heavily and regularly. Clearly, he knows this as he picked up a commitment from Anglin. If he can round that out with long, agile guys that can be drilled in defense, we'd have a much better shot at being competitive. So, like Bass?
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Dec 9, 2021 22:24:47 GMT -5
I think Kaiden has shown that if Patrick is going to continue to run the type of offense he's been running (no signs of changing), he's going to need to be recruiting guys like Kaiden heavily and regularly. Clearly, he knows this as he picked up a commitment from Anglin. If he can round that out with long, agile guys that can be drilled in defense, we'd have a much better shot at being competitive. So, like Bass? Yessir!
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wsdhoya
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Post by wsdhoya on Dec 10, 2021 0:15:03 GMT -5
If you recruit a guy to be a shooter you usually want a guy that can consistently hit open threes. Rice is like a microwave. When he's on he gets hot real quick, but when he's not he doesn't perform any other function. There is a reason Jay Wright, Danny Hurley, Shaka Smart, and Kevin Willard don't recruit guys like him. Mamu the Eastern European forward that just graduated from Seton Hall after last year was so much better of a player than Rice. Could he shoot the ball like Rice does? No. But he could hit an open shot at a decent clip, and more importantly he helped his team win by rebounding, playing defense, being able to post up and show different looks, etc. He didn't rely on one singular, streaky attribute to positively effect a game. Could score around the rim, kick it out of the post, rebound, etc.
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Post by hoyaatheart55 on Dec 10, 2021 0:26:39 GMT -5
Our hopes of beating Cuse probably rely on Rice having a good game. He may attempt 20 against the zone lol.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 10, 2021 2:13:43 GMT -5
If you recruit a guy to be a shooter you usually want a guy that can consistently hit open threes. Rice is like a microwave. When he's on he gets hot real quick, but when he's not he doesn't perform any other function. There is a reason Jay Wright, Danny Hurley, Shaka Smart, and Kevin Willard don't recruit guys like him. Mamu the Eastern European forward that just graduated from Seton Hall after last year was so much better of a player than Rice. Could he shoot the ball like Rice does? No. But he could hit an open shot at a decent clip, and more importantly he helped his team win by rebounding, playing defense, being able to post up and show different looks, etc. He didn't rely on one singular, streaky attribute to positively effect a game. Could score around the rim, kick it out of the post, rebound, etc. If he had all those skills, he wouldn’t be at Georgetown.
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wsdhoya
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Post by wsdhoya on Dec 10, 2021 2:35:22 GMT -5
If you recruit a guy to be a shooter you usually want a guy that can consistently hit open threes. Rice is like a microwave. When he's on he gets hot real quick, but when he's not he doesn't perform any other function. There is a reason Jay Wright, Danny Hurley, Shaka Smart, and Kevin Willard don't recruit guys like him. Mamu the Eastern European forward that just graduated from Seton Hall after last year was so much better of a player than Rice. Could he shoot the ball like Rice does? No. But he could hit an open shot at a decent clip, and more importantly he helped his team win by rebounding, playing defense, being able to post up and show different looks, etc. He didn't rely on one singular, streaky attribute to positively effect a game. Could score around the rim, kick it out of the post, rebound, etc. If he had all those skills, he wouldn’t be at Georgetown. What kind of mentality is that? If a commuter school like Seton Hall can turn into a perennial Big East contender what does is say that Georgetown fans reject the idea that we could possibly land a good player? You people seem to be forgetting what Georgetown is, or I guess now what it was.
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Post by hoyaatheart55 on Dec 10, 2021 3:49:55 GMT -5
Why the random comparison to Mamu though? Mamu was co-conference player of the year last year. Not in the same stratosphere as Rice.
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Post by hoyaatheart55 on Dec 10, 2021 3:54:26 GMT -5
Can’t really think of a good recent Big East comparison to rice. Trying to think of guys that chucked a lot of threes and Andrew Rowsey from Marquette popped in my head first but he averaged 5 assists a game his senior year so he wasn’t just a shooter.
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wsdhoya
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Post by wsdhoya on Dec 10, 2021 4:05:28 GMT -5
Can’t really think of a good recent Big East comparison to rice. Trying to think of guys that chucked a lot of threes and Andrew Rowsey from Marquette popped in my head first but he averaged 5 assists a game his senior year so he wasn’t just a shooter. Here’s a hint. You won’t find many other players like Rice in the Big East because he’s not good enough for the Big East. You wouldn’t find a whole lot of Malcolm Wilson’s either.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Dec 10, 2021 6:12:16 GMT -5
Why the random comparison to Mamu though? Mamu was co-conference player of the year last year. Not in the same stratosphere as Rice. Mamu also wasn't some late edition, graduate student added to the team to help stitch together a roster for the next season. Mamu was a four-year guy who got BETTER during his time at Seton Hall. And here's the thing...Rice wouldn't be as needed six or so months ago during recruiting or even right now if this program could keep its rosters intact rather than losing a barrage of guys with eligibility left virtually every season. But because the team can't hold onto guys for one reason or another Ewing has to turn to graduate players, temporary solutions, to slow the bleeding. Often times it has worked. Rice may not be that type of guy but he does bring with him the singular skill of being an unstoppable deep shooter WHEN HE IS ON. Unfortunately its not a skill that can be relied on for most games. If it could, even with his poor defense, he would have gotten looks from pro teams.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Dec 10, 2021 7:29:29 GMT -5
If he had all those skills, he wouldn’t be at Georgetown. What kind of mentality is that? If a commuter school like Seton Hall can turn into a perennial Big East contender what does is say that Georgetown fans reject the idea that we could possibly land a good player? You people seem to be forgetting what Georgetown is, or I guess now what it was. Because he would be in the NBA, not playing a 5th year of college basketball.
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guru
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Post by guru on Dec 10, 2021 11:07:37 GMT -5
Can’t really think of a good recent Big East comparison to rice. Trying to think of guys that chucked a lot of threes and Andrew Rowsey from Marquette popped in my head first but he averaged 5 assists a game his senior year so he wasn’t just a shooter. Here’s a hint. You won’t find many other players like Rice in the Big East because he’s not good enough for the Big East. You wouldn’t find a whole lot of Malcolm Wilson’s either. Have you figured out efficiency ratings yet?
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Dec 10, 2021 11:18:11 GMT -5
I respect others' opinions but am not certain there is enough sample size on Rice to say he is not good enough for the BE. Not even sure what that means, despite my love for BE basketball. I can think of many teams who have rolled out one-dimensional players and used them very productively. Eight games in and two great shooting performances and a couple of clunkers. His defense is not good--certainly not unique to him on this team or many other BE teams I have watched this year. His handle is weak but not horrible, certainly no worse than many others. Let's see how it plays out and hopefully Rice finds some consistency.
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