jwp91
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,040
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Post by jwp91 on Mar 23, 2019 16:20:44 GMT -5
It always gets me when I read that an AD making 7 figures hires a search firm to do his job for him and present him a list of the 5 most obvious candidates. It covers his a**. How can he be held responsbie when he chose from the search firm’s slate?!!!!
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,642
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Mar 23, 2019 17:03:57 GMT -5
Exactly, that’s how the world works.
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kettlehill
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,149
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Post by kettlehill on Mar 23, 2019 17:28:15 GMT -5
Vandy, being in the SEC, probably has a priority for a solid coach who is “above reproach”. If JT3 could get them middle of the pack SEC and periodic tournament teams, he is their man. Remember, they don’t have much of a history for great basketball, so expectations are mild. Perfect for JT3 and I hope he gets the job ( if indeed he wants it) and does very well.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 24, 2019 8:17:45 GMT -5
I can't see JT3 in Nashville, in the SEC, coaching against big time cheating recruiting schools.
Ivy League, East Coast or West Coast seem like a better fit.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 24, 2019 15:08:44 GMT -5
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blueandgray
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,762
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Post by blueandgray on Mar 24, 2019 20:09:20 GMT -5
I’m hearing possibly Cal.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 24, 2019 21:49:12 GMT -5
I’m hearing possibly Cal. Berkley would be a great fit. Checks all the boxes for him and the school. Vanderbilt would be a mistake.
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SDHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,339
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Post by SDHoya on Mar 24, 2019 22:14:55 GMT -5
I’m hearing [next school to fire coach].
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Post by iheartdurenbros on Mar 24, 2019 22:15:57 GMT -5
I’m hearing possibly Cal. Berkley would be a great fit. Checks all the boxes for him and the school. Vanderbilt would be a mistake. Agreed. Of all the possibilities for him, I like Cal the best.
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LCPolo18
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,406
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Post by LCPolo18 on Mar 26, 2019 10:05:33 GMT -5
Slightly OT, but I didn't realize his brother was the coach of the Go Go.
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sead43
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 796
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Post by sead43 on Mar 26, 2019 12:50:36 GMT -5
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Post by RockawayHoya on Mar 26, 2019 15:51:19 GMT -5
Well, Isaac Copeland has officially killed two coaches during his career. The Nebraska job just opened up.
Really surprised Miles' deep understanding and use of analytics couldn't save him here. * rolls eyes *
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Post by iheartdurenbros on Mar 26, 2019 16:15:47 GMT -5
Well, Isaac Copeland has officially killed two coaches during his career. The Nebraska job just opened up. Really surprised Miles' deep understanding and use of analytics couldn't save him here. * rolls eyes * Your take is nasty. Not sure it belongs on this thread but since you took it there. Copeland could have been the difference since Nebraska was a tournament team before he tore his ACL.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Mar 26, 2019 16:56:57 GMT -5
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by RBHoya on Mar 26, 2019 17:11:00 GMT -5
Putting the money part aside, I really think St. Joes is a good fit for him. Recruiting-wise he could still leverage all of the connections he made while at Georgetown and Princeton. And I think he could succeed in the A-10. There's really no dominant team with a stranglehold on that conference, so with a good recruiting class or two and maybe a couple of transfers they could immediately compete to win the league. Vanderbilt just seems like setting him up to fail. They make sense from the "strong academics" angle, but that's about it. There are just so many huge schools with enormous athletics budgets in that league that succeeding at Vandy seems like it would have long odds. I know they've had good teams in the not-so-distant past, but the league is so strong right now, it just seems like such a tall task. I'm sure they pay much better than St Joes, and I'm sure St. Joes wouldn't compare to what he made at GU either, but if he can succeed and maybe parlay it into a better gig in a few years it might be worth it. Or, settle in as a team that's perennially in the top few teams in the conference and enjoy the job security that comes with it.
It's not impossible for a coach to get axed from a high major team and then land at another high major job without any stops in between. Tubby Smith did it a few times, Billy Gillespie post-Kentucky, Tom Crean's doing it right now, Ben Howland, Rick Barnes, Bruce Weber...I'm sure there are many others. But I feel like most of those guys came from much more high profile schools (Kentucky, Indiana, UCLA), by and large. It's hard for me to see a guy who was fired from Georgetown after not making it out of the first weekend for a decade would excite the fan base at an SEC school and create enough positive buzz among recruits and donors to compete with the Kentuckys and Floridas and Tennessees of the world. No disrespect to JTIII, it just seems like his resume would be underwhelming to Vandy in the same way that it was underwhelming to us at the end. At somewhere like St. Joes or W&M, I think it would go over much differently, as he'd have some instant name value at either of those levels. A better comparison/model for him might be something more like what Dawkins is doing at UCF after being bounced from Stanford. He took a job at a school that was decently positioned to compete in a league where there was room for improvement, and now he was an inch away from going to the Sweet 16. If he has another good year next year, he'll be back in the conversation for SEC & ACC jobs, if he wants to be. I think JT3 could certainly put something like that together at the A-10 level, and he's still young enough that his next stop doesn't necessarily have to be his last. He's 53--by comparison Howland was 58 when he went to Mississippi State, Barnes was about 60 when he started at Tennessee, Larranaga was 61 when he started at Miami, etc.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by TC on Mar 26, 2019 17:33:45 GMT -5
No disrespect to JTIII, it just seems like his resume would be underwhelming to Vandy in the same way that it was underwhelming to us at the end. "I took a team to the Final Four with no All American recruits* and coached for 13 years without any hint of scandal at a school with academic focus" is a great resume for the schools being mentioned here. * Yeah, Vernon Macklin, but c'mon.
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by RBHoya on Mar 26, 2019 19:54:20 GMT -5
No disrespect to JTIII, it just seems like his resume would be underwhelming to Vandy in the same way that it was underwhelming to us at the end. "I took a team to the Final Four with no All American recruits* and coached for 13 years without any hint of scandal at a school with academic focus" is a great resume for the schools being mentioned here. * Yeah, Vernon Macklin, but c'mon. I think it's great for St. Joe's and definitely W&M, but in the SEC? I don't see it. It's true that Vandy is sort of a bottom tier SEC job, but I'd be shocked if their fans were thrilled about JT3. They don't see themselves as bottom tier and want to be competing with Coach Cal, Bruce Pearl, Will Wade and the rest of the big budget SEC. From that perspective, I don't think JTIII has a high enough ceiling, and they'd probably want somebody younger who can at least sell hope. An unbiased college hoops observer might say that III is a solid fit at Vandy, but I don't expect him to generate a ton of buzz, which is what they need to stand any chance in that league. I could be wrong, I haven't perused Vandy message boards or Vandy Twitter. But I'd guess their temperature would be somewhere around what ours was about Tommy Amaker. And I know you're strongly pro-JT3. I am too, and want him to go somewhere where he's going to succeed. I think he'd do great in the A-10. But pitted up against the colossal budgets and moral bankruptcy that dominate the SEC, it's hard for me to see that going well for him, at least at this juncture. I will root for him wherever he ends up, and I don't want to see him get slaughtered. Also FWIW Freeman, Wright and Monroe were all McD All-Americans. Summers and Porter were Jordan Brand All Americans, which in its day was sort of the 1A high school all star game. He had his share of All Americans, and the only guys he was really able to win with were landed by his predecessor (recognizing that 2007 was a blend, since Wallace, Summers, Ewing Jr. and Sapp were his).
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CTHoya08
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Bring back Izzo!
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Post by CTHoya08 on Mar 27, 2019 6:30:25 GMT -5
The 2007 team had five(!) future NBA players, including a lottery pick and a future all-star. I'm not trying to suggest that JTIII didn't have something to do with them becoming NBA players, or otherwise sell him short. And I really want him to succeed in his next stop.* But the idea that the 2007 team lacked talent is silly.
*This is part of the reason why I don't want him to go to Vanderbilt. I like rooting against the Commodores to needle my law school classmates, and would hate to watch my coach be the one to turn the program around.
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Post by hoyas big supporter on Mar 27, 2019 7:44:36 GMT -5
Many in this thread seem to be assuming JT3 today is the JT3 of the last few years at GU. From what I’ve gathered, he is continuing to evolve and imho is more than good enough for a program like Vandy. Did all the more seasoned coaches mentioned in this thread find their permanent home during their first or second stint? Don’t think so
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Mar 27, 2019 9:03:43 GMT -5
Many in this thread seem to be assuming JT3 today is the JT3 of the last few years at GU. From what I’ve gathered, he is continuing to evolve and imho is more than good enough for a program like Vandy. Did all the more seasoned coaches mentioned in this thread find their permanent home during their first or second stint? Don’t think so A difficult leap for an AD in the SEC! I don't know anything about the Vandy fan base. Is it like GU's that the team plays to half-empty stadiums unless it's a hated/big opponent or is it a rabid, demanding fan base? JT3 will need to match the fan base's energy, not the other way around. Will the AD and that fan base allow JT3 to not give any explanations for losing games other than generalities? It will be his first time as a coach without a protector. Think of the difference between a JT3 press conference and a Pat press conference. Also, is he willing to put the long hours in recruiting required to compete for a championship or just to be competitive? Remember that other than Tremont, he was drawing a blank in his last recruiting efforts and he wasn't visible in the summer circuit and in high school gyms. Finally, how does he explain the Julian Vaughn interview (JT3 quitting on practice prep for Ohio game the night before the game)? I agree with RB in that he should go to SJU or W&M for a few years. We're seeing plenty of teams with short leashes, so there will be attractive options for him every year.
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