Cambridge
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Post by Cambridge on Mar 23, 2017 11:41:26 GMT -5
Under the scenario that is being painted here, what would be the earliest he is out? Two, three years? Two, three years too late. If we are locked in to one more year so be it but no more. Certainly no extension of any kind. In my opinion, an extension definitely doesn't mean he sees the end of the contract. I would guess he would get one season before the school exercised the revised buyout, barring some miraculous turnaround. That may seem like it's just kicking the can down the road, but if it saves the University several million dollars and allows them to take more time in lining up the right replacement for a somewhat unique position, then it seems reasonable.
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Post by practice on Mar 23, 2017 11:42:05 GMT -5
I'm not suggesting the contract doesn't matter. And I know that if jt iii and the university parted ways, the university would be on the hook to pay him his salary or buyout fee. What I am suggesting is that it's all a negotiation. Jt iii could agree to keep his job at a reduced rate. Or lose his job but keep his money / buyout. Everyone keeps saying why would he resign (I get it and agree no one would leave money on the table) but when faced with getting fired or restructuring he contract I think that is more nuanced and may find a more willing jt iii. Listen - maybe not. But then we are no worse off and r we him the buyout fee. But don't claim that contracts are written and no restructuring is ever attempted. As I (and Aleutian) have described in previous posts, I think that the negotiation which you are describing (which actually seems rather likely) is occuring and when it is concluded it will be publicly framed as a contract extension. I would guess that the University will try to reduce base pay and the buyout hit, but in consideration for that, will offer JTIII an extension in years and higher incentive bonuses. The extra years would probably be pretty easy things to give up from the University's perspective, as a lower buyout would make early termination more affordable. Similarly, the bonus payments would only be paid out if JTIII rights the ship. If he does that, the school would be happy to make him whole. My point is I bet you are on the right track, but don't be surprised if it gets get announced as a contract extension and vote of confidence. Good God ... I hope you are wrong. He's a dead man walking. Barring some real recruiting rabbits out of a hat, we are in for a historically bad season. For himself and his career, he should find a way to leave gracefully and well compensated now.
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Mar 23, 2017 11:42:41 GMT -5
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royski
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Post by royski on Mar 23, 2017 11:43:21 GMT -5
Please be true, for the love of God.
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Post by HometownHoya on Mar 23, 2017 11:47:14 GMT -5
Is there any way JT3 or really any other coach can take the current team -- Campbell, Mulmore, Mosely, Hines, Govan, Muresan, Agau, Derrickson and Johnson (assuming no one else leaves) -- and have a winning record in the Big East and make the NCAAs? How about if one or two key players leave? Are there enough JUCO and 5th year Seniors and 2+ recruits out there to fix things immediately? I think not. I think it is insane to bring back JT3 if there's little chance of turning things around in the near term. Is he automatically fired after three miserable seasons? What is the upside besides only paying one head coach salary next year? Does anyone think it is in JT3's best interest to finish his career at with another losing season? I just don't see the logic in bringing him back to what is almost certainly a losing proposition. Right now he has the resume to get another high major job -- new place, new start. He's a lot less marketable/attractive in 12 months if he's in this same position again. Again: is it possible to win with this team next year? I don't see it. I see 15-20 losses heading our way. Do JT3 backers think he should leave after a 3rd season? Do JT3 backers see a path to the NCAAs next year with JT3 at the helm? 9 of our 18 losses were by 6 points or less. Another 4 were by 10 points or less. That's between 2-5 baskets. Not a huge margin. I definitely believe that this team as built can have just as good of a record if not better. I'm sure JT3 will keep the non-Nike T OOC pretty easy. Add in that they are heavy on the JUCO and Grad trail, I expect at least 2 more unknown contributors on campus in the fall. Now will that turn us into a BE winning team? Probably not without a good amount of luck. The only upsides to bringing JT3 back are financial and a drawn out coaching consideration. Now why the second hasn't already been going on, that is beyond me. JT3's career would probably be better if he left for greener pastures but he is a Hoya as well and wants to fix it himself (who wouldn't). The man isn't a quitter and will keep coaching the players that want to play for him as long as the university asks/pays him to. If we decide to keep him this year and an "extension" (as Cambridge puts it) is given, then I think he'll have more then one year, unless that buyout is very G-town favorable. If no extension is given, then I expect to see him out at the end of his contract (which many believe it is until 2019).
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Mar 23, 2017 11:53:39 GMT -5
Contracts are breached all the time--indeed its an expected part of any agreement and in any agreement drafted/reviewed by attorneys there will be contract provisions regarding how to deal with a breach. However, a termination is not necessarily a breach. More likely, and as discussed in this thread a zillion time, there is some provision in the contract which states how the each party can unilaterally, or jointly, terminate the agreement. That clause probably discusses misconduct, notice, payout, etc. I can guarantee that there is a clause(s) which deals with this. What we don't know is how easily such a termination clause is to trigger. A breach would only occur if the parties failed to abide by the terms of the termination clause--i.e. JTIII is fired and the school refuses to pay him a buy out. A renegotiation of a contract is simply a new contract which amends the first. In order for a contract to be valid, there must be something of value exchanged ("consideration" for those who have been to law school). So, an invalid renegotiation would be if the school said, "you have a 3 year contract for $3 million/year. Accept $1.5 million/year for the remainder or we won't pay you a cent." in that scenario JTIII receives no consideration for his agreement to alter the previous contract. On the other hand, a perfectly valid renegotiation could be "you have a 3 year contract for $3 million a year, which we can terminate for a payout of $4 million right now. We will trigger that buyout, unless you agree to reduce your salary to $1.5 million/year ($4.5 million total)." In this scenario, JTIII would receive consideration for the renegotiated contract (the new contract is worth more than the buyout which is all that was actually promised in the original). Trust me. I understand the contract law. And what you're saying is generally correct. However, what joey0403p was suggesting in his original post was exactly what you describe as being an invalid renegotiation: "So, an invalid renegotiation would be if the school said, 'you have a 3 year contract for $3 million/year. Accept $1.5 million/year for the remainder or we won't pay you a cent.' in that scenario JTIII receives no consideration for his agreement to alter the previous contract." That's basically what joey0403p was suggesting. Obviously, parties to a contract can renegotiate the contract if they want to do so. It happens all the time. But that's not what was suggested - what was suggested was Georgetown laying down the terms of a renegotiation and if JT3 didn't like it, to tell him to leave. That's breaching a contract, not a renegotiation. This is really silly because there have been like 10 posts about this, and nothing I am saying is controversial or violates any tenets of contract law. I really wonder whether sometimes people write on here just to be contrary.
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Cambridge
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Post by Cambridge on Mar 23, 2017 11:58:26 GMT -5
Things could be worse, btw. We could be Duquesne. Becker from UVM just turned down the gig. I think that's the third candidate to do so publicly.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Mar 23, 2017 12:02:25 GMT -5
Unconfirmed JT3 is gone. This is from CH.
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beenaround
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Post by beenaround on Mar 23, 2017 12:06:23 GMT -5
Hoyasaxa2003...this whole thing is out of control..feel like its like our country's present political divide. Because You are seemingly on the other side from most of us, anything you say must be attacked, even if it is reasonable. Honestly, most your posts indicate you are not even against III being gone...just not advocating for it. This internet thing creates lots of animosty!
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Post by augustusfinknottle on Mar 23, 2017 12:07:05 GMT -5
Could we be heading into "interim coach" territory?
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alleninxis
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Post by alleninxis on Mar 23, 2017 12:08:46 GMT -5
Could we be heading into "interim coach" territory? No. But we are about to have a new one.
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TC
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Post by TC on Mar 23, 2017 12:09:38 GMT -5
Could we be heading into "interim coach" territory? Probably not. If this happens, and it's not just Casual going full on hoyaballa, we had a new coach search wrapped up and signed within a month last time. If they can hire a coach in a month or two, I don't think you miss out on anything but JUCO/2-star/5th year recruiting.
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lda05816
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Post by lda05816 on Mar 23, 2017 12:11:28 GMT -5
Could we be heading into "interim coach" territory? No. But we are about to have a new one. Please tell me it's not Amaker
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Ottomatic
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Post by Ottomatic on Mar 23, 2017 12:13:05 GMT -5
Could we be heading into "interim coach" territory? No. But we are about to have a new one. Christian?
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lda05816
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Post by lda05816 on Mar 23, 2017 12:14:17 GMT -5
Tom Crean?
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deacon
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Post by deacon on Mar 23, 2017 12:14:25 GMT -5
Could we be heading into "interim coach" territory? No. But we are about to have a new one. I just hope it isn't who I think it is. He can recruit no doubt and would have us in position for great '18 and '19 classes, but I really want a great X's and O's guy. Let the assistants handle the heavy lifting recruiting, just close when needed.
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thedragon
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Post by thedragon on Mar 23, 2017 12:14:42 GMT -5
Amaker Wiki page already updated as current coach of Georgetown
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guru
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Post by guru on Mar 23, 2017 12:15:10 GMT -5
Let's see if this is opinion or news (or semi-news)!
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 23, 2017 12:15:12 GMT -5
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 23, 2017 12:15:34 GMT -5
Amaker Wiki page already updated as current coach of Georgetown Well, THERE'S a solid news source.
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