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Post by happyhoya1979 on Aug 29, 2019 10:49:50 GMT -5
what you are missing is that Biden taxes all the capital gains at ordinary income tax rates, which is why I developed the sliding scale in my other post. The full appreciated value is taxed at ordinary rates. Capital gains flow through as income to be applied at the prevailing income tax rates.
With the house for instance, the first 250 k would be taxed at 45.3% the dollars between 1000 and about 300k would be taxed around 40% and the dollars between 84K and about 300 would be taxed at 24%.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,853
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Post by EtomicB on Aug 29, 2019 11:29:09 GMT -5
what you are missing is that Biden taxes all the capital gains at ordinary income tax rates, which is why I developed the sliding scale in my other post. The full appreciated value is taxed at ordinary rates. Capital gains flow through as income to be applied at the prevailing income tax rates. With the house for instance, the first 250 k would be taxed at 45.3% the dollars between 1000 and about 300k would be taxed around 40% and the dollars between 84K and about 300 would be taxed at 24%. Please post the link that you're getting this information from because this level of detail definitely isn't in the WSJ article which says he'll double the CG rate for folks who earn over a million dollars as well as repeal the stepped-up provision... I'll post this article from 7/31/19 again, where it states Biden will tax earners of 1 million or more at the ordinary tax rate. Anyone below the million-dollar threshold will be taxed at the normal CG rates which are: 0% for those in the 0 - 39K range 15% for those in the 39 - 434K range 20% for those above 434 taxfoundation.org/joe-biden-tax-proposals/Biden’s plan would first raise taxes on capital gains by treating them as ordinary income for those earning more than $1 million. On his website he said he would also raise the top rate on ordinary income back up to 39.6 percent from the 37 percent rate put in place by the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. As such, the top rate on long-term gains would nearly double from 23.8 percent to 43.4 percent. Biden’s campaign cites a Joint Committee on Taxation report on tax expenditures which estimates that the special lower rate on capital gains and dividends reduces federal revenue by $127 billion each.
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Post by happyhoya1979 on Aug 29, 2019 12:24:49 GMT -5
Then there a clear conflict between the WSJ (see the link at a previous post) and the Tax foundation.
The difference is one of the degree of pain the middle class will now be taking. If the tax foundation is right, then Biden is effectively rolling back the estate tax to rates of 39.9% above 1 million, and 15% from 39k to $1 million. Even Barack O'Bama protected about $3.2 million for comparison. Both scenarios are horrific attacks on the middle class and the underlying property rights that are essential to democracy and making a person free and independent.
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Aug 29, 2019 12:28:19 GMT -5
Then there a clear conflict between the WSJ (see the link at a previous post) and the Tax foundation. The difference is one of the degree of pain the middle class will now be taking. If the tax foundation is right, then Biden is effectively rolling back the estate tax to rates of 39.9% above 1 million, and 15% from 39k to $1 million. Even Barack O'Bama protected about $3.2 million for comparison. Both scenarios are horrific attacks on the middle class and the underlying property rights that are essential to democracy and making a person free and independent. Yes, but they allow for those who have earned and produced to again pay their “fair share”. Why tax only once that which can be taxed twice or thrice?
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,201
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Post by hoya9797 on Aug 29, 2019 12:32:24 GMT -5
When you’re dead and rotting away, you’ll never know the difference.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,853
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Post by EtomicB on Aug 29, 2019 13:00:11 GMT -5
Then there a clear conflict between the WSJ (see the link at a previous post) and the Tax foundation. The difference is one of the degree of pain the middle class will now be taking. If the tax foundation is right, then Biden is effectively rolling back the estate tax to rates of 39.9% above 1 million, and 15% from 39k to $1 million. Even Barack O'Bama protected about $3.2 million for comparison. Both scenarios are horrific attacks on the middle class and the underlying property rights that are essential to democracy and making a person free and independent. This is another post of pure speculation on your part... The bottom line to me is the fact that you can't support your point that ALL capital gains will be taxed at ordinary tax rates in the Biden plan with any hard evidence... Get back to us when you can because I'd really like to see it...
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Post by happyhoya1979 on Aug 29, 2019 13:37:14 GMT -5
What is undeniable is Biden's direct assault on the middle class any way you slice it. It is only whether it is parkside mauling(Tax foundation version) or a shotgun wounding (WSJ version).
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Filo
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,906
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Post by Filo on Aug 29, 2019 13:50:49 GMT -5
What is undeniable is Biden's direct assault on the middle class any way you slice it. It is only whether it is parkside mauling(Tax foundation version) or a shotgun wounding (WSJ version). Are you a Fox News commentator? Save the histrionics for the Fox News watchers and you may get a better discussion around here. It would be funny if it wasn't so ridiculous. - poverty to these people's old age and penury to their upper middle class grandchildren - explicit declaration of war on the suburban upper middle class - breathtaking - I can't believe my eyes each day as I go to the web site - My worst nightmare - back door estate tax and a particularly cruel one - I am actually astonished at what I saw today - horrific attacks on the middle class and the underlying property rights that are essential to democracy and making a person free and independent direct assault on the middle class any way you slice it - parkside mauling(Tax foundation version) or a shotgun wounding
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Aug 29, 2019 14:18:15 GMT -5
Don’t worry.
Within the next couple of months, Biden will forget he said it...
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Post by happyhoya1979 on Aug 29, 2019 14:35:19 GMT -5
God, I hope you are right and he changes tune after Lizzie/Bernie are disposed of. Please make it at least be Barack Obama's if it can't be JFK's Democrat Party.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Aug 29, 2019 16:24:27 GMT -5
God, I hope you are right and he changes tune after Lizzie/Bernie are disposed of. Please make it at least Barack Obama's if it can't be JFK's Democrat Party. That's pretty funny. Since JFK's proposed top marginal rate was 65% and the corporate rate was in the 40s.
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Post by happyhoya1979 on Aug 29, 2019 16:27:03 GMT -5
JFK actually championed the reduction in the top marginal rate 90 to 70 something percent.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Aug 29, 2019 16:28:05 GMT -5
JFK actually championed the reduction in the top marginal rate 90 to 70 something percent. That's right. 90s from Ike.
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Post by happyhoya1979 on Aug 29, 2019 16:35:45 GMT -5
What is undeniable is Biden's direct assault on the middle class any way you slice it. It is only whether it is parkside mauling(Tax foundation version) or a shotgun wounding (WSJ version). Are you a Fox News commentator? Save the histrionics for the Fox News watchers and you may get a better discussion around here. It would be funny if it wasn't so ridiculous. - poverty to these people's old age and penury to their upper middle class grandchildren - explicit declaration of war on the suburban upper middle class - breathtaking - I can't believe my eyes each day as I go to the web site - My worst nightmare - back door estate tax and a particularly cruel one - I am actually astonished at what I saw today - horrific attacks on the middle class and the underlying property rights that are essential to democracy and making a person free and independent direct assault on the middle class any way you slice it - parkside mauling(Tax foundation version) or a shotgun wounding No, I don't have that kind of talent. I labor away in one of the learned professions, not journalism. When the leading Presidential candidate proposes taxing all inherited wealth over $1 million at 40%, that is a sea change. It is extraordinary. It is alarming. It needs to be properly and eloquently described for its implications. Around these parts in Northern Virginia, two 25 year GS15s with TSPs and a 4 bed house are millionaires+ and yes, they would and should be shocked to know the leading Democrat would tax their heirs at 40% if their plane happened to go down on their next vacation.
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Post by badgerhoya on Aug 29, 2019 17:21:17 GMT -5
Are you a Fox News commentator? Save the histrionics for the Fox News watchers and you may get a better discussion around here. It would be funny if it wasn't so ridiculous. - poverty to these people's old age and penury to their upper middle class grandchildren - explicit declaration of war on the suburban upper middle class - breathtaking - I can't believe my eyes each day as I go to the web site - My worst nightmare - back door estate tax and a particularly cruel one - I am actually astonished at what I saw today - horrific attacks on the middle class and the underlying property rights that are essential to democracy and making a person free and independent direct assault on the middle class any way you slice it - parkside mauling(Tax foundation version) or a shotgun wounding No, I don't have that kind of talent. I labor away in one of the learned professions, not journalism. When the leading Presidential candidate proposes taxing all inherited wealth over $1 million at 40%, that is a sea change. It is extraordinary. It is alarming. It needs to be properly and eloquently described for its implications. Around these parts in Northern Virginia, two 25 year GS15s with TSPs and a 4 bed house are millionaires+ and yes, they would and should be shocked to know the leading Democrat would tax their heirs at 40% if their plane happened to go down on their next vacation. ZOMG. What will those folks do?!? What will we as a society do when folks like this haven't had to pay the tax since (running calculations) 2003. It's almost like Biden is saying something to the effect of... Reagan is dead. Let his economic strategies die too, as R-based tax plans haven't worked in 30+ years.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by tashoya on Aug 29, 2019 19:45:31 GMT -5
How I wish this registered at all in terms of the real problems in this country. We'd be the Land of Opportunity, indeed.
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ksf42001
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
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Post by ksf42001 on Aug 30, 2019 8:28:13 GMT -5
All I learned from this thread is that the definition of "middle-class" has been stretched beyond all recognition...
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,201
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Post by hoya9797 on Aug 30, 2019 10:10:37 GMT -5
All I learned from this thread is that the definition of "middle-class" has been stretched beyond all recognition... I’ve learned that the soup kitchen business in high end suburbs is going to be a growth opportunity soon.
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 10,480
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Post by Elvado on Aug 30, 2019 10:14:49 GMT -5
Let’s just keep taking from those who produce...
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,201
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Post by hoya9797 on Aug 30, 2019 11:34:06 GMT -5
Let’s just keep taking from those who produce... Dead people produce very little.
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