tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,330
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Post by tashoya on Mar 20, 2010 22:16:34 GMT -5
Amen, Tas. I saw a bunch of intensity in the huddle during time outs, etc. But there are a ton of coaches who like to highlight how much they are "coaching" by ranting and raving on the sidelines. A whole bunch of that is a show for the cameras, fans, boosters, owners, etc. III doesn't do that, and he tries to never humiliate a player publicly. Good for him. That is not the reason we're all disapointed this weekend. That's what I was trying to say. Much more succinct. Thank you.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,330
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Post by tashoya on Mar 20, 2010 22:21:46 GMT -5
Another couple of questions:
If coach was the kind of guy that was all fire and energy on the sidelines and screaming and yelling like a 10 year old, do you think that would have a positive or negative effect on Chris and Greg in particular who often try to do things that are either ill-advised or beyond their current abilities? Specifically, would Chris drive the lane out of control less or more (he improved a boatload in this regard this season)? Would Greg turn over his right shoulder and put the ball on the floor in the paint only to have it swatted away by an opposing guard more frequently or less?
Relatedly, do you think Chris and Greg do these things because they lack fire and don't care and don't want to win? Or, do they do these things because they're trying absolutely everything they can think of to get the team going because all they want to do is win?
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Post by dove on Mar 20, 2010 22:29:31 GMT -5
How to win? Just watch the women---aggressive defense,crash the offensive boards,never let up!!
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RDF
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 8,835
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Post by RDF on Mar 20, 2010 22:42:31 GMT -5
How to win? Just watch the women---aggressive defense,crash the offensive boards,never let up!! Yeah--only difference--when you are crashing boards in Women's BB with 6'1/6'2 players--it's not bad--you do that crap in a real sport--with men--and you give up dunks/layups--see end of Notre Dame game--notice the lack of floor balance? Attitude wise--I think you can take anything from a good team-no matter the gender--but it's a helluva lot easier to dominate a sport that isn't nearly as competitive then it is when you are playing high level basketball against athletes.
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Post by afalcon10 on Mar 21, 2010 0:07:36 GMT -5
How to win? Just watch the women---aggressive defense,crash the offensive boards,never let up!! Yeah ...a JT3 coached ballclub will never fit this description, sorry.
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Post by bronxhoya87 on Mar 21, 2010 7:55:18 GMT -5
As for not trying a trap or a press, you did see our zone defense that we switched to when man wasn't working in the beginning of the year? It was beyond awful. You don't switch to something that you haven't taught or worked on. You think we had a short bench this year? Imagine how much shorter it would have looked with running a press.
Tas.........what was the alternative? We were down and we needed to try something. If we were going to die, die aggressively. Despite depth we should know how to press and trap.
What I really want to address in this post is......with the required depth next year do we press and trap? I say no because JTIII is stubborn. What do you think?
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Post by HometownHoya on Mar 21, 2010 17:02:04 GMT -5
As for not trying a trap or a press, you did see our zone defense that we switched to when man wasn't working in the beginning of the year? It was beyond awful. You don't switch to something that you haven't taught or worked on. You think we had a short bench this year? Imagine how much shorter it would have looked with running a press. I wish we would have seen our zone defense more in the beginning of the year. Of course JTIII wouldn't switch to something that he hasn't taught or worked on, so he obviously had taught it and worked on it but it takes IN GAME experience to actually become good at a defense. Cuse was so good at their zone defense this year because they NEVER GOT OUT OF IT. Also, a little more zone gives more time for the players to rest and maybe even an opportunity to press on a possession or two. But I agree that the major reason we did not press was because of our short bench. What I really want to address in this post is......with the required depth next year do we press and trap? I say no because JTIII is stubborn. What do you think? I think that we will press much more and our zone defense has always included a trap. We have the length on the wings to allow us to be very disruptive (much like Cuse's Zone this year) in the Zone and most Zones trap when players find themselves caught in between two player's defensive zone. Obviously JTIII has never (to my knowledge) included a full/aggressive press but I would like to see him start to implement one next year (especially with Markel and Vee seeing more minutes) as long as he uses it EARLY in the season. I don't want to see it pulled out for the first time half way through the BE season. I'm not sure where everyone has gotten that JTIII is stubborn. He has made adjustments in the past, during the offseason, during the season, and even during games. Of course some aren't successful but many are. This season we saw our team try to get more points on transition then we ever have before, we saw Vee get more minutes as JTIII saw that he was ready for in-game time (conversely we saw Sim's decline), which I know was a little necessary due to Austin's illness but Coach could have put Vee back on the bench when Austin returned but Coach found a way to get Vee minutes. Last season we saw coach BENCH his ONLY senior and reduce his minutes as he got less effective, if anything that was the complete opposite of Coach being stubborn. Most other Coaches would stick with their more experienced players, especially the way last season went. So don't say that JTIII is stubborn, he has a very successful offense (both theoretically and we have seen it in practice) so he stays with it. His defense in past years has been VERY effective, so why scrap it before its broken? Teams learned better how to beat it this year so I'm sure we will see some adjustments by the time next season rolls around and we won't be hedging all the time.
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GUHoya07
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,083
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Post by GUHoya07 on Mar 21, 2010 17:25:13 GMT -5
How to win? Just watch the women---aggressive defense,crash the offensive boards,never let up!! Yeah ...a JT3 coached ballclub will never fit this description, sorry. afalcon10, I can certainly understand being disappointed with the way the season ended, we all are. I can also understand questioning certain coaching decisions and strategies. However, I cannot understand the extreme level of stupidity you are displaying with these repeated insults of our head coach, who happens to be one of the best in the country. Maybe you weren't here when JT III took over as coach and quickly took us to Back-to-Back Big East titles, a Big East Tournament Title and a Final Four, with teams that played hard defense and never let up. We had become irrelevant nationally and if it wasn't for him we wouldn't even have the opportunity to make the NCAA tournament and be heartbroken the way we were the other night. We have a great head coach and we should be thankful every day that he came to Georgetown. Idiots like you make me embarrassed to read some of the garbage posted on this board.
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Post by afalcon10 on Mar 21, 2010 17:34:36 GMT -5
Yeah ...a JT3 coached ballclub will never fit this description, sorry. afalcon10, I can certainly understand being disappointed with the way the season ended, we all are. I can also understand questioning certain coaching decisions and strategies. However, I cannot understand the extreme level of stupidity you are displaying with these repeated insults of our head coach, who happens to be one of the best in the country. Maybe you weren't here when JT III took over as coach and quickly took us to Back-to-Back Big East titles, a Big East Tournament Title and a Final Four, with teams that played hard defense and never let up. We had become irrelevant nationally and if it wasn't for him we wouldn't even have the opportunity to make the NCAA tournament and be heartbroken the way we were the other night. We have a great head coach and we should be thankful every day that he came to Georgetown. Idiots like you make me embarrassed to read some of the garbage posted on this board. Agreed, JT3 saved our program. There have been cases at other programs when certain coaches help them reach the national level and then someone else is the one to help them break through. I am forver grateful for what Coach has done for Georgetown Basketball , please dont misunderstand me. I simply am looking for whats best for the future, and I think that is for JT3/the program to make some big time changes. The past three years have simply been too dissapointing given the level of talent we have so Coach must try something new!
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dreamhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,259
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Post by dreamhoya on Mar 22, 2010 0:12:33 GMT -5
Actually since the BET he has been doing that.
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Post by HoyaSouth on Mar 29, 2010 2:17:27 GMT -5
Some of you people act like you lost your house betting on this team. Seriously - get some perspective. Yes, we're all disappointed that they lost. Yes, they never should have lost to Ohio. But sometimes it happens in the NCAA tournament. There is no fundamental flaw in the program, just like there was no fundamental flaw in the program in 1985 when Villanova, who had no business being anywhere near the Hoyas, upset JTJr's squad by shooting out of their minds. Are there things to fix and improve? Certainly. Could the team use a renewed commitment to aggressive defense and rebounding? Yes. Would a couple more solid bench players help? Of course. I've got news: those guys will enroll in the fall. This nonsense that the coaching staff has to suddenly scrap everything they've done so far is just that: nonsense. It's hilarious how all these armchair coaches come out of the woodwork after a loss. If you can't see that this program has one of the top 5 coaches in America running it, then to quote several of those armchair know-it-alls, "you don't know basketball." "If you can't see that this program has one of the top 5 coaches in America running it, then to quote several of those armchair know-it-alls;you don't know basketball" I'm an armchair know-it-all and I know nothing about bball. Because there's no way in you know what that JTIII is one of the top 5 coaches in America. You are the reason I post on here. Your blind loyalty. Did you watch the tournament this year? If so, how in the world can you come to that top 5 conclusion? Thank you Dan McQ. Thanks for showing me what I'm dealing with. Who else in here thinks JTIII is a top 5 coach? Dan, I mean come on man.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,607
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 29, 2010 2:39:27 GMT -5
HoyaSouth, if I am the reason you post here than you truly are simply a troll.
If you feel so strongly about it, pick up the phone and call Jack DeGioia. I am sure he is waiting to hear from someone as observant as you. Why are you wasting your time here? Nobody here has any power to accomplish what you appear to want.
I stand by my statement. Unlike you, I judge coaches on their entire body of work and not just on what happened this past season. Get a new message, troll.
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tjm62
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 855
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Post by tjm62 on Mar 29, 2010 6:54:47 GMT -5
Some of you people act like you lost your house betting on this team. Seriously - get some perspective. Yes, we're all disappointed that they lost. Yes, they never should have lost to Ohio. But sometimes it happens in the NCAA tournament. There is no fundamental flaw in the program, just like there was no fundamental flaw in the program in 1985 when Villanova, who had no business being anywhere near the Hoyas, upset JTJr's squad by shooting out of their minds. Are there things to fix and improve? Certainly. Could the team use a renewed commitment to aggressive defense and rebounding? Yes. Would a couple more solid bench players help? Of course. I've got news: those guys will enroll in the fall. This nonsense that the coaching staff has to suddenly scrap everything they've done so far is just that: nonsense. It's hilarious how all these armchair coaches come out of the woodwork after a loss. If you can't see that this program has one of the top 5 coaches in America running it, then to quote several of those armchair know-it-alls, "you don't know basketball." "If you can't see that this program has one of the top 5 coaches in America running it, then to quote several of those armchair know-it-alls;you don't know basketball" I'm an armchair know-it-all and I know nothing about bball. Because there's no way in you know what that JTIII is one of the top 5 coaches in America. You are the reason I post on here. Your blind loyalty. Did you watch the tournament this year? If so, how in the world can you come to that top 5 conclusion? Thank you Dan McQ. Thanks for showing me what I'm dealing with. Who else in here thinks JTIII is a top 5 coach? Dan, I mean come on man. This is needlessly incendiary. In any case, I would say that I don't feel that JTIII can probably be considered a "top 5 coach in the country" only because any metric of mine to define it would probably need a larger body of work than JTIII has had time to build (he is, after all, one of the younger coaches in the 'elite' class). I do know, however, that there are CERTAINLY not five other coaches whom I would prefer to have over JTIII. Frankly, I'm not sure there are any. JTIII is an intelligent, capable coach who runs a classy program. He has reinvigorated the program in almost no time at all. He has shown an ability to recruit talented players -- and will only get better at finding players that he needs to win as time goes on. Sure, there have been some hiccups -- last year's team was one of the youngest in the game and appeared to have chemistry problems that derailed the season; this year's team had a handful of maddening performances, one of which occurred inopportunely in the first round of the NCAA; I suppose we could count Davidson -- but they were simply a red-hot team with an unstoppable scorer, and I'm not sure we were as good that year as our record indicated. It's frustrating to see several consecutive early round exits, but every school -- and every coach -- deals with that.
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Post by thejerseytornado on Mar 29, 2010 8:24:20 GMT -5
as someone else pointed out, it's ridiculous to believe JTIII's faults as a coach include inflexibility. Consider how different the offense is from the first 3-4 years. Fewer backdoor cuts, more guard penetration, different spacing to take advantage of player abilities. The defense has similarly changed...it used to be higher pressure, more fouls, more aggressive. This year, it was less aggressive, but he played more 2-3 zone. In years past, it's been a match-up zone. He does believe in switching on picks. So what?
Should it improve? yes. Is intransigence one of JTIII's faults and one of the reasons it hasn't improved? Not at all.
As for top 5 or whatever, who cares? JTIII is a coach who can recruit, develop players, and has (not recently) led a team to a long postseason. There aren't that many coaches who can do that + not be asses. If you have one of those coaches, you don't let him go. It's that simple
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chep3
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,314
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Post by chep3 on Mar 29, 2010 8:41:38 GMT -5
I have a question. Given that this is a moderated message board, and not a public forum, why aren't certain posters banned for reposting the same thing over and over again? This isn't even in relation to HoyaSouth (who I consistently disagree with but seems to be a run of the mill troll). It's more in relation to jctnhoya or whomever has been starting threads since yesterday that would've gotten locked 12 minutes after Ohio when the wounds were still raw (I would have posted this in those threads but they always get locked before I can get to it).
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NCHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,927
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Post by NCHoya on Mar 29, 2010 8:45:57 GMT -5
I think you guys are right, let's do what Seton Hall did and go hire a Ralph Willard type or maybe a Steve (I can't find a job for 7 years) Lavin type like SJU. Because, guess what, that is where the Hoyas would be right now without III.
Give it a rest. Why does it kill you haters that JT3 is a good coach. I do disagree with the irrational exuberance that he is a great coach . . . yet. But if you cannot see that III is a good, solid coach who is willing to adapt his schemes (did you see CW push transition this season?, did you see us attack the press?) to his personnel, then you really are just being a blind instigator that adds nothing to the overall discussion.
He will have a full compliment next season if Monroe returns, and yes, I will be disappointed if we do not win 13-16 games in the BE. But I will not judge III based on results in a single game elimination tournament, how many legendary coaches would have been fired if ADs thought like that? This is not 1965, there is parity in the NCAAs. Expecting domination in March as the only measuring stick is just dumb, wake up to the freaking 21st century already!
Given how tough he schedules his teams, I will judge III by his overall and BE records, not a single game in march.
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Post by gtowndynasty on Mar 29, 2010 8:48:54 GMT -5
Excellent point Chep. My question is how many chances does one get before he gets banned permanently. Hasnt his recent behavior shown enough...he has no intention to adhere to the rules, is probably not even a gtown fan, and just wants to stir up the board. I dont wanna hear the free speech argument since that doesnt apply to a talkboard.
Mods-PERMANENT BAN! I cant go through an offseason with these idiots constantly trying to incite the board..
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SaxaCD
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,401
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Post by SaxaCD on Mar 29, 2010 8:49:22 GMT -5
Absolutely -- I'd lock him up for as long as possible. I hope he's coaching at Georgetown for the next 10 years and beyond. And if he is, he'll have a good share of deep NCAA runs and Big East titles (as well as some maddening clunkers, like every other well-respected coach in the country). Best not to get too badly bent out of shape after a bad one-and-done tourney loss.
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Post by HoyasAreHungry on Mar 29, 2010 9:05:11 GMT -5
as someone else pointed out, it's ridiculous to believe JTIII's faults as a coach include inflexibility. Consider how different the offense is from the first 3-4 years. Fewer backdoor cuts, more guard penetration, different spacing to take advantage of player abilities. The defense has similarly changed...it used to be higher pressure, more fouls, more aggressive. This year, it was less aggressive, but he played more 2-3 zone. In years past, it's been a match-up zone. He does believe in switching on picks. So what? Should it improve? yes. Is intransigence one of JTIII's faults and one of the reasons it hasn't improved? Not at all. As for top 5 or whatever, who cares? JTIII is a coach who can recruit, develop players, and has (not recently) led a team to a long postseason. There aren't that many coaches who can do that + not be asses. If you have one of those coaches, you don't let him go. It's that simple thank you for making this point...I was about to do so. Also, if you really don't think D wont be an emphasis in the offseason then you are crazy. I have full confidence our D will be a huge strong suit for us next season. JTIII's offseason adjustments show the most difference for us. I am as/more frustrated as some of you about our loss in the tournament this year, but there's not much we can do about it at this point. Throwing JTIII under the bus isn't going to have us playing in Indy this week
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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 29, 2010 9:08:09 GMT -5
Is it just me or has this off-season brought out the REAL crackpots?
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