tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,328
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Post by tashoya on Aug 19, 2018 23:36:11 GMT -5
These revelations do not, in any way, reduce my faith as a Catholic. My faith is in God and in His church, not men. His Church is Him living among us, not the Pope, cardinals, bishops or priests. Granted, I hope those in leadership positions in my church live their faith and many have failed to do so and I feel extreme shame as a Catholic. In some ways it is not surprising. The 60's ushered in the period of rejection of all authority, including that of God. In the Catholic Church it ushered in a period of picking and choosing what to believe rather than attempting to follow all the beliefs of the Church. The damn-the-authority era made its way into many of our seminaries where sexual depravity became a way of life in the seminaries themselves. Those ordained in that era moved on to become our priests and bishops so why should anyone be surprised at what happened? I am surprised only at the magnitude of it. I will continue to attempt to live my faith; and, to pick myself up and ask for forgiveness when I fail. I ask God's blessings on all the victims and his forgiveness to all the priests who ask for it. I have been blessed to have had good priests and brothers ministering to me, wherever life has taken me, and I hope they are there for me during my remaining (few) months or years. Great post except for the the "damn the authority" part. The blame is on those men, not on that era. They committed those heinous acts and crimes, not the era. That's a cop out and a really poor one. Not to mention, the disproportionate crimes in that small population over decades that are not contained within that era of people. They don't get a pass. They're horrible, ty people and deserve whatever Hell is coming their way. There is no excuse for their predatory behavior. There are horrible people in every era of humans. There is a disproportionate number of horrible people that children and other emotionally vulnerable people go to for guidance and those people have preyed on them. And the Church, though tacitly, condoned it. None of them get a pass due to era or circumstance or any other fallacious softening of the blow for followers. There are horrible people up and down the chain that committed crimes either actively or as accessories. And it was institutionally protected. I'm glad for you that you had and have good priests and brothers ministering to you. I only wish the victims had the same and, when they didn't and it was well known by the Church, someone (if not everyone) stepped up to protect those most in need of protection and counsel which is what they went to Church for in the first place. They are the worst kind of predators. And that's on them. May they rot.
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
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Post by EasyEd on Aug 20, 2018 12:54:48 GMT -5
These revelations do not, in any way, reduce my faith as a Catholic. My faith is in God and in His church, not men. His Church is Him living among us, not the Pope, cardinals, bishops or priests. Granted, I hope those in leadership positions in my church live their faith and many have failed to do so and I feel extreme shame as a Catholic. In some ways it is not surprising. The 60's ushered in the period of rejection of all authority, including that of God. In the Catholic Church it ushered in a period of picking and choosing what to believe rather than attempting to follow all the beliefs of the Church. The damn-the-authority era made its way into many of our seminaries where sexual depravity became a way of life in the seminaries themselves. Those ordained in that era moved on to become our priests and bishops so why should anyone be surprised at what happened? I am surprised only at the magnitude of it. I will continue to attempt to live my faith; and, to pick myself up and ask for forgiveness when I fail. I ask God's blessings on all the victims and his forgiveness to all the priests who ask for it. I have been blessed to have had good priests and brothers ministering to me, wherever life has taken me, and I hope they are there for me during my remaining (few) months or years. Great post except for the the "damn the authority" part. The blame is on those men, not on that era. They committed those heinous acts and crimes, not the era. That's a cop out and a really poor one. Not to mention, the disproportionate crimes in that small population over decades that are not contained within that era of people. They don't get a pass. They're horrible, ty people and deserve whatever Hell is coming their way. There is no excuse for their predatory behavior. There are horrible people in every era of humans. There is a disproportionate number of horrible people that children and other emotionally vulnerable people go to for guidance and those people have preyed on them. And the Church, though tacitly, condoned it. None of them get a pass due to era or circumstance or any other fallacious softening of the blow for followers. There are horrible people up and down the chain that committed crimes either actively or as accessories. And it was institutionally protected. I'm glad for you that you had and have good priests and brothers ministering to you. I only wish the victims had the same and, when they didn't and it was well known by the Church, someone (if not everyone) stepped up to protect those most in need of protection and counsel which is what they went to Church for in the first place. They are the worst kind of predators. And that's on them. May they rot. In no way did my post excuse the actions of these priests. I only said I was not surprised. Your totally justified condemnation of the priests and the hierarchy of the Church would carry more weight if you used similar language to condemn an even more heinous wrong of killing innocent babies.
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,207
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Post by hoya9797 on Aug 20, 2018 14:01:03 GMT -5
You're not holding the priests or the organization accountable for any of their crimes. You really don't care at all about what has happened.
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,207
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Post by hoya9797 on Aug 20, 2018 14:35:41 GMT -5
And, the Pope came down hard today calling for prayer AND fasting. You know he means business when he pulls out the double barreled useless gesture. Never forget that the "cool pope" is just as awful and regressive as the rest of them.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,952
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Post by EtomicB on Aug 20, 2018 20:38:08 GMT -5
Great post except for the the "damn the authority" part. The blame is on those men, not on that era. They committed those heinous acts and crimes, not the era. That's a cop out and a really poor one. Not to mention, the disproportionate crimes in that small population over decades that are not contained within that era of people. They don't get a pass. They're horrible, ty people and deserve whatever Hell is coming their way. There is no excuse for their predatory behavior. There are horrible people in every era of humans. There is a disproportionate number of horrible people that children and other emotionally vulnerable people go to for guidance and those people have preyed on them. And the Church, though tacitly, condoned it. None of them get a pass due to era or circumstance or any other fallacious softening of the blow for followers. There are horrible people up and down the chain that committed crimes either actively or as accessories. And it was institutionally protected. I'm glad for you that you had and have good priests and brothers ministering to you. I only wish the victims had the same and, when they didn't and it was well known by the Church, someone (if not everyone) stepped up to protect those most in need of protection and counsel which is what they went to Church for in the first place. They are the worst kind of predators. And that's on them. May they rot. In no way did my post excuse the actions of these priests. I only said I was not surprised. Your totally justified condemnation of the priests and the hierarchy of the Church would carry more weight if you used similar language to condemn an even more heinous wrong of killing innocent babies.Do you really believe abortion is a more heinous crime than the rape & sodomy of young children Ed? Have you listened to the stories of some of these victims? How their lives & the lives of family members were hurt by what happened to them as children? Here are some.. www.cnn.com/2018/08/15/us/pennsylvania-catholic-church-victims/index.htmlIt's been 70 years since Robert says he was sexually abused by a priest. And in the decades since, his wife and family suffered every day.
"I couldn't show any affection with my wife," said Robert, now 83. "My children, I couldn't hold or hug." This is the kind of lifelong trauma endured by hundreds of victims at the hands of Pennsylvania priests.
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TC
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 9,458
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Post by TC on Aug 20, 2018 23:49:54 GMT -5
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2018 5:21:18 GMT -5
Prescient really. He knew in 2011 that he would end up supporting a President who would endorse Roy Moore.
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
Posts: 18,374
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Post by SSHoya on Aug 21, 2018 5:23:40 GMT -5
In the week since a Pennsylvania grand jury reported on child sex abuse by Catholic priests, Cardinal Donald Wuerl’s reputation has taken a brutal hit. Wuerl’s upcoming book has been canceled by the publisher, he abruptly pulled out of his role as keynote speaker at a major global meeting in Ireland, and officials are considering taking his name off a high school in his hometown of Pittsburgh, where Wuerl served as bishop for 18 years before becoming the archbishop of Washington in 2006. On Monday, a vandal got ahead of them — covering his name in red spray paint. The country’s political divisions also are seeping into the debate and serving to heighten calls for accountability. Wuerl and his predecessor in Washington, Theodore McCarrick, who resigned as cardinal after allegations surfaced that he sexually abused boys and harassed or inappropriately touched men, have become proxies to conservatives who distrust Francis and think he is too open on issues that include abortion and homosexuality. www.washingtonpost.com/local/social-issues/2018/08/20/0a6ae810-a49f-11e8-97ce-cc9042272f07_story.html?utm_term=.a6a37c79d15b
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,207
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Post by hoya9797 on Aug 21, 2018 8:47:32 GMT -5
Now we know who the real vicitim is in this case. Poor guy, you’d think he’d be able to make his speech even after getting caught covering up thousands of rapes.
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
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Post by EasyEd on Aug 21, 2018 13:50:10 GMT -5
In no way did my post excuse the actions of these priests. I only said I was not surprised. Your totally justified condemnation of the priests and the hierarchy of the Church would carry more weight if you used similar language to condemn an even more heinous wrong of killing innocent babies.Do you really believe abortion is a more heinous crime than the rape & sodomy of young children Ed? Have you listened to the stories of some of these victims? How their lives & the lives of family members were hurt by what happened to them as children? Here are some.. www.cnn.com/2018/08/15/us/pennsylvania-catholic-church-victims/index.htmlIt's been 70 years since Robert says he was sexually abused by a priest. And in the decades since, his wife and family suffered every day.
"I couldn't show any affection with my wife," said Robert, now 83. "My children, I couldn't hold or hug." This is the kind of lifelong trauma endured by hundreds of victims at the hands of Pennsylvania priests.Do I believe that murder of young people is more serious than rape and sodomy? Yes. Do I believe that rape and sodomy of young people are heinous crimes? Yes again.
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
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Post by EasyEd on Aug 21, 2018 13:58:37 GMT -5
Pedophilia is awful and should not be tolerated. Period. Do I believe that pedophilia will become an accepted "alternative life style" in the life of some posters? Yes again. Am I in favor of it? No. Emphatically repulsed by the thought. Some people need to learn that a prediction is not an endorsement. I also predicted that football will be outlawed during the life time of some posters.
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
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Post by EasyEd on Aug 21, 2018 14:01:43 GMT -5
Prescient really. He knew in 2011 that he would end up supporting a President who would endorse Roy Moore. And you supported candidates who saw nothing wrong with murdering babies.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,952
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Post by EtomicB on Aug 21, 2018 14:09:45 GMT -5
Do you really believe abortion is a more heinous crime than the rape & sodomy of young children Ed? Have you listened to the stories of some of these victims? How their lives & the lives of family members were hurt by what happened to them as children? Here are some.. www.cnn.com/2018/08/15/us/pennsylvania-catholic-church-victims/index.htmlIt's been 70 years since Robert says he was sexually abused by a priest. And in the decades since, his wife and family suffered every day.
"I couldn't show any affection with my wife," said Robert, now 83. "My children, I couldn't hold or hug." This is the kind of lifelong trauma endured by hundreds of victims at the hands of Pennsylvania priests.Do I believe that murder of young people is more serious than rape and sodomy? Yes. Do I believe that rape and sodomy of young people are heinous crimes? Yes again. Ed, dont rephrase the question.. Do you think abortion is a more heinous crime than the rape and sodomy of young children?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2018 15:37:52 GMT -5
Prescient really. He knew in 2011 that he would end up supporting a President who would endorse Roy Moore. And you supported candidates who saw nothing wrong with murdering babies. Are you 100% sure that the President you support has never paid for a woman to have an abortion?
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by EasyEd on Aug 21, 2018 18:59:41 GMT -5
Do I believe that murder of young people is more serious than rape and sodomy? Yes. Do I believe that rape and sodomy of young people are heinous crimes? Yes again. Ed, dont rephrase the question.. Do you think abortion is a more heinous crime than the rape and sodomy of young children? I will not rephrase the question.
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by EasyEd on Aug 21, 2018 19:02:47 GMT -5
And you supported candidates who saw nothing wrong with murdering babies. Are you 100% sure that the President you support has never paid for a woman to have an abortion? No. But I am 100% sure that most Democratic party members, including their last nominee to become President, are advocates of allowing mothers to kill their children.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Aug 21, 2018 20:00:55 GMT -5
Ed, dont rephrase the question.. Do you think abortion is a more heinous crime than the rape and sodomy of young children? I will not rephrase the question. Your dodging the question is enough for me Ed...
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by EasyEd on Aug 21, 2018 20:08:00 GMT -5
I will not rephrase the question. Your dodging the question is enough for me Ed... You fully understand what I am saying.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Aug 21, 2018 20:28:21 GMT -5
Your dodging the question is enough for me Ed... You fully understand what I am saying. Actually, I don't Ed. I get that you believe that murder is more serious than rape & Sodomy... I also get that you believe that the rape & sodomy of young children is a heinous crime... What I don't know is whether you think that abortion is more heinous than the rape & sodomy of young children, do you believe that?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2018 7:20:27 GMT -5
Are you 100% sure that the President you support has never paid for a woman to have an abortion? No. But I am 100% sure that most Democratic party members, including their last nominee to become President, are advocates of allowing mothers to kill their children. And at least a few Republicans (including - possibly - their current President) have actually paid for babies to be killed. Elliott Broidy, Scott DesJarlais, Tim Murphy...gee, I wonder if there might be others out there. But Democrats are the evil hypocrites on this issue.
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