the_way
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Post by the_way on Feb 25, 2010 13:16:18 GMT -5
Let's flip it. What current coach do you have the most respect for? I like Izzo personally. Izzo, most definitely. Howland at UCLA. Jay Wright i may respect the most. His plays small-ball better than any coach i've seen in some time. His guards always play like bigs too. Never really mismatch for them. Oliver Purnell at Clemson. Tubby Smith, without a doubt. Jamie Dixon. I love the way his teams play at Pitt. Gary Williams - one of the best coaches in the country. Jim Boehiem - say what you want, but the man has been doing this thing for over 30 years. Who would have thought Syracuse would be a top 4 team this year?
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Post by williambraskyiii on Feb 25, 2010 13:20:15 GMT -5
Brey schedules his non-conference for basically 10-12 easy wins, never playing someone tough. It's not hard to get to 20 wins with ND's schedule. Using that as "Brey is good" is a joke. Its the JT Jr, Craig Esherick school of scheduling. may i refer you to the 2001-02 and 2002-03 records.
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Post by williambraskyiii on Feb 25, 2010 13:27:59 GMT -5
Let's flip it. What current coach do you have the most respect for? I like Izzo personally. Izzo, most definitely. Howland at UCLA. Jay Wright i may respect the most. His plays small-ball better than any coach i've seen in some time. His guards always play like bigs too. Never really mismatch for them. Oliver Purnell at Clemson. Tubby Smith, without a doubt. Jamie Dixon. I love the way his teams play at Pitt. Gary Williams - one of the best coaches in the country. Jim Boehiem - say what you want, but the man has been doing this thing for over 30 years. Who would have thought Syracuse would be a top 4 team this year? boeheim i agree with you, but Gary? are you serious? He gave up in 2002 after he won the NC. please.
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NCHoya
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Post by NCHoya on Feb 25, 2010 13:31:50 GMT -5
I agree Brey's POYs were a joke, but given the talent level at ND due to the high and strict academic standards of the university, he does pretty darn well with what he has. Just saying you never see ND with guys from diploma mills or basketball factories, because Brey is simply not allowed to recruit them. I think that has to be taken into consideration. I completely agree with the scheduling point and his record in the BE is pedestrian. But is he over-rated? I do not think so.
Izzo, Boeheim, Jamie Dixon, Jay Wright, Howland, Bruce Pearl, Thad Matta, Purdue Coach are all coaches I feel are pretty good, but the only one I think is under-rated is Izzo. How does he do that at MSU? All the others get some good PR or do not deserve much more. Even trying to be as unbiased as possible, I would probably throw JT3 on that list if the team goes Sweet 16 this season.
One point, it is dangerous to start using the tourney to cast sweeping judgements, match-ups are way too important in a one game series.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Feb 25, 2010 13:33:33 GMT -5
Yeah, Gary got complacent, i'll give you that.
Nobody can argue his style doesn't work, and even with the ACC being down, the Terps squad is quite mediocre, and he has done a heck of a job with them this year.
Gary's fault is, like you said, he gave up after 2002. Not coaching, he gave up recruiting the type of kids he had up to that point. And it cost him these last 7 years.
I think he is getting Maryland back to what it used to be under him.
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rccoleon
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Post by rccoleon on Feb 25, 2010 13:37:55 GMT -5
Izzo is high on there. Gotta give credit to Self too. I thought his first title was sort of a Roy Williams-esque one just taking the talent he was given. Now, he's got that team stacked on his own and playing high-level ball. There was one player on that 2008 National Championship team that was recruited to play at Kansas by Roy (Jeremy Case who only played when KU was up by 30). Every meaningful player on that roster was a Self recruit and a Self player. What Self did last year after losing all five starters and five players to the NBA was amazing. They won the Big 12 and should have beaten Michigan State in the Sweet 16 if they didn't Edited it away in the second half. Sherron Collins was the only returning player last year that played meaningful minutes, he was the sixth man, in 2008. Cole Aldrich wasn't even a meaningful role player on that 2008 team (I think he averaged about 7 minutes a game). Self gets ripped on for the Bucknell and Bradley losses in 2004 and 2005, but he is a top-5 coach for his consistency and the way he preaches defense to his burger AA recruits.
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guru
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Post by guru on Feb 25, 2010 13:40:43 GMT -5
Hate the Terps (obviously) but Gary's a good coach. If the past 2 Hoyas teams had improved over the season on the same trajectory as their counterparts in College Park, we'd be scary good.
Williams doesn't have much to work with this season on that roster (which is his own fault) but he has that group playing solid basketball. Give credit where it's due.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Feb 25, 2010 13:43:47 GMT -5
Izzo is high on there. Gotta give credit to Self too. I thought his first title was sort of a Roy Williams-esque one just taking the talent he was given. Now, he's got that team stacked on his own and playing high-level ball. There was one player on that 2008 National Championship team that was recruited to play at Kansas by Roy (Jeremy Case who only played when KU was up by 30). Every meaningful player on that roster was a Self recruit and a Self player. What Self did last year after losing all five starters and five players to the NBA was amazing. They won the Big 12 and should have beaten Michigan State in the Sweet 16 if they didn't Edited it away in the second half. Sherron Collins was the only returning player last year that played meaningful minutes, he was the sixth man, in 2008. Cole Aldrich wasn't even a meaningful role player on that 2008 team (I think he averaged about 7 minutes a game). Self gets ripped on for the Bucknell and Bradley losses in 2004 and 2005, but he is a top-5 coach for his consistency and the way he preaches defense to his burger AA recruits. I forgot about Self. Self can recruit. Good coach. He recruited some studs to Illinois too. The team that Weber took to the championship game had mostly Self recruits i think.
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rccoleon
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Post by rccoleon on Feb 25, 2010 13:52:00 GMT -5
Ya, they were pretty much all Self's players. That was year two of Weber and we have seen what kind of recruiter Weber is.
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hoyaalf
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Post by hoyaalf on Feb 25, 2010 13:59:57 GMT -5
I'll throw Huggins out there. His teams perenially flop, he hasn't made a Final 4 in almost 20 freakin' years and yet he's still a name coach. +1
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harlemhoya
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Post by harlemhoya on Feb 25, 2010 14:21:56 GMT -5
Rick Barnes. GREAT recruiter. Terrible Coach. John Calipari, Dean Smith and Roy Williams too. Dean Smith overrated? Dean went 30 consecutive years finishing 1st or 2nd in the Acc.
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RDF
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Post by RDF on Feb 25, 2010 14:23:52 GMT -5
Nothing is sweeter then Huggins "butterSCOTCH" suit--and that isn't a typo on what needed to be emphasized. Huggins--aka Mr. WhiteFolks--his pimp name on the "streetz".
As for Brey--he's gone away from the "mock" and gone to a long sleeve polo look. Very suave and "sassy" for the '10.
As for "most overrated coach"--that has to go to Josh Pastner--who is the most overrated person in basketball--NCAA or NBA. He's a clown.
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harlemhoya
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Post by harlemhoya on Feb 25, 2010 14:24:09 GMT -5
Let's flip it. What current coach do you have the most respect for? I like Izzo personally. Izzo, most definitely. Howland at UCLA. Jay Wright i may respect the most. His plays small-ball better than any coach i've seen in some time. His guards always play like bigs too. Never really mismatch for them. Oliver Purnell at Clemson. Tubby Smith, without a doubt. Jamie Dixon. I love the way his teams play at Pitt. Gary Williams - one of the best coaches in the country. Jim Boehiem - say what you want, but the man has been doing this thing for over 30 years. Who would have thought Syracuse would be a top 4 team this year? Izzo, Self and Boehiem.
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hoyaalf
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I like what your doing very much. Why squirrel hate me?
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Post by hoyaalf on Feb 25, 2010 14:25:41 GMT -5
screw maryland
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Feb 25, 2010 14:26:05 GMT -5
John Calipari, Dean Smith and Roy Williams too. Dean Smith overrated? Dean went 30 consecutive years finishing 1st or 2nd in the Acc. only 2 titles (both with asterisks) to show for it all that talent that went through UNC, and only 2 titles? i mean, Bill Guthridge took a UNC team to the Final Four....TWICE.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Feb 25, 2010 14:27:20 GMT -5
To the original subject: Roy Williams... seven McD AAs and your team is last.
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harlemhoya
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Post by harlemhoya on Feb 25, 2010 14:28:30 GMT -5
There was one player on that 2008 National Championship team that was recruited to play at Kansas by Roy (Jeremy Case who only played when KU was up by 30). Every meaningful player on that roster was a Self recruit and a Self player. What Self did last year after losing all five starters and five players to the NBA was amazing. They won the Big 12 and should have beaten Michigan State in the Sweet 16 if they didn't Edited it away in the second half. Sherron Collins was the only returning player last year that played meaningful minutes, he was the sixth man, in 2008. Cole Aldrich wasn't even a meaningful role player on that 2008 team (I think he averaged about 7 minutes a game). Self gets ripped on for the Bucknell and Bradley losses in 2004 and 2005, but he is a top-5 coach for his consistency and the way he preaches defense to his burger AA recruits. I forgot about Self. Self can recruit. Good coach. He recruited some studs to Illinois too. The team that Weber took to the championship game had mostly Self recruits i think. Norm Roberts and Billy Clyde Gillispie recruited those kids at Illinois. Depaul should hire Billy Clyde Gillispie.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Feb 25, 2010 14:29:04 GMT -5
Let's flip it. What current coach do you have the most respect for? I like Izzo personally. Jim Boehiem - say what you want, but the man has been doing this thing for over 30 years. Who would have thought Syracuse would be a top 4 team this year? I certainly did not. Then again, I didn't know who Wes Johnson was before this season. Best kept secret in college basketball goes to Boeheim and the Cuse.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Feb 25, 2010 14:30:19 GMT -5
To the original subject: Roy Williams... seven McD AAs and your team is last. cmon. you know Roy was educated by the Dean Smith school of coaching. you need at least 10 all-americans on your depth chart to compete.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Feb 25, 2010 14:31:27 GMT -5
I forgot about Self. Self can recruit. Good coach. He recruited some studs to Illinois too. The team that Weber took to the championship game had mostly Self recruits i think. Norm Roberts and Billy Clyde Gillispie recruited those kids at Illinois. Depaul should hire Billy Clyde Gillispie. Well, we see what Self is doing these days, and what Norm Roberts and Gillispie are both doing these days. So...um....yeah.
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