SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Aug 31, 2010 15:03:44 GMT -5
Some very few rich people do a lot of good with it. But the reality is, from the study I've seen, the middle class actually gives a much higher % of their earnings than the wealthy to charity.
The Buffets and Gates of the world have given back, and are putting pressure on others to do so. But they are often the exception.
As for Glenn Beck, I think he knowingly makes up facts, ignores facts and spins this negatively to stir up anger and hatred. I don't think that's a good thing on either side of the aisle. So yes, I do think he's hurt people along the way.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Aug 31, 2010 15:18:58 GMT -5
Some very few rich people do a lot of good with it. But the reality is, from the study I've seen, the middle class actually gives a much higher % of their earnings than the wealthy to charity. The Buffets and Gates of the world have given back, and are putting pressure on others to do so. But they are often the exception. As for Glenn Beck, I think he knowingly makes up facts, ignores facts and spins this negatively to stir up anger and hatred. I don't think that's a good thing on either side of the aisle. So yes, I do think he's hurt people along the way. Yeah, but that's just your opinion. I don't mean that snidely. But it's true. It may be the opinion of a lot of like-minded people, but you don't have anything to say he earned his fortune crookedly in any way. So he has every right to it. Let me put it this way. I think Keith Olbermann is far worse than Glenn Beck when it comes to the things you talk about above. In fact he goes out of his way to hurt people with distortions. But I do not begrudge him whatever he earns marketing himself. Personally, I doubt he could gather 50 people on the mall, but if he could do an event like Beck just did, and if he used the proceeds to fund a worthy project, I would have no objection whatsoever to him doing it. Heck, I'll even wish Olbermann good luck on his book sales. (God knows, he's gonna' need it). Or what about Jon Stewart? He has gotten amazingly wealthy pretty much SOLELY on distortions. "Oh, but that's just comedy. He's just an entertainer." Sorry. Glenn Beck is an entertainer too. And a lot of people find him funny as well. And the statistics that show how many people actually get their news from Jon Stewart are depressing and alarming. "But Glenn Beck is trying to influence people!! He is trying to shape politics in this country!!" And Jon Stewart isn't?
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Aug 31, 2010 15:39:59 GMT -5
It is just my opinion. I think the guy's unethical. I'm not sure if he has every right to it; I personally am depressed and annoyed that someone straight lying in a news format is not fraud, but forgetting that I suppose he has a right to it.
It doesn't mean he isn't hurting anyone. I don't watch Keith Olbermann -- I mean, I've NEVER watched Keith Olbermann, so it may be as you say.
I've never seen Stewart lie about anything, personally, though it's possible that my bs detector is on lower. Is he biased in the sense that he and his writers bring their point of view to the comedy table? Absolutely. Do I think he consciously distorts the news to feed ratings? I dunno. I don't think so, but that could just be because he's subtler about it.
I have no problem with people trying to influence people. I have a problem with people distorting the truth, but I think there's at least a subset on both sides who might at least have a good motivation ("this is what's best for the country, etc.").
Then there's people who either straight out lie or intentionally stir people up not for a perceived good cause but simply to forward their career, make money, etc. They don't believe it, they know they something bad will happen, but ratings is ratings!
I could be wrong, but I think Beck is in the last group. Keith Olbermann may be as well.
Lastly, if you find Glenn Beck funny you find people like Colin Cowherd funny. Dude is not funny. And that's non-negotiable.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Aug 31, 2010 16:01:31 GMT -5
Well, he's no Ann Coulter, that's for sure. ;D
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Buckets
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Post by Buckets on Aug 31, 2010 16:15:24 GMT -5
I don't know. Seems to me the guy just completed a very innocuous, very peaceful and very successful gathering that, if nothing else, almost certainly raised millions of dollars for the Special Operations Warrior Foundation. (I don't know fundraising totals, but it had to be in the millions, I would think.) Not really sure what there is to get one's panties in a twist about. Sure, it was overtly religious, so I would expect people like Christopher Hitchens to be very turned off by it. And that's perfectly OK. But other than that, what's the big deal? So would that be similar to building a community center in Manhattan or no?
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Aug 31, 2010 16:22:08 GMT -5
Do I think holding a one-day event is similar to erecting a permanent structure? No, not really.
But both parties are well within their rights to have their event/build their structure. I have not argued otherwise.
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thebin
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Post by thebin on Sept 1, 2010 9:29:57 GMT -5
Glenn Beck is a melodramatic used car salesman who has found himself a well-paying job as an ill-educated demagogue who appeals to the base emotions of disgruntled people. He makes my skin crawl. I don't disagree with him so much as the guy just gives me the willies and I find his shtick embarrassingly saccharine and without any value. The last thing this country needs is more public Christianity.
For the record I voted for Bush twice and McCain and will vote for anyone over Obama in 2012 who isn't Sarah Palin or someone like her. Oh....and I detest Keith Olberman going back to the days when he was literally talking about my high school football team as a local San Diego sportscaster.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Sept 1, 2010 10:06:16 GMT -5
+1.
And to the point above, Jon Stewart is a comedian. He will make fun of whatever is on the plate--that's his job. Keith Olbermann is a commentator. He will express an opinion, whether agreed or not, and that's his job. By contrast, Glenn Beck is an opportunist who preys upon fear and loathing to get ratings and sell gold coins. (I'm sure he would sell fallout shelters too but that sponsor probably still buys time on Art Bell's show.) If Olbermann mercilessly refers to Beck as "Lonesome Rhodes", perhaps it is because, like the character in the movie, Beck's story will eventually collapse and he will move out of the national subconsciousness, as Joe Pyne and Morton Downey Jr. did before him.
Beck noted Saturday that he is "unelectable". Would that Sarah Palin would realize the same.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Sept 1, 2010 11:28:46 GMT -5
If Jon Stewart's job is to be a comedian who mocks "everything on his plate" then he doesn't do his job very well at all.
And I like Stewart, I think he's funny. But that is not a correct characterization of what he does at all.
And if Keith Olbermann's job is just a "commentator," then why does he anchor or co-anchor MSNBC news coverage of major news events?
(And if Keith Olbermann is a commentator, why is Glenn Beck NOT a commentator? Because he's better at what he does? Seems like you have a little double standard going there).
I don't care whether you like Glenn Beck or not. I don't watch his show (EDIT: I should say regularly; of course I've seen his show, I just don't make a point to watch it; I prefer PTI when I am home at that hour). I don't listen to his radio program. It's not for me. Nor did I go to his rally. I don't like crowds. I've seen clips of him, I saw him Sunday on FNS and I read the text of his speech. It was all very harmless.
All I'm saying is he is entitled to earn whatever he wants if he's doing it legally, and I'm not going to rag on him just because he's rich and has found a niche in which he can be successful.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Sept 1, 2010 13:11:10 GMT -5
One thing about Beck that I think makes him different from Olbermann is that Beck represents himself as a satirist, or people say he is a satirist so he won't be held to account for the offensive things that he says. Take when he called Obama a racist - most, I hope, realize he was not serious, but others hope he was serious because they believe that kind of thing. The Obama as fascist-communist rhetoric could also be traced to Beck.
With Olbermann, I don't get the sense that he means anything as satire, and he means what he says whether you agree with it or not.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Sept 1, 2010 14:25:12 GMT -5
"[Beck] seems to have come away from Saturday's rally more convinced of end times, or something close: "I believe we're approaching a last call, all aboard," he said. "I had nightmares last night, because I felt maybe I wasn't clear enough. The message I feel I'm supposed to give you is get behind the shield of God." www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/30/AR2010083005565.html
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SirSaxa
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Post by SirSaxa on Sept 1, 2010 16:16:44 GMT -5
"[Beck] seems to have come away from Saturday's rally more convinced of end times, or something close: "I believe we're approaching a last call, all aboard," he said. "I had nightmares last night, because I felt maybe I wasn't clear enough. The message I feel I'm supposed to give you is get behind the shield of God." www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/08/30/AR2010083005565.htmlLife imitating art? Howard Beale anyone?
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TC
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Post by TC on Sept 1, 2010 16:52:18 GMT -5
And if Keith Olbermann is a commentator, why is Glenn Beck NOT a commentator? Because he hosts his own political rallies.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2010 14:05:54 GMT -5
According to the very left-wing NBC news, Glenn Beck's rally yesterday at the Lincoln Memorial drew about 300,000 people. Other estimates were higher. That's a lot of right-wing kooks. Metro ridership the day of the Beck rally: 510,000 Metro ridership Saturday for the Stewart/Colbert rally: 825,000
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Nov 1, 2010 14:32:31 GMT -5
Aerial photo estimate of crowd at Beck rally: 87,000 Aerial photo estimate of crowd at Stewart/Colbert rally: 215,000
Both estimates from the same company.
Also worth noting for the Metro estimates is the fact that Metro had major breakdowns on the day of the Stewart/Colbert rally, which reduced ridership by quite a bit.
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rosslynhoya
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Post by rosslynhoya on Nov 1, 2010 15:13:43 GMT -5
Aerial photo estimate of crowd at Beck rally: 87,000 Aerial photo estimate of crowd at Stewart/Colbert rally: 215,000 Both estimates from the same company. Of course, that same company was hired by the flagship network for the megacorporation that also owns Comedy Central. For the slow readers: the only "news" network that reported the Beck's rally attendance at under 100,000 attendees has a vested interest in inflating the relative importance of its sister network's stunt. I'm perfectly fine with Cam's analogy on the other hand, though I would guess that some of the difference can be explained by Beck attendees a) being more likely to own cars and insist on foolishly driving them to the mall and b) arriving with organized groups that chartered private motorcoaches rather than public transit.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Nov 1, 2010 15:33:36 GMT -5
Meh. Two successful rallies were held on the mall.
I had no interest in attending either, but I tried to watch some of each on TV.
I didn't find either particularly funny, except maybe for John Oliver.
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on Nov 1, 2010 18:48:44 GMT -5
Aerial photo estimate of crowd at Beck rally: 87,000 Aerial photo estimate of crowd at Stewart/Colbert rally: 215,000 Both estimates from the same company. Of course, that same company was hired by the flagship network for the megacorporation that also owns Comedy Central. For the slow readers: the only "news" network that reported the Beck's rally attendance at under 100,000 attendees has a vested interest in inflating the relative importance of its sister network's stunt. Viacom split from CBS a few years ago. The two are no longer related. Is the number for the Beck rally accurate? Probably not. But most analysts say that the number for the Stewart/Colbert rally is too low as well. Instead of some nefarious plot to increase viewership for a channel they no longer own, the more likely explanation is that the aerial photo company's methodology causes them to underestimate audiences at events like this. Either that, or people on the ground tend to overestimate audiences.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Nov 1, 2010 19:47:52 GMT -5
The rally this weekend never interested me even for television viewing. I was pleased to only see one Hitler sign - which compared Stephen Colbert in jest to Hitler rather than the pre-printed signs that frequent less mainstream rallies.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Nov 2, 2010 9:49:27 GMT -5
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