TC
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Post by TC on Mar 8, 2018 12:26:15 GMT -5
This. They just didn't have the horses. And anyone who thinks that he's on the typical 3-4 year cycle to prove himself does not understand how things work at Georgetown. We fired JT3 the year we opened a training facility with his father's name on it. "Georgetown is different" doesn't work like that anymore - if he loses the fanbase in 3 years, he'll lose his recruiting class and he'll be gone. "Georgetown is different" worked in the era before social media. I doubt the administration can hold the line against fan sentiment nowadays.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2018 12:26:43 GMT -5
Thread: Prediction HOW MANY BIG EAST WINS THIS YEAR?
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playtyler
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Post by playtyler on Mar 8, 2018 12:34:38 GMT -5
Uh... Here is a list of JT III recruits that refute your generalizations above. Other than Cameron and DSR, not sure who you really are talking about. Please advise.
Ewing Jr./Sapp/Macklin/Summers/J.Rivers/Freeman/Wright/Clark/Sims/Benimon/H.Thompson/Ayegba/Bowen/Starks/Whittington/Porter/Hopkins/Trawick/Peak/Copeland/Derrickson/K.Johnson/Mosely/Pryor
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Big Dog
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 8, 2018 13:10:56 GMT -5
The thing is, with different luck they're 7-11 or 8-10 in conference which I think would have stunned most everybody. Five wins seemed like the appropriate O/U going into the season and even into conference play, and five wins is what they got. Then they lost to a team on its home floor that has beaten Duke and Villanova this season.
Bottom line is there was good and bad this year and we don't really have any answers about Patrick as a coach yet.
I will say that one thing was definitely a success: I'm not sure that any 15-15, 5-13 team has ever received so much national publicity. That's a commentary on Ewing and the power of the NYC media even today, but also on the incredible work Chris Grosse does.
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lda05816
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Post by lda05816 on Mar 8, 2018 13:21:57 GMT -5
Evaluating Ewing is somewhat difficult given the sample size and the state of the program when he took over. With that said, here are my 2 cents on his coaching and recruiting thus far.
1) Recruiting: Not sure how anyone can be upset with what he's done with recruiting so far. He inherited a struggling program with multiple open schollies in the Spring. He won a head to head with Maryland (and Broadus) for a Top 75 local kid, which is an area we have struggled in recent years. Pickett has so much potential and player development is something NBA assistants are responsible for. I look for a big leap from him in year 2. Blair looks like a 1 trick pony at this point but with better shot selection I could see a high 30s or low 40s 3PT FG% from him. Dickerson provided much need depth in the backcourt even if it took him 20+ games to figure it out. In the 2018 class to pull a top 75 kid in LeBlanc from the South is impressive, even with the Owens connection. He has the look of the player this defense has been missing since Trawick. A guy who can guard multiple positions and sets the tone. Carter and McClung aren't highly recruited but Mac at least will bring some excitement to the fan base and hopefully is a guard who can actually make a few plays. Obviously what he does this Spring to address the guard position will be critical to next year's success. The 2019 class is huge given the talent departure next year and will be a measuring stick for Ewing and the staff. Overall I think he's done an excellent job for a 1st year head coach given what he inherited.
2) Coaching. Offensively he has definitely freed this team from the doldrums of the Princeton offense. I thought he showed nice wrinkles throughout the year to pre-existing sets. He was creative in getting the ball to MD and JG in positions to score. He deserves some of the blame for the continued 2nd half struggles but the lack of a playmaking guard killed this team. Sometimes a player needs to just go get a bucket when things breakdown and this roster is void of such player. Also becomes much easier to take away post players late in games than it is to keep the ball out of a guards hands. I would expect this team to score plenty next year.
Defensively I thought we would be better by the end of the season. There were simple things like downing a ball screen that show he's teaching the fundamentals but overall the guards especially just couldn't stay in front of anyone. And for all the good from JG on offense, his defense really struggles. He cannot defend a PNR to save his life. This is the area where LeBlanc will be so important next year and why it may be tough to keep him off the floor. This is the area I hope to see the most improvement from Year 1 to Year 2.
These thoughts are jumbled together but overall I think his 1st year was solid. He inherited much less talent than 3 did so this will take longer than last go around. Next year is huge for the momentum of the program. If they make the tournament it would give him some results to sell to the recruits and show he has the ability to get it done.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Mar 8, 2018 13:37:18 GMT -5
Sleepy, you are wrong. JT III's defenses were really good. Sometimes in the top 10, even adjusted for pace. Just in the last few years he recruited defensive minded players, Whittington, Porter, Hopkins, Trawick, Sims, K. Johnson, Moses, Agau (hard to argue that Monroe, Darrickson, Govan, Peak, Copeland, Hayes were only offensive players). I will grant you DSR, Cameron, Pryor, Josh Smith, White and I am sure I am forgetting someone. Point is that your statement is factually wrong. JTIII recruited good/great defenders/athletes and his defenses were good. Please know that I wanted JTIII fired. Not a JT III defender. Just can't take the false statement that "staff recruited players with great talent on the offensive side of the ball without doing much on the D End." There is almost no evidence to back that up. III did not recruit great athletes for the most part. Especially on the perimeter. That is why we kept getting bounced early in the NCAA tournament, we couldn't keep up with guards. Quick-footed teams always gave III teams' problems. III rarely recruited above-the-rim or quick/explosive players. That is why Rodney Pryor's dunks stood out so much last year. It was a breath of fresh air. III usually recruited pudgy/stocky type guards or long/wing players for the most part. Above the rim and swift, change of direction of type players were rare under III. Guess we have an entirely different few of both the schemes that he ran and the talent that he had. whittington and Porter I'll give you. Sims never decided to play until he was a senior and was average at best Hopkins was little more than a warm body and a better than average shot blocker with little speed to challenge in a help situation, never mind that he showed little motor for 3 of his four years Johnson is not a good defensive player he's totally lost can;t find his man follows the ball never mind that he continually blames his teammates for his short comings. Trawick at the one which he played quite a bit was abysmal against anyone with an inkling of quickness and was horrible in closing out on the three great effort but not athletic enough. He looked good was tough but a long way from the defensive stopper I thought he would be. May be Moses showed something in the Kenner league not in season. llls defense when good was based upon schemes and switching defenses from Man to zone to a variety of match up zones that hid the individual deficiencies. Not suprised of your choices here only one guard which is really where our defensive issues have manifest themselves over the last few years. But we can go back Freeman had some defensive skills well trained but lacked quickness defensively, Wright short reach but a lot of effort not especially quick. Really the evidence is clear.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Mar 8, 2018 13:45:27 GMT -5
Yeah, the only guard the could defend that III recruited was Jeremiah Rivers (Ray Reed was recruited by Esh).
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lda05816
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Post by lda05816 on Mar 8, 2018 14:15:41 GMT -5
Evaluating Ewing is somewhat difficult given the sample size and the state of the program when he took over. With that said, here are my 2 cents on his coaching and recruiting thus far. 1) Recruiting: Not sure how anyone can be upset with what he's done with recruiting so far. He inherited a struggling program with multiple open schollies in the Spring. He won a head to head with Maryland (and Broadus) for a Top 75 local kid, which is an area we have struggled in recent years. Pickett has so much potential and player development is something NBA assistants are responsible for. I look for a big leap from him in year 2. Blair looks like a 1 trick pony at this point but with better shot selection I could see a high 30s or low 40s 3PT FG% from him. Dickerson provided much need depth in the backcourt even if it took him 20+ games to figure it out. In the 2018 class to pull a top 75 kid in LeBlanc from the South is impressive, even with the Owens connection. He has the look of the player this defense has been missing since Trawick. A guy who can guard multiple positions and sets the tone. Carter and McClung aren't highly recruited but Mac at least will bring some excitement to the fan base and hopefully is a guard who can actually make a few plays. Obviously what he does this Spring to address the guard position will be critical to next year's success. The 2019 class is huge given the talent departure next year and will be a measuring stick for Ewing and the staff. Overall I think he's done an excellent job for a 1st year head coach given what he inherited. 2) Coaching. Offensively he has definitely freed this team from the doldrums of the Princeton offense. I thought he showed nice wrinkles throughout the year to pre-existing sets. He was creative in getting the ball to MD and JG in positions to score. He deserves some of the blame for the continued 2nd half struggles but the lack of a playmaking guard killed this team. Sometimes a player needs to just go get a bucket when things breakdown and this roster is void of such player. Also becomes much easier to take away post players late in games than it is to keep the ball out of a guards hands. I would expect this team to score plenty next year. Defensively I thought we would be better by the end of the season. There were simple things like downing a ball screen that show he's teaching the fundamentals but overall the guards especially just couldn't stay in front of anyone. And for all the good from JG on offense, his defense really struggles. He cannot defend a PNR to save his life. This is the area where LeBlanc will be so important next year and why it may be tough to keep him off the floor. This is the area I hope to see the most improvement from Year 1 to Year 2. These thoughts are jumbled together but overall I think his 1st year was solid. He inherited much less talent than 3 did so this will take longer than last go around. Next year is huge for the momentum of the program. If they make the tournament it would give him some results to sell to the recruits and show he has the ability to get it done. A quick add to the defensive portion. He cut down the fouling significantly which at least gave this team a chance to win unlike a lot of games last year. This also made the games watchable which is a huge upgrade from last year.
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guru
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Post by guru on Mar 8, 2018 14:39:35 GMT -5
Evaluating Ewing is somewhat difficult given the sample size and the state of the program when he took over. With that said, here are my 2 cents on his coaching and recruiting thus far. 1) Recruiting: Not sure how anyone can be upset with what he's done with recruiting so far. He inherited a struggling program with multiple open schollies in the Spring. He won a head to head with Maryland (and Broadus) for a Top 75 local kid, which is an area we have struggled in recent years. Pickett has so much potential and player development is something NBA assistants are responsible for. I look for a big leap from him in year 2. Blair looks like a 1 trick pony at this point but with better shot selection I could see a high 30s or low 40s 3PT FG% from him. Dickerson provided much need depth in the backcourt even if it took him 20+ games to figure it out. In the 2018 class to pull a top 75 kid in LeBlanc from the South is impressive, even with the Owens connection. He has the look of the player this defense has been missing since Trawick. A guy who can guard multiple positions and sets the tone. Carter and McClung aren't highly recruited but Mac at least will bring some excitement to the fan base and hopefully is a guard who can actually make a few plays. Obviously what he does this Spring to address the guard position will be critical to next year's success. The 2019 class is huge given the talent departure next year and will be a measuring stick for Ewing and the staff. Overall I think he's done an excellent job for a 1st year head coach given what he inherited. 2) Coaching. Offensively he has definitely freed this team from the doldrums of the Princeton offense. I thought he showed nice wrinkles throughout the year to pre-existing sets. He was creative in getting the ball to MD and JG in positions to score. He deserves some of the blame for the continued 2nd half struggles but the lack of a playmaking guard killed this team. Sometimes a player needs to just go get a bucket when things breakdown and this roster is void of such player. Also becomes much easier to take away post players late in games than it is to keep the ball out of a guards hands. I would expect this team to score plenty next year. Defensively I thought we would be better by the end of the season. There were simple things like downing a ball screen that show he's teaching the fundamentals but overall the guards especially just couldn't stay in front of anyone. And for all the good from JG on offense, his defense really struggles. He cannot defend a PNR to save his life. This is the area where LeBlanc will be so important next year and why it may be tough to keep him off the floor. This is the area I hope to see the most improvement from Year 1 to Year 2. These thoughts are jumbled together but overall I think his 1st year was solid. He inherited much less talent than 3 did so this will take longer than last go around. Next year is huge for the momentum of the program. If they make the tournament it would give him some results to sell to the recruits and show he has the ability to get it done. A quick add to the defensive portion. He cut down the fouling significantly which at least gave this team a chance to win unlike a lot of games last year. This also made the games watchable which is a huge upgrade from last year. definitely true. the fouling seemed way, way down. Across the whole league, actually. The games this season were so much more entertaining than those of the past 3-4 seasons as to be unrecognizable as the same sport.
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saxagael
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Post by saxagael on Mar 8, 2018 14:51:44 GMT -5
Yeah, the only guard the could defend that III recruited was Jeremiah Rivers (Ray Reed was recruited by Esh). Do you have Trawick as a forward?
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Post by iheartdurenbros on Mar 8, 2018 15:11:41 GMT -5
Yeah, the only guard the could defend that III recruited was Jeremiah Rivers (Ray Reed was recruited by Esh). Do you have Trawick as a forward? Jason Clark too
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Mar 8, 2018 15:47:07 GMT -5
Do you have Trawick as a forward? Jason Clark too Clark was a good athlete. Only 6'2", but had a long wing-span. Trawick is a g/f known for his toughness and grit.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Mar 8, 2018 15:55:48 GMT -5
Do you have Trawick as a forward? Jason Clark too Are you saying Jason Clark was a good defender. I beg to differ. He was one of the weakest on ball defenders to play here. Aside from the fact that through his junior year he was regularly subbed defense for offense. He had no virtual lateral movement on D always chased with his given speed and played the position standing straight up. Always shocked me that an all met poy was so basically defecient defensively. I'll give you his length and long arms allowed him to come up with a surprisingly high percentage of loose balls especially out of traffic. And for about 6 weeks during conference play as a senior he suddenly turned into a pretty good defender. In retrospect to me 3s reliance upon Clark stands out to me today as a point where we recruited offense at the expense of a more multi demensional player.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Mar 8, 2018 16:10:30 GMT -5
Are you saying Jason Clark was a good defender. I beg to differ. He was one of the weakest on ball defenders to play here. Aside from the fact that through his junior year he was regularly subbed defense for offense. He had no virtual lateral movement on D always chased with his given speed and played the position standing straight up. Always shocked me that an all met poy was so basically defecient defensively. I'll give you his length and long arms allowed him to come up with a surprisingly high percentage of loose balls especially out of traffic. And for about 6 weeks during conference play as a senior he suddenly turned into a pretty good defender. In retrospect to me 3s reliance upon Clark stands out to me today as a point where we recruited offense at the expense of a more multi demensional player. For most of Jason Clark's time at Georgetown he was a really good shooter, but his defense was pretty bad. He did get a lot better by the time he was a senior, to his credit, but not only was he a poor defender, but his handle was really bad too. I actually recall a St. John's game where he was up against a St. John's guard, and the guard totally blew past him and left Clark in the dust. However, I disagree with the person above on Hopkins. Hopkins was never a good player on offense, and played way too big a role on that side of the ball (and I do fault JT3 for this - it was clear Hopkins was awful on offense, yet the JT3 offense - especially in 2013 - insisted on going through him anyway). That said, his defense, especially by senior year, was quite good, and well better than anything we have had since. If you could combine Hopkins' defense with Govan's offense, we'd have one of the best players in the league.
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mdtd
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Post by mdtd on Mar 8, 2018 17:46:34 GMT -5
How could anyone call for a guys job who had one ear of experience? He won games and coached well. Player development was huge too. The fact that anyone calls for his job actually hurts. There are clear pieces of evidence showing he's a good coach. The system revolves around guards and intense defense, which wasn't on the roster. Ewing acknowledged that and literally said this team will struggle day one. It blows my mind that this is a conversation. Give him time which is literally the first thing he asked for after accepting this position. Please give him time. This team showed potential. Jut let him coach and give him some time.
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smokeyjack
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Post by smokeyjack on Mar 8, 2018 17:56:33 GMT -5
How could anyone call for a guys job who had one ear of experience? He won games and coached well. Player development was huge too. The fact that anyone calls for his job actually hurts. There are clear pieces of evidence showing he's a good coach. The system revolves around guards and intense defense, which wasn't on the roster. Ewing acknowledged that and literally said this team will struggle day one. It blows my mind that this is a conversation. Give him time which is literally the first thing he asked for after accepting this position. Please give him time. This team showed potential. Jut let him coach and give him some time. Did anyone actually “call for Ewing’s job?” I think opinions vary pretty widely on what caliber of job he did this season (from great to pedestrian and maybe even a poor or two), but I didn’t see anyone advocating for his ouster. I think at this point we can all agree that would be absurd. This is absolutely the time to grade his performance over the season. The next coach at any level for any team to escape criticism will be the first.
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Post by veilside21 on Mar 8, 2018 17:59:21 GMT -5
As a coach you cant really have both sides unless you are brad stevens and pop not everyone is on that level.
Deantoni is not a defensive coach but they have surrounded him with elite defenders in tucker, mbah amoute and capella plus cp3
Ewing in my eyes is an offensive coach what did inherit the top guys both suck in defense.
Pickett showed development both sides of the court so that means Ewing is trying to instill defense he just doesnt have the players to do it as of right now.
its okay to be hard on ewing but when both of our bigs sucks on the defensive end and our PG's suck at handling the ball only a few can make major strides with that.
But Ewing showed he can run the offense better
next year he added McClung who i think is a decent defender , leblanc who is a stud ...
depending on our last 2 recruits we will find out how things will play
do not forget we also have malinowski who i think will be key when pickett is on the bench.
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justsaying
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Post by justsaying on Mar 8, 2018 18:20:50 GMT -5
First of all I normally bypass such threads with such titles. Given that the year is over I decided I read a few posts in this thread. If those who think that Coach E can't coach then I would have to wonder about their knowledge of the GAME. I've seen the best, Wooden, McGuire, Smith, Attles, Riley, ... etc make mistakes every now and then. I've heard coach Smith admit he should not have stalled so early to lose in a Championship game (by the way that was in the second half of the game). To see players at GU finally show a measure of progressive development that we have been missing for sometime to me is refreshing. And to talk about recruiting this coach have basically one class and that was on short notice. And if the NCAA does not come down on some of these schools and their practices or if rules do not change in some fashion the recruiting part still may have some disadvantages because we try to do it the clean way. I'm sorry to say a lot of the schools that are getting top recruits because they are are paying. This is nothing new but it has gotten much worse in the last 5 - 10 year, for me I've been saying this for years, some acquaintances I know would often talk about players they know at some of these top schools and the perks they were getting.
I saw Coach E simplify his thinking and sets to accommodate his personnel, I would hope that these knowledgeable ones noticed that. I'm not sure what is being related to say adjustments are not made. He tried zone in a few instances and did not bode well for his group and why would a coach attempt to run multiple sets for a given player if the player has difficulties in scoring, yes at the beginning of the game for certain players you may do that to see if you may get something out of them for the night. In many second halves (coming from the locker room) what I saw were certain players would come out with a passive attitude than in the first, now cuts, passes, drives become tentative. That is not the coach, that is players learning their footing in the game. We've had freshmen with more of an attack attitude than a few guys on the roster (these ones were recruited before this coach came here). Let's see what happens if he can get a few of the players that fits his style. Just like the last game we basically had 2 guys playing offensively against 5, the other 3 combinations were very tentative. I sure the younger guys will be more aggressive the next time around. And defensively we have known for the last few years we were somewhat deficient in this area with some of our players that was here before Coach got here. But I see encouragement from especially some of our younger guys and I saw a huge improvement in Derrickson. Again I'm not sure what adjustments we are expecting at this time. I think you will see more adjusting as coach get his like minded players.
As let's think about how Ponds scored quite a few on Duke and various other teams. Does that mean Coach K got out coached especially in the second half. Usually threads such as this has a certain agenda, what that agenda is I will leave that to others.
As all GOOD coaches would say, You need talent to win and I think we are slowly turning the ship, laying a foundation to head in that winning direction. And if we are lucky and get that special type player(s) then the ship will be steaming forward.
I probably will not be back to this thread anytime soon.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Mar 8, 2018 18:34:28 GMT -5
Evaluating Ewing is somewhat difficult given the sample size and the state of the program when he took over. With that said, here are my 2 cents on his coaching and recruiting thus far. 1) Recruiting: Not sure how anyone can be upset with what he's done with recruiting so far. He inherited a struggling program with multiple open schollies in the Spring. He won a head to head with Maryland (and Broadus) for a Top 75 local kid, which is an area we have struggled in recent years. Pickett has so much potential and player development is something NBA assistants are responsible for. I look for a big leap from him in year 2. Blair looks like a 1 trick pony at this point but with better shot selection I could see a high 30s or low 40s 3PT FG% from him. Dickerson provided much need depth in the backcourt even if it took him 20+ games to figure it out. In the 2018 class to pull a top 75 kid in LeBlanc from the South is impressive, even with the Owens connection. He has the look of the player this defense has been missing since Trawick. A guy who can guard multiple positions and sets the tone. Carter and McClung aren't highly recruited but Mac at least will bring some excitement to the fan base and hopefully is a guard who can actually make a few plays. Obviously what he does this Spring to address the guard position will be critical to next year's success. The 2019 class is huge given the talent departure next year and will be a measuring stick for Ewing and the staff. Overall I think he's done an excellent job for a 1st year head coach given what he inherited. 2) Coaching. Offensively he has definitely freed this team from the doldrums of the Princeton offense. I thought he showed nice wrinkles throughout the year to pre-existing sets. He was creative in getting the ball to MD and JG in positions to score. He deserves some of the blame for the continued 2nd half struggles but the lack of a playmaking guard killed this team. Sometimes a player needs to just go get a bucket when things breakdown and this roster is void of such player. Also becomes much easier to take away post players late in games than it is to keep the ball out of a guards hands. I would expect this team to score plenty next year. Defensively I thought we would be better by the end of the season. There were simple things like downing a ball screen that show he's teaching the fundamentals but overall the guards especially just couldn't stay in front of anyone. And for all the good from JG on offense, his defense really struggles. He cannot defend a PNR to save his life. This is the area where LeBlanc will be so important next year and why it may be tough to keep him off the floor. This is the area I hope to see the most improvement from Year 1 to Year 2. These thoughts are jumbled together but overall I think his 1st year was solid. He inherited much less talent than 3 did so this will take longer than last go around. Next year is huge for the momentum of the program. If they make the tournament it would give him some results to sell to the recruits and show he has the ability to get it done. Great post. Re: coaching, in addition to lowering the fouling rate that other posters have already mentioned, you can tell there are certain fundamentals that have improved in a lot of guys. Bigs no longer bring the ball down and put in the floor near the rim; they just go up with it more often than not. Guys don't get the ball poked out of their hands nearly as much either. We don't set nearly as many illegal screens as we used to. Our FT shooting has improved. Our fast breaks have improved a little bit, although we're still far from where we need to be. And while we don't understand time/situation on the offensive end with working the clock to our advantage in late game situations, we definitely do a better job of this on the defensive end. Case in point: when we get down late (think 8-10 points with 5 min to go), we will actually press now! It used to infuriate me watching JTIII's teams sit back in the same situation and just let the other team bleed 25-30 seconds off the clock every possession. The clock management and in-game adjustments needs to improve, as well as executing plays out of timeouts, but I'll give him a slight pass due to having such poor options in the backcourt. If we are having the same issues next year with Mac/Malinowski/grad transfer or spring recruit in the backcourt, my criticism will be much more harsh.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Mar 8, 2018 19:07:31 GMT -5
Sleepy, you are wrong. JT III's defenses were really good. Sometimes in the top 10, even adjusted for pace. Just in the last few years he recruited defensive minded players, Whittington, Porter, Hopkins, Trawick, Sims, K. Johnson, Moses, Agau (hard to argue that Monroe, Darrickson, Govan, Peak, Copeland, Hayes were only offensive players). I will grant you DSR, Cameron, Pryor, Josh Smith, White and I am sure I am forgetting someone. Point is that your statement is factually wrong. JTIII recruited good/great defenders/athletes and his defenses were good. Please know that I wanted JTIII fired. Not a JT III defender. Just can't take the false statement that "staff recruited players with great talent on the offensive side of the ball without doing much on the D End." There is almost no evidence to back that up. Sleey smh lol
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