RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Feb 10, 2010 10:23:15 GMT -5
I took this a completely different way. I think Ethan is still Ethan and knows all about Claire and Kate and who they are/were I think everyone is going to end up back on that island no matter what they do and it will all happen on another flight to australia. Here is why i think this: 1) Jack has to go back to Australia to find his Dad's body 2) Claire has to go back because she lives there 3) Kate goes back to either run from the law or to be with claire for some reason 4) Just before Kate hijacked the Taxi hurley was yelling about something business related that concerned "the outback." at first i thought this was a reference to outback steak house, but now i think it is about a restaurant chain in Australia that he is buying that he will need to go back to Australia to deal with I am guessing the other characters motives will be revealed (like Sun and Jin being deported back to korea) They are stuck and the only way out is death, hence why Juliette said "it worked" after she died This line of thinking is interesting, except, the island is submerged in that timeline. So you think they will all get on a flight to Australia, then die on that flight, and then somehow on the island? Is that some convergence of the timelines or they'll literally crash over the now submerged island, die, and somehow be warped to the reality that we've been seeing on island. I'd say that the "It worked" from dead Juliet is one of the big question marks so far this year. Personally, I'm really thinking that the bomb never went off. The bright white light wasn't necessarily the bomb, but the the same bright light from when the island was skipping through time, which we know happened because Jack/Kate/Sawyer/Sayid/Hurley/Miles/Jin/Juliet were warped from the 70s to 2007. I think the popular wisdom right now seems to be, bomb went off, creating a schism/alternate timeline, while the timeline we're used to was kept as well. But I'm not sure that's what happened. Just think something's fishy about the alternate timeline, that it's something different from what we're thinking, and that we're headed for a big swerve down the line.
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 10, 2010 10:23:32 GMT -5
wait, who was the guy that yelled at Kate in the jungle? she hit him with a butt of the rifle when imprisoned in the Others' camp? Don't you remember the whole prisoner Wookie gambit that they used to free Alex's boyfriend? That was Aldo that they pulled it on.
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jgalt
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Post by jgalt on Feb 10, 2010 11:44:51 GMT -5
I took this a completely different way. I think Ethan is still Ethan and knows all about Claire and Kate and who they are/were I think everyone is going to end up back on that island no matter what they do and it will all happen on another flight to australia. Here is why i think this: 1) Jack has to go back to Australia to find his Dad's body 2) Claire has to go back because she lives there 3) Kate goes back to either run from the law or to be with claire for some reason 4) Just before Kate hijacked the Taxi hurley was yelling about something business related that concerned "the outback." at first i thought this was a reference to outback steak house, but now i think it is about a restaurant chain in Australia that he is buying that he will need to go back to Australia to deal with I am guessing the other characters motives will be revealed (like Sun and Jin being deported back to korea) They are stuck and the only way out is death, hence why Juliette said "it worked" after she died This line of thinking is interesting, except, the island is submerged in that timeline. So you think they will all get on a flight to Australia, then die on that flight, and then somehow on the island? Is that some convergence of the timelines or they'll literally crash over the now submerged island, die, and somehow be warped to the reality that we've been seeing on island. I'd say that the "It worked" from dead Juliet is one of the big question marks so far this year. Personally, I'm really thinking that the bomb never went off. The bright white light wasn't necessarily the bomb, but the the same bright light from when the island was skipping through time, which we know happened because Jack/Kate/Sawyer/Sayid/Hurley/Miles/Jin/Juliet were warped from the 70s to 2007. I think the popular wisdom right now seems to be, bomb went off, creating a schism/alternate timeline, while the timeline we're used to was kept as well. But I'm not sure that's what happened. Just think something's fishy about the alternate timeline, that it's something different from what we're thinking, and that we're headed for a big swerve down the line. Hmmm. See i havent thought it all the way out yet. i was think that there were two distinct realities now but in all realities they end up on the island. Of course there arent enough episodes yet to come to a big conclusion but it just struck me how each character they profiled so far could have a legitimate reason for returning to Australia The most interesting/annoying/shark jumping thing about the season will be the way they resolve the two time lines (maybe the second 2004 time line is just history revising its self to give them a second way to be on the island to keep the time line consistent)
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vcjack
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Post by vcjack on Feb 10, 2010 15:31:54 GMT -5
wait, who was the guy that yelled at Kate in the jungle? she hit him with a butt of the rifle when imprisoned in the Others' camp? Don't you remember the whole prisoner Wookie gambit that they used to free Alex's boyfriend? That was Aldo that they pulled it on. And now he's dead. I think that Miles will have some important things to say about Sayid's condition soon
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Buckets
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Post by Buckets on Feb 11, 2010 3:56:20 GMT -5
Just finished watching and what I really can't stop thinking about is how Baby Ethan should have died on the island in the 1977 explosion. So I guess the schism created by the explosion is retroactive as well?
Good to see Claire back on the island. I also hope Aldo makes some sort of miraculous recovery. Mac AND Lost? How can I lose?!
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Feb 11, 2010 9:51:33 GMT -5
Great point about Ethan that I never thought of. This pushes me even more in the direction that the bomb never actually went off. Hard to imagine that it could change time retroactively, although, who knows. But it definitely makes me think that there is more to meets the eye with alternate timeline and it reflects something other than "the bomb went off and sunk the island, and now it doesn't pull Flight 815 in,"
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 11, 2010 10:24:08 GMT -5
I think jgalt is right on. His theory about them going back to Australia fits right in with Mrs. Hawking's explanation that you cannot change things - you can delay it but the universe finds a way of course-correcting.
I think the series ends with "Where are we?"
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Feb 11, 2010 12:46:48 GMT -5
No I don't think baby eathen should be dead. I assume he and his mom along with all the other women and children were on the sub that left the island before the incident.
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Feb 11, 2010 18:20:21 GMT -5
You're right, totally forgot they threw that in there, so so much for that line of thinking.
Still think there is more than meets the eye with The Incident though.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Feb 17, 2010 9:35:01 GMT -5
Another very good but confusing episode:
First off, Numbers= people? on the wall/ceiling of the seaside cave we see: 4-Locke 8-Reyes 15-Ford 16-Jarrah 23-Shepard 42-Kwon
which kwon is it? Why no kate?
I hope someone gets some screen shots and tells us all the other names that were on the wall. I was told by a friend they saw the name littelton crossed out which i assume is claire.
What of the things that Flocke/Man in Black told us in this episode are true? Was he really once a man? probably but then who made him into the smoke monster? and how? and why? and when? Are the 6 really candidates to replace jacob as protector of the island? If so why does he need a replacement? Since seemingly he started this before he knew he was going to die?( is he dead?) Is there really nothing to protect the island from? Is it really just an island? It sure seems to be more than just an island. Did Jacob make the list of names/cross them out? Or did MiB make that list? ( it could be the same as jacob's list, but MiB made this list in the cave and is taking out the candidates 1 by 1 and crossing them out)
Cool things from last night/ other questions: Smoke monster camera view. MiB screaming at the mystery kid "Don't tell me what I can't do!" Haha I cracked up at that.
Speaking of that kid, who is he? People have postulated a Young Jacob other's an older Aaron. Is it some manifestation of a power higher than jacob and the MiB.
When the kid says "You know the rules you can't kill him" is he referring to Sawyer, or Jacob? Who sets these rules? Why is MiB so scared of this kid?
I really liked the alternate timeline tonight. It was nice to see that Locke and helen got together in this timeline. Neat that rose, hurley, and ben all crossed his path. Also apparently Locke is on good terms with his father since they say he should come to the wedding and there's a picture of locke and his dad on his desk. Assuming this alternate time line is if the bomb went off and they never went to the island, most of the people we've seen so far are a lot better off having never gone to the island.
How funny was ben as a european history teacher.
another interesting connection from the alternate timeline, the first temp lady is the psychic that hugo's dad paid to try and convince him he wasn't cursed back in season 3
MiB picking up the white rock off the scale and throwing it into the sea. Saying it was an inside joke. Clearly The white rock represents Jacob and the black rock represents himself. However are their natures so black and white. We're clearly supposed to beleive at this point that jacob is good and MiB is bad, but is it that simple?
Good episode, but lots of questions.
2 more questions: MiB seemed surprised sawyer could see the kid, why? and How can Sawyer see him?
What does it mean that ben's off the island in the alternate timeline. He didn't get on that sub did he? wasn't he still with the others then?
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Feb 17, 2010 9:58:18 GMT -5
First off, Numbers= people? on the wall/ceiling of the seaside cave we see: 4-Locke 8-Reyes 15-Ford 16-Jarrah 23-Shepard 42-Kwon which kwon is it? Why no kate? Because Kate is useless and should have been killed off a long time ago. But nooooo. We have to continue to watch her whining while Juliet, Charlotte, Libby, Shannon, Claire (not so much anymore -- well, technically not so much anymore for any of them, since they could all show up in parallel timeline), and any other woman who is far more interesting are killed off. (I do, however, continue to fully support the gunning down of Michelle Rodriguez) I've looked around this morning and haven't seen any yet, but I have no doubt there'll be screenshots posted somewhere before the end of the day. I don't think he was ever really a "man," but I'm sure he considers himself to be one. I've got my money on this being a lie. Maybe not a complete lie, they may need candidates for them to inhabit, but I doubt that either Jacob or Esau ever really dies. Yeah. Say, whatever happened to Widmore? That's gotta' come back at some point this season. Along with Desmond, Penny and little Charlie, of course. Again, no, but not a complete lie. In one sense, and to Esau, it really is just an island. It's just more than that to others. See man question above. I think it was a dual participation, hence both stones on the scale in the cave. Pretty sure, in this instance, he was referring to Sawyer/Ford. He definitely has some tie to Jacob, maybe to Aaron as well, but he's also not corporeal, since only "candidates" can see him. I can't figure out why Locke would be on good terms with his father in this timeline. He's still in the wheelchair. Are we supposed to assume that this happened some other way in the other timeline? That seems a stretch. Everyone "seems" better off is I think probably a better description here. Good catch. I never noticed that. Anyway, those are my thoughts.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Feb 17, 2010 10:42:52 GMT -5
This is a theory from Lostopedia, but brings up somethings form the interactive games that took place between season of lost, that i'm not sure every here knows about. Just thought it was interesting.
"From the Lost ARG's, THE NUMBERS are the VALENZETTI EQUATION. The Valenzetti Equation was discovered by a mathematician named Valenzetti, that accurately predicts the date in which humanity will extinguish itself. In Season's 4 & 5, Daniel Faraday talks a lot of "equations" "variables" and "constants." He says that the Variables are people, ("them" to be more accurately). The Numbers coincide with different characters names sketched across a cave wall belonging to Jacob."
1 more question:
What is the meaning of the episodes title the substitute. Obviously it partially is a reference to Locke's new job as a substitute teacher in the alternate time line. But obviously it's more than that. Who's goign to be substituting for whom? Is it a reference to the MiB substituting in locke's form? Does someone have to substitute locke as the new #4 on the wall?
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RBHoya
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Post by RBHoya on Feb 17, 2010 10:49:29 GMT -5
List of the names on the cave ceiling from Lostpedia: 10 MATTINGLY Possibly the US army soldier whose uniform was stolen and used by an Other in 1954. 20 ROUSSEAU Possibly Danielle Rousseau or Alex Rousseau, both of whom had been killed before the list's appearance. Only Danielle actually came to the island from elsewhere; Alex was born there. 29 BRENNAN Possibly the Brennan from the science expedition or Tom Brennan, who was there when Jacob encountered Kate. 31 RUTHERFORD Probably Shannon Rutherford. 33 MARTIN Possibly Karl Martin. 55 BURKE Possibly Juliet. Her death occurred after Jacob's, so her name would have to have been crossed-off before her death. Could also be her late ex-husband, Edmund Burke. 90 TROUPE Probably Gary Troup, author of Bad Twin 147 LEWIS Possibly Charlotte Lewis, or her parents David and Jeanette. 171 STRAUME Possibly Miles Straume. 175 COSTA Unknown. 195 PACE Probably Charlie Pace. 222 O'TOOLE Unknown. 233 JONES Possibly the US army soldier whose uniform was stolen and used by Charles Widmore in 1954. 291 DOMINGO Unknown. 313 LITTLETON Possibly Claire or Aaron. 317 CUNNINGHAM Possibly the US army soldier whose uniform was stolen and used by an Other in 1954. 335 HENDERSON Possibly Rose Nadler, the only known Henderson (maiden name). 346 GRANT Unknown. 761 FARADAY Probably Daniel Faraday. #? AGUILA Unknown. #? ALMEIDA Unknown. #? CHANG Possibly Pierre or Lara. Miles is separately listed under Straum. #? GOODSPEED Possibly any number of Goodspeeds, including Horace, Amy, Olivia, and Ethan. #? LACOMBE Possibly the Lacombe from the science expedition. #? SULLIVAN Probably Sullivan. Main names with numbers: www.getlostpodcastmedia.com/wp-content/gallery/6x04/6x0400001.jpgAwesome episode I thought. Everything with the fake Locke character has been terrific. The scene where he brought Sawyer into the cave was great and it's the kind of thing I always hope for. Of course, it opened up a ton of new questions too. Richard is so scared of the Man in Black/Fake Locke, he must be a pretty bad dude. It was clear that Sawyer was ready to go to the darkside after Juliet's death, and the Fake Locke is winning him over. The whole thing with the kid was interesting, no idea what to make of that for now. Downside, I expect next week's episode will shift back to the Temple, which has not been nearly as cool as the Locke stuff, even though it hasn't been bad. I figure we're probably 2 weeks away from getting any more development on that storyline. Lot to think on from last night though.
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 17, 2010 11:36:53 GMT -5
What was up with tween Jacob running around the woods? Weirdest part of the episode by far.
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Nevada Hoya
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Post by Nevada Hoya on Feb 17, 2010 12:25:23 GMT -5
I too think that Desmond and Penny have to show up soon.
I am a bit confused (an understatement) by the alternate time line. It would seem that the alternate reality is because the bomb went off negating the electromagnetic pull of the island and thus the plane did not crash. Now the bomb went off with the Dharma people already on the island. Was Ben already on the island when that happened? The bomb should not affect anything that happened before. If Ben was not on the island at that point, then I could see his being the history teacher in the alternate reality. I am just having trouble keeping characters and dates straight in my mind.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Feb 17, 2010 13:48:22 GMT -5
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TC
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Post by TC on Feb 17, 2010 14:05:30 GMT -5
By the way, turrible job with the numbers -
- Jack is not a #23. He's not a Michael Jordan. If anything, he's a #4, like Chris Webber, who constantly blew games for other people.
- Hurley is not a #8 - I mean come on, he's a big-man Center - his number should be up in the 50's, maybe #42, but not #8 - aren't single digits usually guards?
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Feb 17, 2010 14:29:36 GMT -5
By the way, turrible job with the numbers - - Jack is not a #23. He's not a Michael Jordan. If anything, he's a #4, like Chris Webber, who constantly blew games for other people. - Hurley is not a #8 - I mean come on, he's a big-man Center - his number should be up in the 50's, maybe #42, but not #8 - aren't single digits usually guards? ;D ;D (and bonus points for the correct spelling of "turrible." Does anyone know if the Charles Barkley Taco Bell rap is available on iTunes?))
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Nevada Hoya
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Post by Nevada Hoya on Feb 17, 2010 17:01:26 GMT -5
The biggest mystery of this season is where is Buff. Like did he get a life or what?
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jgalt
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Post by jgalt on Feb 17, 2010 19:17:17 GMT -5
By the way, turrible job with the numbers - - Jack is not a #23. He's not a Michael Jordan. If anything, he's a #4, like Chris Webber, who constantly blew games for other people. - Hurley is not a #8 - I mean come on, he's a big-man Center - his number should be up in the 50's, maybe #42, but not #8 - aren't single digits usually guards? ;D ;D (and bonus points for the correct spelling of "turrible." Does anyone know if the Charles Barkley Taco Bell rap is available on iTunes?)) What comes in this box; This box that rocks? A cheezie cordida, crunch so much.
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