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Post by professorhoya on Apr 26, 2024 13:06:43 GMT -5
Absolute travesty what happened to Seton Hall by the NCAA selection committee and that imbecile Dr Charles McCleeland. And then Silent Val Ackerman, oh well try to figure out what we did wrong. Well guess what Val. That Seton Hall team has been dismantled by the portal and NIL. Never got the chance to show how good they were. |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 26, 2024 13:27:52 GMT -5
Absolute travesty what happened to Seton Hall by the NCAA selection committee and that imbecile Dr Charles McCleeland. And then Silent Val Ackerman, oh well try to figure out what we did wrong. Well guess what Val. That Seton Hall team has been dismantled by the portal and NIL. Never got the chance to show how good they were. I think Kadary Richmond having to leave Seton Hall because of NIL (if that is true) is a great symbol of why NIL and free transfers are destroying college basketball and the things that are good about it. But this take is absurd. If Seton Hall had made the tournament, this would have likely happened anyway. And if Val Ackerman had been a loud mouth, Seton Hall would have still been outside the tournament, and Kadary Richmond would have still transferred. You just like criticizing Ackerman whenever you get the chance, even if it makes absolutely no sense, like now. |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 26, 2024 13:30:02 GMT -5
It’s kinda of a hoyaboya spin to slightly exaggerate a player who played the most minutes on the team but only totaled 26 assists for the season. He managed to rack up 49 turnovers which means his assist to turnover ration was horrid. He deserves credit for rebounding and blocking shots and hitting a healthy percentage of his shots. But he deserves some scorn for being so passive in far too many BE games when the team needed his scoring contributions. By the end of the season my mindset was that I wanted Styles eating up as few of Drew McKenna’s minutes as possible, and this was without McKenna having yet to play one minute of college ball. Would have been nice to have kept Styles around but I think the Hoyas have potential other “productive players” at their disposal. The “grass is greener” approach…  Looking at NC St for a quick second, their coach is sticking to his FF formula of reloading with upperclassmen from the portal. DS fits that strategy. As of now, they have just two freshmen coming in. NC St only has one scholarship available. I do not argue with you at all that the approach worked for NC State this past season. BUT, I really don't think that approach is easy to replicate. Keep in mind that NC State was NOT an at large team, and only was in the tournament at all because of their winning the ACC tournament. And then they won a series of games where they weren't the favorite. This would be like saying that Georgetown should have stuck to Ewing's strategy in 2021 because he won the BET. A fluky performance is fun for fans, but it's an outlier. Of course, being in a Final Four gets you a lot of attention and makes it easier to recruit. So let's see if perhaps Keatts can repeat. |
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Post by Lethal_Interjection on Apr 26, 2024 13:32:50 GMT -5
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Apr 26, 2024 13:36:38 GMT -5
The “grass is greener” approach… Looking at NC St for a quick second, their coach is sticking to his FF formula of reloading with upperclassmen from the portal. DS fits that strategy. As of now, they have just two freshmen coming in. NC St only has one scholarship available. I do not argue with you at all that the approach worked for NC State this past season. BUT, I really don't think that approach is easy to replicate. Keep in mind that NC State was NOT an at large team, and only was in the tournament at all because of their winning the ACC tournament. And then they won a series of games where they weren't the favorite. This would be like saying that Georgetown should have stuck to Ewing's strategy in 2021 because he won the BET. A fluky performance is fun for fans, but it's an outlier. Of course, being in a Final Four gets you a lot of attention and makes it easier to recruit. So let's see if perhaps Keatts can repeat. You lost me at “Ewing’s strategy.” Poor Keatts, someone comparing him to Ewing… |
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Post by professorhoya on Apr 26, 2024 13:46:50 GMT -5
Absolute travesty what happened to Seton Hall by the NCAA selection committee and that imbecile Dr Charles McCleeland. And then Silent Val Ackerman, oh well try to figure out what we did wrong. Well guess what Val. That Seton Hall team has been dismantled by the portal and NIL. Never got the chance to show how good they were. I think Kadary Richmond having to leave Seton Hall because of NIL (if that is true) is a great symbol of why NIL and free transfers are destroying college basketball and the things that are good about it. But this take is absurd. If Seton Hall had made the tournament, this would have likely happened anyway. And if Val Ackerman had been a loud mouth, Seton Hall would have still been outside the tournament, and Kadary Richmond would have still transferred. You just like criticizing Ackerman whenever you get the chance, even if it makes absolutely no sense, like now. You need to stop white knighting Val and wake up. This is going to force Shaheen to go elsewhere where they have ab big nil war chest weakening Seton Hall and the Big East. This will also make it harder to get a good TV contract along with the Big East only getting 3 teams in the NCAA tournament. |
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Post by Lethal_Interjection on Apr 26, 2024 13:47:09 GMT -5
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Post by Lethal_Interjection on Apr 26, 2024 13:47:39 GMT -5
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 26, 2024 13:48:56 GMT -5
I do not argue with you at all that the approach worked for NC State this past season. BUT, I really don't think that approach is easy to replicate. Keep in mind that NC State was NOT an at large team, and only was in the tournament at all because of their winning the ACC tournament. And then they won a series of games where they weren't the favorite. This would be like saying that Georgetown should have stuck to Ewing's strategy in 2021 because he won the BET. A fluky performance is fun for fans, but it's an outlier. Of course, being in a Final Four gets you a lot of attention and makes it easier to recruit. So let's see if perhaps Keatts can repeat. You lost me at “Ewing’s strategy.” Poor Keatts, someone comparing him to Ewing… To the extent you meant this tongue in cheek, I'm with you on it.  |
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Post by professorhoya on Apr 26, 2024 13:54:57 GMT -5
The “grass is greener” approach… Looking at NC St for a quick second, their coach is sticking to his FF formula of reloading with upperclassmen from the portal. DS fits that strategy. As of now, they have just two freshmen coming in. NC St only has one scholarship available. I do not argue with you at all that the approach worked for NC State this past season. BUT, I really don't think that approach is easy to replicate. Keep in mind that NC State was NOT an at large team, and only was in the tournament at all because of their winning the ACC tournament. And then they won a series of games where they weren't the favorite. This would be like saying that Georgetown should have stuck to Ewing's strategy in 2021 because he won the BET. A fluky performance is fun for fans, but it's an outlier. Of course, being in a Final Four gets you a lot of attention and makes it easier to recruit. So let's see if perhaps Keatts can repeat. This will be the reality. When you have 9-10 new upper class transfers it will take a full season to gel as a team and there will be a lot of bid stealing like this year. It’s not an aberration and unless the NCAA selection committee and that human imbecile Dr Charles McClleland are investigated the Big East will continue to get shafted by the ACC, Big Ten, Sec influence of the committee |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 26, 2024 13:55:32 GMT -5
I think Kadary Richmond having to leave Seton Hall because of NIL (if that is true) is a great symbol of why NIL and free transfers are destroying college basketball and the things that are good about it. But this take is absurd. If Seton Hall had made the tournament, this would have likely happened anyway. And if Val Ackerman had been a loud mouth, Seton Hall would have still been outside the tournament, and Kadary Richmond would have still transferred. You just like criticizing Ackerman whenever you get the chance, even if it makes absolutely no sense, like now. You need to stop white knighting Val and wake up. This is going to force Shaheen to go elsewhere where they have ab big nil war chest weakening Seton Hall and the Big East. This will also make it harder to get a good TV contract along with the Big East only getting 3 teams in the NCAA tournament. I am not white knighting anybody. You just have an irrational dislike for Ackerman for some bizarre reason. You have made this argument multiple times, and you can never tell me how, AFTER THE NCAA TOURNAMENT STIFFED SETON HALL, Val Ackerman throwing a fit would have helped the immediate situation: 1. The NCAA committee did not pick Seton Hall. 2. Nothing Val Ackerman said after this happened would have changed that 3 Big East teams made the NCAA tournament. So how did Ackerman hurt the Big East or Seton Hall? Should she have had a crystal ball, and assumed this would happen? And how would Ackerman mouthing off had helped get a better TV contract? Or put more money into Seton Hall's NIL coffers? Any damage done to Seton Hall by not being picked by the tournament committee occurred the minute the committee made that decision. There was nothing that could have been done after the fact to put Seton Hall back in. As for the TV contract, Connecticut winning the NCAA tournament will more than counteract any negative from Seton Hall getting stiffed. The Big East has won 4 of the last 10 championships. That should go a long way. |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 26, 2024 13:56:26 GMT -5
I do not argue with you at all that the approach worked for NC State this past season. BUT, I really don't think that approach is easy to replicate. Keep in mind that NC State was NOT an at large team, and only was in the tournament at all because of their winning the ACC tournament. And then they won a series of games where they weren't the favorite. This would be like saying that Georgetown should have stuck to Ewing's strategy in 2021 because he won the BET. A fluky performance is fun for fans, but it's an outlier. Of course, being in a Final Four gets you a lot of attention and makes it easier to recruit. So let's see if perhaps Keatts can repeat. This will be the reality. When you have 9-10 new upper class transfers it will take a full season to gel as a team and there will be a lot of bid stealing like this year. It’s not an aberration and unless the NCAA selection committee and that human imbecile Dr Charles McClleland are investigated the Big East will continue to get shafted by the ACC, Big Ten, Sec influence of the committee The aberration is that auto-bids into the NCAA tournament rarely make the Final Four. That is unlikely to change going forward. |
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astrohoya
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Post by astrohoya on Apr 26, 2024 14:07:06 GMT -5
The “grass is greener” approach… Looking at NC St for a quick second, their coach is sticking to his FF formula of reloading with upperclassmen from the portal. DS fits that strategy. As of now, they have just two freshmen coming in. NC St only has one scholarship available. I do not argue with you at all that the approach worked for NC State this past season. BUT, I really don't think that approach is easy to replicate. Keep in mind that NC State was NOT an at large team, and only was in the tournament at all because of their winning the ACC tournament. And then they won a series of games where they weren't the favorite. This would be like saying that Georgetown should have stuck to Ewing's strategy in 2021 because he won the BET. A fluky performance is fun for fans, but it's an outlier. Of course, being in a Final Four gets you a lot of attention and makes it easier to recruit. So let's see if perhaps Keatts can repeat. That was, in fact, Georgetown’s strategy. |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Apr 26, 2024 14:26:44 GMT -5
You lost me at “Ewing’s strategy.” Poor Keatts, someone comparing him to Ewing… To the extent you meant this tongue in cheek, I'm with you on it. No, I disagree re: “I really don't think that approach is easy to replicate,” but there’s no need to argue because it’s a brand new ball game and only time will tell. As we’ve said before, winning will bring some stability, retention, etc. It’s one way to have a winning program. Keatts is bringing in two freshmen, so he hasn’t abandoned hs recruiting. I did a superficial search, so IDK if there are sophomores in the roster. |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Apr 26, 2024 14:33:17 GMT -5
This will be the reality. When you have 9-10 new upper class transfers it will take a full season to gel as a team and there will be a lot of bid stealing like this year. It’s not an aberration and unless the NCAA selection committee and that human imbecile Dr Charles McClleland are investigated the Big East will continue to get shafted by the ACC, Big Ten, Sec influence of the committee The aberration is that auto-bids into the NCAA tournament rarely make the Final Four. That is unlikely to change going forward. That’s so 2010s.  It might be the norm in the second half of the 2020s. |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 26, 2024 14:54:57 GMT -5
The aberration is that auto-bids into the NCAA tournament rarely make the Final Four. That is unlikely to change going forward. That’s so 2010s. It might be the norm in the second half of the 2020s. We can agree to disagree. Structurally, given how the tournament works, the at-large bids and higher seeds, on average, have a higher chance of making the Final Four. That's why higher seeds more often make the Final Four than 11 seeds like NC State. I am not trying to take away from their accomplishment at all, they obviously played well down the stretch and I give all the credit to the coaches and players in achieving that goal. But, this is sort of akin to saying that FDU's strategy for making Round 2 of the tournament should be to win as a 16 seed. Sure, it worked for them one time, but that is obviously not a viable path on a yearly basis. I mean, think about it. Just to get to the NCAA tournament at all, NC State had to win 5 games on consecutive days. That alone is a very tall task for anybody. And not only that, but they had to beat both 4 seed Duke and 1 seed North Carolina to get there. Again, a great accomplishment, but not one that is easy to repeat. Now, if your argument is that you liked the way Keatts constructed his team, that's a different story. But still, Keatts' team essentially missed the NCAA tournament without the ACC unlikely run. Nine times out of 10, my guess is that NC State put in that same exact situation, would fail to make the NCAA tournament at all, foreclosing any chance at the Final Four. That's not a viable path to success. |
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traversb
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Post by traversb on Apr 26, 2024 15:07:27 GMT -5
Neither of these programs has the "resources" Gtown & other programs have. Their boards are upset but understand what their coaches are up against But when a Georgetown player like Styles leaves for more NIL, that's not acceptable because we have a boatload of cash? I get it. There will always be an excuse to paint things in a negative light. Styles left for more NIL after he was recruited over and didnt warrant much NIL here. I don;t get why people are painting this as the other way around. If Cooley wanted Styles he would still be here. He wanted Peavy. |
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Apr 26, 2024 15:17:17 GMT -5
That’s so 2010s. It might be the norm in the second half of the 2020s. We can agree to disagree. Structurally, given how the tournament works, the at-large bids and higher seeds, on average, have a higher chance of making the Final Four. That's why higher seeds more often make the Final Four than 11 seeds like NC State. I am not trying to take away from their accomplishment at all, they obviously played well down the stretch and I give all the credit to the coaches and players in achieving that goal. But, this is sort of akin to saying that FDU's strategy for making Round 2 of the tournament should be to win as a 16 seed. Sure, it worked for them one time, but that is obviously not a viable path on a yearly basis. I mean, think about it. Just to get to the NCAA tournament at all, NC State had to win 5 games on consecutive days. That alone is a very tall task for anybody. And not only that, but they had to beat both 4 seed Duke and 1 seed North Carolina to get there. Again, a great accomplishment, but not one that is easy to repeat. Now, if your argument is that you liked the way Keatts constructed his team, that's a different story. But still, Keatts' team essentially missed the NCAA tournament without the ACC unlikely run. Nine times out of 10, my guess is that NC State put in that same exact situation, would fail to make the NCAA tournament at all, foreclosing any chance at the Final Four. That's not a viable path to success. Of course a #11 to #16 will have a tougher path to the FF. Prof’s point is that a team of 9-10 (NCSt=7) upperclass transfers might have a tough early season, gel by Feb/March, and replicate that FF run. I liked that Keatts was given lemons by the new NCAA rules and he made lemonade. Cooley looked like he was given lemons and is still looking for a recipe. |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Apr 26, 2024 15:44:49 GMT -5
But when a Georgetown player like Styles leaves for more NIL, that's not acceptable because we have a boatload of cash? I get it. There will always be an excuse to paint things in a negative light. Styles left for more NIL after he was recruited over and didnt warrant much NIL here. I don;t get why people are painting this as the other way around. If Cooley wanted Styles he would still be here. He wanted Peavy. Why wouldn’t he have wanted both players? They could easily play together |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 26, 2024 16:13:01 GMT -5
We can agree to disagree. Structurally, given how the tournament works, the at-large bids and higher seeds, on average, have a higher chance of making the Final Four. That's why higher seeds more often make the Final Four than 11 seeds like NC State. I am not trying to take away from their accomplishment at all, they obviously played well down the stretch and I give all the credit to the coaches and players in achieving that goal. But, this is sort of akin to saying that FDU's strategy for making Round 2 of the tournament should be to win as a 16 seed. Sure, it worked for them one time, but that is obviously not a viable path on a yearly basis. I mean, think about it. Just to get to the NCAA tournament at all, NC State had to win 5 games on consecutive days. That alone is a very tall task for anybody. And not only that, but they had to beat both 4 seed Duke and 1 seed North Carolina to get there. Again, a great accomplishment, but not one that is easy to repeat. Now, if your argument is that you liked the way Keatts constructed his team, that's a different story. But still, Keatts' team essentially missed the NCAA tournament without the ACC unlikely run. Nine times out of 10, my guess is that NC State put in that same exact situation, would fail to make the NCAA tournament at all, foreclosing any chance at the Final Four. That's not a viable path to success. Of course a #11 to #16 will have a tougher path to the FF. Prof’s point is that a team of 9-10 (NCSt=7) upperclass transfers might have a tough early season, gel by Feb/March, and replicate that FF run. I liked that Keatts was given lemons by the new NCAA rules and he made lemonade. Cooley looked like he was given lemons and is still looking for a recipe. I understand the point, and there likely are teams with a lot of upperclassman that have had more success than NC State, that are probably better examples of the point. I just think NC State is a bad example given that they would not have even made the tournament if not for the ACC Tournament run. If "gel by Feb/March, and replicate that FF run" means doing that, then no, I don't think it's easy to replicate that. As far as the lemons/lemonade, I think comparing a year 1 coach inheriting Ewing's mess to Keatts who has been at NC state now for 7 seasons is a pretty poor comparison. And Cooley did use the transfer portal to revamp the Providence roster by bringing in Carter/Hopkins, which partially led to Providence making the NCAA tournament last year and almost making it this year, too. So, in some form, Cooley made similar lemonade before Keatts. Just not at Georgetown yet. I won't argue with you that last year wasn't a disaster. It was a horrible season. Cooley did a poor job. But, it seems pretty clear to me that the staff is strongly trying to reverse that result. If you want to dwell on the poor season, that's fine with me. And as I've said I have concerns about the defense, and Cooley's failure to make it better during the season. But, I choose to be optimistic about next season given the additions so far, the incoming freshman who I really think could have a big impact, and whoever else we land in the portal going forward. With Ewing, there was no reason to think he could do much better since he was a horrible coach, showed no good instincts, and in interviews gave no indication that he even recognized the problem. He also had Ronny Thompson and company running things in the background. With Cooley, his history of better success than we had last year*, his bringing on Kenny Johnson, and the apparent investment in NIL, gives me reason to be optimistic where I wasn't with Ewing. If we repeat another 2-18 season, I'll feel differently. * I know that some have expressed concerns about Cooley. hoyaboya's "one Sweet 16" and all of that. While I have quibbles with that, I think it is fair to some degree. Cooley had a lot of success getting to the tournament at Providence, but less so getting over the hump into higher seeds and deeper runs. My hunch is that is one of the reasons he wanted to come to Georgetown. But, I am not trying to open that debate. Instead, everything about Cooley's history indicates he is a better coach than what we saw last year. He turned around Fairfield, he turned around Providence, and now he's trying to do it at Georgetown. Will he succeed? I have no clue. But the fact is the guy's results in a long career have generally been much better than Georgetown 2023-2024. We aren't debating first round NCAA losses v. Final Fours here. That's an argument where I think real debate can be had. I just think there is little reason to believe that 2024-2025 will replicate this past season aren't very strong until we have good reason to think so. But to be clear, I am with you in saying that 2023-2024 was a disaster on the court, and it better not happen again. And I do hold Cooley responsible for it. I just think he can do a lot better. |
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