beenaround
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Post by beenaround on Feb 13, 2016 15:04:21 GMT -5
The question is, in those two time-out huddles, did someone say: we're out of time-outs, so whatever happens the rest of the way, do not foul Bentil? I'm guessing it was said but Mourning and Derrickson got confused as to whose responsibility it was to cover Bentil on the inbound. Inexperience? Perhaps? You would hope. However, I recall we fouled Bentil repeatedly down the stretch in the first game as well..and he made a ton of FT's. We are all just guessing..I am gonna guess they were NOT told to avoid Bentil, unless the players forgot in BOTH games.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:05:49 GMT -5
So, I'm going to go a bit against the grain because I'm actually really bullish on this team after what I saw in the second half. After the Butler game, Ben Standig pointed out that we didn't have a single lineup that could consistently give us five good minutes. I agreed and hadn't seen any signs for optimism until the second half of this game. FINALLY, what a saw in the second half was a team with an offensive identity. We started to run something that resembles what I think of as a Princeton offense--we ran things through the center. Once we got to the ball to our center and let him distribute, things opened up. Derrickson was able to get the ball inside. The center could kick it out to LJ or Ike for a drive or a three-point shot. And it finally took some pressure off our guards. I think we found this plan out of necessity. With Bradley out of the lineup, we now have quicker, more nimble centers. Mourning and Govan were both able to essentially run the offense from inside or outside and break free of the Providence zone to get the ball. Once they had the ball, it opened up the entire offense. Going forward, I would like for us to push the ball inside every single play. At times late in the game, as things got tight, we would still settle for a shot a little too quickly. Once we became more disciplined on offense, the defense came almost naturally. Guys started talking, looking around, and watching their spacing. The team started to play with pride on both ends of the floor, and we looked to me like a Georgetown basketball team. Of course, the foul disparity hurt us, and we need more work on that. But if we can settle on an identity, the other things start to become smaller tweaks. And then there is the coaching. I was disappointed by the first half, but someone got the team back together in the locker room at halftime. I'm going to assume that JTIII was at least partially responsible. I'll evaluate his overall job when the season is over, but I think he drew up a game plan in the second half that put us back in the game. I also watched him show frustration with the officials at multiple points--can't fault his demeanor in the second half one bit. Now, we just need to carry that momentum forward. And those good minutes happened without DSR! I love DSR, but he has played in spurts so far and no one should expect differently the rest of the way. He is what he is. When he is on, get out of the way. JT3 could've stayed with him even though he was playing scared, slower that usual and 27 feet from the basket. Kudos to JT3 for taking him out! From this point forward, he needs to pull that trigger whenever DSR is in a lull. Scoring drought? Take DSR out and mix it up.
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:07:09 GMT -5
I'm guessing it was said but Mourning and Derrickson got confused as to whose responsibility it was to cover Bentil on the inbound. Inexperience? Perhaps? You would hope. However, I recall we fouled Bentil repeatedly down the stretch in the first game as well..and he made a ton of FT's. We are all just guessing..I am gonna guess they were NOT told to avoid Bentil, unless the players forgot in BOTH games. Bentil was 6/6 down the stretch at VC but my recall is that they weren't all fouls on an inbound play. I think (I very well could be wrong) but he managed to establish position on our "defense" and received the ball on the blocks, resulting in our hacks. I think Provy was in double bonus by that time as well.
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Post by michaeldm9 on Feb 13, 2016 15:08:24 GMT -5
Oh let me think of something positive. Ain't s$%# positive. Tournaments hope on the line and you spot the other team 24 points. Can some please post the FT statistics. Gtown 14/16 FT's, 87.5% Providence 27/36 FT's, 75% Thank You. Team Has no Pride. There is no way I can look at this stat on a consistent basis and not Try to play 3000% better.
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jester
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Post by jester on Feb 13, 2016 15:08:48 GMT -5
May have been due to the fact that Mourning has not been in a game-ending situation all season, and Derrickson has has limited opportunities in similar circumstances. Not an excuse, just an explanation. Exactly Exactly. One of the bigger moments of the season and we had to rely on two guys who played limited minutes. It is what it is, but tough when you have to be in those situations. That said, their development may actually be the key to winning enough this season.
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beenaround
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Post by beenaround on Feb 13, 2016 15:09:17 GMT -5
SS...I only mentioned the prior game, because I yelled at the tv a couple of times when we fouled intentionally.."Dont foul Bentil". But, let me say this, at my age, I can remember things completely wrong!
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:10:00 GMT -5
I'm guessing it was said but Mourning and Derrickson got confused as to whose responsibility it was to cover Bentil on the inbound. Inexperience? Perhaps? You would hope. However, I recall we fouled Bentil repeatedly down the stretch in the first game as well..and he made a ton of FT's. We are all just guessing..I am gonna guess they were NOT told to avoid Bentil, unless the players forgot in BOTH games. IMO they're told "stay calm, stay calm", and "so what are you guys seeing out there?"
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:12:25 GMT -5
I may be wrong, but it seems to be we very rarely, if ever, do anything creative on the final shot of a game. Its always just hand the ball to DSR, or whoever our top scorer is that year and hope he makes a heroic effort. I've seen other teams change it up, drive and dish or simply do as Yabo suggested...pass to the screener, who is ALWAYS open...at least for a second. DSR is not an athletic guy who can just elevate over a couple guys and shoot a three (actually sounds like I'm describing Ike..not that he would have made it.) It's formally known as the Braswell option. Is that the two-fist play?
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Feb 13, 2016 15:15:08 GMT -5
So, I'm going to go a bit against the grain because I'm actually really bullish on this team after what I saw in the second half. After the Butler game, Ben Standig pointed out that we didn't have a single lineup that could consistently give us five good minutes. I agreed and hadn't seen any signs for optimism until the second half of this game. FINALLY, what a saw in the second half was a team with an offensive identity. We started to run something that resembles what I think of as a Princeton offense--we ran things through the center. Once we got to the ball to our center and let him distribute, things opened up. Derrickson was able to get the ball inside. The center could kick it out to LJ or Ike for a drive or a three-point shot. And it finally took some pressure off our guards. You may be right. My gripe though is that all it may mean is that III wasn't able to properly adapt his team's style of play to one that didn't have a big man to run the offense through. And frankly while I'm all for having big guys who are versatile, who can face the basket, who can pass, etc., I don't want my team to run an offense through the center, particularly if it means he plays too much time out of the paint for any reason other than taking a jumpshot. Using a center like that is perhaps one of the reasons why III's teams come up short on the rebounding front and in getting to the FT line.
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hoyarad
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Post by hoyarad on Feb 13, 2016 15:15:58 GMT -5
Playing a top 20 team on the road never was an automatic win. Nor necessarily a "must" win. I still say how we fare in the pre-BET conference will matter a lot. It's not like this NCAA season has a bunch of steady teams -- upsets are the norm. And the BE is not a weak sister. The Creighton comeback and this fight from way down shows that heart is not the problem for us. There is still time, still games that can be won. Keep the faith and fight on. We are who we are...but the jury is still out if we are or are not enough. Young guys are emerging. I like Ike and give Peak a chance. It's 340am here and time to crash. Good Mourning Hoyas! Nice fight, after all..... Honestly not this season. If we can show some progress the remainder of the season I'll take it....
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hoyarad
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Post by hoyarad on Feb 13, 2016 15:18:27 GMT -5
You would hope. However, I recall we fouled Bentil repeatedly down the stretch in the first game as well..and he made a ton of FT's. We are all just guessing..I am gonna guess they were NOT told to avoid Bentil, unless the players forgot in BOTH games. IMO they're told "stay calm, stay calm", and "so what are you guys seeing out there?" This comment will be in every in game thread.....I love it because it's absolutely true.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 13, 2016 15:20:07 GMT -5
DSR stubbornly insisted he was going to take the shot despite the fact that he played like crappola on offense all game. Their senior star carried them on his back. Ours dragged us down like an anchor. Very disappointing. Dunn defends DSR extremely well, and DSR had a bad day. You characterize a blocked last shot as a stubborn insistence to take the last shot as if the guy, who is frequently criticized for letting the game come to him, is selfish or something. I think that is an unfair retroactive characterization. We won't win many games when DSR has this type of performance, but I don't think his performance reflects poorly on his character or attitude. I did not mean to paint him as selfish - he just made up his mind that he was going to take the shot whether or not he was open. Some players can still get good shots off when closely guarded. That has never been one of his strengths so I think it was a bad decision.
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bamahoya11
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Post by bamahoya11 on Feb 13, 2016 15:20:48 GMT -5
So, I'm going to go a bit against the grain because I'm actually really bullish on this team after what I saw in the second half. After the Butler game, Ben Standig pointed out that we didn't have a single lineup that could consistently give us five good minutes. I agreed and hadn't seen any signs for optimism until the second half of this game. FINALLY, what a saw in the second half was a team with an offensive identity. We started to run something that resembles what I think of as a Princeton offense--we ran things through the center. Once we got to the ball to our center and let him distribute, things opened up. Derrickson was able to get the ball inside. The center could kick it out to LJ or Ike for a drive or a three-point shot. And it finally took some pressure off our guards. I think we found this plan out of necessity. With Bradley out of the lineup, we now have quicker, more nimble centers. Mourning and Govan were both able to essentially run the offense from inside or outside and break free of the Providence zone to get the ball. Once they had the ball, it opened up the entire offense. Going forward, I would like for us to push the ball inside every single play. At times late in the game, as things got tight, we would still settle for a shot a little too quickly. Once we became more disciplined on offense, the defense came almost naturally. Guys started talking, looking around, and watching their spacing. The team started to play with pride on both ends of the floor, and we looked to me like a Georgetown basketball team. Of course, the foul disparity hurt us, and we need more work on that. But if we can settle on an identity, the other things start to become smaller tweaks. And then there is the coaching. I was disappointed by the first half, but someone got the team back together in the locker room at halftime. I'm going to assume that JTIII was at least partially responsible. I'll evaluate his overall job when the season is over, but I think he drew up a game plan in the second half that put us back in the game. I also watched him show frustration with the officials at multiple points--can't fault his demeanor in the second half one bit. Now, we just need to carry that momentum forward. And those good minutes happened without DSR! I love DSR, but he has played in spurts so far and no one should expect differently the rest of the way. He is what he is. When he is on, get out of the way. JT3 could've stayed with him even though he was playing scared, slower that usual and 27 feet from the basket. Kudos to JT3 for taking him out! From this point forward, he needs to pull that trigger whenever DSR is in a lull. Scoring drought? Take DSR out and mix it up. I was intrigued at the run happening without DSR, too, and I'm inclined to agree with you. Although he isn't a scorer, I thought Campbell actually did a pretty good job running the offense today. I will say in DSR's defense though that he had an awful matchup today with Dunn--providence as a team is built to stop guards, and DSR had a rough day because of it. He will play better, and I think will get even better if we can take some of the pressure off him to set up everything on the offensive end.
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Loyal Hoya
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Post by Loyal Hoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:21:36 GMT -5
I think a pivotal play was Jessie's second foul early in the game when he fouled the three-point shooter (Bullock?). Our best chance was our advantage at the center position. With Bradley out and Jessie's time in the first half limited, we were out of sync the rest of the half. Mourning played well for a stretch of time, but we did not really have the ability to go inside out, and we could not adjust on the offensive end.
Of course, that is no excuse for allowing Prov to score 49 points in the half.
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:23:29 GMT -5
It's formally known as the Braswell option. Is that the two-fist play? Nailed it!
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Post by michaeldm9 on Feb 13, 2016 15:24:53 GMT -5
Board. The team is loosing based on a attitude, based and basketball IQ. Mourning not Guarding Bentil at the end, or JTIII not taking a technical, or any of the other stupid things is ridiculous. Each player has not come to the understanding that they playing in the BE. It requires 40 mins of EXTENDED effort. Being a champion requires even more than that. This team has under achieved due to effort not talent.
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Loyal Hoya
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Post by Loyal Hoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:25:58 GMT -5
Dunn defends DSR extremely well, and DSR had a bad day. You characterize a blocked last shot as a stubborn insistence to take the last shot as if the guy, who is frequently criticized for letting the game come to him, is selfish or something. I think that is an unfair retroactive characterization. We won't win many games when DSR has this type of performance, but I don't think his performance reflects poorly on his character or attitude. I did not mean to paint him as selfish - he just made up his mind that he was going to take the shot whether or not he was open. Some players can still get good shots off when closely guarded. That has never been one of his strengths so I think it was a bad decision. Fair enough. Down three with a couple of seconds remaining, there was a low probability no matter what. I am not sure passing it to Derrickson would have appreciably improved our chances, but reasonable people can disagree.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Feb 13, 2016 15:26:37 GMT -5
And those good minutes happened without DSR! I love DSR, but he has played in spurts so far and no one should expect differently the rest of the way. He is what he is. When he is on, get out of the way. JT3 could've stayed with him even though he was playing scared, slower that usual and 27 feet from the basket. Kudos to JT3 for taking him out! From this point forward, he needs to pull that trigger whenever DSR is in a lull. Scoring drought? Take DSR out and mix it up. I was intrigued at the run happening without DSR, too, and I'm inclined to agree with you. Although he isn't a scorer, I thought Campbell actually did a pretty good job running the offense today. I will say in DSR's defense though that he had an awful matchup today with Dunn--providence as a team is built to stop guards, and DSR had a rough day because of it. He will play better, and I think will get even better if we can take some of the pressure off him to set up everything on the offensive end. It might be a match-up for DSR, but that doesn't mean he has to slow the game down with the ball in his hands as he did today. If it's a bad match-up, move the ball quickly and make the defense work. Also, move DSR off the ball and park him in the corner. If Dunn follows DSR, you have just taken their best defender out of the game, making it a four on four game.
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GUJook97
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Post by GUJook97 on Feb 13, 2016 15:26:41 GMT -5
I still wouldn't be surprised by a strong finish to this season. I think we will win 4 more games but just eventually run out of gas. We still haven't lost games in this stretch we really should have won. Yes, we needed them and could have had them, but it doesn't mean we couldn't beat the other teams left to play.
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beenaround
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Post by beenaround on Feb 13, 2016 15:28:21 GMT -5
I still wouldn't be surprised by a strong finish to this season. I think we will win 4 more games but just eventually run out of gas. We still haven't lost games in this stretch we really should have won. Yes, we needed them and could have had them, but it doesn't mean we couldn't beat the other teams left to play. Do you mean in the Big East or the entire season. I hope you were not expecting to lose to Radford, Monmouth and UNC something or other.
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