SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Jan 10, 2024 23:09:29 GMT -5
I think a lot of things are Cooley trying to balance teaching the players, hoping they will improve or even preparing for the future roster versus trying to win now wit the roster he has. I agree on defensive rebounding. We should have guys crashing. We don't get a lot of fast break points anwyay; I think if we could make a dent there, it'd be worth it. On offensively rebounding, I don't think our issue is crashing. The guys caught out are not our offensive rebounders. Our guards just don't actively get back quickly enough. It's laziness/lack of focus, not systematic to my eye, at least. Part of the problem Cooley faces with balance, too, is that our best defensive players and best offensive players are different. For example, Epps is easily our best offensive player, yet he's weak defensively. Brumbaugh is limited on offense, but probably our best defensive guard. Cook is a pretty good offensive rebounder and can generally finish shots pretty well or get fouled, but his defense in the paint is horrible and he cannot get defensive rebounds (his DR% is 12.7 in Big East play which is horrendous). Heath has struggled on both ends, but when he does contribute, it's on the offensive end, as he's a defensive liability. Massoud has been awful on both ends, but if you had to pick, he's (slightly) better on offense given that he doesn't rebound at all and very poorly for his height. Bristol is clearly better on the offensive end. Fielder is growing and someone I think has potential to be a useful player on both ends, actually. But he's still a developing freshman. The closest we have to a guy who probably contributes good things on both ends is Styles, but even then, I think Styles' offense is agruably ahead of his defense. That is why I think the lineup that we used during our comeback, with Epps, Heath, Bristol, Styles, Fielder did pretty well. You have offensive threats in really all of 5 of them, but especially Epps, and it's one of our best defensive lineups because Styles/Fielder combined are decent on that end (but by no means great). But really any lineups we put out there we have some big gaps on one end of the court. I think it's more that we don't have good defensive players. But we do have guys who try and guys who either don't, or can't seem to remember enough basic stuff to look like they are. For example, Epps will have his moments, or Fielder will be good at some things but a total liability at others. I think Bristol is the only guy who's better on defense (you wrote the opposite but I think you meant that) but nearly everyone on this team has massive defensive issues. But even with that, I think people are missing something if they think this team doesn't take a significant step forward if we replace a couple of our usual starters with Epps-level players, even on defense. There's two guys in particular who simply will not guard anyone, will not rebound, will not get back on the break, and combined, they've had like 2 good games offensively. It's two guys with an eFG% of about 40% combined who don't play defense. Cooley is struggling to remove them because aside from Bristol ... like Bacote is a worse defender. And so is everyone else. But we're too often playing 5 on 3. That's not to say that the rest of them are good at defense or that we'd be killing it. But holy cow, for all the flak Epps gets, replace them with their positional equivalents of Jayden Epps and this team is winning some games. We lost by just a few points here and while Heath had some offense today and wasn't a disaster on D ... at the end, we have an 8 man rotation, and far too often we're looking at 25% of that being crippling.
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iowa80
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Post by iowa80 on Jan 10, 2024 23:13:14 GMT -5
The Casual Hoya team (especially Casual himself) are butt hurt that Georgetown didn't hire Pitino and cannot seem to get over it. Their coverage and quality has really been poor for a while (though individual posts written by others are sometimes good). 10 years ago they had game threads with 200+ comments. The Seton Hall game thread has 14 posts. Perhaps they could get better readership if they did a better job supporting our teams It's really weird. I can understand wanting Pitino, but the dude is in the second half of his forties and he's acting like a child. For accuracy, here's what Holloway says in that timeout: "Everybody relax. I don't understand how we not closing out with our hands down. They just gonna take crazy shots. They just gonna take 30 threes. We told you guys that! You can't close out with your hands down. What are we thinking about? (Name), you can't come back in, you can't turn over the ball. They playing a zone. There's no pressure. (Something) you gotta get in there. Just be solid. Just be solid." So no, this was not some "Cooley's been figured out." It was a coach yelling at his team for not executing pretty standard things. But of course, we must present it as some smoking gun. Nice work. The tip off was "paraphrase." Too bad it was code for "my interpretation." There's some irony in the fact that I initially liked Casual because he did not seem to take himself too seriously.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 10, 2024 23:17:16 GMT -5
I'm fairly sure he said crazy shots, not "bad" -- and he wasn't making a judgement; he was mad at his players for not extending their defense to longer threes. What is not shocking that the casualhoya crew trying to make it sound more negative than it was and then tossing in a paraphrasing to hide a misquote. Reality is that Seton Hall has beaten Marquette, Providence and UConn and we almost beat them, but of course this is a terrible performance, blah, blah, blah. Even more bizarre is the idea that 30 is "too many" threes. I have no idea what team the writers at Casualhoya are watching, but with little to no low post play and exactly one dude who can take a guy off the dribble ... what are people looking for? The strength of this team, if there's any offensively, is in the three. We are not a good team and we are an underdog. Underdogs win upsets by hitting threes. Who are we running these non-3 plays for? The generic "settling for threes" has become the basketball version of "not running enough" that the local drunk screams at the NFL game at the bar. The game has changed, and I am more than okay with a few heat checks 3s with this team. The Casual Hoya team (especially Casual himself) are butt hurt that Georgetown didn't hire Pitino and cannot seem to get over it. Their coverage and quality has really been poor for a while (though individual posts written by others are sometimes good). 10 years ago they had game threads with 200+ comments. The Seton Hall game thread has 14 posts. Perhaps they could get better readership if they did a better job supporting our team. I wouldn’t call out other diehard fans when there are so few of us left. Post counts is a bad measurement when game discussion threads here have one page two hours before the actual game starts. A decade ago, game threads used to have 5-10 pages before the start of the game. Blame La Famiglia for the program’s debacle and the lack of fan engagement.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 11, 2024 0:58:17 GMT -5
The Casual Hoya team (especially Casual himself) are butt hurt that Georgetown didn't hire Pitino and cannot seem to get over it. Their coverage and quality has really been poor for a while (though individual posts written by others are sometimes good). 10 years ago they had game threads with 200+ comments. The Seton Hall game thread has 14 posts. Perhaps they could get better readership if they did a better job supporting our team. I wouldn’t call out other diehard fans when there are so few of us left. Post counts is a bad measurement when game discussion threads here have one page two hours before the actual game starts. A decade ago, game threads used to have 5-10 pages before the start of the game. Blame La Famiglia for the program’s debacle and the lack of fan engagement. I agree with you. When teams are bad, the more "casual" fans (not referencing Casual) disengage, and so there is less interest. Like you, I remember game threads with 10 pages before the game even started. I truly hope we get back to that, but it's going to require a lot of winning in the regular season and then in the NCAA tournament. I know JT3's tenure ended badly, but those years from 2005-2013 were truly fantastic other than the NCAA early exits, and that's why attendance was so high and why fan interest was so high. Given the passage of time, different media landscape, different generation student body, would the same thing happen again? Likely, but it will take a lot of effort and a much better roster than we have now. We can start by filling all of our scholarships for next season with some good portal players. As far as "calling out" fans, Casual Hoya is a blog that covers Georgetown Basketball. While Casual Hoya himself has taken a step back from the site and posts a lot less himself than he did in the JT3 era, he still tweets frequently and so I think it's fair. I do not begrudge Casual Hoya for being frustrated about Pitino, but I think his tweets about St. John's are a bit much. As you know, I was a huge Pitino fan and wanted him. But, at this point, there's really no benefit in going back to that. I really don't know his motivation. Maybe he doesn't like Cooley, maybe he just wanted to be really good quickly like a lot of us who wanted Pitino. I mean, look at his X/Twitter account. It might be tongue in cheek (it probably is), but it says "Hoyas/Johnnies," he recently retweeted a post about St. John's, and he posts things like this, "Convincing win for St. John’s at Villanova. Rick Pitino has our Johnnies at 11-4, 3-1 in Big East play. Quite a turnaround in Year One." Again, I don't know if he's trying to be funny, bitter about not getting Pitino, or whatever--but it's kind of odd.
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thedragon
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Post by thedragon on Jan 11, 2024 1:31:02 GMT -5
I wouldn’t call out other diehard fans when there are so few of us left. Post counts is a bad measurement when game discussion threads here have one page two hours before the actual game starts. A decade ago, game threads used to have 5-10 pages before the start of the game. Blame La Famiglia for the program’s debacle and the lack of fan engagement. I agree with you. When teams are bad, the more "casual" fans (not referencing Casual) disengage, and so there is less interest. Like you, I remember game threads with 10 pages before the game even started. I truly hope we get back to that, but it's going to require a lot of winning in the regular season and then in the NCAA tournament. I know JT3's tenure ended badly, but those years from 2005-2013 were truly fantastic other than the NCAA early exits, and that's why attendance was so high and why fan interest was so high. Given the passage of time, different media landscape, different generation student body, would the same thing happen again? Likely, but it will take a lot of effort and a much better roster than we have now. We can start by filling all of our scholarships for next season with some good portal players. As far as "calling out" fans, Casual Hoya is a blog that covers Georgetown Basketball. While Casual Hoya himself has taken a step back from the site and posts a lot less himself than he did in the JT3 era, he still tweets frequently and so I think it's fair. I do not begrudge Casual Hoya for being frustrated about Pitino, but I think his tweets about St. John's are a bit much. As you know, I was a huge Pitino fan and wanted him. But, at this point, there's really no benefit in going back to that. I really don't know his motivation. Maybe he doesn't like Cooley, maybe he just wanted to be really good quickly like a lot of us who wanted Pitino. I mean, look at his X/Twitter account. It might be tongue in cheek (it probably is), but it says "Hoyas/Johnnies," he recently retweeted a post about St. John's, and he posts things like this, "Convincing win for St. John’s at Villanova. Rick Pitino has our Johnnies at 11-4, 3-1 in Big East play. Quite a turnaround in Year One." Again, I don't know if he's trying to be funny, bitter about not getting Pitino, or whatever--but it's kind of odd. It's a bit. When the coaching search was happening he said if we passed on Pitino and he went to St John's it would become a St John's fan account too.
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TC
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Post by TC on Jan 11, 2024 7:50:37 GMT -5
The Casual Hoya team (especially Casual himself) are butt hurt that Georgetown didn't hire Pitino and cannot seem to get over it. Their coverage and quality has really been poor for a while (though individual posts written by others are sometimes good). 10 years ago they had game threads with 200+ comments. The Seton Hall game thread has 14 posts. Perhaps they could get better readership if they did a better job supporting our team. I think this is pretty dead-on, and it's not just Geiger, it's Bancroft too to a degree. Casual doesn't offer a lot these days though - the Sleeping with the Enemy segment is dead, the awards are dead, the only tweets are basic trolling. I think if you compare their coverage now to the honeymoon they gave Ewing in 2018 it's a pretty stark contrast. The Casual team has been completely lapped by Hilltop Hoops in terms of Twitter coverage, insider info, and analysis. Maybe they see their only lane now as trying to stir up Pitino resentment drama.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 11, 2024 8:16:41 GMT -5
As you know, I was a huge Pitino fan and wanted him. But, at this point, there's really no benefit in going back to that. I really don't know his motivation. Maybe he doesn't like Cooley, maybe he just wanted to be really good quickly like a lot of us who wanted Pitino. This is another area where you and I have disagreed this off season. We both wanted Pitino, but are happy with Cooley. What I don’t understand is why you don’t want to compare both coaches, etc… Obviously, what’s done is done, but it’s fair to compare both situations while wishing for the best. From my point of view, why not imitate the approach of the best in the business who finds himself in a comparable situation to us? I’ve been meaning to write something about Cooley’s approach to rebuilding the program, but I need to find the specific quote I’m looking for in one of his December post-game press conferences to use it. We know Pitino’s approach to rebuilding a program and winning in the new transfer portal era because he told everyone in a press conference in January of his last season in Iona. Cooley’s approach? Every time he mentions Fairfield et al., which all happened before the New Big East was created, makes me concerned in how long it’s going to take. I don’t want to find ourselves not higher than mid-BE in Year 4 of the Cooley Era, Cooley claiming it takes time (contradicting his introductory press conference) and Jackie D extending him another 6 years to see what happens. The program cannot go through it again.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 11, 2024 8:28:21 GMT -5
The Casual Hoya team (especially Casual himself) are butt hurt that Georgetown didn't hire Pitino and cannot seem to get over it. Their coverage and quality has really been poor for a while (though individual posts written by others are sometimes good). 10 years ago they had game threads with 200+ comments. The Seton Hall game thread has 14 posts. Perhaps they could get better readership if they did a better job supporting our team. I think this is pretty dead-on, and it's not just Geiger, it's Bancroft too to a degree. Casual doesn't offer a lot these days though - the Sleeping with the Enemy segment is dead, the awards are dead, the only tweets are basic trolling. I think if you compare their coverage now to the honeymoon they gave Ewing in 2018 it's a pretty stark contrast. The Casual team has been completely lapped by Hilltop Hoops in terms of Twitter coverage, insider info, and analysis. Not surprising. Casual has been at it a lot longer than Hilltop. Isn’t Hilltop a current student or is that Thompson’s Towel? (Btw, I’m a fan of all of them and any other source of Hoya info). Meanwhile, Casual has been a member of HT since the 2000s (or earlier), last posted here in 2014 and built his site with Bancroft. Maybe the Casual crew got tired of the debacle, mismanagement and the real problems with the program and GU. Blame La Famiglia and JD. Btw, the Kente Korner podcasts were a clear sign of things to come with that site. The number of posts here and there? Both sites are reflecting the lack of fan engagement caused by years of neglect of the fans and students. That said, winning cures all.
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saxagael
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Post by saxagael on Jan 11, 2024 9:32:29 GMT -5
I watched the post game presser, which was odd in that the two players Cooley had with him were Rowan and Ish. Colley pulled Rowan early in both halves and Ish deeply struggled.
Cooley has done post game pressers alone, with one player and two. After a tough loss (Cooley strongly blamed himself) it seemed an odd choice, unless they were there for support.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 11, 2024 10:00:55 GMT -5
This is another area where you and I have disagreed this off season. We both wanted Pitino, but are happy with Cooley. What I don’t understand is why you don’t want to compare both coaches, etc… Obviously, what’s done is done, but it’s fair to compare both situations while wishing for the best. From my point of view, why not imitate the approach of the best in the business who finds himself in a comparable situation to us? I’ve been meaning to write something about Cooley’s approach to rebuilding the program, but I need to find the specific quote I’m looking for in one of his December post-game press conferences to use it. We know Pitino’s approach to rebuilding a program and winning in the new transfer portal era because he told everyone in a press conference in January of his last season in Iona. Cooley’s approach? Every time he mentions Fairfield et al., which all happened before the New Big East was created, makes me concerned in how long it’s going to take. I don’t want to find ourselves not higher than mid-BE in Year 4 of the Cooley Era, Cooley claiming it takes time (contradicting his introductory press conference) and Jackie D extending him another 6 years to see what happens. The program cannot go through it again. I think it's fine to compare the coaches, though I think it has to come with a recognition that Georgetown is not starting at exactly the same place as St. John's, either. I know you often refer to La Famigilia and DeGioia--well neither of those factors are present at St. John's, nor is St. John's coming off having one of the worst college basketball coaches in high major history. As far as imitating the approach that works best, I am fine with that approach and would embrace it. I think part of the issue is that Pitino is Pitino and that's an extremely hard thing to replicate. The guy is easily a top 5 coach of the last 40 years, maybe top 3. Of course, this is why many of us wanted him at Georgetown! But, my point is that is not something that is easy to replicate. I truly think much of the success St. John's is having is because Pitino is just an outstanding coach. Did Pitino assemble a better roster than Cooley? Absolutely. But, I would not call it a fantastic roster either. But Pitino is getting the most out of it, as he always does. If we are middle of the pack in Year 4 of Cooley's tenure, I will be extremely disappointed. I don't think that will happen. At Fairfield, arguably it took Cooley 3-4 years to turn the program around, but there was a clear trend of improvement. As far as Providence, Cooley's first four teams were ranked 126, 49, 48, and 27. And the latter two made the tournament. So, even in the era pre-portal, Cooley was able to turn around Providence pretty quickly and get to the tournament by Year 3. Cooley also clearly understands the value of the portal, having used it at Providence last year to put together a team. I am as impatient as everyone. I want to win now. But, I also recognize these things take time. Would we have gotten better faster with Pitino? Almost certainly. That's why I wanted him. Do I think Cooley can turn us around? Yes. Do I think we will be a lot better next year? Yes.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 11, 2024 10:17:02 GMT -5
This is another area where you and I have disagreed this off season. We both wanted Pitino, but are happy with Cooley. What I don’t understand is why you don’t want to compare both coaches, etc… Obviously, what’s done is done, but it’s fair to compare both situations while wishing for the best. From my point of view, why not imitate the approach of the best in the business who finds himself in a comparable situation to us? I’ve been meaning to write something about Cooley’s approach to rebuilding the program, but I need to find the specific quote I’m looking for in one of his December post-game press conferences to use it. We know Pitino’s approach to rebuilding a program and winning in the new transfer portal era because he told everyone in a press conference in January of his last season in Iona. Cooley’s approach? Every time he mentions Fairfield et al., which all happened before the New Big East was created, makes me concerned in how long it’s going to take. I don’t want to find ourselves not higher than mid-BE in Year 4 of the Cooley Era, Cooley claiming it takes time (contradicting his introductory press conference) and Jackie D extending him another 6 years to see what happens. The program cannot go through it again. I think it's fine to compare the coaches, though I think it has to come with a recognition that Georgetown is not starting at exactly the same place as St. John's, either. I know you often refer to La Famigilia and DeGioia--well neither of those factors are present at St. John's, nor is St. John's coming off having one of the worst college basketball coaches in high major history. As far as imitating the approach that works best, I am fine with that approach and would embrace it. I think part of the issue is that Pitino is Pitino and that's an extremely hard thing to replicate. The guy is easily a top 5 coach of the last 40 years, maybe top 3. Of course, this is why many of us wanted him at Georgetown! But, my point is that is not something that is easy to replicate. I truly think much of the success St. John's is having is because Pitino is just an outstanding coach. Did Pitino assemble a better roster than Cooley? Absolutely. But, I would not call it a fantastic roster either. But Pitino is getting the most out of it, as he always does. If we are middle of the pack in Year 4 of Cooley's tenure, I will be extremely disappointed. I don't think that will happen. At Fairfield, arguably it took Cooley 3-4 years to turn the program around, but there was a clear trend of improvement. As far as Providence, Cooley's first four teams were ranked 126, 49, 48, and 27. And the latter two made the tournament. So, even in the era pre-portal, Cooley was able to turn around Providence pretty quickly and get to the tournament by Year 3. Cooley also clearly understands the value of the portal, having used it at Providence last year to put together a team. I am as impatient as everyone. I want to win now. But, I also recognize these things take time. Would we have gotten better faster with Pitino? Almost certainly. That's why I wanted him. Do I think Cooley can turn us around? Yes. Do I think we will be a lot better next year? Yes. I agree that Cooley can make us better next year and I’m hopeful that he can turn us around. But, can he take us to the top of the BE? I’m concerned with the approach. What worked for him before might not work now. I don’t agree with the first part of your post. Mike Anderson’s last year was a disaster and ended worse (i.e., threats and lawsuit) than how we parted ways with Pat. If anything, Cooley has more leeway at GU than in any other Power 5 basketball program. There’s nothing like GU job security, which eliminates any sense of urgency (i.e., lose your job). The difference is that Pitino had a plan on how to win NOW since his last year at Iona while Cooley was caught by surprise, couldn’t fill 13 scholarships and now is preaching patience. IMO, what happens this coming off-season will be the difference between a top team and mid to bottom BE.
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Jan 11, 2024 10:39:11 GMT -5
I think it's fine to compare the coaches, though I think it has to come with a recognition that Georgetown is not starting at exactly the same place as St. John's, either. I know you often refer to La Famigilia and DeGioia--well neither of those factors are present at St. John's, nor is St. John's coming off having one of the worst college basketball coaches in high major history. As far as imitating the approach that works best, I am fine with that approach and would embrace it. I think part of the issue is that Pitino is Pitino and that's an extremely hard thing to replicate. The guy is easily a top 5 coach of the last 40 years, maybe top 3. Of course, this is why many of us wanted him at Georgetown! But, my point is that is not something that is easy to replicate. I truly think much of the success St. John's is having is because Pitino is just an outstanding coach. Did Pitino assemble a better roster than Cooley? Absolutely. But, I would not call it a fantastic roster either. But Pitino is getting the most out of it, as he always does. If we are middle of the pack in Year 4 of Cooley's tenure, I will be extremely disappointed. I don't think that will happen. At Fairfield, arguably it took Cooley 3-4 years to turn the program around, but there was a clear trend of improvement. As far as Providence, Cooley's first four teams were ranked 126, 49, 48, and 27. And the latter two made the tournament. So, even in the era pre-portal, Cooley was able to turn around Providence pretty quickly and get to the tournament by Year 3. Cooley also clearly understands the value of the portal, having used it at Providence last year to put together a team. I am as impatient as everyone. I want to win now. But, I also recognize these things take time. Would we have gotten better faster with Pitino? Almost certainly. That's why I wanted him. Do I think Cooley can turn us around? Yes. Do I think we will be a lot better next year? Yes. I agree that Cooley can make us better next year and I’m hopeful that he can turn us around. But, can he take us to the top of the BE? I’m concerned with the approach. What worked for him before might not work now. I don’t agree with the first part of your post. Mike Anderson’s last year was a disaster and ended worse than how we parted ways with Pat. If anything, Cooley has more leeway at GU than in any other Power 5 basketball program. There’s nothing like GU job security, which eliminates any sense of urgency (i.e., lose your job). Cooley has a nose for what types of transfers to go after. Carter & Hopkins are great examples. Guys that are really good, probably not pros (certainly not draft picks) so they will stick for a few years, and have already transferred once so they know the grass isn't always greener. That required an evolution of thinking on Cooley's part. A guy like Dug McDaniel could be an interesting option. There are always going to be plenty of DMV guys that might be looking for a year or two on the hilltop to wrap up their careers. You add that with high school recruiting & development of the right type of kid and you have something. I don't think Pat ever figured out what type of kid he wanted. He just took the best scorers he could get and those didn't always fit together. he also was always behind it with most of the roster transferring every year. The cynic in us all has been well developed these past six years. We expect everybody to leave, we expect no roster & skill development, and we expect to be disappointed. Life is good, we will be fine, chins up!
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 11, 2024 10:48:43 GMT -5
I agree that Cooley can make us better next year and I’m hopeful that he can turn us around. But, can he take us to the top of the BE? I’m concerned with the approach. What worked for him before might not work now. I don’t agree with the first part of your post. Mike Anderson’s last year was a disaster and ended worse than how we parted ways with Pat. If anything, Cooley has more leeway at GU than in any other Power 5 basketball program. There’s nothing like GU job security, which eliminates any sense of urgency (i.e., lose your job). Cooley has a nose for what types of transfers to go after. Carter & Hopkins are great examples. Guys that are really good, probably not pros (certainly not draft picks) so they will stick for a few years, and have already transferred once so they know the grass isn't always greener. That required an evolution of thinking on Cooley's part. A guy like Dug McDaniel could be an interesting option. There are always going to be plenty of DMV guys that might be looking for a year or two on the hilltop to wrap up their careers. You add that with high school recruiting & development of the right type of kid and you have something. I don't think Pat ever figured out what type of kid he wanted. He just took the best scorers he could get and those didn't always fit together. he also was always behind it with most of the roster transferring every year. The cynic in us all has been well developed these past six years. We expect everybody to leave, we expect no roster & skill development, and we expect to be disappointed. Life is good, we will be fine, chins up! Columbia, I was thinking about this and Cooley’s recruiting options. Most of our current scholarship players, except the returning ones, and the class of 2024 had been recruited by Cooley in Providence (i.e., Epps, Fielder, Styles, etc). If someone can come up with the actual list, that would be great. Cooley can tap into all of the players he has recruited who now are playing at other colleges and might want to transfer to GU. Now that list has to be interesting! We only need to fill three scholarships (or more if…). There might be some interesting and interested candidates.
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Jan 11, 2024 10:53:33 GMT -5
Cooley's problem in the transfer portal next year will be the same as this year. Talented kids with one year of eligibility left are almost certain not to want to come to a team that will again finish at the bottom end of the BE. While there could be an exception for someone who wants to come home to the DMV, it seems foolish to think that Cooley will be in play for the one and done types that might make a difference. Also complicating this will be the arrival of a talented group of freshmen meaning that PT will not necessarily be guaranteed. Unless the Hoyas show some real growth over the next 6 weeks (and I actually see some positive signs) Cooley is going to have to be at his best in recruiting the portal.
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kettlehill
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Post by kettlehill on Jan 11, 2024 11:15:18 GMT -5
I watched the post game presser, which was odd in that the two players Cooley had with him were Rowan and Ish. Colley pulled Rowan early in both halves and Ish deeply struggled. Cooley has done post game pressers alone, with one player and two. After a tough loss (Cooley strongly blamed himself) it seemed an odd choice, unless they were there for support. I suspect Cooley chose those two- Rowan and Ish, because they had poor games."I'll take you out there for the plaudits, but let's see how you handle a bit of negativity". The press were kind though and didn't hit them hard with unpleasant questions. But think about how they felt sitting up there after struggling- maybe a good lesson, or at least an attempt at one.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 11, 2024 11:36:24 GMT -5
Cooley's problem in the transfer portal next year will be the same as this year. Talented kids with one year of eligibility left are almost certain not to want to come to a team that will again finish at the bottom end of the BE. While there could be an exception for someone who wants to come home to the DMV, it seems foolish to think that Cooley will be in play for the one and done types that might make a difference. Also complicating this will be the arrival of a talented group of freshmen meaning that PT will not necessarily be guaranteed. Unless the Hoyas show some real growth over the next 6 weeks (and I actually see some positive signs) Cooley is going to have to be at his best in recruiting the portal. Yes and no. Yes, Cooley will have the same problem with those who don’t buy his recruiting bs and want a sure thing, but this year Cooley will have a bigger NIL bag, knows what he needs vs what he has, will end play around March 9th and will have a two-week recruiting advantage over the NCAA/NIT tournament teams.
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jwp91
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,035
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Post by jwp91 on Jan 11, 2024 11:50:48 GMT -5
Cooley's problem in the transfer portal next year will be the same as this year. Talented kids with one year of eligibility left are almost certain not to want to come to a team that will again finish at the bottom end of the BE. While there could be an exception for someone who wants to come home to the DMV, it seems foolish to think that Cooley will be in play for the one and done types that might make a difference. Also complicating this will be the arrival of a talented group of freshmen meaning that PT will not necessarily be guaranteed. Unless the Hoyas show some real growth over the next 6 weeks (and I actually see some positive signs) Cooley is going to have to be at his best in recruiting the portal. I am optimistic it will be easier with the great recruiting class already committed. Our front court will be young but it should be strong.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 11, 2024 11:55:32 GMT -5
I think it's fine to compare the coaches, though I think it has to come with a recognition that Georgetown is not starting at exactly the same place as St. John's, either. I know you often refer to La Famigilia and DeGioia--well neither of those factors are present at St. John's, nor is St. John's coming off having one of the worst college basketball coaches in high major history. As far as imitating the approach that works best, I am fine with that approach and would embrace it. I think part of the issue is that Pitino is Pitino and that's an extremely hard thing to replicate. The guy is easily a top 5 coach of the last 40 years, maybe top 3. Of course, this is why many of us wanted him at Georgetown! But, my point is that is not something that is easy to replicate. I truly think much of the success St. John's is having is because Pitino is just an outstanding coach. Did Pitino assemble a better roster than Cooley? Absolutely. But, I would not call it a fantastic roster either. But Pitino is getting the most out of it, as he always does. If we are middle of the pack in Year 4 of Cooley's tenure, I will be extremely disappointed. I don't think that will happen. At Fairfield, arguably it took Cooley 3-4 years to turn the program around, but there was a clear trend of improvement. As far as Providence, Cooley's first four teams were ranked 126, 49, 48, and 27. And the latter two made the tournament. So, even in the era pre-portal, Cooley was able to turn around Providence pretty quickly and get to the tournament by Year 3. Cooley also clearly understands the value of the portal, having used it at Providence last year to put together a team. I am as impatient as everyone. I want to win now. But, I also recognize these things take time. Would we have gotten better faster with Pitino? Almost certainly. That's why I wanted him. Do I think Cooley can turn us around? Yes. Do I think we will be a lot better next year? Yes. I agree that Cooley can make us better next year and I’m hopeful that he can turn us around. But, can he take us to the top of the BE? I’m concerned with the approach. What worked for him before might not work now. I don’t agree with the first part of your post. Mike Anderson’s last year was a disaster and ended worse (i.e., threats and lawsuit) than how we parted ways with Pat. If anything, Cooley has more leeway at GU than in any other Power 5 basketball program. There’s nothing like GU job security, which eliminates any sense of urgency (i.e., lose your job). The difference is that Pitino had a plan on how to win NOW since his last year at Iona while Cooley was caught by surprise, couldn’t fill 13 scholarships and now is preaching patience. IMO, what happens this coming off-season will be the difference between a top team and mid to bottom BE. I agree both St. John's and Georgetown were in pretty bad situations following the season; both lost nearly their entire rosters (though in both cases that may have been coach induced, in part, we know with Pitino it was). But, purely from a basketball perspective, Georgetown was clearly worse off given how absymal we were. I really don't think the lawsuits matter much when it comes to the on-court product. I don't think the 17-23ish year olds who you are recruiting care one bit about that. In the last 4 years, Anderson got 30 Big East wins. In contrast, Ewing got 14, and we all know only 2 in the last two seasons. The blunt fact is that people in the portal knew we would not be good this year, so we were a tough sell, as Cooley has stated. I expect that to be better this coming off season, but we need to start winning Big East games, or it could be a problem. St. John's also did not have the black cloud of Ronny Thompson hanging over the program the last few years either. Sure, Cooley got rid of him, but it's hard to underestimate how much the institutional aspects of the program matter. Cooley is definitely taking measures to improve these things. As for our "leadership," I am not at all impressed by DeGioia, think he is a major reason we are in this mess, and well--as alumni we are stuck with it because we cannot (and do not want to) just pick another school to root for. I agree this off season is crucial. As is turning things around a bit to end the season. We aren't going to be good but even if we can sell a "look, we improved a lot at the end of the season: narrative, it'll go a long way toward selling the program. I also think Cooley is likely not getting enough credit for the 2024 recruits he is bringing in. Given how down in the dumps our program is, I think the fact that Cooley netted them is actually pretty impressive. But, it obviously hasn't helped us this year.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 11, 2024 11:56:33 GMT -5
Cooley's problem in the transfer portal next year will be the same as this year. Talented kids with one year of eligibility left are almost certain not to want to come to a team that will again finish at the bottom end of the BE. While there could be an exception for someone who wants to come home to the DMV, it seems foolish to think that Cooley will be in play for the one and done types that might make a difference. Also complicating this will be the arrival of a talented group of freshmen meaning that PT will not necessarily be guaranteed. Unless the Hoyas show some real growth over the next 6 weeks (and I actually see some positive signs) Cooley is going to have to be at his best in recruiting the portal. I am optimistic it will be easier with the great recruiting class already committed. Our front court will be young but it should be strong. I also do not agree that we will be a team that will "again finish at the bottom end of the BE." But, I wouldn't blame someone for thinking that given how awful Georgetown has been over the last decade or so. Say what you will, but Cooley seems like a great salesman. He's going to have to earn his recruiting chops this off season in the portal.
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jwp91
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,035
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Post by jwp91 on Jan 11, 2024 12:03:45 GMT -5
"3 straight turnovers, that's 1000% on me." -Ed Cooley Could there be a greater difference between the leadership posture of Cooley and Ewing? I would bet on Cooley to figure it out. Regarding the attendees, maybe he brought players who he wanted to ensure heard his message. As he said the Coach, the best player, and the PG must be on the same page. Ish may think he is the best player....in which case they all were at the dais.
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