Your Democratic Party

[HoyaNyr320]

Oh my! A real-life case of attempted voter fraud!

www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/glenn-youngkin-son-vote-election/2021/11/05/f5eb7ce0-3e62-11ec-8ee9-4f14a26749d1_story.html

Or just teenage stupidity....

"The 17-year-old son of Virginia Gov.-elect Glenn Youngkin (R) tried to cast a ballot in Tuesday’s gubernatorial election twice despite being too young to vote, Fairfax County officials said in a statement released Friday."

[AvantGuardHoya]

This is so laughable it really isn't funny. Agent Orange started this ongoing effort to undermine the American electoral process and I'm beginning to think things will be effed up for the rest of my life. It's very sad and scary... and truly didn't need to be. SMDH.

[EtomicB]

Nov 3, 2021 22:02:16 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

Nov 3, 2021 19:33:04 GMT -5 tashoya said:

It's beyond me why you'd be "sure" I would contend that CRT is completely made up. In fact, I don't even know what you're trying to say. Regardless, I said that Youngkin ran on racism (with just enough of a nod to the Trump BS) and that he won by doing so. I don't think there's much to be celebrated in that regard, regardless of one's political affiliations/leanings. But, I hope you enjoy your rum and your cigar.

Right well you can say that’s what you believe he ran on all you want, that doesn’t make it true. That’s just your opinion and in my opinion, it is one that is not rooted in fact.

If Virginians like myself voted for Glen Youngkin because we support his “racist” platform, you’ll have to explain why we also voted in the first black woman Lt. Governor and a Cuban American Attorney General. Seems like we’re pretty lousy at this racism thing.

Just to clear it up for you, I voted for the aforementioned three because I believe in conservative values. So thank you because I did in fact enjoy my cigar and rum.

As a wedge issue, CRT was working. But it wasn’t working by appealing to parents, as Republicans pretended. It was working by appealing to white people. In the Fox News poll, white respondents opposed the teaching of CRT by 24 percentage points, but parents opposed it by only five points. That’s because many parents aren’t white, and the poll’s nonwhite respondents were twice as likely to favor CRT as to oppose it. When Republicans talk about a parental backlash against CRT, they’re not talking about all parents. They’re talking about white parents.

[tashoya]

Nov 5, 2021 23:32:02 GMT -5 EtomicB said:

Nov 3, 2021 22:02:16 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

Right well you can say that’s what you believe he ran on all you want, that doesn’t make it true. That’s just your opinion and in my opinion, it is one that is not rooted in fact.

If Virginians like myself voted for Glen Youngkin because we support his “racist” platform, you’ll have to explain why we also voted in the first black woman Lt. Governor and a Cuban American Attorney General. Seems like we’re pretty lousy at this racism thing.

Just to clear it up for you, I voted for the aforementioned three because I believe in conservative values. So thank you because I did in fact enjoy my cigar and rum.

As a wedge issue, CRT was working. But it wasn’t working by appealing to parents, as Republicans pretended. It was working by appealing to white people. In the Fox News poll, white respondents opposed the teaching of CRT by 24 percentage points, but parents opposed it by only five points. That’s because many parents aren’t white, and the poll’s nonwhite respondents were twice as likely to favor CRT as to oppose it. When Republicans talk about a parental backlash against CRT, they’re not talking about all parents. They’re talking about white parents.

Which, as we all know, is the entire point. In fact, the ONLY point. They're running on racism and those that vote for them are voting for racism which makes them, surprise surprise, racists. Hoyaatheart can pee into the wind all he likes. Everyone knows what's actually true. Rationalize it how you like. The "conservative values" of which he speaks is actually one value: keeping America as white as possible. "Republicans" don't even bother discussing other "values" at this point unless it's abortion and they do that very superficially. Just enough to pander to evangelicals and to those stupid enough to think that those running actually care one way or the other. Keeping buying the BS, dummies. Regardless of your political leaning, how you can continue to vote for people that support hindering Americans from voting is beyond me. It's also not something you can explain away. You're voting against American democracy. Which is why your attempts to rationalize/explain that empirical fact falls on deaf ears for those with IQs north of 60. At least own your own reasons for voting that way. Have some integrity for a change.

[tashoya]

Nov 3, 2021 22:02:16 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

Nov 3, 2021 19:33:04 GMT -5 tashoya said:

It's beyond me why you'd be "sure" I would contend that CRT is completely made up. In fact, I don't even know what you're trying to say. Regardless, I said that Youngkin ran on racism (with just enough of a nod to the Trump BS) and that he won by doing so. I don't think there's much to be celebrated in that regard, regardless of one's political affiliations/leanings. But, I hope you enjoy your rum and your cigar.

Right well you can say that’s what you believe he ran on all you want, that doesn’t make it true. That’s just your opinion and in my opinion, it is one that is not rooted in fact.

If Virginians like myself voted for Glen Youngkin because we support his “racist” platform, you’ll have to explain why we also voted in the first black woman Lt. Governor and a Cuban American Attorney General. Seems like we’re pretty lousy at this racism thing.

Just to clear it up for you, I voted for the aforementioned three because I believe in conservative values. So thank you because I did in fact enjoy my cigar and rum.

One day, you'll realize what you actually voted for. Until that day, which "conservative" values have "conservatives" actually fought for? It's not family values or fiscal responsibility. Please tell me that in 2021, you didn't go the single issue route and chose fighting Roe v. Wade over American democracy. If so, how the heck can you justify that? Serious question: what did you actually vote for? What, other than the label of the candidate, made you choose the way you did?

[hoyaatheart55]

I wasn’t going to come back to this portion of the board but I was mentioned so here I am.

I’m not going to engage with people who think everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Give me a break.

I get it, I get it. Everything your side does is virtuous and everything my side does is evil and racist. See this kind of talk all the time from both sides. No I happen to think that you all are probably fine people, we just disagree on what we think is best for this country. All good.

But you know nothing about me other than who I’ve voted for and you’ve come to the conclusion that I’m racist. I have nothing else to say to you.

[tashoya]

Nov 7, 2021 0:11:48 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

I wasn’t going to come back to this portion of the board but I was mentioned so here I am.

I’m not going to engage with people who think everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Give me a break.

I get it, I get it. Everything your side does is virtuous and everything my side does is evil and racist. See this kind of talk all the time from both sides. No I happen to think that you all are probably fine people, we just disagree on what we think is best for this country. All good.

But you know nothing about me other than who I’ve voted for and you’ve come to the conclusion that I’m racist. I have nothing else to say to you.

I've come to the conclusion that you voted for someone who ran on racism. I asked you directly what you voted for with regard to that candidate and you declined to answer.

[DallasHoya]

Nov 7, 2021 0:11:48 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

I wasn’t going to come back to this portion of the board but I was mentioned so here I am.

I’m not going to engage with people who think everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Give me a break.

I get it, I get it. Everything your side does is virtuous and everything my side does is evil and racist. See this kind of talk all the time from both sides. No I happen to think that you all are probably fine people, we just disagree on what we think is best for this country. All good.

But you know nothing about me other than who I’ve voted for and you’ve come to the conclusion that I’m racist. I have nothing else to say to you.

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them, so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

[SSHoya]

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

Nov 7, 2021 0:11:48 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

I wasn’t going to come back to this portion of the board but I was mentioned so here I am.

I’m not going to engage with people who think everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Give me a break.

I get it, I get it. Everything your side does is virtuous and everything my side does is evil and racist. See this kind of talk all the time from both sides. No I happen to think that you all are probably fine people, we just disagree on what we think is best for this country. All good.

But you know nothing about me other than who I’ve voted for and you’ve come to the conclusion that I’m racist. I have nothing else to say to you.

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them, so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

Classic false equivalence - as if the alleged "socialists and anti-semites" control the Democratic Party in the same way that the White supremacists of the MAGA GOP, undisputably led by the racist authoritarian sociopath, are the core of the party/cult.

So Biden espouses the alleged "anti-semitism and socialism" of those left wing elements of the Democratic Party? McCarthy and a slew of GOP "leadership" adopt and mimic the racism of the sociopath and, at best, are silent in the face of it. The exceptions in the MAGA GOP are few - Cheney, Gonzalez, Kinzinger and a handful of others.

Do you want to offer any substantive rebuttal to a GOP operative of forty years, Stuart Stevens? Is he wholly off base? Simply looking to sell his book? Not one of our HoyaTalk GOPers have offered any comment on his mea culpa. Why not?

Is your idea of GOP "leadership" Abbott, Patrick and Paxton?

[hoyajinx]

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

Nov 7, 2021 0:11:48 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

I wasn’t going to come back to this portion of the board but I was mentioned so here I am.

I’m not going to engage with people who think everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Give me a break.

I get it, I get it. Everything your side does is virtuous and everything my side does is evil and racist. See this kind of talk all the time from both sides. No I happen to think that you all are probably fine people, we just disagree on what we think is best for this country. All good.

But you know nothing about me other than who I’ve voted for and you’ve come to the conclusion that I’m racist. I have nothing else to say to you.

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them, so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

I understand you are trying to be clever in order to deflect from the actual discussion here which is clearly you’re prerogative. But this woefully misses the mark. I’m not a “progressive”. As I’ve noted on here, I was a right leaning independent who reliably (90-95%) voted Republican until 2018 (in 2016 I voted Republican except for a third party for president). Even in 2018 and 2019, I overwhelmingly voted locally for Republicans. I simply can’t anymore. Aside from
the fact that Republicans no longer have a coherent set of values or philosophies, CRT has been outed as absolute BS. Further up thread is the architect of this BS ADMITTING that it is all just a ruse. It’s not a coincidence that the focus of this is race and not economic theory. They certainly could have focused on the “socialist” indoctrination angle that many Republicans have in the past, but they didn’t. The focus was clearly race. That appeals to the base on a gut a level. You can pretend all you want that the CRT isn’t a racist issue, but that’s an absolute fantasy. Republicans running for office on banning CRT know exactly what they are doing whether you acknowledge or not. After all, Christopher Rufo explicitly acknowledges this, and you still refuse to believe him. I’m not saying that necessarily makes all those who vote for him a racist; that would be an absolutely ludicrous claim. The CRT portion of his platform wasn’t particularly important to a likely sizable number of his voters. But simply because everyone who voted for him didn’t do it because of CRT, it doesn’t somehow make his focus on it any less of an appeal to those with racist inclinations.

[SSHoya]

Capehart stealing my line of thought.

Because here’s the deal: Voting for a Black candidate does not grant absolution from racism, nor from being motivated by the racist dog whistles — or nowadays, bullhorns — that politicians use to play on racial fears for political gain. And, let’s be clear, being able to say that some of your best friends are Black, that you like Black music and culture, that some of your family members are Black, or that you’re dating or married to someone who’s Black is no pass, either.

I said on the “PBS NewsHour” the Friday before the election that Youngkin’s campaign focus showed how Republicans have decided that picking at White anxieties and tap-dancing with white supremacy are their ways back into power.

www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/11/07/winsome-sears-virginia-election-youngkin-racist-campaign/

[Deleted]

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

Nov 7, 2021 0:11:48 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

I wasn’t going to come back to this portion of the board but I was mentioned so here I am.

I’m not going to engage with people who think everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Give me a break.

I get it, I get it. Everything your side does is virtuous and everything my side does is evil and racist. See this kind of talk all the time from both sides. No I happen to think that you all are probably fine people, we just disagree on what we think is best for this country. All good.

But you know nothing about me other than who I’ve voted for and you’ve come to the conclusion that I’m racist. I have nothing else to say to you.

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

What does centering your campaign around CRT have to do with any of those things?

The only thing on that list that Republicans actually try and do when there in office is lowering taxes. They spend just as much if not more than Democrats. LGBTQ folks and many other marginalized groups would like to have a word about that whole equal opportunity thing, and Republicans have had no issue embracing big government so long as it fulfills their political ambitions and ideological preferences. The culture war nonsense we see regularly from that side might not be the things that move you or Hoyaatheart but can you honestly deny the fact that at minimum there's a lot of subtle racism and bigotry in Republican messaging right now?

[TC]

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity

Since when do conservatives believe in any of those things?

[tashoya]

Nov 7, 2021 17:30:06 GMT -5 @yaboynyp said:

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

What does centering your campaign around CRT have to do with any of those things?

The only thing on that list that Republicans actually try and do when there in office is lowering taxes. They spend just as much if not more than Democrats. LGBTQ folks and many other marginalized groups would like to have a word about that whole equal opportunity thing, and Republicans have had no issue embracing big government so long as it fulfills their political ambitions and ideological preferences. The culture war nonsense we see regularly from that side might not be the things that move you or Hoyaatheart but can you honestly deny the fact that at minimum there's a lot of subtle racism and bigotry in Republican messaging right now?

Succinct and accurate. Nicely stated, sir.

[tashoya]

Nov 7, 2021 22:45:27 GMT -5 TC said:

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity

Since when do conservatives believe in any of those things?

To them, saying they believe them is enough. Or, at least, it has been for 4 decades and running. Folks like hoyaatheart throw those things out there when they're called on what their actions say. The elected "Republicans" have consistently shown they don't believe in any of those things. They can say they do but their actions tell a very different story.

It's indisputable that Youngkin won by appealing to the racist part of the party. It was THE issue he ran on under the guise of "education." So, if you get judged by others by having cast a vote for a person that ran on that, so be it. People get judged by others by what those people know about the other person. Not on the entirety of their person or their character. He voted for a person that won on appealing to the racist faction of the base. It was clear as day. Saying you voted for other things that were, at best, ancillary to the primary talking point may be entirely true. However, you still voted for the main goal. Maybe you get the limited government (you never do), reduced spending (spending ALWAYS goes up under "Republican" leadership) or lower taxes (of course you will). But, you'll also get a greater focus on racial division. Education? Puh-leeze. In any case, all of those other things are policy issues. The thing he ran on made it glaringly clear that he's a bad person. We can debate policy issues. We cannot debate marginalizing other Americans for no other reasons than the pigment of their skin and personal political ambitions.

[tashoya]

Nov 5, 2021 18:40:03 GMT -5 AvantGuardHoya said:

This is so laughable it really isn't funny. Agent Orange started this ongoing effort to undermine the American electoral process and I'm beginning to think things will be effed up for the rest of my life. It's very sad and scary... and truly didn't need to be. SMDH.

I think you'll need to live a very long time for that not to be the case. It's exceedingly clear that this is the playbook moving forward because they know they can't win on issues or demographics. Each year, their constituency shrinks because old white people can only live so long. The solution? Undermine democracy if you can't win a free and fair, democratic election.

[boxout05]

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

Nov 7, 2021 0:11:48 GMT -5 hoyaatheart55 said:

I wasn’t going to come back to this portion of the board but I was mentioned so here I am.

I’m not going to engage with people who think everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Give me a break.

I get it, I get it. Everything your side does is virtuous and everything my side does is evil and racist. See this kind of talk all the time from both sides. No I happen to think that you all are probably fine people, we just disagree on what we think is best for this country. All good.

But you know nothing about me other than who I’ve voted for and you’ve come to the conclusion that I’m racist. I have nothing else to say to you.

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them, so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

I don’t necessarily agree with everything you've written, but think you’re onto some things worth hashing out by both sides. For the sake of argument, if you’re a “country club Republican” how/when are you ‘allowed’ to vote for your candidates, how responsible are you for the crazies, how closely can you associate before you’re tainted and when do you have to push back?

IMO it can’t be that everyone who voted R is irredeemably evil, but JFC there is so much wrong with the GOP that it’s actually breaking democracy and the same can’t be said about Dems.

[tashoya]

Nov 9, 2021 12:09:00 GMT -5 boxout05 said:

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them, so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

I don’t necessarily agree with everything you've written, but think you’re onto some things worth hashing out by both sides. For the sake of argument, if you’re a “country club Republican” how/when are you ‘allowed’ to vote for your candidates, how responsible are you for the crazies, how closely can you associate before you’re tainted and when do you have to push back?

IMO it can’t be that everyone who voted R is irredeemably evil, but JFC there is so much wrong with the GOP that it’s actually breaking democracy and the same can’t be said about Dems.

The anti-democracy "wing" of the "party" IS the party. It's not a faction. So, while they may not be, "irredeemably evil," they are enemies of our country.

[SSHoya]

Sure, race and his dogwhistle of CRT had nothing to do with Youngkin's win in Virginia.

So what, then, do these voters want? Many essentially see politics as a great battle between White, Christian America and the multiracial, religiously diverse reality of 21st century America. They want someone to help them win that existential fight. Government is there not to produce legislative fixes to real-world problems but to engage their enemies on behalf of White Christianity.

PRRI’s chief executive Robert P. Jones points out: “Among the 42% of Virginia voters who believe that Confederate monuments should be taken down, nearly nine in ten (87%) voted for the Democratic candidate Terry McAuliffe.” By contrast, “Among the 51% of Virginia voters who believe that Confederate monuments should be left in place, more than eight in ten (82%) voted for Republican candidate Glenn Youngkin.”

Jones underscores that this MAGA resentment translates into “fears about the rising number of Latino Americans, fears about Islam, and anti-Black attitudes tied to a ‘law and order’ mentality where African Americans are associated with criminal activity and lawlessness in major cities. You won’t need to search far to find each of these interpretations made painfully explicit in former President Trump’s speeches and in the content of the 2016 and 2020 Republican National Conventions.”

www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/11/09/america-cannot-give-evangelicals-want-they-want/

[SSHoya]

Nov 9, 2021 12:09:00 GMT -5 boxout05 said:

Nov 7, 2021 9:56:31 GMT -5 DallasHoya said:

I think I’ve figured it out.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions, but also says something that according to progressives is a racist dog whistle, then the politician is a racist and so are you for voting for him or her.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who happens to be African-American, then according to progressives the politician is simply a mouthpiece for white supremacy (per Eric Dyson) or it’s no different than saying you have an African-American friend, which in either case is racist and therefore voting for that politician makes you a racist.

If you believe in limited government, lower taxes, reduced spending and equal opportunity, and vote for a politician who supports those positions but does not use a racist dog whistle, that doesn’t matter either, because some racist politicians share those positions and your vote therefore empowers them, so by empowering racists that makes you a racist. Alternatively, while the policies in of themselves are not racist, they are not anti-racist, and if they’re not anti-racist, they must be a racist, and so therefore so are you for voting for them.

So clearly the only solution is to vote for progressive politicians because otherwise you’re a racist.

Of course, none of this applies to anyone else; for example, while voting for a Democratic centrist enables the Democratic Party to control the House, which therefore empowers the socialists and anti-semites in the party, that clearly does not make you a socialist or anti-semite.

And with that I will join you in again trying my best to ignore this board.

I don’t necessarily agree with everything you've written, but think you’re onto some things worth hashing out by both sides. For the sake of argument, if you’re a “country club Republican” how/when are you ‘allowed’ to vote for your candidates, how responsible are you for the crazies, how closely can you associate before you’re tainted and when do you have to push back?

IMO it can’t be that everyone who voted R is irredeemably evil, but JFC there is so much wrong with the GOP that it’s actually breaking democracy and the same can’t be said about Dems.

You don't vote for ANY Republican - you don't have to vote Dem as former Republican Max Boot counseled (Oct. 11, 2021, Washington Post op-ed) but you can stay home and decline to vote at all or if your candidate has publicly taken a Cheney/Kinzinger position, vote for them. Those GOPers are far and few between. The silent and complicit GOPers who may "tsk tsk" in private about the sociopath lack any political courage and don't deserve to be in public office.

Opinion: I’m no Democrat — but I’m voting exclusively for Democrats to save our democracy.

By Max Boot
Columnist
October 11, 2021 at 2:30 p.m. EDT


There appears to be a consensus in Washington that the success of the Biden presidency will hinge on the outcome of the massive infrastructure and social-spending bills now before Congress. That may be true, but their fate won’t affect how I vote.

I’m a single-issue voter. My issue is the fate of democracy in the United States. Simply put, I have no faith that we will remain a democracy if Republicans win power. Thus, although I’m not a Democrat, I will continue to vote exclusively for Democrats — as I have done in every election since 2016 — until the GOP ceases to pose an existential threat to our freedom.