Expectations for JTIII - 2016-17 version

[eagle54]

In an effort to move forward from the JTIII coaching discussion thread that has been interesting on both sides but isn't finding common ground I thought it may be more productive to hear what expectations for next year and moving forward should be for this staff.

I'll start with my own for next season:

1.  Out-of-conference schedule - Win a game or two that we shouldn't but don't drop any bad losses
2.  BE performance - Finish top 3 or 4 in conference 
3.  NCAA seeding - Secure NCAA bid regardless of seed  
4.  NCAA tournament performance - Win at least one game in the tournament if we are higher seeded team as 6 or better.

And beyond:

5.  Longer term - No more let downs of a non NCAA tournament season (let alone losing record) and move forward with at least one run to an elite 8 or better in next three seasons.    

[EtomicB]

Mar 25, 2016 23:38:00 GMT -5 eagle54 said:

In an effort to move forward from the JTIII coaching discussion thread that has been interesting on both sides but isn't finding common ground I thought it may be more productive to hear what expectations for next year and moving forward should be for this staff.

I'll start with my own for next season:

1.  Out-of-conference schedule - Win a game or two that we shouldn't but don't drop any bad losses
2.  BE performance - Finish top 3 or 4 in conference 
3.  NCAA seeding - Secure NCAA bid regardless of seed  
4.  NCAA tournament performance - Win at least one game in the tournament if we are higher seeded team as 6 or better.

And beyond:

5.  Longer term - No more let downs of a non NCAA tournament season (let alone losing record) and move forward with at least one run to an elite 8 or better in next three seasons.    

These are the things that matter,# 2 is most important though..

I've said for awhile now that finishing in the top 4 of the BE consistently will bring post season opportunities..

Long term goals should be about changing the culture/feel of the program, JT3 needs to reinvent himself imo..

[Deleted]

Mar 25, 2016 23:38:00 GMT -5 eagle54 said:

In an effort to move forward from the JTIII coaching discussion thread that has been interesting on both sides but isn't finding common ground I thought it may be more productive to hear what expectations for next year and moving forward should be for this staff.

I'll start with my own for next season:

1.  Out-of-conference schedule - Win a game or two that we shouldn't but don't drop any bad losses
2.  BE performance - Finish top 3 or 4 in conference 
3.  NCAA seeding - Secure NCAA bid regardless of seed  
4.  NCAA tournament performance - Win at least one game in the tournament if we are higher seeded team as 6 or better.

And beyond:

5.  Longer term - No more let downs of a non NCAA tournament season (let alone losing record) and move forward with at least one run to an elite 8 or better in next three seasons.    

Just to be clear - with the exception of Bill Self (who is just on a monster NCAA run), all of the teams/coaches in this year's Elite Eight have missed the NCAA tourney at least once in the past 10 years. I would argue with the exception of maybe Oregon, the public perception of the other 7 teams is "consistently successful". So maybe "no missing the tournament" is a bit of a high bar?

[eagle54]

Mar 26, 2016 7:21:17 GMT -5 @whitegamehats said:

Mar 25, 2016 23:38:00 GMT -5 eagle54 said:

In an effort to move forward from the JTIII coaching discussion thread that has been interesting on both sides but isn't finding common ground I thought it may be more productive to hear what expectations for next year and moving forward should be for this staff.

I'll start with my own for next season:

1.  Out-of-conference schedule - Win a game or two that we shouldn't but don't drop any bad losses
2.  BE performance - Finish top 3 or 4 in conference 
3.  NCAA seeding - Secure NCAA bid regardless of seed  
4.  NCAA tournament performance - Win at least one game in the tournament if we are higher seeded team as 6 or better.

And beyond:

5.  Longer term - No more let downs of a non NCAA tournament season (let alone losing record) and move forward with at least one run to an elite 8 or better in next three seasons.    

Just to be clear - with the exception of Bill Self (who is just on a monster NCAA run), all of the teams/coaches in this year's Elite Eight have missed the NCAA tourney at least once in the past 10 years. I would argue with the exception of maybe Oregon, the public perception of the other 7 teams is "consistently successful". So maybe "no missing the tournament" is a bit of a high bar?

Already factored in as we have missed two of last three years going into next year and no postseason this year so think for next three we should not.

[aleutianhoya]

Mar 25, 2016 23:38:00 GMT -5 eagle54 said:

In an effort to move forward from the JTIII coaching discussion thread that has been interesting on both sides but isn't finding common ground I thought it may be more productive to hear what expectations for next year and moving forward should be for this staff.

I'll start with my own for next season:

1.  Out-of-conference schedule - Win a game or two that we shouldn't but don't drop any bad losses
2.  BE performance - Finish top 3 or 4 in conference 
3.  NCAA seeding - Secure NCAA bid regardless of seed  
4.  NCAA tournament performance - Win at least one game in the tournament if we are higher seeded team as 6 or better.

And beyond:

5.  Longer term - No more let downs of a non NCAA tournament season (let alone losing record) and move forward with at least one run to an elite 8 or better in next three seasons.    

I think I agree completely with 1-4.

As for 5, if you're saying that we should make the NCAAT each of the next three years given what has happened the last three, I agree. Obviously qualifying every year into infinity isnt going to happen.

As this and every tournament shows, so much (calls, matchups, etc.) has to go right for virtually any team exceot for the truly elite to get to the elite 8. So I guess I'd say sweet 16 there. To me, making it to the second weekend is the key. There's not much difference perception-wise between sweet 16 and elite 8.

[KHoyaNYC]

Nothing inherently wrong with the above but do not see next year's team making tourney. I think we have one more lackluster year ahead of us first. So, except for retitilng the thread 2017-18 I am on board with the goals.

[bamahoya11]

I'm generally in agreement with these expectations, with the exception that I wouldn't place any conditions on NCAA Tournament performance other than making the field (with the right to revise my expectations if we somehow land a high seed).  I don't really break down the expectations into in-conference and out-of-conference, but I expect us to win 20 games, finish in the top 5 of the Big East, and land an NCAA Tournament bid.  I also expect to see some improvement on defense, particularly in terms of the fouling rate.  It doesn't have to be dramatic, but I expect to see fewer of the same mistakes from the past three years repeating themselves next season.  It's time for the staff to prove that they can adapt to the realities of the game as it is today.

If we do those things, I'll be happy.  This team provides some of the same reasons for excitement that we had last year, and last year didn't work out so well.  So I'm keeping an open mind.  I still think we are a player or two away from having a really top-notch team this year.  We definitely could use another guard, and I think another "true 5" would also be beneficial.  But, whatever happens in recruiting, I expect improvement, and I think a top-half BE finish and a tournament bid would be enough for me.

[drquigley]

Let me add one more important item:

BEAT MARYLAND!!!!!!

[lichoya68]

keep all players NUF said THEN work hard hustle SIX AM FOR ALL and play forty minutes or more of GEORGETOWN BBALL pleasssseeeeee

[GIGAFAN99]

Top 3 conference finish, NCAA bid, play to seed once there.

[drquigley]

Let me say it again....BEAT MARYLAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[FrazierFanatic]

Mar 26, 2016 16:43:49 GMT -5 drquigley said:

Let me say it again....BEAT MARYLAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And Syracuse. Please!!

[drquigley]

The expectations just got greater. A small private Catholic school from the "nothing" BE just beat a big bad Big12 team to go to the final four. Hello!? Are you listening JT3?

[michaelgrahamfan]

And the Lowes commercial is as embarrassing as this year's performance...

[hoyajinx]

Mar 26, 2016 22:33:50 GMT -5 drquigley said:

The expectations just got greater. A small private Catholic school from the "nothing" BE just beat a big bad Big12 team to go to the final four. Hello!? Are you listening JT3?

Jay Wright helped lend some credence to the adage "the first step to solving a problem is admitting you have a problem." Jay Wright owned his post season failures earlier this year. Apparently we 1) have had a string of bad luck in the tournament or 2) just overachieved in the regular season so it's okay we flamed out in the tournament. Maybe we can pretend nothing is wrong and hope things will just work themselves out? That definitely seems like a clear path to success!

[MCIGuy]

This is dependent only on the players whom have eligibility to return actually end up returning....

1)Stop with the No Moral Victory Parade. For the last half dozen or so years it seems as if the Hoyas meet a few highly ranked and well regarded teams early in the season only to come away with one victory or maybe none at all. The games are close though which makes it all the more frustrating. Two seasons ago it was against the likes of Wisconsin and Kansas. This season it was against the likes of Maryland and Duke. I understand it isn't fair for Gtown to win all of these contests every year, but if the program wants to set a tone and raise the level of expectations (including possibly their own), the Hoyas will need years in which they actually win most if not all of these games. Next season if Maryland comes in as depleted as it looks like they will the Hoyas need to BEAT them....even if Verizon has more Terp fans. If the Hoyas play in another pre-season tournament then they are OVERDUE to actually have the stones to win one of those @#$% things. The Hoyas should be able to match up against Kansas no matter if the game is played in DC or in Lawrence. The Hoyas by all means better beat a UConn team at home that they should have beaten on the road this past season. And the Hoyas better be ready to take care of business at Syracuse. If the Hoyas lose one of these games so be it. That is still very good. But to lose more than one suggests more of the same.

2)The Hoyas won't start in any preseason Top 25s but they need to win enough games early in to get in the Top 25 as soon as possible. And then...stay there for the remainder of the @#$% season. Enough of this nonsense. Even in Porter's last season the team started off horribly enough that it took forever to get into the Top 25. Going on a win streak for over a month of games cemented our place in that Top 25. Over the past three seasons though the Hoyas have only been ranked for a few weeks total. That's not getting it done. I realize some like to spend each early part of the season on this board dismissing the notion of the worthiness of the Top 25 ("we don't need it", "I'd rather we sneak up on teams", "let us be seen as the underdogs"). Once I was even guilty of that. But it is clear that one important way of staying relevant in this new Big East era in which the media (local included) goes out of its way to ignore you, is to put yourself in a position in which the media has no choice but to cover you. Being ranked would do that for the Hoyas and provide more press. But since, as I pointed out already, the Hoyas won’t start off in any preseason Top 25s, they must go out and win the BIG games that I discussed in the previous paragraph while also avoiding the season-killing losses to the midmajors that plagued them this season.

3)A top two finish in the Big East, with an all-out effort to finish number one. Yeah, I said it. Or wrote it. I understand who Villanova is likely to return as well as Xavier. I get the fact that there is always a possibility of Whitehead returning for Seton Hall. And if Marquette gets their big man to return for one more year they have the potential to be as good as anyone. And I don’t care. There was to much talent on this Gtown roster this year to be that bad and next year, depending on my condition of all guys returning there will still be too much talent and now even more experience for this team NOT to challenge for the BE crown. We would need to rebound next season like Seton Hall did this season but unlike SH the players on next year’s Gtown squad will at least have the benefit of having gone to the tourney two years prior. If you don’t think Peak has the talent to be a First Team All Big East you weren’t paying attention. If you don’t think Copeland has the potential to be up there as well as long as he puts in the work then you’re being overly negative. If you don’t think a healthy Paul White can contribute positively then you are sleeping on that kid. Not to mention that Derrickson was further along as a frosh than Jennings was as freshman for Villanova. And also that Govan, depending on if the Marquette guy returns, would be the most talented big man in the conference. Then there are guys like Mourning and Johnson that I think very highly of who I feel can take the next step as well as the potential of the Louisville transfer whose name escapes me at this moment. Point is the team has talent on its roster to beat anyone like it did at Xavier this year. If the team needs another ballhandler or two then so be it. Its III’s job to take care of that. And I expect him to do so.

4)Sweep Providence. Good grief. To be owned by the Friars (four straight losses, five out of the last six) is inexcusable. Two seasons ago the Hoyas should have won both games and let them get away. This past season the Hoyas were competitive but again lost both. Enough of this. The team and program is going anywhere if III allows his squad to keep being owned by programs like the Friars. You can make an argument that in the three years of the BE-Fox era the three top programs have been Nova, Xavier and Providence. And the Hoyas have been dominated by all three. That must change. And that change should occur first at least with a Dunn-less Friars. But if the guys from Rhode Island sweep us again then III shouldn’t even get another year.

5)Make it to the @#$% championship of the Big East Tournament. Last time I checked Syracuse, UConn, Louisville, Pitt and even freakin’ Notre dame are not in the Big East anymore. That means the path to a championship game played on a Saturday night at MSG is a much easier one than previously. FOX/FS1 has been nice enough to give Gtown the opportunity of at least ten years of appearing in such a game and so far the Hoyas have squandered three of those years. III was talking crap a few years ago when he told the media that the New Big East should be called the Georgetown conference considering how Gtown was leading the way and dictating terms to Fox. It rubbed some non Gtown fans the wrong way and even caught the negative attention of some media guys like Feinstein. And three years later our coach looks like a fool. It is time for him to earn his paycheck and live up to his own big expectations. We need to be playing on national TV at MSG next season in the championship game for the BE. Period. It’s a good tool for recruiting and it proves we are actually serious about an NCAA tourney run.

6)If the team is assured of an NCAA bid (sorry….WHEN the team is assured) please no more large celebration gathering of everyone on campus around the TV screens for the media to cover and the world to see. If III wants to be serious and change his fortunes, then he should consider changing his script and have a more private gathering with his team. He keeps wanting to put together this big party as if the main goal has been achieved. Isn’t he sick of that by now? Does he at least believe in bad luck by this point?

7)Last of all….make it to the second weekend of the NCAA tourney, particularly if the team ends up with a 4 seed or better. No excuses. Get it done. Sweet Sixteen or bust.

[beenaround]

Mar 26, 2016 23:17:54 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

This is dependent only on the players whom have eligibility to return actually end up returning....

1)Stop with the No Moral Victory Parade. For the last half dozen or so years it seems as if the Hoyas meet a few highly ranked and well regarded teams early in the season only to come away with one victory or maybe none at all. The games are close though which makes it all the more frustrating. Two seasons ago it was against the likes of Wisconsin and Kansas. This season it was against the likes of Maryland and Duke. I understand it isn't fair for Gtown to win all of these contests every year, but if the program wants to set a tone and raise the level of expectations (including possibly their own), the Hoyas will need years in which they actually win most if not all of these games. Next season if Maryland comes in as depleted as it looks like they will the Hoyas need to BEAT them....even if Verizon has more Terp fans. If the Hoyas play in another pre-season tournament then they are OVERDUE to actually have the stones to win one of those @#$% things. The Hoyas should be able to match up against Kansas no matter if the game is played in DC or in Lawrence. The Hoyas by all means better beat a UConn team at home that they should have beaten on the road this past season. And the Hoyas better be ready to take care of business at Syracuse. If the Hoyas lose one of these games so be it. That is still very good. But t lose more than one suggests more of the same.

2)The Hoyas won't start in any preseason Top 25s but they need to win enough games early in to get in the Top 25 as soon as possible. And then...stay there for the remainder of the @#$% season. Enough of this nonsense. Even in Porter's last season the team started off horribly enough that it took forever to get into the Top 25. Going on a win streak for over a month of games cemented our place in that Top 25. I realize some like to spend each early part of the season on this board dismissing the notion of the worthiness of the Top 25 ("we don't need it", "I'd rather we sneak up on teams", "let us be seen as the underdogs"). Once I was seven guilty of that. But it is clear that one important way of staying relevant in this new Big East era in which the media (local included) goes out of its way to ignore you, is to put yourself in a position in which the media has no choice but to cover you. Being ranked would do that for the Hoyas and provide more press. But since, as I pointed out already, the Hoyas won’t start off in any preseason Top 25s, they must go out and win the BIG games that I discussed in the previous paragraph while also avoiding the season-killing losses to the midmajors that plagued them this season.

3)A top two finish in the Big East, with an all-out effort to finish number one. Yeah, I said it. Or wrote it. I understand who Villanova is likely to return as well as Xavier. I get the fact that there is always a possibility of Whitehead returning for Seton Hall. And if Marquette gets their big man to return for one more year they have the potential to be as good as anyone. And I don’t care. There was to much talent on this Gtown roster this year to be that bad and next year, depending on my condition of all guys returning there will still be too much talent and now even more experience for this team NOT to challenge for the BE crown. We would need to rebound next season like Seton Hall did this season but unlike SH the players on next year’s Gtown squad will at least have the benefit of having gone to the tourney two years prior. If you don’t think Peak has the talent to be a First Team All Big East you weren’t paying attention. If you don’t think Copeland has the potential to be up there as well as long as he puts in the work then you’re being overly negative. If you don’t think a healthy Paul White can contribute positively then you are sleeping on that kid. Not to mention that Derrickson was further along as a frosh than Jennings was as freshman for Villanova. And also that Govan, depending on if the Marquette guy returns, would be the most talented big man in the conference. Then there are guys like Mourning and Johnson that I think very highly of who I feel can take the next step as well as the potential of the Louisville transfer whose name escapes me at this moment. Point is the team has talent on its roster to beat anyone like it did at Xavier this year. If the team needs another ballhandler or two then so be it. Its III’s job to take care of that. And I expect him to do so.

4)Sweep Providence. Good grief. To be owned by the Friars (four straight losses, five out of the last six) is inexcusable. Two seasons ago the Hoyas should have won both games and let them get away. This past season the Hoyas were competitive but again lost both. Enough of this. The team and program is going anywhere if III allows his squad to keep being owned by programs like the Friars. You can make an argument that in the three years of the BE-Fox era the three top programs have been Nova, Xavier and Providence. And the Hoyas have been dominated by all three. That must change. And that change should occur first at least with a Dunn-less Friars. But if the guys from Rhode Island sweep us again then III shouldn’t even get another year.

5)Make it to the @#$% championship of the Big East Tournament. Last time I checked Syracuse, UConn, Louisville, Pitt and even freakin’ Notre dame are not in the Big East anymore. That means the path to a championship game played on a Saturday night at MSG is a much easier one than previously. FOX/FS1 has been nice enough to give Gtown the opportunity of at least ten years of appearing in such a game and so fat the Hoyas have squandered three of those years. III was talking crap a few years ago when he told the media that the New Big East should be called the Georgetown conference considering how Gtown was leading the way and dictating terms to Fox. It rubbed some non Gtown fans the wrong way and even caught the negative attention of some media guys like Feinstein. And three years later our coach looks like a fool. It is time for him to earn his paycheck and live up to his own big expectations. We need to be playing on national TV at MSG next season in the championship game for the BE. Period. It’s a good tool for recruiting and it proves we are actually serious about a NCAA tourney run.

6)If the team is assured of an NCAA bid (sorry….WHEN the team is assured) please no more large celebration gathering of everyone on campus around the TV screens for the media to cover and the world to see. If III wants to be serious and change his fortunes, then he should consider changing his script and have a more private gathering with his team. He keeps wanting to put together this big party as if the main goal has been achieved. Isn’t he sick of that by now? Does he at least believe in bad luck by this point?

7)Last of all….make it to the second weekend of the NCAA tourney, particularly if the team ends up with a 4 seed or better. No excuses. Get it done. Sweet Sixteen or bust.

I predict MCIGuy will be very unhappy next basketball season.

[MCIGuy]

Mar 26, 2016 23:34:08 GMT -5 beenaround said:

Mar 26, 2016 23:17:54 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

I predict MCIGuy will be very unhappy next basketball season.

And how would that be any different than most of the last eight years? Point is I still have enough expectations from this program to not be happy with a team that settles for finishing in the top half of an inferior Big East or settles for winning one lousy game in the NCAA tourney. If those become the standards for this program then I'm sure I will choose to eventually just stop following the team altogether.

[hoyasaxa2003]

Mar 26, 2016 23:17:54 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

This is dependent only on the players whom have eligibility to return actually end up returning....

1)Stop with the No Moral Victory Parade. For the last half dozen or so years it seems as if the Hoyas meet a few highly ranked and well regarded teams early in the season only to come away with one victory or maybe none at all. The games are close though which makes it all the more frustrating. Two seasons ago it was against the likes of Wisconsin and Kansas. This season it was against the likes of Maryland and Duke. I understand it isn't fair for Gtown to win all of these contests every year, but if the program wants to set a tone and raise the level of expectations (including possibly their own), the Hoyas will need years in which they actually win most if not all of these games. Next season if Maryland comes in as depleted as it looks like they will the Hoyas need to BEAT them....even if Verizon has more Terp fans. If the Hoyas play in another pre-season tournament then they are OVERDUE to actually have the stones to win one of those @#$% things. The Hoyas should be able to match up against Kansas no matter if the game is played in DC or in Lawrence. The Hoyas by all means better beat a UConn team at home that they should have beaten on the road this past season. And the Hoyas better be ready to take care of business at Syracuse. If the Hoyas lose one of these games so be it. That is still very good. But to lose more than one suggests more of the same.

We have a super difficult OOC next year. We have games away at Syracuse and Kansas, home Connecticut and Maryland, plus the Hawaii tournament which is stacked with talent. Even with a high-quality roster and team, the game at Kansas is an expected loss. They just play so well there than expecting a win would make no sense.

That being said, I don't see the history you're referencing:

2010: 10-1 OOC. Only loss to Old Dominion. Beat an excellent Duke team, Butler, and Washington.

2011: 11-1 OOC. Only loss was an away game at Temple (which we lost by three points). We beat Missouri in that fun OT game, Memphis, and Utah State.

2012: 13-1 OOC. Only loss was to Kansas in Hawaii (by 4). We beat Memphis in Hawaii and home, and a solid win at Alabama.

2013: 10-1 OOC. Lost to then #1 ranked Indiana in OT loss at MSG. Otherwise, we beat UCLA, Tennessee, and Texas.

2014: 9-3 OOC. Losses to Oregon and Kansas, and bad loss to Northeastern. We did beat VCU and Michigan State.

2015: 8-3 OOC. Losses to Wisconsin, Butler (in the November tournament), and Kansas. Otherwise, we beat Florida and Indiana.

I don't disagree at all that we need to have a great OOC; I think that's generally true in this conference situation. But, I also think that the idea that we have somehow had OOC troubles really could only be made for the last 3 seasons. And, in 2014, we had at least two good wins. So yeah, the last couple of seasons haven't been great, but I don't think there's a pattern.

2)The Hoyas won't start in any preseason Top 25s but they need to win enough games early in to get in the Top 25 as soon as possible. And then...stay there for the remainder of the @#$% season. Enough of this nonsense. Even in Porter's last season the team started off horribly enough that it took forever to get into the Top 25. Going on a win streak for over a month of games cemented our place in that Top 25. Over the past three seasons though the Hoyas have only been ranked for a few weeks total. That's not getting it done. I realize some like to spend each early part of the season on this board dismissing the notion of the worthiness of the Top 25 ("we don't need it", "I'd rather we sneak up on teams", "let us be seen as the underdogs"). Once I was even guilty of that. But it is clear that one important way of staying relevant in this new Big East era in which the media (local included) goes out of its way to ignore you, is to put yourself in a position in which the media has no choice but to cover you. Being ranked would do that for the Hoyas and provide more press. But since, as I pointed out already, the Hoyas won’t start off in any preseason Top 25s, they must go out and win the BIG games that I discussed in the previous paragraph while also avoiding the season-killing losses to the midmajors that plagued them this season.

I agree. Ideally, I would like to use some high quality OOC wins to get ranked ASAP and stay there. The best way to do that is to win most of our OOC games. I also agree that being underdogs or "sneaking up" on others is silly. I want to be a high quality team, and if we are high quality, people will know about us.

3)A top two finish in the Big East, with an all-out effort to finish number one. Yeah, I said it. Or wrote it. I understand who Villanova is likely to return as well as Xavier. I get the fact that there is always a possibility of Whitehead returning for Seton Hall. And if Marquette gets their big man to return for one more year they have the potential to be as good as anyone. And I don’t care. There was to much talent on this Gtown roster this year to be that bad and next year, depending on my condition of all guys returning there will still be too much talent and now even more experience for this team NOT to challenge for the BE crown. We would need to rebound next season like Seton Hall did this season but unlike SH the players on next year’s Gtown squad will at least have the benefit of having gone to the tourney two years prior. If you don’t think Peak has the talent to be a First Team All Big East you weren’t paying attention. If you don’t think Copeland has the potential to be up there as well as long as he puts in the work then you’re being overly negative. If you don’t think a healthy Paul White can contribute positively then you are sleeping on that kid. Not to mention that Derrickson was further along as a frosh than Jennings was as freshman for Villanova. And also that Govan, depending on if the Marquette guy returns, would be the most talented big man in the conference. Then there are guys like Mourning and Johnson that I think very highly of who I feel can take the next step as well as the potential of the Louisville transfer whose name escapes me at this moment. Point is the team has talent on its roster to beat anyone like it did at Xavier this year. If the team needs another ballhandler or two then so be it. Its III’s job to take care of that. And I expect him to do so.

Obviously, this would be great, but I think under the right scenario, a top 3 finish could be similar. For example, let's say we do have a great OOC, and miss 2nd place by 1 game to another good team. That would not be a disappointment, necessarily.

4)Sweep Providence. Good grief. To be owned by the Friars (four straight losses, five out of the last six) is inexcusable. Two seasons ago the Hoyas should have won both games and let them get away. This past season the Hoyas were competitive but again lost both. Enough of this. The team and program is going anywhere if III allows his squad to keep being owned by programs like the Friars. You can make an argument that in the three years of the BE-Fox era the three top programs have been Nova, Xavier and Providence. And the Hoyas have been dominated by all three. That must change. And that change should occur first at least with a Dunn-less Friars. But if the guys from Rhode Island sweep us again then III shouldn’t even get another year.

Providence has benefited from Dunn and, this year, Bentil. That said, I am not sure why we are singling out Providence. They were very good the last two seasons, but I really don't see them having gained a significantly higher profile as a result. But, the fact is that if we want to be a top team in the Big East, we shouldn't lose many games, and thus splitting with Providence should be feasible.

5)Make it to the @#$% championship of the Big East Tournament. Last time I checked Syracuse, UConn, Louisville, Pitt and even freakin’ Notre dame are not in the Big East anymore. That means the path to a championship game played on a Saturday night at MSG is a much easier one than previously. FOX/FS1 has been nice enough to give Gtown the opportunity of at least ten years of appearing in such a game and so far the Hoyas have squandered three of those years. III was talking crap a few years ago when he told the media that the New Big East should be called the Georgetown conference considering how Gtown was leading the way and dictating terms to Fox. It rubbed some non Gtown fans the wrong way and even caught the negative attention of some media guys like Feinstein. And three years later our coach looks like a fool. It is time for him to earn his paycheck and live up to his own big expectations. We need to be playing on national TV at MSG next season in the championship game for the BE. Period. It’s a good tool for recruiting and it proves we are actually serious about an NCAA tourney run.

Again, I am more concerned with the record in aggregate. If we have a great season, beat some good OOC teams, finish 1st or 2nd in the Big East, and then face a good team in the semifinal and lose, and get a high NCAA seed anyway, am I going to be heartbroken? No, but I would love to get back to the BET final anyway.

6)If the team is assured of an NCAA bid (sorry….WHEN the team is assured) please no more large celebration gathering of everyone on campus around the TV screens for the media to cover and the world to see. If III wants to be serious and change his fortunes, then he should consider changing his script and have a more private gathering with his team. He keeps wanting to put together this big party as if the main goal has been achieved. Isn’t he sick of that by now? Does he at least believe in bad luck by this point?

I really think this is done more for the fans and to get excitement for the team on campus and support them. It's my understanding most schools do that. I don't have a problem with it. Knowing the way JT3 is, my guess is that if given a choice, he likely would do something private. I think it's done for the school community more so than anybody else.

7)Last of all….make it to the second weekend of the NCAA tourney, particularly if the team ends up with a 4 seed or better. No excuses. Get it done. Sweet Sixteen or bust.

I think it's safe to say that we all want that. The problem, as this year's tournament showed, is that a lot of good teams lose in the NCAA tournaments. But hey, we've lost a bunch of times already in that position. I'm good with next year being different!

[MCIGuy]

Mar 27, 2016 0:51:25 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

We have a super difficult OOC next year. We have games away at Syracuse and Kansas, home Connecticut and Maryland, plus the Hawaii tournament which is stacked with talent. Even with a high-quality roster and team, the game at Kansas is an expected loss. They just play so well there than expecting a win would make no sense.

That being said, I don't see the history you're referencing:

2010: 10-1 OOC. Only loss to Old Dominion. Beat an excellent Duke team, Butler, and Washington.

2011: 11-1 OOC. Only loss was an away game at Temple (which we lost by three points). We beat Missouri in that fun OT game, Memphis, and Utah State.

Shouldn't have lost to Temple. Period. Good teams figure out ways to avoid such losses to inferior teams even on the road.

2012: 13-1 OOC. Only loss was to Kansas in Hawaii (by 4). We beat Memphis in Hawaii and home, and a solid win at Alabama.

Another example of a close loss to a very good and ranked team. How about us winning that contest? It was doable so it would have been nice if the Hoyas actually did it.

2013: 10-1 OOC. Lost to then #1 ranked Indiana in OT loss at MSG. Otherwise, we beat UCLA, Tennessee, and Texas.

UCLA turned out to be vastly overrated, Tennessee and Texas were hot garbage. So...once more...the Hoyas fall to a very good team in a close contest. Same story. Would it have been nice for once for the Hoyas to go into the BE season with zero losses and a huge major win already in the can?

2014: 9-3 OOC. Losses to Oregon and Kansas, and bad loss to Northeastern. We did beat VCU and Michigan State.

Could have accepted the Kansas loss (albeit I wanted a more competitive game) much easier if the Hoyas had beaten Oregon. as far as I'm concerned hungry programs ran by hungry coaches make their rep or propel themselves to great seasons by clawing to wins in such games. III's teams have for too many closes losses to talented teams in early season games. And the loss to Northeaster pretty much cancels out the win against VCU.

2015: 8-3 OOC. Losses to Wisconsin, Butler (in the November tournament), and Kansas. Otherwise, we beat Florida and Indiana.

Do I need to even comment on this one?

I don't disagree at all that we need to have a great OOC; I think that's generally true in this conference situation. But, I also think that the idea that we have somehow had OOC troubles really could only be made for the last 3 seasons. And, in 2014, we had at least two good wins. So yeah, the last couple of seasons haven't been great, but I don't think there's a pattern.

When you are constantly leaving one or more victories that were within your grasp on the floor in early season contests, then that is a pattern. And when those losses tend to come at the hands of the best team you face it suggests you aren't ready for the big boys and won't beat out expectations in the NCAA tourney.

Obviously, this would be great, but I think under the right scenario, a top 3 finish could be similar. For example, let's say we do have a great OOC, and miss 2nd place by 1 game to another good team. That would not be a disappointment, necessarily.

It would be so III-esque. Win that one game and end up second. Or better yet win two or more and end up first.

Providence has benefited from Dunn and, this year, Bentil.

And? Other unranked BE teams face the Friars with those same two guys and manage to pull out victories. Why couldn't GU?

That said, I am not sure why we are singling out Providence.

I'm singling them out because they swept the Hoyas the last two seasons and beaten Gtown five out of the last six times. That's a problem.

But, the fact is that if we want to be a top team in the Big East, we shouldn't lose many games, and thus splitting with Providence should be feasible.

If we want to be a top team in the BE the goal should be to sweep Providence.

Again, I am more concerned with the record in aggregate. If we have a great season, beat some good OOC teams, finish 1st or 2nd in the Big East, and then face a good team in the semifinal and lose, and get a high NCAA seed anyway, am I going to be heartbroken? No, but I would love to get back to the BET final anyway.

The greatest spotlight FOX can give the program all year is that final game at MSG. And you are okay with making it to the semi-finals (finally!) just so long as the Hoyas beat some good OOC teams and finish in the top two of the conference? Okay, if that's how you roll. It's not good enough for me. Historically Gtown as a program tends to have terrific NCAA tourney showings after at least appearing in the BET Finals or especially winning the finals. Losing before that game is typically a harbinger for a so-so NCAA tournament run. Until that pattern changes I will be worried over any Gtown team that falls short in the Big East tournament.

I really think this is done more for the fans and to get excitement for the team on campus and support them. It's my understanding most schools do that. I don't have a problem with it. Knowing the way JT3 is, my guess is that if given a choice, he likely would do something private. I think it's done for the school community more so than anybody else.

I get it is for the excitement of the team but I know how superstitious coaches can be and if III fits that classification then maybe he should seek a change. Besides he and his program only end up looking like idiots a week later when they make quick exits from the big dance. And given how he is allowed some license like his dad, I'm sure III has the pull to make the tournament selection show a private affair if he wants.

I think it's safe to say that we all want that. The problem, as this year's tournament showed, is that a lot of good teams lose in the NCAA tournaments. But hey, we've lost a bunch of times already in that position.

Excuses, excuses. Win already. Stop wasting such good seeding with such poor results. We as Hoya fans have lost a lifetime of second weekend tournament memories because of III's inability to get his team into the Sweet Sixteen as of late. Enough of that. Most of Gtown losses in the the tourney the past six trips came because the Hoyas got punched in the mouth and looked clueless on how to punch back. That's on the coach and the attitude he instills within his team. III's idea of punching is his team knocking down three-pointers early and often. But if that doesn't happen his team looks clueless in figuring out other ways to win a game in the big dance. For God's sakes it isn't even as if the team has been losing to a bunch of squads from the power conferences. We have been having our heads handed to us by mid majors for the most part. Good programs don't have this happen to them repeatedly.

This thread is about what each person's expectations are for III and the team next season and I'm already getting responses form people (all due respect) who think I should tamper my apparently too high hopes/demands. It isn't as if I wrote the Hoyas need to win the BE tournament, make it to the Final Four and win a national championship next year. In my opinion my expectations are reasonable based upon talent and experience on roster. Meanwhile some people are already checking off losses in the regular season to Kansas next season. Come on , folks.