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Post by FrazierFanatic on Nov 18, 2016 20:07:16 GMT -5
Massive upgrade? Really? He has been a head coach for 2 years. The first year as a mid-major he was slightly above .500 and lost in the CAA second round. Last year they had a very good record, but did not beat any high major teams. He might be a good coach at our level, but it is far too early to tell.
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deacon
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Post by deacon on Nov 18, 2016 22:51:05 GMT -5
Just saw that Northern Iowa beat Oklahoma today. Ben Jacobson has been at UNI for 10 years but has had a lot of success and has proven time and time again that he can take a team with inferior talent and beat some of the best programs in the country.
I would have to do a little research to see if other programs have gone after him over the last few years and if so, why has he chosen to stay put.
But, the results speak for themselves.
The guy I really wanted, Jerod Haase, got the Stanford job. So ... yeah.
Outside the box: Mike Jones from DeMatha. Whatever shortcomings he may have from a coaching standpoint would be more than made up by the talent we'd bring in. Worked last time we brought in a local high school coach *shrug*
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eagle54
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Post by eagle54 on Nov 18, 2016 23:04:05 GMT -5
Just saw that Northern Iowa beat Oklahoma today. Ben Jacobson has been at UNI for 10 years but has had a lot of success and has proven time and time again that he can take a team with inferior talent and beat some of the best programs in the country. I would have to do a little research to see if other programs have gone after him over the last few years and if so, why has he chosen to stay put. But, the results speak for themselves. The guy I really wanted, Jerod Haase, got the Stanford job. So ... yeah. Outside the box: Mike Jones from DeMatha. Whatever shortcomings he may have from a coaching standpoint would be more than made up by the talent we'd bring in. Worked last time we brought in a local high school coach *shrug* Deacon, you are now calling for Coach to step down? Now I know the sentiment has changed. |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Nov 18, 2016 23:55:09 GMT -5
Some people wonder why I question the ability of our school to get a high quality coach (if we needed one), so let's review the list of people mentioned in the last 24 hours:
Ben Jacobson - 10 complete seasons as coach, 4 NCAA tournaments at UNI.
Jerod Haase - 5 complete seasons as coach, 1 NCAA tournament at UAB.
Mike Jones (Dematha) - Realistically, we cannot hire a high school coach.
Ewing - Complete unknown; no idea how he would recruit; no head coaching experience; wants the NBA, not college.
Ewing Jr. - Only in his second season in coaching.
Wallace - Smart guy, but he's in the midst of his first season coaching.
Kevin Keatts - Two seasons at UNC Wilmington. He made one NCAA tournament. This is the definition of unproven.
King Rice - 5 complete seasons at Monmouth. No NCAA tournaments (and BTW, they are 1-2 this season, so last year was probably a fluke).
Danny Hurley - Never made an NCAA tournament team in 6 completed seasons. His name is always mentioned for openings, yet he's stuck with Rhode Island. Plus, his records at Rhode Island: 9-21, 14-18, 23-10, 17-15.
Will Wade - Three completed seasons, 1 NCAA tournament. He may be a good coach, but it's too early to know.
Archie Miller - Easily the best of the bunch. He has made 3 NCAA tournaments in 6 complete seasons as a coach. I think it's highly unlikely he would be leave to come to Georgetown but if we had an opening, he'd be one of the better options.
Really, on this list, I think Miller, Wade, and Hurley are okay choices (and maybe Jacobson, I don't know enough about him), but the rest I think have no business leading our program. So, when I say I'm not confident we can draw top level coaching talent, maybe you'll see now where I am coming from. I'm sorry, but I am not willing to turn the keys over the someone like King Rice who is totally unqualified.
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eagle54
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Post by eagle54 on Nov 19, 2016 0:00:57 GMT -5
Some people wonder why I question the ability of our school to get a high quality coach (if we needed one), so let's review the list of people mentioned in the last 24 hours: Ben Jacobson - 10 complete seasons as coach, 4 NCAA tournaments at UNI. Jerod Haase - 5 complete seasons as coach, 1 NCAA tournament at UAB. Mike Jones (Dematha) - Realistically, we cannot hire a high school coach. Ewing - Complete unknown; no idea how he would recruit; no head coaching experience; wants the NBA, not college. Ewing Jr. - Only in his second season in coaching. Wallace - Smart guy, but he's in the midst of his first season coaching. Kevin Keatts - Two seasons at UNC Wilmington. He made one NCAA tournament. This is the definition of unproven. King Rice - 5 complete seasons at Monmouth. No NCAA tournaments (and BTW, they are 1-2 this season, so last year was probably a fluke). Danny Hurley - Never made an NCAA tournament team in 6 completed seasons. His name is always mentioned for openings, yet he's stuck with Rhode Island. Plus, his records at Rhode Island: 9-21, 14-18, 23-10, 17-15. Will Wade - Three completed seasons, 1 NCAA tournament. He may be a good coach, but it's too early to know. Archie Miller - Easily the best of the bunch. He has made 3 NCAA tournaments in 6 complete seasons as a coach. I think it's highly unlikely he would be leave to come to Georgetown but if we had an opening, he'd be one of the better options. Really, on this list, I think Miller, Wade, and Hurley are okay choices (and maybe Jacobson, I don't know enough about him), but the rest I think have no business leading our program. So, when I say I'm not confident we can draw top level coaching talent, maybe you'll see now where I am coming from. I'm sorry, but I am not willing to turn the keys over the someone like King Rice who is totally unqualified. Sometimes you and others can just over analyze things. We are in a bad place and change is needed and that's been the case beyond the last two games. You need to have some leadership, make a decsion and put some confidence back in the program. The fear this board has in a coaching change is equivalent to the same cowardice that we play with against I-AA programs. Be decisive, right the ship and move on. It's not that complicated and it's what most teams in big time college and professional sports do each year. |
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Nov 19, 2016 0:28:04 GMT -5
Some people wonder why I question the ability of our school to get a high quality coach (if we needed one), so let's review the list of people mentioned in the last 24 hours: Ben Jacobson - 10 complete seasons as coach, 4 NCAA tournaments at UNI. Jerod Haase - 5 complete seasons as coach, 1 NCAA tournament at UAB. Mike Jones (Dematha) - Realistically, we cannot hire a high school coach. Ewing - Complete unknown; no idea how he would recruit; no head coaching experience; wants the NBA, not college. Ewing Jr. - Only in his second season in coaching. Wallace - Smart guy, but he's in the midst of his first season coaching. Kevin Keatts - Two seasons at UNC Wilmington. He made one NCAA tournament. This is the definition of unproven. King Rice - 5 complete seasons at Monmouth. No NCAA tournaments (and BTW, they are 1-2 this season, so last year was probably a fluke). Danny Hurley - Never made an NCAA tournament team in 6 completed seasons. His name is always mentioned for openings, yet he's stuck with Rhode Island. Plus, his records at Rhode Island: 9-21, 14-18, 23-10, 17-15. Will Wade - Three completed seasons, 1 NCAA tournament. He may be a good coach, but it's too early to know. Archie Miller - Easily the best of the bunch. He has made 3 NCAA tournaments in 6 complete seasons as a coach. I think it's highly unlikely he would be leave to come to Georgetown but if we had an opening, he'd be one of the better options. Really, on this list, I think Miller, Wade, and Hurley are okay choices (and maybe Jacobson, I don't know enough about him), but the rest I think have no business leading our program. So, when I say I'm not confident we can draw top level coaching talent, maybe you'll see now where I am coming from. I'm sorry, but I am not willing to turn the keys over the someone like King Rice who is totally unqualified. Keatts has won coach of the year in the CAA both years on the job.. Took a team that was 3-13 in conference in 2013-14 to 12-6 & then 14-4.. UNCW had 6 straight losing season before he took over, he's on the rise.. |
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Post by HometownHoya on Nov 19, 2016 0:44:24 GMT -5
Some people wonder why I question the ability of our school to get a high quality coach (if we needed one), so let's review the list of people mentioned in the last 24 hours: Ben Jacobson - 10 complete seasons as coach, 4 NCAA tournaments at UNI. Jerod Haase - 5 complete seasons as coach, 1 NCAA tournament at UAB. Mike Jones (Dematha) - Realistically, we cannot hire a high school coach. Ewing - Complete unknown; no idea how he would recruit; no head coaching experience; wants the NBA, not college. Ewing Jr. - Only in his second season in coaching. Wallace - Smart guy, but he's in the midst of his first season coaching. Kevin Keatts - Two seasons at UNC Wilmington. He made one NCAA tournament. This is the definition of unproven. King Rice - 5 complete seasons at Monmouth. No NCAA tournaments (and BTW, they are 1-2 this season, so last year was probably a fluke). Danny Hurley - Never made an NCAA tournament team in 6 completed seasons. His name is always mentioned for openings, yet he's stuck with Rhode Island. Plus, his records at Rhode Island: 9-21, 14-18, 23-10, 17-15. Will Wade - Three completed seasons, 1 NCAA tournament. He may be a good coach, but it's too early to know. Archie Miller - Easily the best of the bunch. He has made 3 NCAA tournaments in 6 complete seasons as a coach. I think it's highly unlikely he would be leave to come to Georgetown but if we had an opening, he'd be one of the better options. Really, on this list, I think Miller, Wade, and Hurley are okay choices (and maybe Jacobson, I don't know enough about him), but the rest I think have no business leading our program. So, when I say I'm not confident we can draw top level coaching talent, maybe you'll see now where I am coming from. I'm sorry, but I am not willing to turn the keys over the someone like King Rice who is totally unqualified. Don't forget Grant McCasland...gotta throw his name in the hat, he's clearly better then JT3. |
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Post by hoyaball on Nov 19, 2016 7:48:57 GMT -5
And don't forget Tim Craft, who could be a great pick.
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3xhoya
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Post by 3xhoya on Nov 19, 2016 14:49:35 GMT -5
Can someone please explain this 1 AM meeting? I haven't seen much posted on this just some references here and there. Thanks.
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Nov 19, 2016 15:00:15 GMT -5
Can someone please explain this 1 AM meeting? I haven't seen much posted on this just some references here and there. Thanks. Gentlemen, remember to bring your sunscreen. Dismissed. |
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royski
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Post by royski on Nov 19, 2016 15:32:09 GMT -5
Massive upgrade? Really? He has been a head coach for 2 years. The first year as a mid-major he was slightly above .500 and lost in the CAA second round. Last year they had a very good record, but did not beat any high major teams. He might be a good coach at our level, but it is far too early to tell. Massive upgrade. Really. He has been coach of the year each of his two years in a good CAA conference. He completely transformed the UNC-W program. He has show the ability to make the most of the talent on his roster, which is far more than the current regime can say. JT3 is a bad coach at our level. That's not too early to tell. |
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Nov 19, 2016 15:37:38 GMT -5
"Massive" is a ridiculous exaggeration. Nice try though.
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royski
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Post by royski on Nov 19, 2016 15:43:31 GMT -5
"Massive" is a ridiculous exaggeration. Nice try though. His team is better than ours. We are Georgetown. They are UNC-Wilmington. Yet somehow, someway, they're better. Probably because of the guy who has won Coach of the Year every season he's coached. Massive upgrade is completely accurate. Imagine what he could do with with Georgetown's resources. I imagine he'd be able to teach the team to inbound a basketball consistently. |
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Nov 19, 2016 15:47:28 GMT -5
Who says they are better? 3 games in my friend, let's cool your jets until we see how things play out. Big fish in a little pond.
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Post by hoyaball on Nov 19, 2016 15:54:10 GMT -5
Another great coach to consider is Scott Nagy.
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lda05816
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Post by lda05816 on Nov 19, 2016 16:10:40 GMT -5
"Massive" is a ridiculous exaggeration. Nice try though. His team is better than ours. We are Georgetown. They are UNC-Wilmington. Yet somehow, someway, they're better. Probably because of the guy who has won Coach of the Year every season he's coached. Massive upgrade is completely accurate. Imagine what he could do with with Georgetown's resources. I imagine he'd be able to teach the team to inbound a basketball consistently. Massive upgrade is a bit overblown. JT3 took us to a final 4 in year 3. Initial success isn't indicative of long term success. I'm not saying I'm against a change but there have been plenty of "future superstar" coaches who flame out quickly. |
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Nov 19, 2016 16:21:26 GMT -5
For comparison's sake, JT3 had four years of head coaching experience when he was hired. He made two NCAA tournaments at Princeton (his first and last season) and the NIT once. He lost in the first round in all three. He also never coached in a conference tournament, since the Ivy League doesn't have one. Looking back, his resume being completely berefit of tournament success may have been something that should have been given more weight at the time.  |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Nov 19, 2016 16:21:56 GMT -5
Sometimes you and others can just over analyze things. We are in a bad place and change is needed and that's been the case beyond the last two games. You need to have some leadership, make a decsion and put some confidence back in the program. The fear this board has in a coaching change is equivalent to the same cowardice that we play with against I-AA programs. Be decisive, right the ship and move on. It's not that complicated and it's what most teams in big time college and professional sports do each year. You're basically saying that acknowledging basic facts about the coaching suggestions is "over analyz[ing]." Really, I am just looking at their records. I get it. In your mind, basically anybody would be a better coach and an improvement, so you're not even willing to acknowledge that some of the people that have been suggested simply aren't good choices. If this was 2009-2010, I am sure many people would have been interested in Oliver Purnell, and we know how that panned out at DePaul. My point is that getting a good coach is a lot easier than saying X coach had a little success at some mid-major. |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Nov 19, 2016 16:43:40 GMT -5
Seriously, if you guys are suggesting people like McAsland or Tim Craft, you're making me even more averse to change. These aren't impressive people you are suggesting. Could one of them work out? Maybe, but I think the odds are against nearly everyone listed except Jacobson, Wade, Hurley, and Miller, and there's no guarantee any of those 4 (who are very unlikely to take the job) would be successes either. Let's look at tournament success:
Ben Jacobson - 10 seasons, 4 NCAA tournaments. NCAA record: 4-4. One Sweet 16.
Jerod Haase - 4 seasons, 1 NCAA tournaments. NCAA record: 1-1.
Mike Jones, Ewing, Ewing Jr. and Wallace - No head coaching experience.
Kevin Keatts - 2 seasons, 1 NCAA tournaments. NCAA record: 1-1
King Rice - 5 seasons, 0 NCAA tournaments.
Dan Hurley - 6 seasons, 0 NCAA tournaments.
Will Wade - 3 seasons, 1 NCAA tournament. NCAA record: 1-1.
Archie Miller - 5 seasons, 3 NCAA tournaments. NCAA record: 4-3. One Elite Eight.
Grant McAsland - First season in Division I.
Scott Nagy - 12 seasons, three NCAA tournaments. NCAA record: 0-3.
Tim Craft - 3 seasons, 0 NCAA tournaments.
So in sum, these coaches have combined, 50 completed seasons of head coaching, 13 NCAA bids, and a combined NCAA record of 11-13, one Sweet 16 and one Elite Eight.
In contrast, JT3: 16 seasons, 10 NCAA bids. NCAA record: 9-10 (9-8 at Georgetown), one Sweet 16, one Final Four.
Now, I realize JT3's success was frontloaded and since 2007, his NCAA record is not nearly as good. And that's a fair criticism. But before making hyperbolic protestations that several of these coaches above would be better, look at the record.
Please note, I am not saying this is an argument for/against change at the top for our program. I just wish people would look at the situation rationally, and stop pretending that the local CYO basketball coach would be an improvement.
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Nov 19, 2016 17:08:32 GMT -5
Keats and Wade each have coached in as many NCAA games as JT3 did prior to his hire. They've also both won an NCAA game, something JT3 didn't do at Princeton. Mid-major coaches that are successful don't stay at mid-majors for very long. Even Shaka Smart, who felt like he was at VCU forever, was only there 6 years. Basically, at some point, the Hoyas are going to hire a new head coach with 3-7 years of head coaching experience at the mid-major level (unless they hire an assistant).
Some other examples from the Big East--Ed Cooley had 5 years as a head coach at Fairfield before moving to Providence. Jay Wright had 7 years at Hofstra. Kevin Willard had 3 years at Iona. Chris Mack had zero years as a head coach. Chris Holtmann had three years at Gardner-Webb prior to joining Butler as an assistant (which is kind of weird).
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