kghoya
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Post by kghoya on Aug 18, 2020 16:16:09 GMT -5
Lots of former players outside of the eventual NBA stars felt a disconnect to the program under Big John to varying degrees.
It's like there were two camps - the David Falk former players club and the others.
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Aug 18, 2020 16:24:35 GMT -5
Lots of former players outside of the eventual NBA stars felt a disconnect to the program under Big John to varying degrees. It's like there were two camps - the David Falk former players club and the others. Most notably, Fred Brown. Kevin Millen - well, he had some other larger issues.
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Aug 18, 2020 16:24:48 GMT -5
It's not necessarily that the Princeton worked better with one group or another. The players acknowledge that the Princeton helped them to win a lot of games in college. Some of them (especially the guards) just feel that the offense just didn't highlight them or prepare them for professional play as much as another system could have. Highlighting maybe, but preparing? Hmmm. The perception of the Princeton prevented the recruitment of the next Sleepy Floyd or Iverson. Those type of guys weren't coming here. For the standout guards we had under III (Starks, DSR, Wright, Freeman),we all got to see those guys shine during their time at G-town. However, it seemed they were more geared to play overseas as a professional than the NBA. Not a knock on those guys. Have you listened to the podcasts? All of the guards have spoken about how when they transitioned to the pros they weren't as prepared to run the pick and roll, and how in the pros they would pass up open shots trying to find a perfect shot and they had to break that habit.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Aug 18, 2020 16:57:13 GMT -5
Lots of former players outside of the eventual NBA stars felt a disconnect to the program under Big John to varying degrees. It's like there were two camps - the David Falk former players club and the others. That's a generalization. There are 107 living alumni and/or transfers recruited in the John Thompson era, roughly from the ages of 40 to 70. The "David Falk former players club" is probably less than, what, seven? But the other 100 probably have a wide degree of views of John Thompson and the program and probably have closer ties with former teammates than with Thompson, Stein, Esherick, Riley et al. A random selection of five "non-Falk" former players (let's say, Greg Brooks, David Blue, Dwayne Bryant, George Butler, and Rhese Gibson) would yield five probably very different views on their experiences at Georgetown, which is to be expected.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Aug 18, 2020 17:09:52 GMT -5
Highlighting maybe, but preparing? Hmmm. The perception of the Princeton prevented the recruitment of the next Sleepy Floyd or Iverson. Those type of guys weren't coming here. For the standout guards we had under III (Starks, DSR, Wright, Freeman),we all got to see those guys shine during their time at G-town. However, it seemed they were more geared to play overseas as a professional than the NBA. Not a knock on those guys. Have you listened to the podcasts? All of the guards have spoken about how when they transitioned to the pros they weren't as prepared to run the pick and roll, and how in the pros they would pass up open shots trying to find a perfect shot and they had to break that habit. If you can play in the league, that won't prevent you from staying in the league. There is an adjustment from college to pros for every player. Are some systems geared toward the NBA game more than others? Yes. However, they also said in one of the podcasts that Gilbert Arenas and his squad did quite well running the Princeton under Eddie Jordan with the Wizards. They also ran it in Sacramento with Webber and the Kings back in the day. They were good too.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Aug 18, 2020 17:15:25 GMT -5
No talk of defense? Austin with a mea culpa? I wonder what he tells the kids in DeMatha re: playing defense and being an all-around player.
I don't know if I'm being too optimistic, but from the videos all of the 8 recruits look like they are geared to play both sides of the ball. It would be a nice change if we could have a better defensive team. That alone can contribute to more Ws.
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Aug 18, 2020 17:57:19 GMT -5
Have you listened to the podcasts? All of the guards have spoken about how when they transitioned to the pros they weren't as prepared to run the pick and roll, and how in the pros they would pass up open shots trying to find a perfect shot and they had to break that habit. If you can play in the league, that won't prevent you from staying in the league. There is an adjustment from college to pros for every player. Are some systems geared toward the NBA game more than others? Yes. However, they also said in one of the podcasts that Gilbert Arenas and his squad did quite well running the Princeton under Eddie Jordan with the Wizards. They also ran it in Sacramento with Webber and the Kings back in the day. They were good too. And Eddie Jordan was no longer an NBA head coach by the time Wright and Freeman graduated. But anyways, I agree with you, and I'm not trying to argue whether or not they should have been in the NBA. I'm sure that you know way more about basketball and basketball talent than I do. I was just defending Wright and Freeman from another poster who was making it sound like they had sour grapes about the Princeton preventing them from getting to the NBA, when throughout the podcasts they have been fair and honest without being overly negative about the program while owning up to their own faults.
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kghoya
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Post by kghoya on Aug 18, 2020 18:35:36 GMT -5
Lots of former players outside of the eventual NBA stars felt a disconnect to the program under Big John to varying degrees. It's like there were two camps - the David Falk former players club and the others. That's a generalization. There are 107 living alumni and/or transfers recruited in the John Thompson era, roughly from the ages of 40 to 70. The "David Falk former players club" is probably less than, what, seven? But the other 100 probably have a wide degree of views of John Thompson and the program and probably have closer ties with former teammates than with Thompson, Stein, Esherick, Riley et al. A random selection of five "non-Falk" former players (let's say, Greg Brooks, David Blue, Dwayne Bryant, George Butler, and Rhese Gibson) would yield five probably very different views on their experiences at Georgetown, which is to be expected. My point was that players often relate more to assistants than their head coach and it's not just a jt3 thing.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Aug 18, 2020 20:31:53 GMT -5
It really depends on the situation and setup of your program.
In basketball, I would think head coaches would have more influence than say football where you have position coaches/coordinators.
Then again, assistants are the lead recruiter/scouts/good cop. They build the bond with the recruit initially, so a lot of times kids feel indebted to the their recruiter.
Iverson and JT2 are still tight today,yet Iverson got rid of Falk early into his NBA career.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Aug 18, 2020 20:51:53 GMT -5
I'm glad to hear the happy memories and the regrets/gripes. I love that Austin and Chris are doing this and getting SO many great Hoya guests. Regardless of details of what has been said or not, it's very clear that Austin and Chris love Georgetown and want the program to improve. Them discussing past failures and shortcomings as well as past successes can only serve to help people (including recruits) to get a feel for what has been and what's going to be with the byproduct of creating more of a sense of "family" that Mac didn't seem to feel. I think it's great that Chris and Austin are reaching out to so many former players. I hope they continue and bring guys back for repeat appearances and start to build a bit more of a community amongst themselves.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Aug 18, 2020 21:48:53 GMT -5
I just saw on Twitter that they're soon going to be putting out some gear to support their pod. When they provide a link and the stuff is available, if you're able, please help support what our guys are doing. I'll drop the link here for those so inclined.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Aug 18, 2020 22:33:44 GMT -5
I mean, a lot of the players in these podcast episodes said that they wished that they had played in a more up and down system. I just thought that your previous phrasing of "I think it's a bit of sour grapes for a guy like Wright or Freeman to blame the system for their failure to get to the NBA" was a little harsh, since while Wright and Freeman have said that the Princeton offense didn't necessarily help them get to the NBA, they don't solely blame the system or anyone else for not making it. And they don't even say that they didn't like the Princeton with disdain, since they acknowledge that it helped them to win games, they just don't feel like they got highlighted as much as they could have in a different system. Fair enough - "sour grapes" was probably poor wording on my part. The only area where I disagree is I do think they oftentimes reflect on the Princeton system with some level of disdain (and I don't mind it; if that's their opinion that's their opinion). Obviously, much of that is in tone, the way in which it comes across, etc., and subject to interpretation. But, clearly Chris and Austin are trying to do positive things for Georgetown, and I appreciate it much.
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Post by FromTheBeginning on Aug 19, 2020 15:55:45 GMT -5
AI might have been much better off now if he had stayed with David Falk.
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Aug 23, 2020 12:15:40 GMT -5
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LCPolo18
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Post by LCPolo18 on Aug 23, 2020 12:16:08 GMT -5
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BigmanU
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BigmanU
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BigmanU
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BigmanU
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Post by BigmanU on Sept 7, 2020 12:49:38 GMT -5
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 26, 2021 13:58:27 GMT -5
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