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Post by bornhoya on Sept 3, 2021 12:59:35 GMT -5
The only way I can see OTE make it is if their true goal is for the kid to sign off on having OTE permanently represent them after OTE. And then take a cut of any NBA contracts. I think that's the hope with alot of these NIL agency reps/IMG's giving money to the college players. But I'm not sure OTE could control the kid once they left OTE. Kids now a days watch OTE highlights almost more than they watch regular games
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SDHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,330
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Post by SDHoya on Sept 3, 2021 13:05:41 GMT -5
Can someone please explain to me why "chasing a dream" and getting a college degree are mutually exclusive? If Jaylen gets paid $400k over two years to play with OTE, and then finds out he's not getting any NBA sniffs or good Euro offers, what is stopping him from taking half of that money and using it to go back to school? You don't have to be 18 to be a college freshman. Actually this whole back and forth is all incorrect because OTE offers $100,000 in college money if a player chooses that basketball is not for them. This is on top of the money they already get for salary. *the caveat is that if OTE goes bankrupt like Movie Pass, which I think there is a high likelyhood that that happens then all these promises may go up in smoke. Then my point is even stronger. Based on what you point out, OTE's explicit pitch to these kids is that they won't be giving up the opportunity to go to college by getting paid now to play ball. Your separate point about OTE's viability is also a good one. We obviously do not know whether they can/will succeed, and if no one tunes in to OTE games and OTE can't find a steady revenue stream through some other "new media" puffery, then it will last roughly as long as the league Lavar Ball built so his kids had something to do. And for those kids who did not have any other offers to be paid to play ball, they could be in a tough spot (depending on how much $$ they recieved before the league went belly up). But the point really is, "pursuing pro ball" or "going to college" is a false choice.
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Post by professorhoya on Sept 3, 2021 13:21:31 GMT -5
Actually this whole back and forth is all incorrect because OTE offers $100,000 in college money if a player chooses that basketball is not for them. This is on top of the money they already get for salary. *the caveat is that if OTE goes bankrupt like Movie Pass, which I think there is a high likelyhood that that happens then all these promises may go up in smoke. Then my point is even stronger. Based on what you point out, OTE's explicit pitch to these kids is that they won't be giving up the opportunity to go to college by getting paid now to play ball. Your separate point about OTE's viability is also a good one. We obviously do not know whether they can/will succeed, and if no one tunes in to OTE games and OTE can't find a steady revenue stream through some other "new media" puffery, then it will last roughly as long as the league Lavar Ball built so his kids had something to do. And for those kids who did not have any other offers to be paid to play ball, they could be in a tough spot (depending on how much $$ they recieved before the league went belly up). But the point really is, "pursuing pro ball" or "going to college" is a false choice. Yes, I think this is the bigger danger. OTE seems a little shady like Movie Pass, and haven't really spelled out a viable plan to make money. So in that sense Hoyaewingfan is right that kids could be making a rash decision. it could go belly up like the USFL, so unless you are smart enough like Steve Young or Bobby Bonilla to get a long term guaranteed contract that pays you for 30 years it seems like a foolish move compared to going to G League Elite. (But I do understand that G Leave is looking only for lottery picks so maybe some of these OTE guys aren't wanted by G Leage Elite). If i were a kid or their parents, I would want to make sure that the $100,000 college money is in some kind of trust or esckrow that couldn't be touched by OTE bankruptcy.
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Post by hibernatinghoyafan on Sept 3, 2021 13:22:33 GMT -5
Maybe this is better left for a different thread but who is advising these guys? A short-term 6 figure salary does not outweigh a college degree/education. For athletes that don't make the NBA or play in Europe long enough to generate a lifelong net worth, they will not be able to enter into the white collar fields later in life. Surprising for a kid with a 4.2 GPA to not realize that. Working on Wall Street for a FO office, we talk to plenty of the athletes who make it and give us money to invest but that is such a small % of basketball players that the rest are way better off having a 4-year degree to fall back on in their life post-basketball. I don't think OTE will make it long-term unless they enter into ISA's with their athletes as the won't be able to generate enough profit to offset the costs of running the league and paying these salaries. What about kids who aren't suited to 4 year college? Or kids with no interest in it? What is the value of 1 or two years of college ball if the kid intends to leave as soon as he can? If the only reason some kids are going to college is because its the only real stepping stone to getting paid to play ball, then chances are they aren't taking classes seriously enough to really get the value out of the education that is forced upon them. If college sports is really made up of "student athletes", isn't it better to have kids who want to be there because of the educational benefit? Furthermore, if a kid chooses OTE or G-Ignite or Australia etc. instead of college ball--and after a few years of 6-figure salaries realizes professional sports is not a long term solution, what's to stop that kid (by that time not such a kid) using some of the money he earned to go back to college to get a degree? Heck, if I had the option as an 18 year old to delay college a few years in order to make that kind of money straight out of high school, it would have been hard to pass up. I think we have got to stop criticizing these kids for taking the money. Its a logical and rational choice for many of them. At this point, the only thing that NCAA ball gives kids that OTE/G-League do not is a bigger platform, which now can be monetized by at least some of them through NIL deals. But if OTE and their ilk are successful, even that may change, and the only thing left going for NCAA will be the free education. Not everyone has to value a liberal arts education--but for those that do, NCAA sports can remain a viable option. Idk, you only get to go to college as a young adult once. Sure, if you decide after 2 years then fine. But, a 24/26/28 year old freshman has a much different experience in college. Let alone, developing into a young man surrounded by peers your own age while also being VIPs walking around campus (football and bball players) is an amazing life and one you'd probably look back upon fondly. The financialization of 16-20 year old teenagers is pretty sickening. Let the Kobes/Lebrons/T-Macs go to the pros as 18 year olds, but most of these kids (only IMO) should be going to a university and maturing into young men before the get thrown to the wolves. If this really was a feasible model that benefitted the kids then football would have found a way to make this work already, especially because the average pro career is shorter.
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Post by hibernatinghoyafan on Sept 3, 2021 13:26:49 GMT -5
Additionally, OTE taking the top 10-15 kids in each class and doing this at 16 is fine. My biggest issue is with the kids who have very little legitimate NBA potential and are being told by those around them that it's a shoe in.
Why is a college degree seemingly becoming obsolete for these guys? Just easier for them to be exploited by others if they don't have that education. Hell, someone like John Thompson (and I hope Ewing) did an amazing job at mentoring these guy and helping them understand what to expect out there. If you are going to be an NBA player, playing college ball for 2 years isn't going to do anything in the long run to change your financial situation. That one contract set you for life and I know that I'd want my son to be educated/mature enough to take advantage of that situation and not get screwed by the inevitable leeches that come around.
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bostonfan
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,508
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Post by bostonfan on Sept 3, 2021 13:45:26 GMT -5
Signed with Overtime Elite Interesting choice by this young man. When Overtime Elite, and the G League option, started I thought it would take some of the top 10-20 kids who really had no interest in going to school and trying to get an education as a back up plan if basketball didn't work out for them. I don't blame those top 10-20 kids for taking that route if school is just not their thing and they only want to focus on basketball and are betting on their ability to make it to the NBA. The concern is that the decision is now being made by kids outside of that top 10-20 recruits. I had thought when the NIL option gave these young men a chance to make some money while still pursuing a degree that still only the few top kids would skip school all together and the recruits in the 30-75 range would still go to college for at least a year or so, but it seems I am wrong. As I said, these kids are betting on themselves and I hope it works out for them and these organizations (overtime elite and the G league) can follow through on the promises they make these young men.
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,642
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Sept 3, 2021 16:17:43 GMT -5
Why go to college if you’re a top-75 type player? Start earning money out of high school and focus on honing your craft. It’s not NBA or bust, you can play overseas and make a living. Maximize your earning potential while you’re young.
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hoyainla
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Suspended
Posts: 4,719
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Post by hoyainla on Sept 3, 2021 22:30:59 GMT -5
Charlie Ward was a beast. He is a former Heisman trophy winner. He played football only all throughout college but after he graduated (I think from Florida St or some other ACC school), he decided he wanted to play basketball. He was immediately drafted by the Knicks which was, at that time, my favorite team because they had Patrick Ewing on that team. Jeff Van Gundy eventually made him the starting point guard for the Knicks, after Doc Rivers retired. Charlie Ward was a very good player for the Knicks and he and Patrick have a lot of history together. I am pretty sure everyone on this board knows who Charlie Ward is... I rarely get shocked on here but so many people barely knowing who one of the greatest college athletes ever was is shocking. People on here expect recruits to know and be impressed by Ewing's legacy. These are kids who were barely or not even alive when he was relevant yet they don't know of a guy who was relevant when they were much older.
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Post by HoyaAtHeart on Sept 3, 2021 23:01:50 GMT -5
With the NIL in place, my biggest wonder is how sustainable is Overtime Elite?
On the surface, this just looks like what Lavar Ball tried to pull off but with a bigger budget / bigger investors. Sure, they've got cash now to hand to a kid that's ranked #55 or something...but how much money is that league going to earn to sustain that moving forward?
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Post by HoyaAtHeart on Sept 3, 2021 23:13:47 GMT -5
Maybe this is better left for a different thread but who is advising these guys? A short-term 6 figure salary does not outweigh a college degree/education. For athletes that don't make the NBA or play in Europe long enough to generate a lifelong net worth, they will not be able to enter into the white collar fields later in life. Surprising for a kid with a 4.2 GPA to not realize that. Working on Wall Street for a FO office, we talk to plenty of the athletes who make it and give us money to invest but that is such a small % of basketball players that the rest are way better off having a 4-year degree to fall back on in their life post-basketball. I don't think OTE will make it long-term unless they enter into ISA's with their athletes as the won't be able to generate enough profit to offset the costs of running the league and paying these salaries. One day you guys are going to learn that the (relatively elite) kids who will be making these decisions don't give 2 ***** about a college degree at THIS point in time. They're trying to play professional basketball. College isn't going anywhere. I can assure you even the ones who won't play in Europe long enough to generate a lifelong net worth... will have made enough to pursue higher education that grants them access to these "white collar fields" whenever they choose to do so.
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 14,899
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Post by EtomicB on Sept 3, 2021 23:50:40 GMT -5
Maybe this is better left for a different thread but who is advising these guys? A short-term 6 figure salary does not outweigh a college degree/education. For athletes that don't make the NBA or play in Europe long enough to generate a lifelong net worth, they will not be able to enter into the white collar fields later in life. Surprising for a kid with a 4.2 GPA to not realize that. Working on Wall Street for a FO office, we talk to plenty of the athletes who make it and give us money to invest but that is such a small % of basketball players that the rest are way better off having a 4-year degree to fall back on in their life post-basketball. I don't think OTE will make it long-term unless they enter into ISA's with their athletes as the won't be able to generate enough profit to offset the costs of running the league and paying these salaries. OTE Elite seems like Movie Pass or Mars One. Basically they have no real plan. A one team league. Who are they going to play? Who is going to watch a bunch of C level players (A level being NBA, B level G league). I have hardly enough time to watch NBA and college basketball and I'm sure most people are in the same boat. At least G League elite has a solid system in place. www.cnbc.com/2021/04/22/jeff-bezos-drake-and-more-invest-80-million-in-sports-media-company-overtime.htmlSports media company Overtime has secured an $80 million fundraising round with investors including Jeff Bezos’ investment firm, global entertainer Drake, Reddit co-founder Alexis Ohanian and several National Basketball Association players.
“The breadth and diversity of this investment group, including leaders from business, entertainment, technology and sports, speaks to Overtime’s remarkable growth and our future trajectory,” co-founder and CEO Dan Porter said in a statement. “We believe this is just the tip of the iceberg, as we develop new ways for Overtime to engage with and entertain the next generation of athletes and fans.”"In just four years, Overtime has become synonymous with sports for a new generation of athletes and fans, with programming that is viewed more than 14 billion times a year and an audience of more than 45 million social media followers," said Dan Porter, Overtime's CEO and co-founder. "We have created an amazing platform by telling the stories of the next generation of superstars. Now, it's time to leverage that platform to create a league that strengthens players' development and performance and results in fewer injuries and longer careers."
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Post by HoyaAtHeart on Sept 3, 2021 23:56:11 GMT -5
Maybe this is better left for a different thread but who is advising these guys? A short-term 6 figure salary does not outweigh a college degree/education. For athletes that don't make the NBA or play in Europe long enough to generate a lifelong net worth, they will not be able to enter into the white collar fields later in life. Surprising for a kid with a 4.2 GPA to not realize that. Working on Wall Street for a FO office, we talk to plenty of the athletes who make it and give us money to invest but that is such a small % of basketball players that the rest are way better off having a 4-year degree to fall back on in their life post-basketball. I don't think OTE will make it long-term unless they enter into ISA's with their athletes as the won't be able to generate enough profit to offset the costs of running the league and paying these salaries. OTE Elite seems like Movie Pass or Mars One. Basically they have no real plan. A one team league. Who are they going to play? Who is going to watch a bunch of C level players (A level being NBA, B level G league). I have hardly enough time to watch NBA and college basketball and I'm sure most people are in the same boat. At least G League elite has a solid system in place. It's not a one team league. There are multiple teams within the league. But I agree with the general notion that this is a step behind the NCAA and the G-League from an NBA perspective if that's the end game. It's basically AAU basketball being sold as a "league", and if I'm an NBA scout...what's the point?
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